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Author Topic: Can someone tell me which is the most secure of the offline wallets?  (Read 6760 times)
Muhammed Zakir
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February 20, 2015, 01:35:30 PM
 #101

How about bitcoin core ? We need to download the blockchain or no?
yes you have to download the whole blockchain, but you may speed up this process, by looking for a torrent and then bootstraping it into your wallet.
Here is the help on that: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=145386.0, for the up-to-date torrent use google.

0.10 is super-fast and torrent isn't needed, I don't know whether it would even work.

wow thanks for explain but the power wallet is too hard for me to use that

Compiling is easy if you have visual studio.

   -MZ

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February 20, 2015, 01:51:12 PM
 #102

You don't need to download the blockchain to generate a wallet, you can always create the transaction on an online computer then transfer it using a usb the offline computer, sign and use online computer to broadcast it.

Bitcoin Armory can't sign normal raw TX. I don't know if there is any script which can do it. You can use CounterWallet to create a Armory compatible raw unsigned TX.

How about bitcoin core ? We need to download the blockchain or no?

Yes, you have to but you can also use Bitcoin core like ranochigo told. You might be interested in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=958960.0 but I haven't verified the source code yet.

   -MZ
My bad, mixed up armory with electrum somehow. Thanks for correcting. Bitcoin core can sign raw tx using the RPC console so blockchain isn't really required since you can still spend them by signing and broadcasting the transaction.

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Muhammed Zakir
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February 20, 2015, 02:39:56 PM
 #103

My bad, mixed up armory with electrum somehow. Thanks for correcting.

You are welcome! Converting raw TX to Armory raw TX - not tested:

So I figured it out and wrote a script to do this, which will take a bitcoind hex raw txn and convert to an armory style txn, which should be good for signing and/or broadcasting (if already signed) I would think.

Any suggestions to the script are welcome (and feel free to add this to the armory extras folder):

Code:
import sys
sys.path.append("/usr/lib/armory")
from armoryengine import *

#See https://bitcoinarmory.com/developers/python-scripting/

if len(sys.argv) != 3:
    print "Please pass wallet file, followed by hex encoded unsigned raw txn"
    sys.exit(2)

walletPath = sys.argv[1]
hexRawTxn = sys.argv[2]

wlt = PyBtcWallet().readWalletFile(walletPath)
# Register wallet and start blockchain scan
TheBDM.registerWallet(wlt)
TheBDM.setBlocking(True)
TheBDM.setOnlineMode(True)  # will take 20 min for rescan
# Need "syncWithBlockchain" every time TheBDM is updated
wlt.syncWithBlockchain()

#Translate raw txn
pytx = PyTx()
print("Encoding raw txn: %s" % hexRawTxn)
binTxn = hex_to_binary(hexRawTxn)
pytx.unserialize(binTxn)
tx = PyTxDistProposal(pytx)
print("\n\nOutput is:\n%s" % tx.serializeAscii())

TheBDM.execCleanShutdown()

Bitcoin core can sign raw tx using the RPC console so blockchain isn't really required since you can still spend them by signing and broadcasting the transaction.

To get a list of unspent TX outputs(UTXO) with details, you can use block explorer APIs. Recommended : https://blockchain.info/unspent?address=your_address&format=json or http://btc.blockr.io/api/v1/address/unspent/your_address.

Eg:- https://blockchain.info/unspent?address=1MZakirz92c76pK6BNy1NAEmbWYpDcP7mh&format=json or http://btc.blockr.io/api/v1/address/unspent/1MZakirz92c76pK6BNy1NAEmbWYpDcP7mh will show UTXOs of my address.

If you want to get a human-friendly UI, change 'json' to 'html' in Blockchain.info, i.e., https://blockchain.info/unspent?address=your_address&format=html, for mine : https://blockchain.info/unspent?1MZakirz92c76pK6BNy1NAEmbWYpDcP7mh&format=html.

For help, see https://people.xiph.org/~greg/signdemo.txt. More about the words in raw TX:

Each unspent output in the list will have:
  • txid = The transactionID of the transaction that sent you the bitcoins
  • vout = The output index to the specific output from that transaction that sent you the bitcoins
  • scriptPubKey = Not important for our current purpose, but sets up the requirements for spending the output
  • amount = the amount of bitcoins the output would contribute to a transaction if it is used as an input
  • confirmations = the number of confirmations received on the output so far

   -MZ

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February 20, 2015, 02:48:10 PM
 #104

Although not a "wallet" as such the CIYAM Safe (https://susestudio.com/a/kp8B3G/ciyam-safe) is arguably the most secure way to do offline tx signing as it uses QR codes and cams for communications only (the latest revelations about the NSA and firmware with HDDs might have you wondering whether you really want to be plugging in a USB device from your online computer into your offline computer).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
Muhammed Zakir
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February 20, 2015, 03:13:27 PM
 #105

Although not a "wallet" as such the CIYAM Safe (https://susestudio.com/a/kp8B3G/ciyam-safe) is arguably the most secure way to do offline tx signing as it uses QR codes and cams for communications only.

That's good but what if there is no cam?

(the latest revelations about the NSA and firmware with HDDs might have you wondering whether you really want to be plugging in a USB device from your online computer into your offline computer).

