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Author Topic: Store bitcoins in a timed vault.  (Read 1731 times)
Fray
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August 13, 2014, 04:21:21 PM
 #21

I'm currently researching ways to store bitcoins but in such a way that the bitcoins will not be available to anyone for lets say 1 year. Just like an old school timed vault. Not sure if there is a way to really determine the correct time on machine that cant be tricked. Is this ability already available on the blockchain? I wanted to make sure before I burn too many briancells trying to figure this out.

I really do need this now! I'm totally freaked about that crash last night and I need to put my BTC somewhere safe, or I will just go and sell them! Maybe I should go and find some people who are willing to take care of them for me until this whole thing is over!

I'd be happy to hold them for you.  I'd just need to know exactly under which conditions I should return them.

That is a fair offer, and if I know Danny right - then is he not kidding.
You should take this offer, you will be very happy one year from now.
I think it is very risky to have a third party hold your bitcoin like this. If you forget the circumstances that you agree to have your bitcoin released, or if you are unable to meet the circumstances but truly need your bitcoin then you will be unable to access it.
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August 13, 2014, 04:25:33 PM
 #22

I'm currently researching ways to store bitcoins but in such a way that the bitcoins will not be available to anyone for lets say 1 year. Just like an old school timed vault. Not sure if there is a way to really determine the correct time on machine that cant be tricked. Is this ability already available on the blockchain? I wanted to make sure before I burn too many briancells trying to figure this out.

I really do need this now! I'm totally freaked about that crash last night and I need to put my BTC somewhere safe, or I will just go and sell them! Maybe I should go and find some people who are willing to take care of them for me until this whole thing is over!

I'd be happy to hold them for you.  I'd just need to know exactly under which conditions I should return them.

That is a fair offer, and if I know Danny right - then is he not kidding.
You should take this offer, you will be very happy one year from now.
I think it is very risky to have a third party hold your bitcoin like this. If you forget the circumstances that you agree to have your bitcoin released, or if you are unable to meet the circumstances but truly need your bitcoin then you will be unable to access it.

Well, storing money in the bank is equal risky under those assumptions (if not more).
What Danny is proposing is to act as Treasurer, which is not unusual at all, the circumstance for release can be stated in a contract - same as if you go to a bank.



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August 13, 2014, 06:03:29 PM
 #23

I'm currently researching ways to store bitcoins but in such a way that the bitcoins will not be available to anyone for lets say 1 year. Just like an old school timed vault. Not sure if there is a way to really determine the correct time on machine that cant be tricked. Is this ability already available on the blockchain? I wanted to make sure before I burn too many briancells trying to figure this out.

Hey, you may want to have a look at what I posted in the Gambling subforum several months ago, as it's a software-based solution requiring no third party and seems to be relevant to your request:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=520359

If you're interested in that kind of solution, let me know. That thread is admittedly a little short on details, and I am currently traveling with only occasional Internet access, but I'll glad to answer questions and provide more info when I return home.
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August 13, 2014, 11:29:23 PM
 #24

I'm currently researching ways to store bitcoins but in such a way that the bitcoins will not be available to anyone for lets say 1 year. Just like an old school timed vault. Not sure if there is a way to really determine the correct time on machine that cant be tricked. Is this ability already available on the blockchain? I wanted to make sure before I burn too many briancells trying to figure this out.

I really do need this now! I'm totally freaked about that crash last night and I need to put my BTC somewhere safe, or I will just go and sell them! Maybe I should go and find some people who are willing to take care of them for me until this whole thing is over!

I'd be happy to hold them for you.  I'd just need to know exactly under which conditions I should return them.

That is a fair offer, and if I know Danny right - then is he not kidding.
You should take this offer, you will be very happy one year from now.
I think it is very risky to have a third party hold your bitcoin like this. If you forget the circumstances that you agree to have your bitcoin released, or if you are unable to meet the circumstances but truly need your bitcoin then you will be unable to access it.

Well, storing money in the bank is equal risky under those assumptions (if not more).
What Danny is proposing is to act as Treasurer, which is not unusual at all, the circumstance for release can be stated in a contract - same as if you go to a bank.
If you go to a bank then all you have to do is prove your identity and you can withdraw your funds. Danny and the OP kind of implied that there will be more strict requirements for "withdrawing" the OP's coins.
DeathAndTaxes
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August 13, 2014, 11:34:11 PM
 #25

If/when lockTime is fully supported in bitcoin...

Create lockTime transaction sending to new address.
Sign locktime transaction with necessary private keys.
Permanently delete the private keys that were used to sign the lockTime transaction from ALL locations.

Done.

Save the braincells for a better use.

You can do that right now.   Before the nlocktime has been reached nodes will not relay/store the unconfirmed txn but you could print it out and be sure that it can't be included in a block.  Maybe someone should make a fancy looking cert with a qr code and call it a Bitcoin Certificate Of Deposit.   You could give them as gifts and the recipient would not be able to spend them until the locktime has passed.
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August 13, 2014, 11:46:17 PM
 #26

If/when lockTime is fully supported in bitcoin...

Create lockTime transaction sending to new address.
Sign locktime transaction with necessary private keys.
Permanently delete the private keys that were used to sign the lockTime transaction from ALL locations.

Done.

Save the braincells for a better use.

You can do that right now.   Before the nlocktime has been reached nodes will not relay/store the unconfirmed txn but you could print it out and be sure that it can't be included in a block.  Maybe someone should make a fancy looking cert with a qr code and call it a Bitcoin Certificate Of Deposit.   You could give them as gifts and the recipient would not be able to spend them until the locktime has passed.

Silly me, I wasn't even thinking of holding on to the transaction for later broadcast.  You're right, obviously.

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August 14, 2014, 10:25:22 PM
 #27

If/when lockTime is fully supported in bitcoin...

Create lockTime transaction sending to new address.
Sign locktime transaction with necessary private keys.
Permanently delete the private keys that were used to sign the lockTime transaction from ALL locations.

Done.

Save the braincells for a better use.

You can do that right now.   Before the nlocktime has been reached nodes will not relay/store the unconfirmed txn but you could print it out and be sure that it can't be included in a block.  Maybe someone should make a fancy looking cert with a qr code and call it a Bitcoin Certificate Of Deposit.   You could give them as gifts and the recipient would not be able to spend them until the locktime has passed.
Modern day certificates of deposit in fiat based banks will allow a customer to withdraw their money from a certificate of deposit with some level of penalty, in this case it would be impossible to spend the bitcoin contained in this transaction.

Another issue is that these types of transactions will send a TX to a specific address sometime in the future. If between now and that time in the future your private key to that address is somehow compromised (or potentially compromised) then you would have no way to spend these funds without significantly risking them. Under normal circumstances if you think your wallet has been compromised or if you find a potential vulnerability in the creation of your keys you can solve the issue by simply moving your coins to an address that does not have this potential vulnerability. 

 
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August 14, 2014, 10:31:11 PM
 #28

Yeah I would just set a multi sig address up and allow my family or a member of family to have access to the other key so in emergencies you would be able to get the Bitcoin out.

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