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Author Topic: GoldMoney [FB post]: James Turk in conversation with Félix Moreno de la Cova  (Read 14508 times)
n8rwJeTt8TrrLKPa55eU
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September 20, 2012, 10:30:53 PM
 #41

watch the interview again.  Turk did ask him how one would become an exchange for Bitcoin...

Considering MtGox has, as of August 2012, 192,270 registered accounts with 15,391 active in the last 30 days (about the same size as GoldMoney's 22,349 customers), and has grossed about $525,000 from Jan-Aug 2012, surely Mr. Turk cannot be so dense as to not sense the tremendous business opportunity; particularly given the relatively low cost of implementation because of GoldMoney's current system of AML/KYC, etc. already in place.

Plus, given all the negative experiences MtGox customers have had they could use a good competitor.

This is the obvious synergy between GoldMoney and Bitcoin.  Turk needs to add Bitcoin as both a deposit/withdrawal mechanism as well as simply another "hard-commodity" offering alongside gold, silver, platinum, palladium.
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September 20, 2012, 10:34:58 PM
 #42

sunnankar:  get yourself on Capital Account.  she's cute too.  Wink
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September 20, 2012, 10:41:45 PM
 #43

sunnankar:  get yourself on Capital Account.  she's cute too.  Wink

Perhaps you could nudge them?

I have an interview lined up to be released around the first week in October with a finance/economics blog that does about 10m visitors per year and the author interviewing me recently gave a speech at the NY Fed. Hope I can handle the heat! Going to be fun exposure for Bitcoin either way.

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September 20, 2012, 10:42:04 PM
 #44

...

Thus, the argument can be summed up as Bitcoin:Gold::math:physics/chemistry.

At least, that is a rought draft of the argument and why the use and definition of words is so important for the communication of ideas.

If one thinks about it, the quantum electrodynamics which are responsible for the physical properties of a the gold in a Krugerrand and lend it some of it's strength as a monetary instrument are every bit as conceptually challenging as the mathematics and cryptographic algorithms which do the same for Bitcoin.  Vastly more-so I would suggest.


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September 20, 2012, 10:49:26 PM
 #45

Felix also mentioned Hayek's theory of Emerging Order which fits Bitcoin to a tee:

Hayek’s key insights included a recognition that, because knowledge is dispersed and depends on time, place, and context, no central authority could acquire all the knowledge required to plan an economy. He also sought to better understand a phenomenon first identified by philosophers of the Scottish Enlightenment – that of spontaneous orders. Many orders such as languages, Hayek noted, are not constructed by a central authority. Instead, millions of individuals acting on their own create an ordered way of communication with one another.
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September 20, 2012, 10:53:10 PM
 #46

sunnankar:  get yourself on Capital Account.  she's cute too.  Wink

Perhaps you could nudge them?

I have an interview lined up to be released around the first week in October with a finance/economics blog that does about 10m visitors per year and the author interviewing me recently gave a speech at the NY Fed. Hope I can handle the heat! Going to be fun exposure for Bitcoin either way.

i actually tried to put up a comment request yesterday but couldn't get their commenting function to work.  i'll try again.
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September 20, 2012, 10:55:54 PM
 #47

Felix also mentioned Hayek's theory of Emerging Order which fits Bitcoin to a tee:

So Bitcoin fits into the Regression Theorem and the Emerging Order theory, yet the mainline Mises/Hayek crowd is still hesitant. Maybe they're waiting for the government to give Bitcoin its imprimatur? Wink
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September 20, 2012, 10:56:13 PM
 #48

If one thinks about it, the quantum electrodynamics which are responsible for the physical properties of a the gold in a Krugerrand and lend it some of it's strength as a monetary instrument are every bit as conceptually challenging as the mathematics and cryptographic algorithms which do the same for Bitcoin.  Vastly more-so I would suggest.

Except that Bitcoin is all of that (quantum electrodynamics) and more being an abstraction running on top of it (gold, silicon, copper, etc.).

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September 20, 2012, 10:57:30 PM
 #49

Felix also mentioned Hayek's theory of Emerging Order which fits Bitcoin to a tee:

So Bitcoin fits into the Regression Theorem and the Emerging Order theory, yet the mainline Mises/Hayek crowd is still hesitant. Maybe they're waiting for the government to give Bitcoin its imprimatur? Wink

The mind, like a parachute, has to be open to work. Most people are just followers anyway and very few are willing to actually do the hard intellectual labor of thinking. Let alone the harder intellectual work of changing how others think!

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September 20, 2012, 11:00:12 PM
 #50

The mind, like a parachute, has to be open to work. Most people are just followers anyway and very few are willing to actually do the hard intellectual labor of thinking. Let alone the harder intellectual work of changing how others think!

I suspect the run to bitcoin (pardon the pun) will start when the upper-tier deleveraging becomes more apparent to the mainstream investor. Rumors of QE3 and now the actual event makes everything look rosy at the moment but the buzz won't last.
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September 20, 2012, 11:02:04 PM
 #51

Felix also mentioned Hayek's theory of Emerging Order which fits Bitcoin to a tee:

Hayek’s key insights included a recognition that, because knowledge is dispersed and depends on time, place, and context, no central authority could acquire all the knowledge required to plan an economy. He also sought to better understand a phenomenon first identified by philosophers of the Scottish Enlightenment – that of spontaneous orders. Many orders such as languages, Hayek noted, are not constructed by a central authority. Instead, millions of individuals acting on their own create an ordered way of communication with one another.

in contrasting this with the system we have in place today, what we have is a fiat/debt based financial system whose means of conveying accurate price information (or communication) between billions of people is in purposeful disorder.  the most accurate information is hidden by a financial cartel that exists to hide or obfuscate information (communication) in order to gain unfair advantage and thus profit from this information (communication) asymmetry and the volatility it creates. 