More details : https://twitter.com/KZM279/status/568489124136689664

   -MZ

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February 20, 2015, 03:15:01 PM
 #106

That's good but what if there is no cam?

You can add a cam (without comprising the security assuming once you have plugged the cam into the offline computer you never plug it into an online computer again) or am I missing something that you are implying?

Understand that even if the cams are infected with whatever it can't compromise the QR code comms (apart from just make them invalid).

There is no *code* in the QR code comms (i.e. data only).

For the cam itself to be able to somehow compromise the offline CIYAM Safe then it would have to had to have code specifically written to do that (so perhaps buy a cam that is older than 2012 if really paranoid).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
Muhammed Zakir
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February 20, 2015, 03:48:53 PM
 #107

You can add a cam (without comprising the security assuming once you have plugged the cam into the offline computer you never plug it into an online computer again) or am I missing something that you are implying?

Understand that even if the cams are infected with whatever it can't compromise the QR code comms (apart from just make them invalid).

There is no *code* in the QR code comms (i.e. data only).

For the cam itself to be able to somehow compromise the offline CIYAM Safe then it would have to had to have code specifically written to do that (so perhaps buy a cam that is older than 2012 if really paranoid).

Thanks for the explanation!

I have a 80's or 90's cam but I can't even see correctly. Wink

I will check more about it.

   -MZ

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February 20, 2015, 03:52:35 PM
 #108

Luckily simple Bitcoin txs are actually quite small so the cam doesn't even need to be that good (I used one from the 90's for initial testing and it worked fine - it only struggled with GPG keys as they are much bigger - which is why I split the encrypted GPG private key into two QR codes).

CIYAM Safe uses GPG so that you can also safely "back up" your offline private keys (using QR codes of course).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
Muhammed Zakir
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February 20, 2015, 04:10:37 PM
 #109

Luckily simple Bitcoin txs are actually quite small so the cam doesn't even need to be that good (I used one from the 90's for initial testing and it worked fine - it only struggled with GPG keys as they are much bigger - which is why I split the encrypted GPG private key into two QR codes).

CIYAM Safe uses GPG so that you can also safely "back up" your offline private keys (using QR codes of course).


That would be awesome! I will try it and post about it here(if possible). Thanks once again.

   -MZ

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February 20, 2015, 05:39:42 PM
 #110

Some other options besides are fireproof wallets:

https://bitkee.com/



http://cryptocards.co/



Plenty of options to secure your offline stash.

These are nice!
Cool idea to have you're public address in a card and simply put it on your wallet, I always have it on my phone but it's stressful when the battery dies.
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February 20, 2015, 05:51:45 PM
 #111

Some other options besides are fireproof wallets:

https://bitkee.com/

[img ]https://bitkee.com/img/gallery/BIP38-Titanium.png[/img]

http://cryptocards.co/

[img ]http://cdn.makeuseof.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/bitcoin-and-dogecoin-cryptocards-.jpg?84ec63[/img]

Plenty of options to secure your offline stash.

These are nice!
Cool idea to have you're public address in a card and simply put it on your wallet, I always have it on my phone but it's stressful when the battery dies.

It's cool to have your public key printed/carved on to something which looks good but it is bad idea to have a private key there.

   -MZ

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February 21, 2015, 06:54:10 AM
 #112

Some other options besides are fireproof wallets:

https://bitkee.com/

[img ]https://bitkee.com/img/gallery/BIP38-Titanium.png[/img]

http://cryptocards.co/

[img ]http://cdn.makeuseof.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/bitcoin-and-dogecoin-cryptocards-.jpg?84ec63[/img]

Plenty of options to secure your offline stash.

These are nice!
Cool idea to have you're public address in a card and simply put it on your wallet, I always have it on my phone but it's stressful when the battery dies.

It's cool to have your public key printed/carved on to something which looks good but it is bad idea to have a private key there.

   -MZ
I don't see it as a bad idea, encrypt it with BIP38 and it would be safe even if someone sees the card. To prevent the loss of the item, you can always write the key on several papers and place it on different geographical location.

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BC.GAME
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February 21, 2015, 07:25:00 AM
 #113

the most secure wallet is what "you" make most secure

there is no such thing as most secure. you can lose all of them if you don't them secure enough

Actually yes their is a such thing as "most secure"its called a wallet that hasn't seen the light of the internet. Their always has to be that one guy who comments just to stir up some senseless debate.
actually you didn't quite understand my comment. even a paper wallet can not be secure as long as you don't keep it safe. it can be lost damaged or even be stolen!

Weak hands have been complaining about missing out ever since bitcoin was $1 and never buy the dip.
Whales are those who keep buying the dip.
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February 21, 2015, 09:55:34 AM
 #114

the most secure wallet is what "you" make most secure

there is no such thing as most secure. you can lose all of them if you don't them secure enough

Actually yes their is a such thing as "most secure"its called a wallet that hasn't seen the light of the internet. Their always has to be that one guy who comments just to stir up some senseless debate.
actually you didn't quite understand my comment. even a paper wallet can not be secure as long as you don't keep it safe. it can be lost damaged or even be stolen!
If you keep a few backups of them at different geographical places and the wallet is encrypted with password, it would be more than secure since the funds cannot be stolen without password.

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