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Author Topic: It’s Time to Legalize Polygamy  (Read 1405 times)
jeannemadrigal2
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June 28, 2015, 12:29:39 AM
 #41

To force mosques to have same sex marriages or be forced to loose all tax exemptions?

I don't believe the marriage-equality issue is about forcing religious organisations to conduct marriages which are counter to their inherent bigotry.

AFAIK marriage-equality deals solely with the issue of ensuring that all US States have to conduct and recognise marriages between two people, irrespective of their gender. It is a legal issue of ensuring gay couples can have the same rights in marriage as heterosexual couples.

The law does not concern forcing religious organisations to conduct gay marriages. Unless you know otherwise.



Yes this is a common misunderstanding, and literally the ONLY valid argument that christians have against legalizing gay marriage.  But in reality there is no evedince that churches will be forced to marry gay people.  They just have to deal with other churches doing it if they so choose.

I think on the basic idea polygamy is ok, and there should be no problem with it.  But most of the time as mentioned above it is for unequal relationships.  Like in cults, and usually it involves minors too.  But it should be legal anyways, its like making piano wire illegal because someone used it to kill once before.  But anyway I think that people who want this lifestyle can have it, they just must have it "off the books", at least in america.

And don't get me started with muslims and how they treat their women, that is a whole other pandoras box.
Wilikon (OP)
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June 28, 2015, 12:55:43 AM
 #42

To force mosques to have same sex marriages or be forced to loose all tax exemptions?

I don't believe the marriage-equality issue is about forcing religious organisations to conduct marriages which are counter to their inherent bigotry.

AFAIK marriage-equality deals solely with the issue of ensuring that all US States have to conduct and recognise marriages between two people, irrespective of their gender. It is a legal issue of ensuring gay couples can have the same rights in marriage as heterosexual couples.

The law does not concern forcing religious organisations to conduct gay marriages. Unless you know otherwise.



Yes this is a common misunderstanding, and literally the ONLY valid argument that christians have against legalizing gay marriage.  But in reality there is no evedince that churches will be forced to marry gay people.  They just have to deal with other churches doing it if they so choose.

I think on the basic idea polygamy is ok, and there should be no problem with it.  But most of the time as mentioned above it is for unequal relationships.  Like in cults, and usually it involves minors too.  But it should be legal anyways, its like making piano wire illegal because someone used it to kill once before.  But anyway I think that people who want this lifestyle can have it, they just must have it "off the books", at least in america.

And don't get me started with muslims and how they treat their women, that is a whole other pandoras box.


*Already opened*


Beliathon
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June 28, 2015, 04:03:07 PM
 #43

As if this has never happened before throughout history... The walls crumble... Then it is rebuilt, then it goes down again... Over and over again. Nothing new.
Slavery was never returned after the violence to end slavery. Feudalism isn't making any comebacks either. Nor will monogamy, or capitalism when they fall to INTERNET + empathy.

Remember Aaron Swartz, a 26 year old computer scientist who died defending the free flow of information.
Wilikon (OP)
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June 28, 2015, 05:29:07 PM
 #44

As if this has never happened before throughout history... The walls crumble... Then it is rebuilt, then it goes down again... Over and over again. Nothing new.
Slavery was never returned after the violence to end slavery. Feudalism isn't making any comebacks either. Nor will monogamy, or capitalism when they fall to INTERNET + empathy.



It seems a lot of countries that are dealing (as in owning and selling) slaves today are also big fans of polygamy... This could be a coincidence...






We think of slavery as a practice of the past, an image from Roman colonies or 18th-century American plantations, but the practice of enslaving human beings as property still exists. There are 29.8 million people living as slaves right now, according to a comprehensive new report  issued by the Australia-based Walk Free Foundation.

This is not some softened, by-modern-standards definition of slavery. These 30 million people are living as forced laborers, forced prostitutes, child soldiers, child brides in forced marriages and, in all ways that matter, as pieces of property, chattel in the servitude of absolute ownership. Walk Free investigated 162 countries and found slaves in every single one. But the practice is far worse in some countries than others.

The country where you are most likely to be enslaved is Mauritania. Although this vast West African nation has tried three times to outlaw slavery within its borders, it remains so common that it is nearly normal. The report estimates that four percent of Mauritania is enslaved – one out of every 25 people. (The aid group SOS Slavery, using a broader definition of slavery, estimated several years ago that as  many as 20 percent of Mauritanians might be enslaved.)

