How much BTC to have mixed in an address for expenses? And best method?

[takuma sato]

After thinking about what is the best way to spend BTC in a way where you could expect reasonably privacy, it seems clear that you would want to do this:

1) Use a wallet that lets you control your utxos properly (I use Bitcoin Core as a wallet too, never felt safe with any other software)
2) Think about how much money you would like to have ready to spend in products or services (to make the analogy, how much you would carry on your physical wallet)
3) After you decide an amount (let's say, $1000) then you have to mix this amount, so it simulates cash (cash is not traceable when you give it to someone, so you want to separate what is in your wallet from the rest of your networth). In order to mix, you have to pick a method:
  -Coinjoin: I have never used this. I have heard about JoinMarket. Not sure how this works
  -Mixers: This is what im familiar with. But I want to learn how Coinjoin works since stupid authorities now think anyone that wants privacy is automatically suspect of doing something wrong. So I don't want to pay someone after having mixed the coins, then this someone goes into a KYC exchange, gets blacklisted for some reason, gets asked where the money came from, then says "X gave it to me" (in case you make a person to person payment where you are identifiable, this would be an immediate problem)
 -Non KYC exchange: Register in a non-KYC exchange with Tor, send coins, and send them back to another address. This should add a reasonable amount of privacy. Im not familiar with such exchanges.

So this is my idea to spend BTC in a way where you can add a reasonable amount of privacy. The question I have is, given these 3 methods, is anyone familiar with this, and what is the best one? Coinjoin sounds good. I talked to a lawyer, and said that in theory, it presents less problems legally than a mixer, but I would like if someone that is familiar with this and ideally uses Bitcoin Core, can explain the step by step process in case in missing something.

[Stalker22]

The question I have is, given these 3 methods, is anyone familiar with this, and what is the best one?

You could also think about using a privacy coin like Monero.  Monero is designed specifically to provide enhanced privacy.  There are options to swap Bitcoin for Monero and back to Bitcoin without providing a bunch personal information or KYC.  Just be careful in picking a trustworthy exchange that wont rip you off or compromise your data.  The key is finding the right balance between anonymity and safety when moving digital currencies.

[LoyceV]

Why didn't you continue these questions in How to have reasonable privacy safely when paying??

3) After you decide an amount (let's say, $1000) then you have to mix this amount

Why? You're saying this as if it's a given, but it totally depends on who you're trying to hide from, and how your current funds are "distributed" (just one UTXO, or many).

-Mixers: This is what im familiar with. But I want to learn how Coinjoin works since stupid authorities now think anyone that wants privacy is automatically suspect of doing something wrong.

That depends on your country:

https://www.fiod.nl/fiod-takes-large-crypto-currency-mixer-off-the-air/

A cryptocurrency mixing service is not necessarily illegal. It is an online service that allows users to disguise the origin and destination of cryptocurrencies.

I like my privacy, but I don't like paying 2-5% mixing fee. My satoshis are too valuable to waste them like that.

-Non KYC exchange: Register in a non-KYC exchange with Tor, send coins, and send them back to another address. This should add a reasonable amount of privacy. Im not familiar with such exchanges.

They may not know who you are, but you should assume they keep all transaction data for many years. As always, the level of privacy gained depends on who you're trying to hide from.

[ABCbits]

  -Coinjoin: I have never used this. I have heard about JoinMarket. Not sure how this works

CoinJoin refers to the technique, where JoinMarket is one of many CoinJoin implementation.

  -Mixers: This is what im familiar with. But I want to learn how Coinjoin works since stupid authorities now think anyone that wants privacy is automatically suspect of doing something wrong. So I don't want to pay someone after having mixed the coins, then this someone goes into a KYC exchange, gets blacklisted for some reason, gets asked where the money came from, then says "X gave it to me" (in case you make a person to person payment where you are identifiable, this would be an immediate problem)

Some mixer these days claim you'd receive "clean" coin which doesn't trigger their software, although i don't know how true is it. Besides, some exchange also treat coin from CoinJoin the same way with coin from mixer.

[LoyceV]

Some mixer these days claim you'd receive "clean" coin which doesn't trigger their software, although i don't know how true is it.

Since "clean" and "dirty" is defined by whoever makes it up, it's impossible to make such a claim. Here is my list of all clean Bitcoin addresses and here's my list of all dirty Bitcoin addresses. See what I did there?

[OcTradism]

Since "clean" and "dirty" is defined by whoever makes it up, it's impossible to make such a claim. Here is my list of all clean Bitcoin addresses and here's my list of all dirty Bitcoin addresses. See what I did there?

If it comes to time when "dirty bitcoins" will no longer be allowed to use for storage or transactions, active freefloat circulating bitcoins will be very smaller than 21 millions of bitcoins. If this drop does not relate to regulations to seize bitcoins, censor transactions, Bitcoin price will soar to the Moon. Sorry for using Moonish word here.

Unfortunately, a scenario in which these things happen will be with massive severe centralized, censored, regulated world against Bitcoin, Bitcoin price will not soar, but will fall a lot. Because definitions on "dirty bitcoins" are from governments, they will gradually seize and take all "dirty" bitcoins from their citizens.

[LoyceV]

If it comes to time when "dirty bitcoins" will no longer be allowed to use for storage or transactions

That can only happen if people fall for it. I consider "taint" an attack on Bitcoin. Governments can't stop it any other way, but "they" can make (some) people believe Bitcoin is dirty.

Because definitions on "dirty bitcoins" are from governments

I haven't seen any definition coming from a government. I've only seen companies trying to sell the notion of taint. They won't tell you what they base it on, and it's all arbitrary and different for each of them, but they need you to believe you need to pay them to tell you whether your Bitcoins are good or bad.

[FinneysTrueVision]

Coinjoining works well when used properly. It is also trustless so I prefer it over mixers. I would avoid using KYC exchanges though. They don’t really see a difference between mixers and using coinjoin. If they see one as suspicious, they will also have a problem with the other.

It is still possible to be de-anonymized when using non-KYC exchanges to swap BTC for another coin and back to BTC by analyzing the timing of transactions and the amount transferred. It’s better than nothing but might be one of the weaker privacy options depending on user behavior.