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Author Topic: Inside The Conservative Campaign To Stop Cops From Enforcing Federal Gun Laws  (Read 858 times)
Chef Ramsay (OP)
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March 01, 2015, 12:39:43 AM
 #1

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Right now, there are a number of federal laws restricting various kinds of gun use. For example, felons, fugitives, people convicted of domestic abuse misdemeanors and people subject to certain domestic restraining orders are restricted from buying guns under federal law. And no civilians are allowed to buy newly manufactured machine guns.

In Montana, the state House passed legislation earlier this month that would prohibit the enforcement of any potential federal ban or restriction on firearms and magazines. If a Montana cop did enforce such a federal law, it would be considered theft of public money. The Montana bill says that state employees are still allowed to enforce some federal laws -- for example, the ban on machine guns. But most states that have introduced this type of legislation have used broader language.

An Arizona bill that passed two state Senate committees this month says that state employees can't enforce "all federal [laws]... that are in violation of the Second Amendment" if they "violate the Second Amendment's true meaning." That bill does not address federal restrictions on domestic abusers or felons. And Arizona state law is weaker than the federal law in some respects. The state does prohibit people convicted of domestic violence misdemeanors from owning firearms -- but only while they are serving their probation.

The so-called "nullification" movement isn't entirely new, but it has taken off since President Barack Obama was elected, and it appears to have been further spurred on by the anti-gun sentiments many people expressed after the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in 2012.

"I am concerned with Obama, his admin[istration] has been hostile to gun rights," state Rep. Art Wittich (R), the sponsor of the Montana legislation, told The Huffington Post in an email.

Gary Marbut, president of the Montana Shooting Sports Association, was involved in writing the first draft of that bill. He said he discussed the concept in 2009 while waiting to appear on Glenn Beck's Fox News show with Andrew Napolitano, the senior judicial analyst for Fox News, in New York City. As Marbut remembers it, Napolitano told him: "All you need to do is don't help [the federal government] enforce these federal laws, because they don't have the manpower to do it."

Napolitano did not respond to a request for comment, although The Huffington Post verified that he did appear on Beck's show with Marbut in 2009 to discuss gun legislation.


...


The way this could play out, said David Kopel, an adjunct constitutional law professor at the University of Denver, is that if the federal government were to ban assault weapons, and then a local cop pulled someone over for a traffic violation and saw an assault weapon in the car, the cop could simply give the guy a ticket for the traffic violation and send him on his way.

A handful of states have passed nullification laws in the last few years. The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence is challenging a Kansas law that goes so far as to declare that Kansas firearms and accessories are "not subject to any federal law, treaty, federal regulation, or federal executive action." (A similar Montana law was struck down in 2013 by the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.)

The Brady Campaign argues that the Kansas law is reminiscent of certain states' efforts in the 1950s to fight federal law requiring the integration of African-American students into all-white schools. Jonathan Lowy, director of the Legal Action Project at the Brady Campaign, told HuffPost that these kinds of gun laws are "blatantly unconstitutional" and "extraordinarily dangerous" if permitted by the courts.

The Obama administration has agreed that the Kansas law is unconstitutional. "I am writing to inform you that federal law enforcement agencies... will continue to execute their duties to enforce all federal firearm laws," Attorney General Eric Holder told Kansas Gov. Sam Brownback (R) in an April 2013 letter.

More...http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/26/federal-gun-laws_n_6754416.html
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March 02, 2015, 12:44:30 PM
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Right now, there are a number of federal laws restricting various kinds of gun use. For example, felons, fugitives, people convicted of domestic abuse misdemeanors and people subject to certain domestic restraining orders are restricted from buying guns under federal law. And no civilians are allowed to buy newly manufactured machine guns.

In Montana, the state House passed legislation earlier this month that would prohibit the enforcement of any potential federal ban or restriction on firearms and magazines. If a Montana cop did enforce such a federal law, it would be considered theft of public money. The Montana bill says that state employees are still allowed to enforce some federal laws -- for example, the ban on machine guns. But most states that have introduced this type of legislation have used broader language.

An Arizona bill that passed two state Senate committees this month says that state employees can't enforce "all federal [laws]... that are in violation of the Second Amendment" if they "violate the Second Amendment's true meaning." That bill does not address federal restrictions on domestic abusers or felons. And Arizona state law is weaker than the federal law in some respects. The state does prohibit people convicted of domestic violence misdemeanors from owning firearms -- but only while they are serving their probation.

