Is it the end for privacy in the crypto space

[tvplus006]

...I would not trust telegram with anything related with Bitcoin.

Of course, Bitcoins are valuable to us, but we also need to protect all our personal data so that they do not first become the property of the special services, and then the entire Internet. And such caution should be taken not only for Telegrams, but also for everything that we have to deal with in everyday life.

[Rustam Meraj]

Most of the platform we're using today requires our basic information such as phone number and also IP address and most of them already ask for this in their terms and conditions before creating an account well if you are private with your details I guess using dummy accounts is suitable to you to make sure it didn't evade your privacy well in crypto space its normal because they want to keep themselves out of touch in terms of their details but most of the users recently neglect this already and they are all about the money. If the platform proves that they leak the details or sell those they can sue them with the data privacy issue of course.

Yes you are right many websites and apps ask for basic information like phone numbers and IP addresses when you create account. This is usually stated in their terms and conditions. For people who care about keeping their information private using fake accounts might be good solution. But nowadays many people using cryptocurrency platforms do not worry about privacy as much. They focus mainly on making money. Websites and apps have duty to keep user information safe. If they break this trust by sharing or selling personal data users can take them to court for violating data privacy laws.

[Pmalek]

Websites and apps have duty to keep user information safe. If they break this trust by sharing or selling personal data users can take them to court for violating data privacy laws.

That's a complicated subject. Online services have privacy policies that mention what they do with the data they have on you. If these documents grant them the right to store and share this data with third parties and you agreed to it by accepting their terms and the privacy policy, then you have no grounds to sue them. You agreed to it and gave your consent. You can only sue them if they breech their own terms and do something they don't mention there or if the company is breaking other data laws, like GDPR, for example.

[CryptSafe]

As for telegram, they already said it loud and clear that they would be cooperating with the government and third parties if the need be or any request from the government for telegram ID details and number which they already agreed to. I believe this was the possible agreement between the government and the telegram boss as the government feels and claims the social media giant is used to carryout heinous crimes which no one could be able to detect hence their demand to regulate and keep track of its activities to getting information about its users.

They made it seems like they are not doing it before now but the Durov arrest change the talk. Telegram doesn't have any privacy but they want to reassure users that they can't hide in the darkness and make it look like "hey we are monitoring you and we have everything about you, everything is under them and nobody knows anything about you but if they asked, we are going to give them" like WTF? It's their platform and I don't blame them, if you don't use it, there is no case.

In the first place, telegram is full of crypto scammers, most legit crypto projects don't create any group, what they use the most is Discord and they are very strict with rules over there, unlike telegram where anyone can just message you or pretend in the group even though you set privacy, they send unsolicited links to scam people.

That's truth you have said. Before now, they just made it looks like they were keeping users data away from the third party and now after the scuffle and attention of users drawn towards that direction, they come up and let users know that they have said it long before now that they would make sure they protect users ID and only cooperate with the third parties if the need arises. Off course it is their platform and nobody have say over what they do and how they do it. Users are only left with the option to use or not to use the platform but as for the government, nobody can stop them from getting what they want if they are convinced and are out for what they feel is not alright with them.

As for telegram engagements, we all know that scammers are way to rampant on the platform and they just keep up with their illicit PMs with phishing links and malwares just to get at people to steal details from. I will agree with you that there are fake projects in disguise with the intentions of being real but we all know that they have no good intentions towards their investors although good projects still use the platform and have been running till tis moment but when it comes to safety, it is a personal race and everyone is liable to their actions. So in other to be on the safe side, take the safety of your assets serious and discard unsolicited PMs from unknown senders and always note that admins of group platforms would never PM you first.

[summonerrk]

The latest news concerning the arrest of Telegram CEO now is that Telegram will share users IP addresses and phone numbers to the governments when legally required.

The question that pop up in my head is will privacy and anonymity flourish in the crypto space at all? I don't care about anything else that this man did, what he created or invented is what's causing this problem presently.

Also majority of new privacy coins are not just doing well, I've watched few since 2022 but man, they seem abandoned due to lack of interest.

Do you think it is the end for anything privacy in crypto space?

Would you advice anyone to start making their IP addresses because of these issues with the governments?

I think not, because this news about Pavel Durov does not really concern the crypto industry. Yes, now we cannot be sure that Telegram will reliably save our data, and of course those who store personal data and passwords there should have deleted them from Telegram after this news.
Regarding anonymous coins like Monero or ZCash - unfortunately, they have been driven into a corner for a long time, and it seems that anonymous coins are living out their time.
Anonymity is being taken away from us, and I think that all forum members here felt it after the mixers were blocked...

