pirateat40 (OP)
Avast Ye!
Sr. Member
![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif) ![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif) ![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif)
Offline
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
"Yes I am a pirate, 200 years too late."
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 30, 2011, 09:48:14 PM |
|
If there was a way to buy hashing power, on the spot and for as long as you prepaid for, how much would you pay per Gh per day?
|
|
|
|
|
pirateat40 (OP)
Avast Ye!
Sr. Member
![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif) ![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif) ![*](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/star.gif)
Offline
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
"Yes I am a pirate, 200 years too late."
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 30, 2011, 09:55:01 PM |
|
Yea, I saw those, I'm looking for a current market price and by GH per day.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 30, 2011, 10:08:04 PM |
|
It is continually changing every second due to market price and difficulty however the current spot value of hashing power is
The daily revenue in USD for 1 GH/s of hashing power is: (Daily price in USD) = (USD per BTC) * 1005828.381 / (current difficulty)
The constant "1005828.381" comes from reducing known conversions (seconds per day, BTC per block, hashes per block).
|
|
|
|
molecular
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 12:02:35 PM |
|
there are some mining corporations on glbse.com: MergedMining, FPGA.Contract, JLP-BMD.
You could check their shares market value, figure out their hashrates and determine an average price per GH/s that way. I don't know how that would compare to other, more direct ways of calculating this based on mining income and running cost.
|
PGP key molecular F9B70769 fingerprint 9CDD C0D3 20F8 279F 6BE0 3F39 FC49 2362 F9B7 0769
|
|
|
ElectricMucus
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 12:22:48 PM |
|
Renting Hashing power is beyond pointless.
|
|
|
|
payb.tc
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 12:46:43 PM |
|
Renting Hashing power is beyond pointless.
i made a decent return renting hashing power from yochdog's BitCorp.
|
|
|
|
ElectricMucus
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 12:58:47 PM |
|
Renting Hashing power is beyond pointless.
i made a decent return renting hashing power from yochdog's BitCorp. That may be so. People make money on lots of things. You can pay someone to solve captchas for you, and spam can be quite profitable too. Probably even more profitable.
|
|
|
|
payb.tc
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 01:37:25 PM |
|
Renting Hashing power is beyond pointless.
i made a decent return renting hashing power from yochdog's BitCorp. That may be so. People make money on lots of things. You can pay someone to solve captchas for you, and spam can be quite profitable too. Probably even more profitable. yeah but on the other hand making money on profitable endeavors is beyond pointless.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 01:55:35 PM |
|
Renting hashing power could be taken either way
As in it is beyond pointless to rent hashing power to others or it is beyond pointless to rent hashing offered by others.
Technically I agree. It is a zero sum game. Either the renter is a loser or the rentee is the loser.
The renting rig business isn't viable it just exists because Bitcoin is an immature business.
It would be like me having a dollar bill store. If I sell dollar bills for $1.10 each then the buyer is losing. If I sell dollars bills for $0.90 each then the seller (me) is losing.
This is why we tend not to see dollar bill stores.
|
|
|
|
molecular
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 02:05:38 PM |
|
Renting hashing power could be taken either way
As in it is beyond pointless to rent hashing power to others or it is beyond pointless to rent hashing offered by others.
Technically I agree. It is a zero sum game. Either the renter is a loser or the rentee is the loser.
The renting rig business isn't viable it just exists because Bitcoin is an immature business.
It would be like me having a dollar bill store. If I sell dollar bills for $1.10 each then the buyer is losing. If I sell dollars bills for $0.90 each then the seller (me) is losing.
This is why we tend not to see dollar bill stores.
Not everyone has access to cheap power.
|
PGP key molecular F9B70769 fingerprint 9CDD C0D3 20F8 279F 6BE0 3F39 FC49 2362 F9B7 0769
|
|
|
Dan The Man
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 02:12:43 PM |
|
Renting hashing power could be taken either way
As in it is beyond pointless to rent hashing power to others or it is beyond pointless to rent hashing offered by others.
Technically I agree. It is a zero sum game. Either the renter is a loser or the rentee is the loser.
The renting rig business isn't viable it just exists because Bitcoin is an immature business.
