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Author Topic: what the hell ever happened to deepbit?  (Read 5489 times)
kinlo
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October 17, 2012, 01:03:56 PM
 #21

Deepbit has indeed been decreasing in market share.  They're now at 15% of the total mining power.

Allow me to spam my site again: http://blockorigin.pfoe.be/top.php

This data is much more accurate then the info on blockchain, and as my data always calculates in real time over the last 2 weeks, you get low variance numbers.
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There are several different types of Bitcoin clients. Header-only clients like MultiBit trust that the majority of mining power is honest for the purposes of enforcing network rules such as the 21 million BTC limit. Full clients do not trust miners in this way.
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organofcorti
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October 17, 2012, 01:22:51 PM
 #22

Deepbit has indeed been decreasing in market share.  They're now at 15% of the total mining power.

Allow me to spam my site again: http://blockorigin.pfoe.be/top.php

This data is much more accurate then the info on blockchain, and as my data always calculates in real time over the last 2 weeks, you get low variance numbers.

The variance based on blocks/time period isn't that low. Atm, for Deepbit, you list 309 blocks and 50btc 378 blocks. The 95% confidence interval for Deepbit's hashrate will be +/- 11% and for 50btc it will be +/- 10%. Not very large, but not negligible either. Your site provides a great estimate though.

The only way to get an accurate estimate of hashrate for a given period is to add up all the hashes and divide by the total time in seconds - you have to rely on the pool's website providing accurate data to do that.


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October 17, 2012, 03:41:22 PM
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o how the mighty have fallen.



seriously. wtf happened?

they went from over 50% to like 2% of the hash rate.
people finally understood deepbit is a rip-off. hard but true Wink

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October 17, 2012, 07:25:17 PM
 #24

blockchain has reported multiple triplemining and btc50 blocks as 'deepbit' blocks when it records my node as relaying them first (5.9.24.81).  seems as if I got the 'deepbit' tag on myself.

most of the deepbit blocks will be relayed by 82.130.102.160, as it's my understanding that deepbit blocks the blockchain IPs

kinlo
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October 17, 2012, 11:17:16 PM
 #25

blockchain has reported multiple triplemining and btc50 blocks as 'deepbit' blocks when it records my node as relaying them first (5.9.24.81).  seems as if I got the 'deepbit' tag on myself.

Blockchain is too often wrong...
kinlo
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October 17, 2012, 11:19:36 PM
 #26

The variance based on blocks/time period isn't that low. Atm, for Deepbit, you list 309 blocks and 50btc 378 blocks. The 95% confidence interval for Deepbit's hashrate will be +/- 11% and for 50btc it will be +/- 10%. Not very large, but not negligible either. Your site provides a great estimate though.

The only way to get an accurate estimate of hashrate for a given period is to add up all the hashes and divide by the total time in seconds - you have to rely on the pool's website providing accurate data to do that.

My method is not perfect, that's true.  However, people use blockchain's graphs to look at pool shares, which is a) often incorrect by attributing blocks to the wrong pool and b) calculated over only a few days..  That makes it completly unreliable...
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October 17, 2012, 11:25:53 PM
 #27

The variance based on blocks/time period isn't that low. Atm, for Deepbit, you list 309 blocks and 50btc 378 blocks. The 95% confidence interval for Deepbit's hashrate will be +/- 11% and for 50btc it will be +/- 10%. Not very large, but not negligible either. Your site provides a great estimate though.

The only way to get an accurate estimate of hashrate for a given period is to add up all the hashes and divide by the total time in seconds - you have to rely on the pool's website providing accurate data to do that.

My method is not perfect, that's true.  However, people use blockchain's graphs to look at pool shares, which is a) often incorrect by attributing blocks to the wrong pool and b) calculated over only a few days..  That makes it completly unreliable...

If you meant that the variance would be lower than blockchain's because it's based on a longer time period, then I agree. It's much better to use your table than blockchain's pie chart. But it's even more accurate to calculate data based on total hashes / seconds as reported by the website - as I do on the chart I linked to on the last page.


