Question about the genesis wallet

[Lucianamiaseillann]

Why have the bitcoins never been moved from satoshi's genesis wallet? Is there a reason? They can't be moved because they are like a bank's reserve or is there another theory?

[DannyHamilton]

Why have the bitcoins never been moved from satoshi's genesis wallet? Is there a reason? They can't be moved because they are like a bank's reserve or is there another theory?

Are you talking about the first 50 BTC that were the block reward in the first block that Satoshi created?  There's a bug in the software that makes it impossible to access those. It's possible that Satoshi did that on purpose, but it's FAR more likely that it was just a mistake that he didn't notice until it was too late. Either way, those 50 BTC will never be spent.

[RickDeckard]

Are you talking about the first 50 BTC that were the block reward in the first block that Satoshi created?  There's a bug in the software that makes it impossible to access those. It's possible that Satoshi did that on purpose, but it's FAR more likely that it was just a mistake that he didn't notice until it was too late. Either way, those 50 BTC will never be spent.

OP if you are interested in understanding why accessing those bitcoins is impossible, out of all the places where you can read that, I find that this[1] thread pretty much sums up the whole ordeal with a clear and simple explanation.
[1]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5498594.0

[EL MOHA]

Check the forum using the search function there have been multiple posts about this and the answer it cannot be moved because it is not included in the general transaction databa. The first coinbase transaction was actually this 50 bitcoin and it was actually not added to overall database transactions there by making it non existence to the nodes who validate transactions before they are spent, in that regard it is as though it doesn’t exist and cannot be spent then. This might be a flaw or might not be a flaw but a deliberate act by Satoshi himself as said earlier, it is almost similar to the choosing of 21 million as the total supply

[NotFuzzyWarm]

My guess is that the BTC blockchain needed an 'anchor' transaction to build upon. If true then it is not a bug or flaw preventing coins from that 1st block from being moved - it was intentionally coded with the coins being locked to serve as start of the blockchain.

[pooya87]

Lets not forget that the 50 BTC block reward for the Genesis block is by definition premined coins which means whether it was intentional or an accidental, the result is a good thing. Because today we can say that every single satoshi that was ever created and is in circulation was mined fair and square, since anybody could have mined block #1 but nobody other than Satoshi could have mined block #0.

[DannyHamilton]

My guess is

Please don't use guessing to answer questions in the technical subforums. If you have questions, ask. If you know some or all of the answer, share what you know. If you learned something, but are unsure if the source of your knowledge was reliable, explain what you learned and ask for clarification.

Guessing is a waste of time, and is generally likely to be incorrect.

that the BTC blockchain needed an 'anchor' transaction to build upon.

No. There are many blockchains that do not work that way. Satoshi never explained if it was done intentionally, or if it was a bug, but it wasn't something that was "needed" for any technical reason.

If true

It's not.

then it is not a bug or flaw preventing coins from that 1st block from being moved - it was intentionally coded with the coins being locked to serve as start of the blockchain.

Nope. It's either a bug, or Satoshi just decided he didn't want those first 50 BTC to be spendable. There were several bugs in the early versions of Bitcoin that eventually got fixed. This is very likely to be just another bug, and it just wasn't worth going through the hard fork that would be necessary to fix it.

[vjudeu]

Why have the bitcoins never been moved from satoshi's genesis wallet?

Because if you start a new coin from scratch, then you naturally start from zero coins in circulation. The first version had no "Genesis Block" at all. But: if you have no such block, then you can always erase the full chain, by mining in the past. Then, you don't have to start from 2009. You can start from 1970 as well, and create a chain of blocks for 39 years.

So, you start from a version without any Genesis Block, produce some chains, and notice, that it is needed, to block any incentive, to mine blocks in the past, and constantly rewrite the chain. To make the system honest, it is also needed to prove somehow, that you also didn't mine the chain in advance, and everyone had the chance to mine it, after being released.

Then, you use some information from the outside, like a text from the newspaper (or the mainnet block hash, as it is in testnet4). You make this block special, which also allows you, to reset the chain, if needed. And during testing, you can check different scenarios, by starting from different genesis blocks.

For example: this is prenet Genesis Block: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5355610.0

They can't be moved because they are like a bank's reserve or is there another theory?

Those coins are locked forever. Coins could be locked into OP_RETURN as well (or rather: OP_FALSE, because the meaning of OP_RETURN was different at that time), or the amount could be set to zero. It doesn't matter, nobody can access them, because you start from an empty database, and then add new coins, on top of that. Of course, it was more natural, to use a regular OP_CHECKSIG, with a regular key, to have the ability to prove, that you started the chain, if that would ever be needed.

[apogio]

Nope. It's either a bug, or Satoshi just decided he didn't want those first 50 BTC to be spendable. There were several bugs in the early versions of Bitcoin that eventually got fixed. This is very likely to be just another bug, and it just wasn't worth going through the hard fork that would be necessary to fix it.

The technical explanation that you 've provided is the correct one.

One could argue that Satoshi has intentionally "lost" access to the coins that they 've mined.
There are assumptions, but no proof whatsoever, that Satoshi mined many blocks (~20,000).
The coins that they 've generated haven't moved either.