It would be like me having a dollar bill store. If I sell dollar bills for $1.10 each then the buyer is losing. If I sell dollars bills for $0.90 each then the seller (me) is losing.
This is why we tend not to see dollar bill stores.
Not everyone has access to cheap power. That's not the point. The point is that the renter has access to the equipment. Either they are renting it out below value or above value. If they rent it for below value, then the rentee just turns the hashes into BTC and then into USD at the open rate. Money tree! If they are renting above value, then the rentee is an idiot who is paying more than he could buy BTC for on the open market.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 02:36:43 PM |
|
Renting hashing power could be taken either way
As in it is beyond pointless to rent hashing power to others or it is beyond pointless to rent hashing offered by others.
Technically I agree. It is a zero sum game. Either the renter is a loser or the rentee is the loser.
The renting rig business isn't viable it just exists because Bitcoin is an immature business.
It would be like me having a dollar bill store. If I sell dollar bills for $1.10 each then the buyer is losing. If I sell dollars bills for $0.90 each then the seller (me) is losing.
This is why we tend not to see dollar bill stores.
Not everyone has access to cheap power. Your missing the point. Even if the person renting rigs was using stolen hardware and free power (hence cost is $0.00) they "value" of the rental is the amount of Bitcoins obtained. If the rentee sells it for < market value of Bitcoins generated the rentee is losing money over just running the rigs themselves and selling the coins. If the rentee sells it for > market value of Bitcoins generated the renter is losing money over just buying the coins on the market. The cost of production is immaterial. If your cost to produce 1 BTC was $0.01 would you sell it on the exchange for $0.02? Or would you sell it for the max you could sell it for? Renting hashes is a zero sum game. Either the price is too high and renter is losing or the price is too low and rentee is losing.
|
|
|
|
payb.tc
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 03:34:22 PM |
|
Your missing the point. Even if the person renting rigs was using stolen hardware and free power (hence cost is $0.00) they "value" of the rental is the amount of Bitcoins obtained.
If the rentee sells it for < market value of Bitcoins generated the rentee is losing money over just running the rigs themselves and selling the coins. If the rentee sells it for > market value of Bitcoins generated the renter is losing money over just buying the coins on the market.
The cost of production is immaterial. If your cost to produce 1 BTC was $0.01 would you sell it on the exchange for $0.02? Or would you sell it for the max you could sell it for?
Renting hashes is a zero sum game. Either the price is too high and renter is losing or the price is too low and rentee is losing.
it's a completely different argument if you're thinking in fiat. i was talking purely btc in/out. eg. i rented 7 days for 32 btc and got back 35 btc, then i rented 30 days for 150 btc and got back 160 btc. win/win because the rentee reduces risk and gets upfront payment. and i don't have to worry about hardware, setup, mining expertise. but that's beyond pointless. a bit like arguing with some of the people on this forum.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 03:52:07 PM |
|
Your missing the point. Even if the person renting rigs was using stolen hardware and free power (hence cost is $0.00) they "value" of the rental is the amount of Bitcoins obtained.
If the rentee sells it for < market value of Bitcoins generated the rentee is losing money over just running the rigs themselves and selling the coins. If the rentee sells it for > market value of Bitcoins generated the renter is losing money over just buying the coins on the market.
The cost of production is immaterial. If your cost to produce 1 BTC was $0.01 would you sell it on the exchange for $0.02? Or would you sell it for the max you could sell it for?
Renting hashes is a zero sum game. Either the price is too high and renter is losing or the price is too low and rentee is losing.
it's a completely different argument if you're thinking in fiat. i was talking purely btc in/out. eg. i rented 7 days for 32 btc and got back 35 btc, then i rented 30 days for 150 btc and got back 160 btc. win/win because the rentee reduces risk and gets upfront payment. and i don't have to worry about hardware, setup, mining expertise. but that's beyond pointless. a bit like arguing with some of the people on this forum. No it is the same argument. You won, the rentee lost. It is a zero sum game. You were smart enough to realize the contract was undervalued. If the contract had been 40 BTC for 7 days and you estimated you would get 35 then you likely would have passed. Had you taken it the rentee would have won and you would have lost. The rentee sold you 195 BTC for 182 BTC. Good for you, not so good for him. Not much different than my dollar store (selling dollar bills for $0.90) analogy.
|
|
|
|
payb.tc
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 03:56:54 PM |
|
Your missing the point. Even if the person renting rigs was using stolen hardware and free power (hence cost is $0.00) they "value" of the rental is the amount of Bitcoins obtained.
