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Author Topic: Change in BIP32 will make Trezor 1.0 useless?  (Read 1240 times)
Mickeyb
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August 02, 2015, 01:38:13 PM
 #21

I fail to see how this is an issue? regardless of it being Trezor or any other "BIP39" complaint hardware wallet.

So long as you remember your BIP39 mnemonic words you can recover your private keys and move funds even if there are changes OR your hardware wallet dies. There is half a dozen websites providing client side tools i.e. a single file (html + js) that you can keep on a USB (if you are paranoid that it wont be available in the future) that will derive your private keys from your BIP39 mnemonic (all done from the comfort of a old PC without a internet connection)

Need less of this scaremongering around here.

EDIT : Personally I use multiple hardware wallets with multisig ... get the best of both worlds + best security possible.

This whole thread is pretty much just FUD.
Any relevant change to protocols will be implemented as a firmware update to Trezor devices.

Trezors are not 'subject to failure' as far as I know.
Paper is hardly more secure or long-lasting.

Thank you guys, now I can sleep tighter! Smiley
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cafucafucafu
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August 02, 2015, 04:56:12 PM
 #22

This whole thread is pretty much just FUD.
Any relevant change to protocols will be implemented as a firmware update to Trezor devices.

Trezors are not 'subject to failure' as far as I know.
Paper is hardly more secure or long-lasting.
Well I am no expert. I was just looking at what Andreas said.


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cypherdoc
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August 02, 2015, 09:24:57 PM
 #23

Having bitcoins in a hardware wallet is a scary proposition. At least if the idea is to put it in and forget it for 10 years or so... Because with the speed of software changes - it is likely that in 10 years it will be very difficult if not almost impossible to access such an ancient system with much more modern software.

All software or hardware wallets will be impossible to access in just a few years. Already software from pre vista times are failing unless it is wery well written. I have a lot of floppy disks, 3.5 disk, HDs, CDs and USB devices that are failing and many terrabytes of informaton is gone.



If it uses BIP32 it shouldn't matter which wallet you use.

Even when you cant get the wallet software to run?

there will always be today's version of software available on github; forever.  so even if software updates and becomes backwards incompatible, all previous versions are available to access your current wallets.
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August 03, 2015, 09:08:44 PM
 #24

This whole thread is pretty much just FUD.
Any relevant change to protocols will be implemented as a firmware update to Trezor devices.

Trezors are not 'subject to failure' as far as I know.
Paper is hardly more secure or long-lasting.
Well I am no expert. I was just looking at what Andreas said.

The issue he's talking about is that it gets harder to change a protocol when it starts to become embedded.
It's not that the protocol changes can't be released as an upgrade, it's more that there are many devices that will never get upgraded for various reasons. Think about stuff like home routers, for example, that never get an upgrade.
If the network stops completely, people would either learn how to do it, pay someone to do it, or buy another router

Bitcoin involves their money, so I'd think the incentive is there to get the upgrade particularly if they can no longer access their money. Upgrades that just add features will likely not get done.
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August 03, 2015, 09:21:36 PM
 #25

This whole thread is pretty much just FUD.
Any relevant change to protocols will be implemented as a firmware update to Trezor devices.

Trezors are not 'subject to failure' as far as I know.
Paper is hardly more secure or long-lasting.
Well I am no expert. I was just looking at what Andreas said.

The issue he's talking about is that it gets harder to change a protocol when it starts to become embedded.
It's not that the protocol changes can't be released as an upgrade, it's more that there are many devices that will never get upgraded for various reasons. Think about stuff like home routers, for example, that never get an upgrade.
If the network stops completely, people would either learn how to do it, pay someone to do it, or buy another router

Bitcoin involves their money, so I'd think the incentive is there to get the upgrade particularly if they can no longer access their money. Upgrades that just add features will likely not get done.


Even if there is are many reasons to upgrade they will not get done if people leave the hardware wallet in a bank vault for x years. Many people want wealth they can treat like that.
errornone
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August 03, 2015, 09:29:51 PM
 #26

that is why i think BREADWALLET is the best wallet and cold storage out there.

iOS is super secure and you can always update everything to the newest versions.

It relies on BIP32+BIP39, so every private-key you actually have can be stored in your brain (or wherever you want). It is genius.

error
harrymmmm
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August 05, 2015, 01:42:00 AM
 #27

This whole thread is pretty much just FUD.
Any relevant change to protocols will be implemented as a firmware update to Trezor devices.

Trezors are not 'subject to failure' as far as I know.
Paper is hardly more secure or long-lasting.
Well I am no expert. I was just looking at what Andreas said.

The issue he's talking about is that it gets harder to change a protocol when it starts to become embedded.
It's not that the protocol changes can't be released as an upgrade, it's more that there are many devices that will never get upgraded for various reasons. Think about stuff like home routers, for example, that never get an upgrade.
If the network stops completely, people would either learn how to do it, pay someone to do it, or buy another router

Bitcoin involves their money, so I'd think the incentive is there to get the upgrade particularly if they can no longer access their money. Upgrades that just add features will likely not get done.


Even if there is are many reasons to upgrade they will not get done if people leave the hardware wallet in a bank vault for x years. Many people want wealth they can treat like that.

No problem there. The bitcoin is on the blockchain and safe. The hardware device holds a copy of the keys, but they can be kept elsewhere as well for use with any kind of wallet in future.
I would have trouble believing that in 10 years time there would be no software around that could restore those keys given a current hd seed even if the protocol was changed. Maybe a minor speed bump to get someone to find the software and do it for you, I guess.
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