[garlonicon]

One could argue that Satoshi has intentionally "lost" access to the coins that they 've mined.

Even in that case, the public key is valid. Which means, that there is a matching private key, which can be used, to sign those coins, and move them. But fortunately, the Genesis Block is unspendable, so even if you know the key, you cannot move those coins. But still: you can move all coins, which were deposited later into this P2PK, or into matching P2PKH.

There are assumptions, but no proof whatsoever, that Satoshi mined many blocks (~20,000).

There are only traces of extraNonce, pointing out, that some miner produced a lot of blocks. It doesn't have to be Satoshi, and the estimation of 20k blocks is also covered with a huge assumption, that a single miner own all chunks of nonces (which may be incorrect, because every time, when extraNonce starts again from zero, there could be another miner, with similar mining power).

The coins that they 've generated haven't moved either.

Some of them moved, but then, they are excluded from the pattern. For example: http://satoshiblocks.info/

We have blocks from 0 to 14 with one extraNonce line, and people assume, that Satoshi mined them. But: block number 9 and 12 are explicitly excluded from the pattern, because those coins were spent.

And then, we have blocks from 15 to 25, forming another extraNonce line. And people assume, that if the first line was mined by Satoshi, then the second line also was.

[apogio]

Even in that case, the public key is valid. Which means, that there is a matching private key, which can be used, to sign those coins, and move them. But fortunately, the Genesis Block is unspendable, so even if you know the key, you cannot move those coins. But still: you can move all coins, which were deposited later into this P2PK, or into matching P2PKH.

Certainly, this is in fact strengthening my point! Every coin that is not burned using OP_RETURN is by definition spendable. So the coins after the genesis block may be intentionally lost but this doesn't mean they are provenly unrecoverable!

Some of them moved, but then, they are excluded from the pattern. For example: http://satoshiblocks.info/

We have blocks from 0 to 14 with one extraNonce line, and people assume, that Satoshi mined them. But: block number 9 and 12 are explicitly excluded from the pattern, because those coins were spent.

And then, we have blocks from 15 to 25, forming another extraNonce line. And people assume, that if the first line was mined by Satoshi, then the second line also was.

Good info, thanks!

[Cricktor]

But: block number 9 and 12 are explicitly excluded from the pattern, because those coins were spent.

Block 9 is known to have been mined by Satoshi Nakamoto because Satoshi sent 10BTC from this block to Hal Finney and as far as I remember this is well documented and confirmed by Hal.

This first Bitcoin transaction f4184fc596403b9d638783cf57adfe4c75c605f6356fbc91338530e9831e9e16 spending Satoshi's coins and sending to another person was confirmed in block 170.

The change coins, conveniently transfered to the origin Public Key, were then spent a few blocks later again by Satoshi in a small series of deduction transactions (chronologically from block 9's coinbase -10BTC to Hal Finney, -10BTC, -1BTC, -1BTC and -10BTC, the left change of 18BTC on Public Key 0411db93e1dcdb8a...9b8643f656b412a3 remains unspent 'till today and likely will forever).

[seoincorporation]

Satoshi haven't move any of his 1M bitcoin, and the main reason for that is to stay anonymous, if he decide to move his coins then he will become traceable. So, it's better this way.

And Just think about the panic in the markets if he decide to move those coins, a hard crash would happen.

[hd49728]

Why have the bitcoins never been moved from satoshi's genesis wallet? Is there a reason? They can't be moved because they are like a bank's reserve or is there another theory?

DannyHamilton answered you, I only provided some other sources for you.

Bitcoin Genesis block with some notes from Blockchain.com explorer

Coinbase Message
EThe Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks

Bitcoin Genesis
On January 3rd 2009, the Bitcoin network was created when Satoshi Nakamato (the project's mysterious creator) mined the “Genesis” block. The 50 bitcoin coinbase reward is unredeemable, as it was omitted from the transaction database. This means any attempt to spend it would be rejected by the network. Whether this was intentional or not still remains unknown.

A total of 0.00 BTC ($0.00) were sent in the block with the average transaction being 0.0000 BTC ($0.00). Satoshi earned a total reward of 50.00 BTC $0.00. The reward consisted of a base reward of 50.00 BTC $0.00 with an additional 0.0000 BTC ($0.00) reward paid as fees of the 1 transactions which were included in the block.

Genesis Block (Bitcoin Wiki).

Block reward

The first 50 BTC block reward went to address 1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa,[1] though this reward can't be spent due to a quirk in the way that the genesis block is expressed in the code. It is not known if this was done intentionally or accidentally.[4][5][6] It is believed that other outputs sent to this address are spendable, but it is unknown if Satoshi Nakamoto has the private key for this particular address, if one existed at all.

[pooya87]

Satoshi haven't move any of his 1M bitcoin, and the main reason for that is to stay anonymous, if he decide to move his coins then he will become traceable. So, it's better this way.

And Just think about the panic in the markets if he decide to move those coins, a hard crash would happen.

First of all, nobody knows how many bitcoins Satoshi mined or owns today. The 1 mil thing is just a pure guess that has counter arguments as well.
Secondly, in case you have missed it, a lot of coins mined very early on (that also looked to have been mined by Satoshi) have moved over the years and none of the caused any kind of "panic" to be able to crash the market.