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October 18, 2012, 01:39:51 AM
 #28


o how the mighty have fallen.



seriously. wtf happened?

they went from over 50% to like 2% of the hash rate.
people finally understood deepbit is a rip-off. hard but true Wink

I wouldn't call using the most reliable pool, which one can use unattended with complete confidence, a "rip-off".  I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use.  And I don't, particularly, have a problem with hoppers.  If I did have a problem with hoppers I would hop myself to offset the loss, which anyone can do if they want to put forth the time and effort.  0 fee pools are a rip-off if you ask me.  You just can't get something for nothing, no way to get around that fact, learn it, live it, know it!
Sam

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October 18, 2012, 02:42:13 AM
 #29

I just got sick of it and moved to something without fees.
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October 18, 2012, 04:32:34 AM
 #30


o how the mighty have fallen.



seriously. wtf happened?

they went from over 50% to like 2% of the hash rate.
people finally understood deepbit is a rip-off. hard but true Wink

I wouldn't call using the most reliable pool, which one can use unattended with complete confidence, a "rip-off".  I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use.  And I don't, particularly, have a problem with hoppers.  If I did have a problem with hoppers I would hop myself to offset the loss, which anyone can do if they want to put forth the time and effort.  0 fee pools are a rip-off if you ask me.  You just can't get something for nothing, no way to get around that fact, learn it, live it, know it!
Sam
totaly wrong, this is OSS. If you dont understand the basics, just dont even try to argue  Wink

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organofcorti
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October 18, 2012, 05:18:01 AM
 #31


o how the mighty have fallen.



seriously. wtf happened?

they went from over 50% to like 2% of the hash rate.
people finally understood deepbit is a rip-off. hard but true Wink

I wouldn't call using the most reliable pool, which one can use unattended with complete confidence, a "rip-off".  I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use.  And I don't, particularly, have a problem with hoppers.  If I did have a problem with hoppers I would hop myself to offset the loss, which anyone can do if they want to put forth the time and effort.  0 fee pools are a rip-off if you ask me.  You just can't get something for nothing, no way to get around that fact, learn it, live it, know it!
Sam
totaly wrong, this is OSS. If you dont understand the basics, just dont even try to argue  Wink

os2sam can't be wrong unless you clearly define "rip off".I can think of many values of "rip off" for which os2sam would be correct and you would not.

Please define "rip off" in terms that can be tested.

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K1773R
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October 18, 2012, 05:55:35 AM
 #32

PPS:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*90

Prop:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*97

this was fine in the start due to no other pools (expect sluh's) were able to compete with deepbit, but now the situation is different.
its like selling a 10 year old car still for the same prices as you bought it -> rip-off.
so to clarify, nowadays deepbit is a rip-off.

Not even to talk about this from us2sam
"I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use."
all i have to say to that is total retardness, sry if this sound harsh but its  a fact.
and for the point, 0 fee pools are rip-off. there are scampools (yes 0 fee pools, 100+% PPS pools, etc) but you setting a fee is forcing ppl. as example take a look at EMC, 0% fee per default but you can donate on your own, most dont but thats because they are selfish. Another example would be ArsBitcoin (which failed due to bad luck and developer having no time to work on his pool), 1% fee per default but you can set it to 0% if you want.

Mining at a hyped pool dosnt mean its worth it. This discussion would lead to marketing and there isnt a good idea to discus. Or are you one of the guys just buying a new iPhone because everyone else has it, or because i has the Apple Logo on it? I bet so...

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October 18, 2012, 06:04:24 AM
 #33

deepbit should lower its fees in order to get more hash power Smiley
it isn't 100% ddos proof thus the continuing 3% fee is too much now days!
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October 18, 2012, 06:05:19 AM
 #34

PPS:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*90

Prop:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*97

Can you give me your rip off limits for DGM and PPLNS too? I'm trying to decide if you're one of those miners who want something for nothing.

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October 18, 2012, 06:10:17 AM
 #35

10% fee PPS is unnaceptable, max 5% should be it.
3% fee for Prop is unnaceptable too, 3% DGM would be the max too. But DGM is totally different from Prop!

If i would want a 0% fee pool i continue at EMC and set the donation to 0%, but no my donation isnt at 0%!

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October 18, 2012, 11:13:19 AM
 #36

PPS:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*90

Who mines PPS at Deepbit anymore?

Prop:
#DEFINE rip-off (ACTUALWORK/100)*97

That is in line with most other fee based pools.

its like selling a 10 year old car still for the same prices as you bought it -> rip-off.