[RockBell]

Of course, Bitcoins are valuable to us, but we also need to protect all our personal data so that they do not first become the property of the special services, and then the entire Internet. And such caution should be taken not only for Telegrams, but also for everything that we have to deal with in everyday life.

Personal data comes first and, in the end, privacy is what makes bitcoin unique. If that privacy is compromised, there will be a great deal of confusion because, for instance, we know that whales exist, but we don't actually know who they are. That will even serve as additional defense against attacks and other threats. However, we already know that there is an issue when everything gets centralized, which is why the entire KYC-initiated procedure is odd for the industry.

And I don't think people will agree to anything that will expose their privacy, and that is one of the challenges that they have been facing and that is one of the reasons Binance left Nigeria since they were requesting for people's data and if they had agreed to that it would have affected the exchange seriously, that is in term of reputation because a lot of them will withdraw from using the exchange just because they wanted to protect their customers it was actually a good one.

Because a lot are trying to go centralized and that is what the government is trying to follow up making everything centralized but it won't work.

[PrivacyG]

That's a complicated subject. Online services have privacy policies that mention what they do with the data they have on you. If these documents grant them the right to store and share this data with third parties and you agreed to it by accepting their terms and the privacy policy, then you have no grounds to sue them. You agreed to it and gave your consent. You can only sue them if they breech their own terms and do something they don't mention there or if the company is breaking other data laws, like GDPR, for example.

Unfortunately, in a lot of situations GDPR is useless and only a spark of hope.

I have encountered multiple situations where I requested the removal of all my information from the data base of a few Companies only to find out they still had every single information as if I never requested its removal.

More over, I would imagine big Corporations could easily breach GDPR and Privacy Laws because a fine given to Google is as if I lost a dime on the ground.

The best thing is still to try and keep as much information about yourself far away from any Third Party.  It is almost impossible nowadays and it will become worse in time, but the best we can do is just try our best.

[Pmalek]

I have encountered multiple situations where I requested the removal of all my information from the data base of a few Companies only to find out they still had every single information as if I never requested its removal.

Terms usually mention how long they store the information they collect about you. Let's say it's one year. I guess you can only request data deletion once that time expires. If you do it before, they can always say they are obliged by law to keep your data, they do it for your own safety, bla bla bla.

And even if they delete the data they have on you, who is to say that they haven't shared it with other partner companies before. And if they have, perhaps they will again get hold of your data a second time whenever an exchange between those two companies happens.

The game is rigged. We just have the illusion that we can win.

[Justbillywitt]

Websites and apps have duty to keep user information safe. If they break this trust by sharing or selling personal data users can take them to court for violating data privacy laws.

That's a complicated subject. Online services have privacy policies that mention what they do with the data they have on you. If these documents grant them the right to store and share this data with third parties and you agreed to it by accepting their terms and the privacy policy, then you have no grounds to sue them. You agreed to it and gave your consent. You can only sue them if they breech their own terms and do something they don't mention there or if the company is breaking other data laws, like GDPR, for example.

I think that's the angle he is talking from. Those online privacy policies don't include selling their customers data to third parties. No one will sue a company for not violating their own rules. But these days how many people do actually sue these companies as they are constantly selling off their customers data to third parties. Most people don't even take their time to read to those policies when signing up for an app or website. And I think these companies are aware that majority of the people don't read those lengthy policies anymore.

Therefore they will include some clauses that will favour them in it and people click without even reading. Are we going to blame someone who draft dangerous policies that will favour them or blame people who don't read them? Even if you read them, you will still consent because you need their services at that point because you don't have alternatives. For me these policies are just there to favour those companies who don't care about their customers. It makes me wonder sometimes if true privacy can actually exist in this present world?

[Pmalek]

Those online privacy policies don't include selling their customers data to third parties.

Most Terms & Conditions and/or Privacy Policies mention sharing and making data available to partner services. They will also have a clause stating that by agreeing to those terms and using the service, you agree to such sharing of data. What they usually don't mention is who they share your data with or why. 

[tbct_mt2]

Most Terms & Conditions and/or Privacy Policies mention sharing and making data available to partner services. They will also have a clause stating that by agreeing to those terms and using the service, you agree to such sharing of data. What they usually don't mention is who they share your data with or why. 

You only can click on Agree and move on to use their service or leave and find another service to use.

