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Author Topic: New York Prohibition of Mining Law  (Read 276 times)
stompix
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November 30, 2022, 11:20:35 AM
 #21

Now if all coal paid that price for killing the land then coal would not be very cheap at all. So coal is being subsidized here in USA as I type.
I can make a very simple statement this needs to be addressed one way or the other and so far it is not being addressed in a good way.
look at satellite shots and you will see mile and miles and miles and mile and miles of these pits. Every one was a subsidy for coal mining.

And solar panels are not made from materials that are mined just like coal, and they don't end up in huge waste dumps in Africa and India, and let's not even talk about the child labor involved in mining lithium in South America, without which most of home solar installations would be useless with no batteries. Also, you know that coal is used to refine silicon right? So no coke, more expensive solar panels!

And let's not forget that without good old coal and nuclear there won't be any light at night and nobody to give you electricity for you credits you gain during the day with the panels. There is no perfect source of energy, coal and gas pollute more, and solar is highly subsidized, and just like the wind you end up with tons of nonrecycled waste, hydro can't possibly give us all the energy we need, and nuclear, although my favorite won't be able to scale int he next half a century even if we want to build them.

I am not debating ANY of that.

Just pointing out that it was at best political theater. The BTC price is down, no new permits have been applied for. Unless we enter a bull market in the next 2 years there will be no new permits, mostly because there is no reason for them.
There is enough space and the old permitted places are still coming online and some are actively trying to sell off excess space. Pass some legislation to make yourself look good.

From the political point of view this "ban" is indeed stupid, just like the ban in EU (not Europe) if it ever happens, common, next ban cocoa plantations in Norway, tariffs have already killed mining there, so what's left to ban?

Anyhow, I was trying to point out that just like Amazon buys tax credits and declares is not polluting right now with a million vans, just like Google does so and miraculously their data centers that run on a mix of energy become green with money so do some of the miners, greenwashing their business when they know it's not like that. I mean seriously, it's hilarious when the so-called Bitcoin Mining council was publishing all those percentages about how green they are, and the biggest backer behind them, MARA was quietly operating that coal powerplant in Montana

The whole thing is pointless from both sides, NY knows that it can't make all consumers turn to green energy as there isn't enough there so they hand-pick some to show they are doing stuff, miners claim the same stuff about being ecofriendly to get investors, knowing that not even 1% will go and try to find out details on how thing work if they were they wouldn't pour millions in business that are losing money as we speak and in reality nothing changes.

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philipma1957
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November 30, 2022, 01:24:50 PM
 #22

Now if all coal paid that price for killing the land then coal would not be very cheap at all. So coal is being subsidized here in USA as I type.
I can make a very simple statement this needs to be addressed one way or the other and so far it is not being addressed in a good way.
look at satellite shots and you will see mile and miles and miles and mile and miles of these pits. Every one was a subsidy for coal mining.

And solar panels are not made from materials that are mined just like coal, and they don't end up in huge waste dumps in Africa and India, and let's not even talk about the child labor involved in mining lithium in South America, without which most of home solar installations would be useless with no batteries. Also, you know that coal is used to refine silicon right? So no coke, more expensive solar panels!

And let's not forget that without good old coal and nuclear there won't be any light at night and nobody to give you electricity for you credits you gain during the day with the panels. There is no perfect source of energy, coal and gas pollute more, and solar is highly subsidized, and just like the wind you end up with tons of nonrecycled waste, hydro can't possibly give us all the energy we need, and nuclear, although my favorite won't be able to scale int he next half a century even if we want to build them.

I am not debating ANY of that.

Just pointing out that it was at best political theater. The BTC price is down, no new permits have been applied for. Unless we enter a bull market in the next 2 years there will be no new permits, mostly because there is no reason for them.
There is enough space and the old permitted places are still coming online and some are actively trying to sell off excess space. Pass some legislation to make yourself look good.

From the political point of view this "ban" is indeed stupid, just like the ban in EU (not Europe) if it ever happens, common, next ban cocoa plantations in Norway, tariffs have already killed mining there, so what's left to ban?

Anyhow, I was trying to point out that just like Amazon buys tax credits and declares is not polluting right now with a million vans, just like Google does so and miraculously their data centers that run on a mix of energy become green with money so do some of the miners, greenwashing their business when they know it's not like that. I mean seriously, it's hilarious when the so-called Bitcoin Mining council was publishing all those percentages about how green they are, and the biggest backer behind them, MARA was quietly operating that coal powerplant in Montana

The whole thing is pointless from both sides, NY knows that it can't make all consumers turn to green energy as there isn't enough there so they hand-pick some to show they are doing stuff, miners claim the same stuff about being ecofriendly to get investors, knowing that not even 1% will go and try to find out details on how thing work if they were they wouldn't pour millions in business that are losing money as we speak and in reality nothing changes.

Dude solar panels last 30 years on average and are about 15x the energy produced as compared to the energy used to create them.


1 400 watt panel

so 400 x 24 = 9600 watts a day x 365 = 3500 kwatts a year x 20 = 70,000 kwatts of energy for about 4666 kwatts worth of coal.

so you can reduce 4666/70000 = 93.33% less coal burned. seems like a win in my book.

and if you used solar as part of the process to make solar the numbers would be better. maybe 96%

another way 1.12 pound for a kwatt is 4666 x 1.12 pounds = 5226 pound of coal to make 1 panel

but 1 panel does 70000 x 1.12 = 78400 pounds

so 1 panel saves 73000 pounds of coal over its life of 30 years. BTW I gave the panel credit for 20 years of fully power not 30 to be conservative.

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December 30, 2022, 05:22:45 AM
 #23

Than it would be more devastating news for Bitcoin miners that have larger Mining equipments and their business can be in a track of loss. So I do not know what can happen with them.
BitDane
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January 01, 2023, 11:06:23 PM
 #24

What impact do you think this will have on mining?

After a month of the implementation of the law, it looks like the mining network is unaffected.  DaveF is on the spot correct in saying that it has no effect on Bitcoin Mining. I do have the same sentiment because I believe, as long as one part of the world is allowing people to set up a mining farm, prohibition of one part of the globe will not affect the miining operation because those wo are mining on that region will only move to the region where mining is allowed.

Not saying that New York isn't a miner's haven at all so only a few people use that location for Bitcoin mining.



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