Looking For Advice On Opening My Own Bitcoin ATM Business

[DebitMe]

I am interested in hearing stories about people owning or operating their own Bitcoin ATM's.  I have a potential opportunity to install machines into some convenience stores and want to know some of the challenges and rewards of making this investment.

Some things I am interested about finding out about...

Obviously sales, I know this will vary by location and what not, but generally, what kind of interest have you seen in your ATM within the 1st month, 2nd month, and so on?  Did you generally see business rise the longer your ATM was active?

Regulatory concerns.  Based on what I have read about KS, by buying and selling from me to another person, I am not in need of a money transfer license.  If I were to use a 3rd party exchange to connect buyer and sellers, then I get into issues.  So by owning a machine that I stock with bitcoins, I should not have any issues with the current law.  Can anyone share any research they have done on the subject?

I am going to have to research whether this would be considered a service or goods for sales tax purposes.  Thoughts?

Security and machine type?  How secure was the machine and did you feel comfortable leaving it in a store, possibly in not so nice neighborhoods?  Did you have insurance on your machine and if so, how much was it and where did you get it?  Were you ever robbed/machine stolen?

Issues with the machine.  How often did you find yourself servicing the machine for errors or other problems?  Were the machines easy enough to just set and collect once a week or did other problems arise?

I am also wondering if I should apply and get an EIN and make this into an actual business with its own books and bank accounts/what not.  Would probably be easier to manage everything that way, but I am not totally sure yet.  Anyone create a business around this?  The spots where the machines would go are not owned by me, but by someone I have been put in contact with.  I have no idea how he would want to structure the deal, but if anyone has paid for space or shared monthly profits, what has the split been for just renting space?

This is a pretty good list of questions to start with.  I am planning to visit some other ATM's in my area to find out what premiums they are charging and other information that they owner might share with me.  If there are any further experiences or thoughts please share them here as I would need to put a business proposal together if I were to move forward with this plan.

Thank you everyone for reading, I look forward to hearing your responses

[DebitMe]

Some information I have gathered for Kansas that may be interesting to some.  I do not believe that Bitcoin sales are subject to Sales Tax in the state of Kansas.

Sales of coins, bullion, stamps, antiques, collectables, commemoratives, and other similar items are subject to sales tax even though purchased as an investment. It is immaterial that a gain, benefit, or other advantage may not be realized until the resale of the item. [ Kan. Admin. Regs. §92-19-56 .] Exchanges of currency   or coins for other currency   or coins at face value are not taxable transactions. Neither are exchanges of currency   or coins at the current exchange rate taxable. But if currency or coins are bought at rates not reflecting face value or when value is determined by metal content, the purchase is taxable. [ Kan. Admin. Regs. §92-19-56(b) .]
Sales of commodity contracts for gold, silver, and similar items are not taxed. But sales of bullion and similar property that is transferred in Kansas to a customer are taxable. [ Kan. Admin. Regs. §92-19-56(d) .]

This statement basically says that anything charged above spot price is a fee.  Fees are not subject to sales tax in Kansas.

Will report back with more information as I gather it.  Please let me know any of your experiences as well.

[HeroCat]

Firstly just calculate your profit per each ATM installed each month Plus what will be the total cost, and Return Of Investment 

[jokerboy]

Actually if the place is good, you can make lots of money. How can I get an BTC ATM. Is there any information about this?

[DebitMe]

Firstly just calculate your profit per each ATM installed each month Plus what will be the total cost, and Return Of Investment 

The problem is, it is really tough to estimate profits because this is so new.  All I really have right now to base it off of is my current localbitcoin sales that I do monthly.

I believe I have a few good spots that I can get in.  Just need to finish negotiations with the guy that owns the convenience stores.

[gentlemand]

Actually if the place is good, you can make lots of money. How can I get an BTC ATM. Is there any information about this?

There are plenty of choices. Skyhook was looking promising but that seems to have some technical problems at present. Robocoin is another player but some people do not have good things to say. The Lamassu machine seems to be pleasing its customers.

It's going to need some proper homework and it's maybe best to contact existing operators for opinions.

[jokerboy]

Actually if the place is good, you can make lots of money. How can I get an BTC ATM. Is there any information about this?

There are plenty of choices. Skyhook was looking promising but that seems to have some technical problems at present. Robocoin is another player but some people do not have good things to say. The Lamassu machine seems to be pleasing its customers.

It's going to need some proper homework and it's maybe best to contact existing operators for opinions.

Thank you for information. I am thinking but this kind of application needs lots of cash. If I can find any investor in my country, maybe I will go for it.

[gentlemand]

Thank you for information. I am thinking but this kind of application needs lots of cash. If I can find any investor in my country, maybe I will go for it.

By the sounds of it location is all. If you can secure somewhere with the right crowd and plenty of footfall before you approach investors you'll be in a much stronger position.

[Swordsoffreedom]

The state you are located in makes all the difference in the United States, some states have shut down Bitcoin banks recently while others are adopting and growing at a rapid pace while I am not aware of the situation in Kansas I do know that it's a crap shoot but the best locations tend to be cafes and restaurants.