These terms are everywhere and very popular on centralized platforms. They always write a vague situation, open one at the end of each term that will be their reference point, when they use ToS against their customers.

So it's easy, if you want privacy, and see that a platform does not protect it, find others with non KYC, with better privacy policy. Agree to start means you accept to their ToS and are ready to lose your privacy with time.

[Cookdata]

I think not, because this news about Pavel Durov does not really concern the crypto industry. Yes, now we cannot be sure that Telegram will reliably save our data, and of course those who store personal data and passwords there should have deleted them from Telegram after this news.
Regarding anonymous coins like Monero or ZCash - unfortunately, they have been driven into a corner for a long time, and it seems that anonymous coins are living out their time.
Anonymity is being taken away from us, and I think that all forum members here felt it after the mixers were blocked...

Telegram doesn't have password log, they only have users number, the date the number was registered on the platform and the ip addresses that are used to access the platform. To login, you need a one time password to access the account, so there is nothing like password on telegram and that's what they share with the government when they think you have violated what the governments don't want you to do.

As for Durov, the Telegram open network is run by independent group of team, not related to telegram but you really think they don't know the development going on the network, he do give a shout out and definitely support the blockchain, what he is only doing is avoid linking the blockchain to the app because it's already forbiden from beginning but somehow, people are coming to telegram and signing up because they want to use the app, he is definitely involved in the Ton network.

[dkbit98]

The best thing is still to try and keep as much information about yourself far away from any Third Party.  It is almost impossible nowadays and it will become worse in time, but the best we can do is just try our best.

This is easier said than done in real life, especially if you are creating many online accounts with your personal information, and if you are combining that with different online payment methods.
Problem with terms of use is that companies are changing them all the time, and most of the people just accept that without reading anything.
Privacy with telegram and with most privacy email services like proton was always an illusion.

[Nwada001]

Problem with terms of use is that companies are changing them all the time, and most of the people just accept that without reading anything.

The most annoying part of some of this update in terms of service by some of these platforms is that they will not remember to send a service update to their already existing customers, or they usually do it on purpose to always get something they can use against the person in case they won't be okay with the new update policy.

[Pmalek]

The most annoying part of some of this update in terms of service by some of these platforms is that they will not remember to send a service update to their already existing customers, or they usually do it on purpose to always get something they can use against the person in case they won't be okay with the new update policy.

This also differs from service to service. I am sure you have received emails from service providers you are signed up with, informing you about updates in Terms & Conditions with information on what was changed or a link to review the changes. But this is usually ignored, and no one checks it. Another method that companies use to inform their customers is when you log in to a service, you will get a popup or notification that terms have changed. Again, people don't read it and just agree to the changes if it's required of them.

One more thing: the terms of many services state that the company can update and change them at any time. By agreeing and accepting the TOS, you also agree to future changes/updates.

[Tmoonz]

The most annoying part of some of this update in terms of service by some of these platforms is that they will not remember to send a service update to their already existing customers, or they usually do it on purpose to always get something they can use against the person in case they won't be okay with the new update policy.

This also differs from service to service. I am sure you have received emails from service providers you are signed up with, informing you about updates in Terms & Conditions with information on what was changed or a link to review the changes. But this is usually ignored, and no one checks it. Another method that companies use to inform their customers is when you log in to a service, you will get a popup or notification that terms have changed. Again, people don't read it and just agree to the changes if it's required of them.

One more thing: the terms of many services state that the company can update and change them at any time. By agreeing and accepting the TOS, you also agree to future changes/updates.

I completely agreed with you on this, how at most times people ignores reading not just reading but reading and understanding the terms and conditions before signing up can become very problematic where at some point when changes/updates negatively affects us we look for who to be blamed. However, in my school of thought their is no privacy towards whatever that is done between two parties hence we should be expecting the best or even the worst senerio cases whenever we have an agreement between another body that is not just you only.

[Plaguedeath]

I completely agreed with you on this, how at most times people ignores reading not just reading but reading and understanding the terms and conditions before signing up can become very problematic where at some point when changes/updates negatively affects us we look for who to be blamed. However, in my school of thought their is no privacy towards whatever that is done between two parties hence we should be expecting the best or even the worst senerio cases whenever we have an agreement between another body that is not just you only.

We have no privacy when we talk about our identity, everything are exposed. If your real name is quite unique, not something like "Thomas", "Jack" or "Bob", you can try to search your full name in google, it's a high possibility it will show something related to your identity.

But, if we want to hide few thing, it's still possible including to hide how much coins you have.