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Author Topic: Will Bitcoin do to Bank what email did to the post office?  (Read 378 times)
JayJuanGee
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December 15, 2023, 03:07:39 AM
 #41

Bitcoin is changing the payment system in the world right now. Payments made in Bitcoin are always fast to receive and do not days to receive.
Bitcoin is 14 years old now. In their first 14 years other inventions have achieved huge adoption and disrupted their sphere. You just can't say the same about Bitcoin. It's mainly used for speculative trading. People don't use it as money for a variety of reasons. One of them being transaction speed, because 10 minutes is not good enough for small physical purchases. Meanwhile banks these days have instant transactions through Visa and Mastercard.

It is amazing that anyone who actually knows about bitcoin and who has been a member of this forum for more than 7.5 years would consider bitcoin as NOT having any disruptive impact on the world, and if you think about it, shitcoins exist ONLY because bitcoin is disrupting the whole ways that value can be attached to information in very powerful censorship resistant ways.  Surely an overwhelming majority of shitcoins are crappy imitations of bitcoin with a variety of variations, but bitcoin still sparked their ability to even exist and to imitate bitcoin in various ways to even cause previously unimaginable ways to print money and to scam people in new ways.

Of course, you are not the ONLY bitcoin naysayer in this thread, and I am surprised by the number of senior forum members who downplay bitcoin's importance and already existing impact on the ways of the world... and surely banks are likely going to continue to exist a long time into the future, just like post offices continue to exist right now, and sure maybe banks are going to be able to adapt to bitcoin, but they are likely going to need to adapt to bitcoin, and we already see various kinds of adaptations taking place, and surely there are going to be banks and other third party custodian who might merge in order to help people with their custody solutions, while at the same time, some of the power of bitcoin allows for increased knowledge that there is power to have options and to even keep some value (maybe not all value) outside of the banks so that they have to compete to get your business, and if they cannot win you over, then you are going to take your coins into self-custody... yes.. the power of self-custody is not without complications, but it is a powerful dynamic, and there are already bitcoin-related products in which people have given up their right to self-custody and they are seeking BTC price exposure, so we are going to continue to have dances with the various rug pulls that may well contribute towards the learning and practice of self-custody... which again, these are not all or nothing solutions, because we might keep our bitcoin in various places, but at the same time, we might also learn that if banks (and other third party custodians) are not actually offering sufficient and/or adequate services, and/or if they are overly taking advantage of the possession that they have of our coins, then we may well not want to be allowing them to have our coins, and we will either take some or all of our coins to another custodian or we may well take some or all of our coins into self-custody.

Bitcoin is changing the payment system in the world right now. Payments made in Bitcoin are always fast to receive and do not days to receive.
What Email did to the post office is already happening to bitcoin and banks, but it’s a different case. I notice that most people who know about bitcoin don’t really keep their money in banks any longer;

How would you know whether bitcoiners got rid of their banks in the event that they had a bank to begin with?

It seems a bit ridiculous for bitcoiners to completely get rid of banks in their lives, even though I can see why some might do it or believe that it is better and/or easier for them to try to get by without any banks and/or banking accounts..

I doubt that bitcoin services are even close to being sufficiently wide-spread in order for it to really be practical, meaningful and/or more empowering to NOT have any bank and/or banking arrangements.

Sure there are some folks who are unbanked, who could not get a bank account, even if they wanted to.. and sure some of those peeps might be moving into bitcoin and believing that they don't really need any banking services, but still I doubt that those people are representative, even to the extent that there are some people who likely fit into such a category of unbanked from traditional banks but still holding bitcoin.

they prefer leaving their money in bitcoin rather than somewhere where there won’t be any increase in it.

That might be another story regarding how much money to keep in bitcoin versus in your local fiat versus in some other fiat versus in other assets.  If all of your expenses are payable in bitcoin, then maybe it is easy to just keep everything in bitcoin, but I doubt that very many people are able to have all of their expenses in bitcoin.. That sounds like a rare bird to me.

