Bitcoin Forum
May 06, 2024, 12:26:33 PM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
Author Topic: 21 Inc Confirms Plans for Mass Bitcoin Miner Distribution  (Read 2097 times)
crazyivan
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1652
Merit: 1007


DMD Diamond Making Money 4+ years! Join us!


View Profile
May 19, 2015, 09:37:22 AM
 #21

Excelent news.

So my toaster ll be mining BTC in the future. This is going to be big time push for the crypto acceptance.

I don't think they will be adding chips into any device without internet access.
So you are probably looking at TV's, Game Consoles, PC hardware, etc.

I d like to have wireless connection to my toaster. So I can tell it when to switch to a different coin.

If they add it to mobile phones, they ll add it to anything with a gpu or cpu, which s basically any electronic device.

For security, your account has been locked. Email acctcomp15@theymos.e4ward.com
1714998393
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714998393

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714998393
Reply with quote  #2

1714998393
Report to moderator
1714998393
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714998393

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714998393
Reply with quote  #2

1714998393
Report to moderator
1714998393
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714998393

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714998393
Reply with quote  #2

1714998393
Report to moderator
"In a nutshell, the network works like a distributed timestamp server, stamping the first transaction to spend a coin. It takes advantage of the nature of information being easy to spread but hard to stifle." -- Satoshi
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
1714998393
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714998393

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714998393
Reply with quote  #2

1714998393
Report to moderator
1714998393
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714998393

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714998393
Reply with quote  #2

1714998393
Report to moderator
davejh
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 136
Merit: 100


View Profile
May 19, 2015, 11:27:29 AM
 #22

The whole mobile phone idea is just a really bad joke. Let's say something like an iPhone 6 uses about 10 Wh of power to charge it (0.01 kWh): http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/iphone/11128043/How-much-power-is-used-to-charge-an-iPhone-6.html.

If we assume that 21 can make a 50 GH/s ASIC that runs at 0.1 J/GH (way way better than anything available right now) then that 10 Wh of power will last less than 2 hours while the ASIC is active (much less in fact because the Wi-Fi or LTE modems and either the main CPU or an NPU have to be active too to connect to anything).

Given that the single biggest complaint almost every phone user has about their phone is battery life does anyone really thing that people are going to be happy with phones that need charging every 90 minutes? Let's say they throttle back to a duty-cycle that's only 25% (6 hours when the phone is charging overnight) then the phone has a whopping 12.5 GH/s of hashing; that's 1 28 millionth of the current hash rate so to supply 50% of the network hashrate will require 28M mobile phones (at the current hash rate).

Of course this is a zero-sum problem so those 28M phone users will between them mine half of the 25 BTC per block (going down to 12.5 BTC next year). That's 44.6 satoshis each per block (call it 45 with the tx fee). If the indications about reward sharing are correct then 21.co get 75%, or 33.75 of those 45 satoshis so our phone owner has 11.25 satoshis per block or 1620 satoshis per day. After a year they've got 591k satoshis, so that's 5.91 mBTC ($1.37 at current prices).

At an average of 12.5 GH/s and 0.1 J/GH then they used 24 * 12.5 * 0.1 = 30 Wh of power per day, or 10.95 kWh per year (assuming a perfect charger; not that they exist - the numbers will be higher). If the video's quoted price of $0.12 per kWh is correct (retail electricity pricing) then mining that $1.37 costs at best $1.31 but also costs the battery on the phone draining, the phone getting hotter, etc. The heat thing is not to be dismissed because phone enclosures aren't designed to dump sustained heat this way.

Basically they'll have to persuade 28M phone owners that they should spend their electricity mining for 21.co, getting a worse phone experience and having to pay more for the phone in the process (to cover the extra ASIC and the necessary heat dissipation). Now if they persuade 56M phone owners then 21.co's mining operation is huge; it now nets them 2/3 of all of the bitcoins but our phone users now only get 3.94 mBTC ($0.91) but their costs stay the same.

When the block reward halves then the numbers get much worse from the consumer's perspective. Now they have the same costs but only half of their previous reward.

Oh and here's the irony: the claim is that this is to enable "decentralisation" right? Well guess what, our 28M phone miners are delivering all of the blocks to 21.co's mining pool; that's 50% of the network. Can we please see the necessary freak out along the lines of when GHash.io didn't actually quite get to 50% of the network last year? Our 56M phone miners would give 21.co 66% of the network.

Remind me again how all of this is a good idea?
louise123
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 462
Merit: 250



View Profile
May 19, 2015, 11:37:46 AM
 #23

Excelent news.

So my toaster ll be mining BTC in the future. This is going to be big time push for the crypto acceptance.

I don't think they will be adding chips into any device without internet access.
So you are probably looking at TV's, Game Consoles, PC hardware, etc.

I d like to have wireless connection to my toaster. So I can tell it when to switch to a different coin.

If they add it to mobile phones, they ll add it to anything with a gpu or cpu, which s basically any electronic device.