The map at the top of this page shows almost every country in the world colored according to the share of its population that is enslaved. The rate of slavery is also alarmingly high in Haiti, in Pakistan and in India, the world's second-most populous country. In all three, more than 1 percent of the population is estimated to live in slavery.

A few trends are immediately clear from the map up top. First, rich, developed countries tend to have by far the lowest rates of slavery. The report says that effective government policies, rule of law, political stability and development levels all make slavery less likely. The vulnerable are less vulnerable, those who would exploit them face higher penalties and greater risk of getting caught. A war, natural disaster or state collapse is less likely to force helpless children or adults into bondage. Another crucial factor in preventing slavery is discrimination. When society treats women, ethnic groups or religious minorities as less valuable or less worthy of protection, they are more likely to become slaves.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/10/17/this-map-shows-where-the-worlds-30-million-slaves-live-there-are-60000-in-the-u-s/


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http://www.religioustolerance.org/sla_world.htm


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Beliathon
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June 28, 2015, 05:29:32 PM
 #45

I am in a monogamous relationship, but am polyamorous at heart.
Same here. Paying rent in my city costs too much of my time to sustain multiple very intimate relationships, to say nothing of the rarity of compatible +young + mutually attractive +poly folk.

Emboldened is the essence of polyamory. I only wish more people were like this.
Everyone will be like this after a few more decades, the walls have already begun crumbling down for all the myths of religion, monogamy is simply the last one to go. 


As if this has never happened before throughout history

nothing I wrote implied this is the first time a taboo has fallen away. When America was 13 colonies, both homosexuality and masturbation were crimes punishable by death.

Change is the only constant.

Remember Aaron Swartz, a 26 year old computer scientist who died defending the free flow of information.
fitimi
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June 29, 2015, 07:18:31 AM
 #46




Most dispiriting, and least convincing, are those arguments that simply reconstitute the slippery slope arguments that have been used for so long against same sex marriage. “If we allow group marriage,” the thinking seems to go, “why wouldn’t marriage with animals or children come next?” The difference is, of course, consent. In recent years, a progressive and enlightened movement has worked to insist that consent is the measure of all things in sexual and romantic practice: as long as all involved in any particular sexual or romantic relationship are consenting adults, everything is permissible; if any individual does not give free and informed consent, no sexual or romantic engagement can be condoned.

This bedrock principle of mutually-informed consent explains exactly why we must permit polygamy and must oppose bestiality and child marriage. Animals are incapable of voicing consent; children are incapable of understanding what it means to consent. In contrast, consenting adults who all knowingly and willfully decide to enter into a joint marriage contract, free of coercion, should be permitted to do so, according to basic principles of personal liberty. The preeminence of the principle of consent is a just and pragmatic way to approach adult relationships in a world of multivariate and complex human desires.

Progressives have always flattered themselves that time is on their side, that their preferences are in keeping with the arc of history. In the fight for marriage equality, this claim has made again and again. Many have challenged our politicians and our people to ask themselves whether they can imagine a future in which opposition to marriage equality is seen as a principled stance. I think it’s time to turn the question back on them: given what you know about the advancement of human rights, are you sure your opposition to group marriage won’t sound as anachronistic as opposition to gay marriage sounds to you now? And since we have insisted that there is no legitimate way to oppose gay marriage and respect gay love, how can you oppose group marriage and respect group love?

I suspect that many progressives would recognize, would pushed in this way, that the case against polygamy is incredibly flimsy, almost entirely lacking in rational basis and animated by purely irrational fears and prejudice. What we’re left with is an unsatisfying patchwork of unconvincing arguments and bad ideas, ones embraced for short-term convenience at long-term cost. We must insist that rights cannot be dismissed out of short-term interests of logistics and political pragmatism. The course then, is clear: to look beyond political convenience and conservative intransigence, and begin to make the case for extending legal marriage rights to more loving and committed adults. It’s time.


http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2015/06/gay-marriage-decision-polygamy-119469.html?cmpid=sf#ixzz3eBgtvUuQ




They don't just want to destroy marriage, they want to destroy Christianity.

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