Sending BitCoins without Transaction Fees!

[BitHits]

Sending BitCoins without Transaction Fees?

Is this possible with the official client ? (ie: Client Name Satoshi Client Version v0.8.0-beta)

[exlin]

I assume you refer as a official version to bitcoin-qt
Haven't really tried but it should be. On previous version you can set transaction fee from wallets settings.

Even tho if you can do it you shouldn't. Miners reserves their fee + sometimes it can take quite long before your transaction is confirmed.

[bulltrap]

You can do 0-fee transfers at least with the latest 0.8 client.

[AdriKGB]

Good to know. Thank you

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

You can do 0-fee transfers at least with the latest 0.8 client.

I don't think the fee policy has changed.

Certain transactions are eligible without fees. If you wait before spending your coins, and if all the outputs are greater than 0.01 BTC, then you can pay no fee.

But bitcoin-qt won't let you send a TX without an acceptable fee. Use Blockchain.info for that 

[FarmerBlue]

You can do 0-fee transfers at least with the latest 0.8 client.

I can't see how to do it, only see a setting under "options" for "Optional transaction fees", which can make other then 0.00000000 and that only adds extra tx fees to already default fee.

[mintymark]

One of the main thing that determines if a fee is mandatory in the standard client is how old the coins are.

If they are 'new', so you just got them a mandatory fee is more likely needed. If you leave them there for a while (many days) then its less leikely that a mandatory fee will be needed.

The other thing that affects weather a fee is needed or not is if you are sending an amount that is made by combining many small amounts. 

Bear in mind that even if the client allows you to send with no fee, it can be problematic not to do so. I once sent a sizeable transaction without a fee and it too 24 hours to get through, rather than the usual few seconds. Yes you can bet I was really panicking about that one!!

The fee is small, its much better to include a small fee.

The 3rd factor (as far as I know) that it depends how full the current block is. This varies from block to block, so sometimes just waiting a few minutes can affect weather the transaction is allowed to go with no fee in the current client.

[BitHits]

But if the protocol specifics that 0 tx fee transactions are indeed valid, assuming its not being double spent. Then is it possible to send 'new' coins, that have at least 1 confirmation or are completely confirmed, with 6 or higher. Without tx fee, with the default client.

So far everything i have tried adds a fee. Save for using sendrawtransaction with the debug console...

So assuming using a raw transaction is the only way to do it with the official client, how would one go about signing and getting a raw transaction on its way ?

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees

"Transaction fees are voluntary on the part of the person making the bitcoin transaction, as the person attempting to make a transaction can include any fee or none at all in the transaction. On the other hand, nobody mining new bitcoins necessarily needs to accept the transactions and include them in the new block being created. The transaction fee is therefore an incentive on the part of the bitcoin user to make sure that a particular transaction will get included into the next block which is generated."

[deepceleron]

The age of the coins and the amount you are sending will determine whether you can send for free. Sending without the minimum fee when it is required will cause you headaches later, and the Bitcoin client won't let you do it.

First, recognize that a transaction is made of:
- inputs - the funding source(s), the individual payments you previously received, and
- outputs - the amount(s) you are sending to different addresses. Typically only one or two outputs, but you can send to many people in one transaction if you want.

The baseline calculation for "when it becomes free" is 1 BTC after one day. If the input of your transaction is a single 1 BTC payment you received over a day ago (144 confirmations), then Bitcoin-qt won't require a fee, even if you are only sending .1 BTC to someone else (the other .9 is also sent, but it's sent back to your wallet as another output). Likewise, if your balance is from a single 0.1 BTC, a transaction using that payment would be free to send after 10 days of confirmations.

The above examples are when your transaction is made of one input. Often a transaction will be made of many smaller previous payments to you, put together by Bitcoin in whatever way it calculates will minimize the change that needs to be sent back to you. Therefore, it can be harder to know if you will need a fee without actually attempting to send the transaction. No "warning, requires a fee" message? That means a fee was not required, and only your optional fee (if set above 0) will be included.