Not a good analogy, it would clearly depend on the car.  There are cars that sell many times what they cost new.

Not even to talk about this from us2sam
"I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use."
all i have to say to that is total retardness, sry if this sound harsh but its  a fact.

Why?  What's wrong with supporting a quality pool so that it can stay in business?  Some people want pools to go away, is that why you hold this point of view?

but you setting a fee is forcing ppl.

How does a pool force a person to pay a fee?  A person has a choice where they mine, a pool cannot force anyone to mine there, thus pay a fee.

and for the point, 0 fee pools are rip-off. there are scampools (yes 0 fee pools, 100+% PPS pools, etc)
...snip...
 as example take a look at EMC, 0% fee per default but you can donate on your own, most dont but thats because they are selfish.

I shouldn't have made a blanket statement about 0 fee pools.  I'm not all are a "rip-Off".

Another example would be ArsBitcoin (which failed due to bad luck and developer having no time to work on his pool), 1% fee per default but you can set it to 0% if you want.

Or maybe it wasn't feasible at that fee structure?

Mining at a hyped pool dosnt mean its worth it. This discussion would lead to marketing and there isnt a good idea to discus.

The only I hype I ever hear about Deepbit is FUD.  I have never seen/read/heard [Tycho] market his pool.  People use it because they have a good experience with it.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.


Or are you one of the guys just buying a new iPhone because everyone else has it, or because i has the Apple Logo on it? I bet so...

The only reason I have an iPhone (stupid name) is because my employer requires me to have it.  If I had my choice I would still be using my Motorola StarTac flip phone.

We all have the freedom of choice, you are trying to restrict my freedom, I won't stand for it.  You make your choices for your reasons, fine I respect that.  Respect my freedom to make my choices!
Sam

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October 18, 2012, 11:24:01 AM
 #37

10% fee PPS is unnaceptable, max 5% should be it.
3% fee for Prop is unnaceptable too,

Fine, start your own pool and set your own fee structure.  Put your money where your mouth is.

3% DGM would be the max too. But DGM is totally different from Prop!

DGM is virtually unverifiable my the average miner.  I would never use it DGM unless I trusted the pool without reservation.

If i would want a 0% fee pool i continue at EMC and set the donation to 0%, but no my donation isnt at 0%!

So in the end we end up agreeing.  You choose what pool you support and I choose the pool(s) I support.  I'm not irritated with your choice.

Why are you irritated with me exercising my freedom?
Sam

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
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A: Top-posting.
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October 18, 2012, 12:04:46 PM
 #38

3% DGM would be the max too. But DGM is totally different from Prop!

DGM is virtually unverifiable my the average miner.  I would never use it DGM unless I trusted the pool without reservation.

Are you saying that it's possible to underpay miners on DGM unless you trust the pool? It would be nice if there was a simple to follow accounting method for miners using DGM, true, but as most DGM tune for variance reduction a month's mining should tell if you're earning PPS or not.

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October 18, 2012, 12:10:28 PM
 #39

3% DGM would be the max too. But DGM is totally different from Prop!

DGM is virtually unverifiable my the average miner.  I would never use it DGM unless I trusted the pool without reservation.

Are you saying that it's possible to underpay miners on DGM unless you trust the pool?

NO! I am not saying that.  I am saying "I" don't know how to verify it.

That being said I am using a DGM pool that I trust without reservation and am very happy with it.

I am NOT trying to start DGM FUD.
Sam

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
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A: Top-posting.
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October 18, 2012, 01:19:51 PM
 #40


o how the mighty have fallen.



seriously. wtf happened?

they went from over 50% to like 2% of the hash rate.
people finally understood deepbit is a rip-off. hard but true Wink

I wouldn't call using the most reliable pool, which one can use unattended with complete confidence, a "rip-off".  I pay higher fees/contributions at the other pools I use.  And I don't, particularly, have a problem with hoppers.  If I did have a problem with hoppers I would hop myself to offset the loss, which anyone can do if they want to put forth the time and effort.  0 fee pools are a rip-off if you ask me.  You just can't get something for nothing, no way to get around that fact, learn it, live it, know it!
Sam
Hello

Let's speak about p2pool. No fees, you also receive transaction fees, it's the most reliable pool, it's totally safe and it is never down.

 Wink

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