The World's Self-Proclaimed First Bitcoin Refugee

[Davidvictorson]

I stumbled on this interesting story on YouTube. Although it is from 6years ago, I guess that many people may not have known that it happened. Otto de Voogd is the world's self-proclaimed first bitcoin refugee. Why? Because about six (6) years ago, he fled Estonia for the Netherlands after being threatened with imprisonment for being a staunch bitcoin advocate and for running a bitcoin exchange BTC.ee. What actually happened was that at that time, the Estonian government wanted to regulate bitcoin trading and other digital currencies. Otto de Voogd's company BTC.ee was one of the crypto companies targeted by the Estonian Financial Intelligence Unit. His appeal to the Tallinn Administrative Court and the Tallinn Circuit Court to operate a bitcoin exchange which was turned down twice. He therefore, had no option than to flee the country or risk being imprisoned for 3 years. Indeed bitcoin has come a long way. Do you have a similar story to share?

Source

[crwth]

This is, of course, the documented one; we will never know how many more people have been a refugee and uses Bitcoin as their source of funds. Imagine it being more than ten years ago in existence here, and the self-proclaimed one is not the first, IMO. It's going to be hard to verify, though.

I think that's just the part where it's just gaining traction, and back then, countries are finding ways to regulate it. They just probably haven't found a solution yet at that time. No one wants jail time, for sure. 

[Pmalek]

It's the first time I hear about this particular case. The site of the old Estonian exchange is still live, but it's no longer operational. The man moved to The Netherlands and started the same type of exchange there and called it CoinEra. https://coinera.eu/. That site is also still live but non-operational just like the Estonian version. He did write an announcement when he closed it down mentioning he never experienced the issues from Estonia in the Netherlands.

Interesting case. Estonia has lately often been tagged as one of the most crypto-friendly nations in the world. Looks like that wasn't always the case. Probably the root problem was that the government wanted to tax the traders but Otto didn't make it easy for them.   

BTW, your newsbtc source is unavailable.

[TheNineClub]

I wouldn't use the term Refugee for this. Financial immigrant, but definately not refugee ast that would be resrved for people who are fleeing extreme conditions, not just one financial law of their country.

As for financial immigrants, they were present from the creation of the financial system onwards, and crypto isni exeption, with pribably much more undocumented.

[jackg]

Interesting case. Estonia has lately often been tagged as one of the most crypto-friendly nations in the world. Looks like that wasn't always the case. Probably the root problem was that the government wanted to tax the traders but Otto didn't make it easy for them.   

I don't think many countries in Europe are that friendly to startups (perhaps it's the same.for the rest of the world). Removing things like tax audits for their first few years of operation (in innovative markets) does seem like a much better policy as the company would still be finding its feet.

As for financial immigrants, they were present from the creation of the financial system onwards, and crypto isni exeption, with pribably much more undocumented.

This is quite well documented with global companies trying to exempt themselves from regulations and tax too (though it can be done on individual levels - I'd guess there are pitfalls to both along with the benefits they receive).

[avikz]

I stumbled on this interesting story on YouTube. Although it is from 6years ago, I guess that many people may not have known that it happened. Otto de Voogd is the world's self-proclaimed first bitcoin refugee. Why? Because about six (6) years ago, he fled Estonia for the Netherlands after being threatened with imprisonment for being a staunch bitcoin advocate and for running a bitcoin exchange BTC.ee. What actually happened was that at that time, the Estonian government wanted to regulate bitcoin trading and other digital currencies. Otto de Voogd's company BTC.ee was one of the crypto companies targeted by the Estonian Financial Intelligence Unit. His appeal to the Tallinn Administrative Court and the Tallinn Circuit Court to operate a bitcoin exchange which was turned down twice. He therefore, had no option than to flee the country or risk being imprisoned for 3 years. Indeed bitcoin has come a long way. Do you have a similar story to share?

Source

There must be other stories available but I have one to share. But in my store I won't use the word "Refugee".

Zebpay was the first ever bitcoin wallet and exchange service available in India. They were doing business when there was no rules and regulations available for cryptocurrency in India. So as expected, Indian government started attacks through the banks and their bank accounts were frozen. The owner of Zebpay was a true visionary and he knew that if he tries to fight a legal battle in India, he will have to spend the rest of his life on this.

So he simply moved to Singapore with some of his initial employees and registered his business there. Now he is operating in more than 30 countries excluding India. Can we call him a willful refugee??

[Upgrade00]

It's always ironic to me how governments can effectively try to clamp down on those linked to things that they do not support like Bitcoin, and how media channels can censor Bitcoin related terms, but various scams are run under these platforms constantly.

It's unfortunate the guy had to flee his country, cause the government were not informed enough on how it works.
Estonia seems to be a bit more friendly now to Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies than it was all those years ago.

[franky1]

crypto-refugee's/digital-nomads have been around for long before 6 years ago.

there were even some as far back as 2010-11. people like amir taaki,
there were a few exchanges and services in 2012-14 where the CEO's moved out of the U.S to south america to avoid regulations

[takuma sato]

Most people that made it in Bitcoin renounced US citizenship, im assuming at least that would be common, similar to Roger Ver and others. They probably moved to some of these fancy islands with favourable taxing plans.

Non US citizens have it even easier, since the IRS doesn't follow your ass all around the planet. All you have to do in most cases is live 6 months out of your country and that's it, you are now paying taxes on your new country. If it is considered a tax haven you may need 4 years but there's tricks around this too.

[franky1]

there are many ways in which people can use tax loopholes. but learning these tricks is hard because the elites that use them dont want their method getting out to the public. which then leaves the lower level people that have recently become rich having to escape a country for multiple reasons as they have not had the same training as the elitists

tax tax law
did you know trump/clintons has funds stashed in 'trusts' where the funds are not 'owned' by a certain person so that certain person cannot be taxed on the value of the trust.

but as maintainer of a trust, they can make a 'personal loan' to themselves from the trust. where by loans are not taxable.

yep when you read stories of how trump has done personal loans to himself from his other entities/businesses in his name or some of the UK ministers have gave themselves personal loans. that is their way of getting hold of the cash tax free.
ofcourse the terms of the personal loans are repayment plans of $1 a decade and zero interest.. and ofcourse if they default on themselves its not like they wil chase themselves or sue themselves

(this is not financial advice i have over simplified alot of aspects.. speak to a well trained tax lawyer to get better, advice about tax loop holes)