In terms of machines I have nothing but praise for Lamassu out of all the brands you can choose from Bitaccess is a good model as well.
(Power issues depend on how long the tablet has been in use but newer versions tend to run longer I believe that is a bigger issue with low cost models such as Skyhook etc)

[DebitMe]

The state you are located in makes all the difference in the United States, some states have shut down Bitcoin banks recently while others are adopting and growing at a rapid pace while I am not aware of the situation in Kansas I do know that it's a crap shoot but the best locations tend to be cafes and restaurants.

In terms of machines I have nothing but praise for Lamassu out of all the brands you can choose from Bitaccess is a good model as well.
(Power issues depend on how long the tablet has been in use but newer versions tend to run longer I believe that is a bigger issue with low cost models such as Skyhook etc)

Thanks for the advice, I have done ample research on KS laws and feel very comfortable I will not be in any trouble based on current regulations.

I would love if the convenience store I hopefully get them set up in will then start taking Bitcoins, I would suppose that would be a great reason to have traffic.  Otherwise it could be tough to let people know they are there.

I like the Lamassu and the look of them as well.  If I am doing this, I don't want to cheat corners and go for a cheaper model that will have problems.  From what I have read, the Skyhook seems to have all sorts of issues and that's something I would like to avoid.  I know the better models are more expensive, and am prepared for that, I just won't start with putting a machine in all 13 stores lol.

[Swordsoffreedom]

The state you are located in makes all the difference in the United States, some states have shut down Bitcoin banks recently while others are adopting and growing at a rapid pace while I am not aware of the situation in Kansas I do know that it's a crap shoot but the best locations tend to be cafes and restaurants.

In terms of machines I have nothing but praise for Lamassu out of all the brands you can choose from Bitaccess is a good model as well.
(Power issues depend on how long the tablet has been in use but newer versions tend to run longer I believe that is a bigger issue with low cost models such as Skyhook etc)

Thanks for the advice, I have done ample research on KS laws and feel very comfortable I will not be in any trouble based on current regulations.

I would love if the convenience store I hopefully get them set up in will then start taking Bitcoins, I would suppose that would be a great reason to have traffic.  Otherwise it could be tough to let people know they are there.

I like the Lamassu and the look of them as well.  If I am doing this, I don't want to cheat corners and go for a cheaper model that will have problems.  From what I have read, the Skyhook seems to have all sorts of issues and that's something I would like to avoid.  I know the better models are more expensive, and am prepared for that, I just won't start with putting a machine in all 13 stores lol.

True that, to begin one Douro should be a good test, depending on if the market is more for Buyers or Sellers you could buy the Santo Tirso also known as the Stand for it and make it a true two way machine, however one way is what you want as I presume that in Kansas people are more interested in the buying side than in the money remittance and conversion side.

The Douro by itself is a bit small by so you will need a stand for it so no one can carry it away which is easy enough to make just a few sandbags and a good cover for it with the bolts located underneath if you feel like it you can even make it more stylish etc as long as it can bolted somewhere.

Once that's done there are some general guides that Lamassu provides its users to get started up which should be a synch such as setting up a Digital Ocean node to a Bitcoin wallet, Putty etc linking to an exchange to base your rate on they have good manuals for it the trouble in the beginning is finding the location but if you have one in mind and know a fellow that goes a long way towards it or check your local Bitcoin meetup, if there isn't one you can make one and build your market and advertising through them like Unocoin did in India etc.

[UserVVIP]

You should first test your market. For all I know your town lives under a rock and wont know what btc is, much less want it.

[DebitMe]

You should first test your market. For all I know your town lives under a rock and wont know what btc is, much less want it.

Yea I have been selling through localbitcoins for a few years now and am definitely seeing an uptrend in the market recently.  It has gotten to the point where a month and a half ago I started to really keep track of my sales amounts and profits so that I could properly report them (before this mark, it was so small that it wasn't worth it).  At the current pace, I am on track to do 100,000 in sales over a 52 week period.  Hoping I can outsource some of this to a machine in the near future as I am meeting up with people 2 to 3 nights a week.

[DebitMe]

Hey Guys, my Grandfather wants a business plan put together and is looking for some sales numbers from current owners.  If anyone currently operates one or more machines could they possibly share some sales information that they have built?

I am looking for numbers related to...
Initial period sales aka first, second, third months etc.
premium charges (what do you charge over spot).  Any other costs associated.
Current sales.  Are they increasing, staying stagnant, going down?  Average buy and/or sell order?

Thanks to everyone who is willing to share information.

[Mitchell]

Hey Guys, my Grandfather wants a business plan put together and is looking for some sales numbers from current owners.  If anyone currently operates one or more machines could they possibly share some sales information that they have built?

I am looking for numbers related to...
Initial period sales aka first, second, third months etc.
premium charges (what do you charge over spot).  Any other costs associated.
Current sales.  Are they increasing, staying stagnant, going down?  Average buy and/or sell order?

Thanks to everyone who is willing to share information.

Send MrBitco.in™ (a Bitcoin ATM collective) a message on Twitter: https://twitter.com/MrBitc0in. They own/owned a few Bitcoin ATM's in Amsterdam.