If the rentee sells it for < market value of Bitcoins generated the rentee is losing money over just running the rigs themselves and selling the coins. If the rentee sells it for > market value of Bitcoins generated the renter is losing money over just buying the coins on the market.
The cost of production is immaterial. If your cost to produce 1 BTC was $0.01 would you sell it on the exchange for $0.02? Or would you sell it for the max you could sell it for?
Renting hashes is a zero sum game. Either the price is too high and renter is losing or the price is too low and rentee is losing.
it's a completely different argument if you're thinking in fiat. i was talking purely btc in/out. eg. i rented 7 days for 32 btc and got back 35 btc, then i rented 30 days for 150 btc and got back 160 btc. win/win because the rentee reduces risk and gets upfront payment. and i don't have to worry about hardware, setup, mining expertise. but that's beyond pointless. a bit like arguing with some of the people on this forum. No it is the same argument. You won, the rentee lost. It is a zero sum game. You were smart enough to realize the contract was undervalued. If the contract had been 40 BTC for 7 days and you estimated you would get 35 then you likely would have passed. Had you taken it the rentee would have won and you would have lost. The rentee sold you 195 BTC for 182 BTC. Good for you, not so good for him. Not much different than my dollar store (selling dollar bills for $0.90) analogy. the rentee reduced risk, got an upfront payment. but then, i already typed that.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
October 31, 2011, 04:01:25 PM |
|
Options and short posistions can be used to hedge for far less than the massive loss the rentee took.
Sure Exxon could "reduce their risk" by selling all their oil for next century at $50 per barrel but you don't see them doing that. If a company wants to hedge they will use financial transactions to hedge without handing huge portion of their profit to someone else for the "service" of reducing their risk.
Great deal for you while it lasts though. Anyone willing to give significant chunk of their profit to "reduce risk" likely shouldn't be mining in the first place.
|
|
|
|
molecular
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
November 03, 2011, 02:07:57 PM |
|
Options and short posistions can be used to hedge for far less than the massive loss the rentee took.
Sure Exxon could "reduce their risk" by selling all their oil for next century at $50 per barrel but you don't see them doing that. If a company wants to hedge they will use financial transactions to hedge without handing huge portion of their profit to someone else for the "service" of reducing their risk.
Great deal for you while it lasts though. Anyone willing to give significant chunk of their profit to "reduce risk" likely shouldn't be mining in the first place.
One could also buy shares of mining companies like "JLP-BMD, MergedMining, FPGA.contract" on glbse.com
|
PGP key molecular F9B70769 fingerprint 9CDD C0D3 20F8 279F 6BE0 3F39 FC49 2362 F9B7 0769
|
|
|
jetmine
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 53
Merit: 0
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
November 03, 2011, 07:20:23 PM |
|
That's not the point. The point is that the renter has access to the equipment. Either they are renting it out below value or above value. If they rent it for below value, then the rentee just turns the hashes into BTC and then into USD at the open rate. Money tree! I'm interested in this (rent for slightly below market value), and I don't feel stupid. Generating BTC is one thing, and turning BTC into revenue with flawless papertrail backing is another. Why not pay for service? I for example, don't have time to convert BTC myself and whatever I could save now I would pay it twice after the next tax inspection (in fines). If that's a money tree for you, great! Live and let live, that's how business works.
|
|
|
|
DeathAndTaxes
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
|
![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
November 03, 2011, 07:42:27 PM |
|
I'm interested in this (rent for slightly below market value), and I don't feel stupid. Generating BTC is one thing, and turning BTC into revenue with flawless papertrail backing is another. Why not pay for service? I for example, don't have time to convert BTC myself and whatever I could save now I would pay it twice after the next tax inspection (in fines). If that's a money tree for you, great! Live and let live, that's how business works. What? How would you get fined for selling your own coins? As opposed to renting your hardware?
|
|
|
|
|