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Author Topic: The Reality of Masternode Centralization  (Read 7470 times)
illodin
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June 05, 2015, 10:45:58 AM
 #81

People are running their masternodes where ever it's cheapest, because the rewards for running one are only ~$40 or w/e per month.

The reason the reward is so small right now, is that we aren't at the point where government agencies would get interested in DASH yet.

If DASH would attain Bitcoin-like adoption (and the interest of TLA's), by then we'd probably have custom hardware without NSA backdoors ("Masternode ASICs" if you will) to run masternodes on. At that point the "best practices" list is going to be quite short and easy to follow.
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June 05, 2015, 11:49:16 AM
 #82

People are running their masternodes where ever it's cheapest, because the rewards for running one are only ~$40 or w/e per month.

The reason the reward is so small right now, is that we aren't at the point where government agencies would get interested in DASH yet.

If DASH would attain Bitcoin-like adoption (and the interest of TLA's), by then we'd probably have custom hardware without NSA backdoors ("Masternode ASICs" if you will) to run masternodes on. At that point the "best practices" list is going to be quite short and easy to follow.


"Yeah it's weak and centralized at the moment... But when we will have the market cap of Bitcoin, things will get much better!".

How do you get to Bitcoin level if the stuff is half-broken to start with?

Monero's privacy and therefore fungibility are MUCH stronger than Bitcoin's. 
This makes Monero a better candidate to deserve the term "digital cash".
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June 05, 2015, 12:10:50 PM
 #83

"Yeah it's weak and centralized at the moment... But when we will have the market cap of Bitcoin, things will get much better!".

"Yeah we don't bother making a GUI so the user experience is weak and centralized to www wallet because we have more important things to do... But when we do, things will get much better!".
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June 05, 2015, 01:01:06 PM
 #84

"Yeah it's weak and centralized at the moment... But when we will have the market cap of Bitcoin, things will get much better!".

"Yeah we don't bother making a GUI so the user experience is weak and centralized to www wallet because we have more important things to do... But when we do, things will get much better!".

There are several GUI available other than www and you know that very well, so don't play dumb.
Who cares if there isn't written "official" on them? We're talking decentralized open-source project, not corporations products.

Monero's privacy and therefore fungibility are MUCH stronger than Bitcoin's. 
This makes Monero a better candidate to deserve the term "digital cash".
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June 05, 2015, 01:14:19 PM
 #85

In Bulgaria there are a lot of DRK (Dash) "fans", but I don't like it. I didn't expected to see that many masternodes though.
Basically, Nettera is quite old bulgarian IT company, but I'm quite sure that they are not doing good lately.

P.S. I don't like Monero either, because almost all discussions are turned into Monero-Dash war.
P.S.2. I didn't read entire thread - just the OP.

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June 05, 2015, 01:35:45 PM
 #86

There are several GUI available other than www and you know that very well, so don't play dumb.
Who cares if there isn't written "official" on them? We're talking decentralized open-source project, not corporations products.

I'm not going to download any unofficial wallet that only 5 people are using because I don't trust it. I'm ok with downloading an official wallet or using a Bitcoin wallet such as Multibit or Armory because thousands of people are using them and any malice or fatal bugs would've been found already.
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June 05, 2015, 06:02:27 PM
 #87

There are several GUI available other than www and you know that very well, so don't play dumb.
Who cares if there isn't written "official" on them? We're talking decentralized open-source project, not corporations products.

I'm not going to download any unofficial wallet that only 5 people are using because I don't trust it. I'm ok with downloading an official wallet or using a Bitcoin wallet such as Multibit or Armory because thousands of people are using them and any malice or fatal bugs would've been found already.

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes I get that you want to use the easiest thing available, but don't fool yourself into thinking that the easiest thing available is the best thing available--when Monero releases the official wallet, you will literally have no advantage over Monero, so what's your hurry?

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June 06, 2015, 02:48:52 AM
 #88

There are several GUI available other than www and you know that very well, so don't play dumb.
Who cares if there isn't written "official" on them? We're talking decentralized open-source project, not corporations products.

I'm not going to download any unofficial wallet that only 5 people are using because I don't trust it. I'm ok with downloading an official wallet or using a Bitcoin wallet such as Multibit or Armory because thousands of people are using them and any malice or fatal bugs would've been found already.

We all know you are perfectly capable of using a command line wallet. Quit trolling.

As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.




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June 08, 2015, 02:10:02 PM
 #89

How is ponzi-node blinding coming along?