Bitcoin solves this unfairness by maintaining a decentralized publicly based accounting ledger and software protocol open for all to see and examine in a way as to preserve order, not disorder.
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September 20, 2012, 11:03:36 PM
 #52

The mind, like a parachute, has to be open to work. Most people are just followers anyway and very few are willing to actually do the hard intellectual labor of thinking. Let alone the harder intellectual work of changing how others think!

I suspect the run to bitcoin (pardon the pun) will start when the upper-tier deleveraging becomes more apparent to the mainstream investor. Rumors of QE3 and now the actual event makes everything look rosy at the moment but the buzz won't last.

RUNTOBITCOIN.COM!!! Cheesy
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September 20, 2012, 11:13:42 PM
 #53

sunnankar:  get yourself on Capital Account.  she's cute too.  Wink

Perhaps you could nudge them?

I have an interview lined up to be released around the first week in October with a finance/economics blog that does about 10m visitors per year and the author interviewing me recently gave a speech at the NY Fed. Hope I can handle the heat! Going to be fun exposure for Bitcoin either way.

ok, just put up a comment requesting you on today's Capital Acct video.  how does she contact you?
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September 20, 2012, 11:21:17 PM
 #54

watch the interview again.  Turk did ask him how one would become an exchange for Bitcoin...

Considering MtGox has, as of August 2012, 192,270 registered accounts with 15,391 active in the last 30 days (about the same size as GoldMoney's 22,349 customers), and has grossed about $525,000 from Jan-Aug 2012, surely Mr. Turk cannot be so dense as to not sense the tremendous business opportunity; particularly given the relatively low cost of implementation because of GoldMoney's current system of AML/KYC, etc. already in place.

Plus, given all the negative experiences MtGox customers have had they could use a good competitor.

This is the obvious synergy between GoldMoney and Bitcoin.  Turk needs to add Bitcoin as both a deposit/withdrawal mechanism as well as simply another "hard-commodity" offering alongside gold, silver, platinum, palladium.

To be quite frank, I have a feeling any exchange that Turk sets up will be hacked.  The CEO of a bitcoin exchange has to be not only business savvy, but also techincal.  If the CEO has a hard time now understanding bitcoin there is a chance he will miss something.  I hope I am wrong.
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September 20, 2012, 11:40:49 PM
 #55


Is there a quick counter-argument for the "bitcoins are not tangible"?

It should be added to the Bitcoin - Myths, in honor of James Turk.

I liked the interview, James Turk seems reasonable enough. If the "tangible" is the only issue for him to embrace the idea, man, that's easy.



if James Turk were to tell me that money should be tangible or something i should be able to hold in my hand i would immediately ask him how can he justify developing digital GoldGrams?   he would blurt out something like, "well GoldGrams are backed by my patented proprietary software and there will never be anymore than there is physical gold in the GoldMoney system".  i would then retort, but i don't trust you James.  how do i know you won't change the code, get hacked, or fractionally reserve my bullion?  how do i know the US gov't won't come in and seize my gold?

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September 21, 2012, 12:05:33 AM
 #56

If one thinks about it, the quantum electrodynamics which are responsible for the physical properties of a the gold in a Krugerrand and lend it some of it's strength as a monetary instrument are every bit as conceptually challenging as the mathematics and cryptographic algorithms which do the same for Bitcoin.  Vastly more-so I would suggest.

Except that Bitcoin is all of that (quantum electrodynamics) and more being an abstraction running on top of it (gold, silicon, copper, etc.).

Fair enough.  All of these arguments do aptly illustrate that, similar to a fractal, pretty much all potential monetary instruments (and pretty much everything else besides) has many layers which could be explored.  And could safely be ignored if one wishes to focus on the simple engineering challenges of employing said instrument reliably.

I (for one) hold that both gold and Bitcoin are more simple and [thus] more robust than the various counter-party based instruments that are presented through 'MOPE' as the only realistic options.  (Alas, I must associated GoldMoney with the counter-party stuff as Cypherdoc argues/frets about, though I admit to not knowing much about it.)


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September 21, 2012, 12:47:03 AM
 #57

Turk did ask him how one would become an exchange for Bitcoin...

I wonder if Turk ever knew that Ruxum was allowing funds to be added to their exchange using GoldMoney goldgrams account-to-account transfers.  (The goldgrams received by Ruxum were converted to USDs or other fiat currency and credited to the account.)

I see that Ruxum exchange will accept GoldMoney Gold Grams, Silver and Palladium for adding funds to the exchange.  The metal is converted at current rates for the trading currency you choose, less a fee.


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September 21, 2012, 12:57:34 AM
 #58

goldbugs demand tangibility, what they actually mean is :
I want to be able to be the only one who can touch it.
when someone translates them that their word "tangibility" means "absolute ownership"
they should be able to get on the right track to understanding advantages of bitcoin

and about backing,
it is backed by me not wanting to sell it (cheap)
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"Proof-of-Asset Protocol"


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September 21, 2012, 01:14:24 AM
 #59

when someone translates them that their word "tangibility" means "absolute ownership"
they should be able to get on the right track to understanding advantages of bitcoin

This is a good start.

Absolute and provable ownership and easy verifiability are great features of Bitcoin. Tangible or intangible, doesn't matter, it's an asset.


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Affordable Physical Bitcoins - Denarium.com


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September 21, 2012, 01:17:35 AM
 #60

Lots of discussion going on in the Youtube comments. I posted a hell of a lot, need sleep now. Someone take over for me. In case you're wondering, I have Sabbetus as my nickname over there.

Denarium - Leading Physical Bitcoin Manufacturer - Gold Parity Coin Batch #2 NOW FOR SALE!
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