I doubt they will be adding it on mobile phones.
It would dry the battery in no time.
It wouldn't be worth it.

██████
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
                ▄███
             ▄███▌ █
            ▀▀▀██▄  █
          ▄███▄▄ ▀▀▀█
         █ █████▀▀▀▄▄
        ▄██ ███▄    █
       ▐███▀   ▀█   █
       ████     █   █
      ▄██▀▄█▄▄▄█▀   █
      ▀▄▄███▌      █
  ▄▄▄▀▀▀████       █
▄▀    ██ ██       █
▐▌     ██▌▐▌      ▀▄
█      ██ █         ▀▄
█      █▀▄▌          █
█   ▄▀█▄██           █
█ ▄▀      ▀▀▄▄▀▄     █
▀▀             █    █
              █  ▄▀
              ▀▄█
     ▀█████████████▄▄
 ▀ ▀▀▀███████████████▌
  ▀ ▀▀▀▀██▀▀▀▀▀▀██████         ▄███████▄      ▄▄███████▄    ▄███▄    ▄███▄ ▄███▄      ▄███▄
▀ ▀▀▀▀█████▄▄▄▄▄▄█████▌       ▄████▀▀▀████▄   ▐████▀▀█████   ▀████▄ ▄████▀ █████▄    ▄█████
   ▀▀███████████████▀       █████     ████▌          ████▌    ▀████████▀    █████▄  ▄█████▌
  ▀ ▀████████████████▀ ▀    ██████████████▌   ▄▄██████████     ▄██████▄      █████▄▄█████▌
    ██████      ██▀▀▀▀▀▀▀ ▀ █████▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀    █████▀▀▀█████    ▄████████▄      ██████████▌
    ██████▄▄▄▄▄▄██████▄ ▄    ████▄▄   ▄▄█▄   ████▄  ▄█████ ▄█████▀▀█████▄     ████████▌
    █████████████████▀        ▀███████████   ▀████████████  ████▀    ▀████      ██████▌
    ██████████████▀▀             ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀       ▀▀▀▀▀▀ ▀▀▀    ▀▀        ▀▀        █████
                                                                               ▄█████
                                                                           ▄███████▀
                                                                           ▀████▀▀
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
███
██████
|█████████████████
███████████████████
█████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
  WHITEPAPER 
 LIGHTPAPER
|Instant Deposit
✓ 24/7 Support
Referral Program
davejh
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 136
Merit: 100


View Profile
May 19, 2015, 12:28:45 PM
 #24

I doubt they will be adding it on mobile phones.
It would dry the battery in no time.
It wouldn't be worth it.

It doesn't make sense on any device though. Always costs more to run than it's worth, plus requires consumers to do setup work to utilise what it does. I don't mind doing setup for my phone because I gain a lot from doing it, but what I don't get is why having BTC mining in my TV or a games console is interesting? What problem related to those devices does it solve? The funds aren't going to be large enough to do interesting micropayments. Even at 50 GH/s there's not enough BTC mined in a year to pay for a game or more than one or two TV episodes. Gets dramatically worse next year when the block reward drops to 12.5 BTC.

Unless there's going to be major adoption by users then the OEMs won't install the capability in their hardware because it costs them money (silicon, board space, software development and maintenance, customer service calls, retailer margin). There's a lot of commercial risk and highly questionable upside?
Fedoraeuphoria
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 28
Merit: 0


View Profile
May 19, 2015, 01:14:04 PM
 #25

These chips also give the NSA a nice backdoor of their choosing for our appliances.
wagabee london
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 406
Merit: 100



View Profile
May 19, 2015, 02:00:19 PM
 #26

it,s great news this will bring more people to bitcoin in a few years everybody will be using bitcoin it,s digital gold for the people

⚫ ▬▬     V T O S   |   Decentralized CDN & Social Network     ▬▬ ⚫
  Whitepaper    JOIN OUR ICO  >  MAY 28th  <
FACEBOOK               MEDIUM               TWITTER               GITHUB               TELEGRAM
R2D221
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 658
Merit: 500



View Profile
May 19, 2015, 03:10:19 PM
 #27

I'm sorry, but I still don't see the point.

An economy based on endless growth is unsustainable.
Amph
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3206
Merit: 1069



View Profile
May 19, 2015, 03:12:24 PM
 #28

Why would we host miners for 21?

We must miss something or it's a very crappy idea.

I won't pay electricity for someone else to profit.

they'll give you the 25%, i suspect it is above what you will be pay in electricity for it, also taking into account that those asic will operate with 16nm , they should not consume very much
LiteCoinGuy
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1148
Merit: 1010


In Satoshi I Trust


View Profile WWW
May 19, 2015, 03:25:28 PM
 #29

that firm will change alot for bitcoin if they are successful.
just take a look at the partner-firms that they have on board like Cisco, Qualcomm, Intel....it is   Shocked  Shocked  !

https://medium.com/@21dotco/a-bitcoin-miner-in-every-device-and-in-every-hand-e315b40f2821

Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!