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June 08, 2015, 02:33:37 PM
 #90

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley
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June 08, 2015, 02:41:02 PM
 #91

How is ponzi-node blinding coming along?

It isn't.  Boy genius Duffield didn't realize ponzi-node blinding wrecks DASH's existing infrastructure until it was too late.


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Monero
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whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
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generalizethis
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June 08, 2015, 02:52:32 PM
 #92

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.


illodin
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June 08, 2015, 03:04:23 PM
 #93

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).
generalizethis
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June 08, 2015, 03:14:24 PM
 #94

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).

The nodes randomness is useless if an attacker owns (or can see) what a large portion of nodes are doing. Or else the graphs dashers like to post outlining the # of nodes needed break dash's anonymity are pretty stupid to have on hand as evidence of dash's security.  Wink

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June 08, 2015, 03:20:16 PM
 #95

How is ponzi-node blinding coming along?

It isn't.  Boy genius Duffield didn't realize ponzi-node blinding wrecks DASH's existing infrastructure until it was too late.

Did McDuff take it off the DASH roadmap?

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illodin
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June 08, 2015, 03:44:54 PM
 #96

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).

The nodes randomness is useless if an attacker owns (or can see) what a large portion of nodes are doing. Or else the graphs dashers like to post outlining the # of nodes needed break dash's anonymity are pretty stupid to have on hand as evidence of dash's security.  Wink

Hence the multiple rounds specification. As the number of rounds go up, the odds against go up astronomically.
generalizethis
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June 08, 2015, 03:56:16 PM
 #97

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).

The nodes randomness is useless if an attacker owns (or can see) what a large portion of nodes are doing. Or else the graphs dashers like to post outlining the # of nodes needed break dash's anonymity are pretty stupid to have on hand as evidence of dash's security.  Wink

Hence the multiple rounds specification. As the number of rounds go up, the odds against go up astronomically.

The number of nodes controlled by an attacker determines privacy, hence why centralization is a big deal. If you are mixing multiple rounds in a system that is 95% (% of mn's held in just 5 countries) clear, your privacy is still pretty weak compared to a coin like Monero irregardless of how many rounds you choose.

*Of course, each round creates a fee, so why wouldn't you want people to have to increase their rounds to achieve the illusion of privacy? Wink

illodin
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June 08, 2015, 04:10:15 PM
 #98

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? Roll Eyes

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.


As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. Smiley

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).

The nodes randomness is useless if an attacker owns (or can see) what a large portion of nodes are doing. Or else the graphs dashers like to post outlining the # of nodes needed break dash's anonymity are pretty stupid to have on hand as evidence of dash's security.  Wink

Hence the multiple rounds specification. As the number of rounds go up, the odds against go up astronomically.

The number of nodes controlled by an attacker determines privacy, hence why centralization is a big deal. If you are mixing multiple rounds in a system that is 95% (% of mn's held in just 5 countries) clear, you're privacy is still pretty weak compared to a coin like Monero irregardless of how many rounds you choose.

If two things are anonymous to everyone else but the NSA, does it matter which one is "more" anonymous? Aren't they both anonymous enough? Or are you saying Monero is NSA proof?
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June 08, 2015, 04:24:59 PM
 #99

If two things are anonymous to everyone else but the NSA, does it matter which one is "more" anonymous? Aren't they both anonymous enough? Or are you saying Monero is NSA proof?


This is a flawed logic. Monero's privacy is achieved very simply, at the cryptographic level. Dash one is just a technical obfuscation achieved in a fairly complex network of interconnected hardware devices.
We can't affirm with 100% certainty that the NSA can't break through Monero's privacy or Dash's privacy, but IT IS THE ONLY THING they have in common. Otherwise these are two entirely different beasts.
Claiming that because both don't hold 100% certainty, they're equivalent, is really crappy sophism.

This is also a dangerous logic. Following that dangerous logic, we should never try to improve TOR or I2P, research and elaborate tools to keep our privacy and liberty as strong as possible, etc. Since you'd say nothing is NSA proof anyway. So what Sherlock, better give up then? Because *maybe, only maybe* ECDSA is not NSA proof, let's rely on 32-bits RSA instead?

Monero's privacy and therefore fungibility are MUCH stronger than Bitcoin's. 
This makes Monero a better candidate to deserve the term "digital cash".
illodin
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June 08, 2015, 06:00:22 PM
 #100

Claiming that because both don't hold 100% certainty, they're equivalent, is really crappy sophism.

Who made that claim? Not me. Still you're implying I did. Because if I did, then I would claim Bitcoin and DuckNote are equivalent, which I don't.
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