Retail adoption hurts bitcoin price it doesn't help it and here's why

[jjc326]

It depends. I'm one of the people behind BitKassa, the Dutch Bitcoin payment provider that is being used for most merchants in Arnhem (active since the Arnhem Bitcoincity event in May). Most merchants use BitKassa to accept Bitcoin payments and receive euros. However, these bitcoins are not being dumped on exchanges. So far we have sold exactly ZERO bitcoins of all the payments we processed.

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Unless they can do things like pay interest on loans, buy can for their cars and food every night with bitcoin straight up, they'll have to sell bitcoin for fiat at some point. That's the problem right now.  Like their employees aren't taking thousands of bitcoins for salary I'll tell you that much.

[cryptworld]

I have alwas thought about this point
imagine amazon selling his diaries sells in bitcoin market
fatality
but there are many points of view

[oceans]

It would be nice if these companies would offer an option to pay employees a portion of there pay in BTC if they so chose. It wouldn't be much different then them offering a stock option or something like that. Granted it would be higher risk but I bet alot of people would take some coin a couple percent perhaps.

[zedicus]

It depends. I'm one of the people behind BitKassa, the Dutch Bitcoin payment provider that is being used for most merchants in Arnhem (active since the Arnhem Bitcoincity event in May). Most merchants use BitKassa to accept Bitcoin payments and receive euros. However, these bitcoins are not being dumped on exchanges. So far we have sold exactly ZERO bitcoins of all the payments we processed.

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Unless they can do things like pay interest on loans, buy can for their cars and food every night with bitcoin straight up, they'll have to sell bitcoin for fiat at some point. That's the problem right now.  Like their employees aren't taking thousands of bitcoins for salary I'll tell you that much.

I don't think this would be possible. This person would have massive exchange rate risks and would be vulnerable to loosing a lot of money. This would also very quickly get expensive for him because some business process tens of thousands of dollars in bitcoin sales per month.

[zolace]

It depends. I'm one of the people behind BitKassa, the Dutch Bitcoin payment provider that is being used for most merchants in Arnhem (active since the Arnhem Bitcoincity event in May). Most merchants use BitKassa to accept Bitcoin payments and receive euros. However, these bitcoins are not being dumped on exchanges. So far we have sold exactly ZERO bitcoins of all the payments we processed.

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Unless they can do things like pay interest on loans, buy can for their cars and food every night with bitcoin straight up, they'll have to sell bitcoin for fiat at some point. That's the problem right now.  Like their employees aren't taking thousands of bitcoins for salary I'll tell you that much.

I don't think this would be possible. This person would have massive exchange rate risks and would be vulnerable to loosing a lot of money. This would also very quickly get expensive for him because some business process tens of thousands of dollars in bitcoin sales per month.

isnt there a new service where you can lock the value of your bitcoins then im sure they can lock each transaction made then it wouldnt be a problem for them to hold the bitcoins and pay there employees as well.

[Jace]

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Yes, and yes.

[aesma]

It depends. I'm one of the people behind BitKassa, the Dutch Bitcoin payment provider that is being used for most merchants in Arnhem (active since the Arnhem Bitcoincity event in May). Most merchants use BitKassa to accept Bitcoin payments and receive euros. However, these bitcoins are not being dumped on exchanges. So far we have sold exactly ZERO bitcoins of all the payments we processed.

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Unless they can do things like pay interest on loans, buy can for their cars and food every night with bitcoin straight up, they'll have to sell bitcoin for fiat at some point. That's the problem right now.  Like their employees aren't taking thousands of bitcoins for salary I'll tell you that much.

I don't think this would be possible. This person would have massive exchange rate risks and would be vulnerable to loosing a lot of money. This would also very quickly get expensive for him because some business process tens of thousands of dollars in bitcoin sales per month.

isnt there a new service where you can lock the value of your bitcoins then im sure they can lock each transaction made then it wouldnt be a problem for them to hold the bitcoins and pay there employees as well.

Then the service is taking the risk and is probably expensive, while not really safe, if Bitcoin crashes really bad, you can bet the company would fold.

The only possibility is that investors in the company use it as a way to buy into Bitcoin over time, using spare millions of Euros they've got.

[noviapriani]

Then the company will need some valuable backing to do so, but  also heard there was some kind of locking the value of bitcoin service coming.  some type of bitcoin locker, heard of it?

[Nagle]

Isn't there a new service where you can lock the value of your bitcoins?

Yes, Coinbase will do that. For a few minutes. Just long enough that shopping cart programs can accept Bitcoins without the selling merchant taking an exchange risk. You pay a small premium for that service.

[wasserman99]

It depends. I'm one of the people behind BitKassa, the Dutch Bitcoin payment provider that is being used for most merchants in Arnhem (active since the Arnhem Bitcoincity event in May). Most merchants use BitKassa to accept Bitcoin payments and receive euros. However, these bitcoins are not being dumped on exchanges. So far we have sold exactly ZERO bitcoins of all the payments we processed.

So how does it work? Do you pay the merchants EUR from your own reserves? Is it sustainable?

Unless they can do things like pay interest on loans, buy can for their cars and food every night with bitcoin straight up, they'll have to sell bitcoin for fiat at some point. That's the problem right now.  Like their employees aren't taking thousands of bitcoins for salary I'll tell you that much.

I don't think this would be possible. This person would have massive exchange rate risks and would be vulnerable to loosing a lot of money. This would also very quickly get expensive for him because some business process tens of thousands of dollars in bitcoin sales per month.

isnt there a new service where you can lock the value of your bitcoins then im sure they can lock each transaction made then it wouldnt be a problem for them to hold the bitcoins and pay there employees as well.

This sounds more or less like selling your bitcoin and then repurchasing more bitcoin when you are ready to spend it. If you did not actually do this then you would need to pay for some kind of derivative that would essentially cause similar effects on the market.

[botany]

This sounds more or less like selling your bitcoin and then repurchasing more bitcoin when you are ready to spend it. If you did not actually do this then you would need to pay for some kind of derivative that would essentially cause similar effects on the market.

Selling and repurchasing bitcoin without the transaction fees.

[allthingsluxury]

This is something that has been greatly debated time and time again. I believe in the grand scheme of things, adoption is the greatest way to grow bitcoin.

[Mobius]

This sounds more or less like selling your bitcoin and then repurchasing more bitcoin when you are ready to spend it. If you did not actually do this then you would need to pay for some kind of derivative that would essentially cause similar effects on the market.

Selling and repurchasing bitcoin without the transaction fees.

I think the setup described by zolace would likely have a greater effective fee then selling and then buying bitcoin on an exchange. The "fee" would likely be in the form of some kind of risk premium that you would need to pay to compensate the other side of the transaction for the risk they are taking. This is very similar to how various types of options on financial products work.