The first thing to know

[Erdogan]

The first thing to know, is that you are not your government.

There is no such thing as Argentina, there is the government of Argentina, and the people of
Argentina, each consisting of a bunch of individuals.

"My fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
(John F. Kennedy). Translated: You, as a member of the public living in an area where we currently are in control, by threat of violence and silent consent, do not ask what we can do for you, but what you can do for me.

[Daniel91]

It's true statement.
In some other post someone asked which country we hate the most.
There is no such things like evil countries or people, just bad governments which can be replaced with the people either in free elections or revolution (if they become to much corrupted over time).

[Nemo1024]

It's true statement.
In some other post someone asked which country we hate the most.
There is no such things like evil countries or people, just bad governments which can be replaced with the people either in free elections or revolution (if they become to much corrupted over time).

The problem with revolutions, is that they are conducted by people with an agenda of "Why they, and not me are stinking rich? Unfair! Must do something about it." Revolutions never benefit the people who seem to support them. See the OP's definition of government.

[u9y42]

It's true statement.
In some other post someone asked which country we hate the most.
There is no such things like evil countries or people, just bad governments which can be replaced with the people either in free elections or revolution (if they become to much corrupted over time).

I agree that we shouldn't conflate the two, but when you have a bad government supported by its people, shouldn't the people also take some responsibility for its government's actions?

[Possum577]

I'll concede that the Government and the people are different entities, but the people do create their government. And they can change their government, albeit slowly at first but it can be changed.

In fact, only the people can change their government...politicians have so little ability to change that they all end up just pushing the government further in the direction it's heading.

What if the people had a better voice in their government, would you people become more involved?

[Omikifuse]

There is no such thing like government or "people".

There are individuals that occupy certain positions in society.


Say government and people are abstractions, you can't use them like they are the real stuff.

[Possum577]

The vote of the people is the most powerful thing on this planet. I know most of you will say "what about guns? force?" but the vote (or will) of the people is more powerful.

[Erdogan]

The vote of the people is the most powerful thing on this planet. I know most of you will say "what about guns? force?" but the vote (or will) of the people is more powerful.

Votes means nothing, the distance to the top is to big, it is impossible to keep the leaders in check.
Still the consent and economical support, based upon eiher fear or ignorance, is the source of the power of government. When the individuals, though by their leaders to be subjects, withdraw their support, the state quickly falls apart.

Numerous examples from our time. For instance in Ukraine. When the individuals residing in that country saw to what extent Viktor Yanukovych was willing to use deadly force to keep his position, he was ousted. Why is Assad still in reign? Because he has support, although he is a tyrant.

[libivan]

The vote of the people is the most powerful thing on this planet. I know most of you will say "what about guns? force?" but the vote (or will) of the people is more powerful.

Votes means nothing, the distance to the top is to big, it is impossible to keep the leaders in check.
Still the consent and economical support, based upon eiher fear or ignorance, is the source of the power of government. When the individuals, though by their leaders to be subjects, withdraw their support, the state quickly falls apart.

Numerous examples from our time. For instance in Ukraine. When the individuals residing in that country saw to what extent Viktor Yanukovych was willing to use deadly force to keep his position, he was ousted. Why is Assad still in reign? Because he has support, although he is a tyrant.

That's exactly how I see things: corrupt governments receive people support based upon fear and ignorance. Most of the people refuse to even try to see that their governments DO lie, commit crimes and acts of terror. They prefer to believe whatever they are told by the official propaganda.