If any output of your transaction is less than 0.01 BTC, a minimum fee is required regardless, to keep people from cheaply spamming the blockchain by sending the same money over and over.

[Hewitt9aa]

I do make my TX fee less on blockchain.info (but seems TX need to more than 0.01 BTC and it get slow to confirm)

[filledbit]

The bitcoin fee confuses me too.  How do those "Free bitcoin" sites send 0.00005 BTC.   I do not seem to be able to do this from one wallet to another without a fee being imposed.  Do we need to put in a setting in the BITCOIN.CONF file?

[wiggi]

The bitcoin fee confuses me too.  How do those "Free bitcoin" sites send 0.00005 BTC.   I do not seem to be able to do this from one wallet to another without a fee being imposed.  Do we need to put in a setting in the BITCOIN.CONF file?

Perhaps they do pay the fees?

[wiggi]

So assuming using a raw transaction is the only way to do it with the official client, how would one go about signing and getting a raw transaction on its way ?

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees

I think it's possible using regular transactions.

For example:
if there is a wallet (official client) with lots of micro amounts (100 * 0.001 BTC)
in it, you could clean it out without fee by sending one transaction (> 1 BTC) in,
wait some days, then send out as much as the standard client allows without fee.
Rinse, repeat.

If I'm not confused atm,
5 BTC waiting for 8 days would allow the maximum free transactions size of 10KB
500000000 * 144 * 8 / 10000 = 57600000
To wait longer woulnd't help.

[alig23]

That would defeat the whole ground bitcoin is built on.

[FarmerBlue]

Think several of are struggling with these micro (or dust particles) of BTC transactions we receive form those freebee sites in to the original Bitcoin_QT client.

I do use delayed payments when i can. I also want to receive these dust pieces and then transfer them to my main wallet (a different client) without the dust being eaten up from tx fees, if they are going to be eaten up by fees there is no point in even collecting from sites that dont have delayed payments option.

(my idea of my set up i want to get these little freebees and then send them to my main wallet in bigger chunks to be stored or spent form the new main wallet) dont want my main wallet cluttered with all the dust transactions is why i want to do it this way.

therefore if there is no way to do this i want to know so i can stop collecting from no delayed payment sites.

if there is a way i want to know how cause i would rather not lose a source of free btc

[filledbit]

maybe...if you know the private key for the receviver address, you could import that key to the other wallet?  Then, you transfer the key, between wallets, not sending the coins?  Just a thought

[MilesDyson]

I can't see how to do it, only see a setting under "options" for "Optional transaction fees", which can make other then 0.00000000 and that only adds extra tx fees to already default fee.

I also do not see any way around having to pay a fee for transferring my bitcoin (dust) to another account.... every where I turn, it seams i am paying a fee of some kind or another when trying to traid/convert/spend/use bitcoins.....

I want to be a node and collect fees for nothing too. any ideas on how to do this?

[galbros]

When it comes to dust from the various faucets I've found it best just to start sending it wherever I am going to want it.  So right now I am digging peerbet, so I just send my dust from things like bitvisitor to that deposit address. 

I agree, sending it all into the bitcoin-qt client is not the smartest thing to do, though it is exactly what I did at first as well!

[ufmace]

I can't see how to do it, only see a setting under "options" for "Optional transaction fees", which can make other then 0.00000000 and that only adds extra tx fees to already default fee.

I also do not see any way around having to pay a fee for transferring my bitcoin (dust) to another account.... every where I turn, it seams i am paying a fee of some kind or another when trying to traid/convert/spend/use bitcoins.....

I want to be a node and collect fees for nothing too. any ideas on how to do this?

I'm pretty sure that the fees are collected by miners when they solve a block with the transaction in it. So start mining... though the block reward seems to be much bigger than the fees anyways.