The so-called "nullification" movement isn't entirely new, but it has taken off since President Barack Obama was elected, and it appears to have been further spurred on by the anti-gun sentiments many people expressed after the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in 2012.

"I am concerned with Obama, his admin[istration] has been hostile to gun rights," state Rep. Art Wittich (R), the sponsor of the Montana legislation, told The Huffington Post in an email.

Gary Marbut, president of the Montana Shooting Sports Association, was involved in writing the first draft of that bill. He said he discussed the concept in 2009 while waiting to appear on Glenn Beck's Fox News show with Andrew Napolitano, the senior judicial analyst for Fox News, in New York City. As Marbut remembers it, Napolitano told him: "All you need to do is don't help [the federal government] enforce these federal laws, because they don't have the manpower to do it."

Napolitano did not respond to a request for comment, although The Huffington Post verified that he did appear on Beck's show with Marbut in 2009 to discuss gun legislation.


...


The way this could play out, said David Kopel, an adjunct constitutional law professor at the University of Denver, is that if the federal government were to ban assault weapons, and then a local cop pulled someone over for a traffic violation and saw an assault weapon in the car, the cop could simply give the guy a ticket for the traffic violation and send him on his way.

A handful of states have passed nullification laws in the last few years. The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence is challenging a Kansas law that goes so far as to declare that Kansas firearms and accessories are "not subject to any federal law, treaty, federal regulation, or federal executive action." (A similar Montana law was struck down in 2013 by the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.)

The Brady Campaign argues that the Kansas law is reminiscent of certain states' efforts in the 1950s to fight federal law requiring the integration of African-American students into all-white schools. Jonathan Lowy, director of the Legal Action Project at the Brady Campaign, told HuffPost that these kinds of gun laws are "blatantly unconstitutional" and "extraordinarily dangerous" if permitted by the courts.

The Obama administration has agreed that the Kansas law is unconstitutional. "I am writing to inform you that federal law enforcement agencies... will continue to execute their duties to enforce all federal firearm laws," Attorney General Eric Holder told Kansas Gov. Sam Brownback (R) in an April 2013 letter.

More...http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/26/federal-gun-laws_n_6754416.html

The entire premises of this may be wrong.

I am not aware that "cops", being agencies of the municipality, or the county, the county being a division of the state, have statutory authority to enforce federal laws at all.  In some cases federal law is essentially written into state law, but in many cases it is not.

Also factually in error seems to be the assertion that citizens cannot buy "newly manufactured machine guns."  That's just the $200 BATF fee and stamp, right?
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March 03, 2015, 04:10:23 AM
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The entire premises of this may be wrong.

I am not aware that "cops", being agencies of the municipality, or the county, the county being a division of the state, have statutory authority to enforce federal laws at all.  In some cases federal law is essentially written into state law, but in many cases it is not.

Also factually in error seems to be the assertion that citizens cannot buy   That's just the $200 BATF fee and stamp, right?


You are right to a degree. In general police would not be enforcing federal laws, but they certainly could make the arrest and send it to court in a federal jurisdiction. In addition to reporting the person to appropriate federal agencies. It seems what they are seeking to do is to remove that potentiality within the state by making such actions criminal in their own right by invoking the supremacy of State law over Federal law. As far as the part about no "newly manufactured machine guns", I believe this is relatively new legislation, similar to the now elapsed "assault rifle" ban which prohibited the manufacture or import of new "assault rifles".
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March 03, 2015, 03:00:17 PM
 #4

The entire premises of this may be wrong.

I am not aware that "cops", being agencies of the municipality, or the county, the county being a division of the state, have statutory authority to enforce federal laws at all.  In some cases federal law is essentially written into state law, but in many cases it is not.

Also factually in error seems to be the assertion that citizens cannot buy   That's just the $200 BATF fee and stamp, right?


You are right to a degree. In general police would not be enforcing federal laws, but they certainly could make the arrest and send it to court in a federal jurisdiction. In addition to reporting the person to appropriate federal agencies. It seems what they are seeking to do is to remove that potentiality within the state by making such actions criminal in their own right by invoking the supremacy of State law over Federal law. As far as the part about no "newly manufactured machine guns", I believe this is relatively new legislation, similar to the now elapsed "assault rifle" ban which prohibited the manufacture or import of new "assault rifles".
A policeman cannot make an arrest for crime that he is not empowered to do so for.

But on second thought, I googled this question and guess what?  Up comes the same discussion on some cop forum.  There are all kinds of variations practiced.

http://forums.officer.com/t182024/

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