But we all know that the government is against bitcoin and they are in support of banks, so they will never allow bitcoin to replace banks.

sure governments are having troubles figuring out ways to control bitcoin, but they might not have any choices regarding various things that happen in the world.  Governments have to adapt, just like banks have to adapt, and so there can be incentives for certain kinds of activities, but the incentives have to be somewhat lined up with what people want and the public good, so sometimes certain institutions will have to adapt to become more in line with the public good.

I know the government will do everything possible to stop that from happening. But with time people will start reducing the amount they leave in their bank accounts and increase the amount they keep in bitcoin.

Sure.  We need to engage in practices to protect our own assets and our value, and surely there are a lot of ways that people have been robbed from over the years, and bitcoin should help to make it more difficult to be robbed in certain kinds of ways, but bitcoin still does not necessarily solve all problems, especially when governments sometimes might be overreaching and/or overbearing in regards to burdens and attacks that they might make against bitcoin.

1) Self-Custody is a right.  There is no such thing as "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
Omahabit
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December 15, 2023, 12:10:23 PM
 #42

Bitcoin is changing the payment system in the world right now. Payments made in Bitcoin are always fast to receive and do not days to receive.

I do not agree that bitcoin will replace fiat currency because 70 out of 100% of its owners view it as an investment, which may make it impossible for bitcoin to take over the banking system.

Remember, bitcoin is a limited asset. And government owns the banking system and will not allow it to fail as a way to control the flow of money in the economy.

If bitcoin were to become as common as email is to the post office, either the system or its advocates would betray the public and turn bitcoin into a centralised currency rather than a decentralised one. At that point, the government would seize control of the entire system.
For these reasons, I think bitcoin will not do to the bank what email will do to the post office.
JayJuanGee
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December 15, 2023, 09:04:45 PM
 #43

Bitcoin is changing the payment system in the world right now. Payments made in Bitcoin are always fast to receive and do not days to receive.

I do not agree that bitcoin will replace fiat currency because 70 out of 100% of its owners view it as an investment, which may make it impossible for bitcoin to take over the banking system.

Remember, bitcoin is a limited asset. And government owns the banking system and will not allow it to fail as a way to control the flow of money in the economy.

If bitcoin were to become as common as email is to the post office, either the system or its advocates would betray the public and turn bitcoin into a centralised currency rather than a decentralised one. At that point, the government would seize control of the entire system.
For these reasons, I think bitcoin will not do to the bank what email will do to the post office.

You have a lot of weird presumptions Omahabit, which contributes to my wondering if you have very many clues what bitcoin is, besides what your handlers may have told you to say. 

Both the effect of bitcoin and the banking systems are adapting with the passage of time, and bitcoin's adoption and expansion of its networking effects (as outlined by Trace Mayer) are ongoing with bigger and BIGger and BIGGER players getting into the mix that affects dynamics in a lot of difficult to foresee ways.

Frequently there are questions regarding how much BTC adoption has already taken place, and so it is not easy to know the various ways that bitcoin is being expanded and used beyond your vague category of "investment," and even the concept of investment might refer to who's holding the private keys in that it seems that more than 70% of BTC are held off of exchanges and are not really moving, so if that is what you mean by investment? and at the same time when there is demand for more bitcoin, then that would come from the circulating supply, and surely if the circulating supply is not increasing as much as demand, then the BTC price has to go up to the extent to which some of the supply might be faked, as what happened with the FTX situation and some of the others who were caught not holding as much BTC as they claimed to have had been holding the various cascading crashes through the middle to late 2022 timeframe.

Your assumption of any kind of an ability to change bitcoin from decentralized to centralized also seems weird, and sure there can be attacks upon bitcoin and even attempts to change bitcoin, but I doubt that it is possible to speculate how the supposed battles will play out prior to their being waged.

yes, it is the wet  dream of status quo government folks, financial institutions and perhaps even the status quo rich to believe that they want to get bitcoin under control,  and so they will attempt various kinds of ways to reach such ends of controlling bitcoin, and so far one of the central selling points of the value of bitcoin is that no one can really control it, even if they are going to make attempts to do so, and maybe even claim that they are making progress in that direction.. .. but I will believe that there are successes in controlling bitcoin when I see it...and I am not going to take it for granted.

1) Self-Custody is a right.  There is no such thing as "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
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