Scam Alert!!! Another user Escrowed for his alt

[Neotox]

Here is story:

I done a trade with a user "X" and after trade was complete this account"X" was sold to other user (can't reveal username because this account is now owned by a new owner who has nothing to do with this stuff so I don't want to involve him in this)
I had some problem with trade so I sent him many PMs and after he never replied left him a neg feedback but later he replied to me that he is new owner of this account and it was sold to him by user "Kanapka" using Defcon23 as escrow.


Cool

I sent message to user "Kanapka" for problem regarding my trade and this user responded me that he never sold me anything , and he bought this account from someone using Defcon23 as escrow, and asked me that I can confirm this from Defcon23
"here is screenshot of feedback left by Defcon23 on Kanapka trust page saying that this account(Kanapka) was sold using his escrow service"
https://i.imgur.com/DFebY2i.png

Ok, then I sent message to Defcon23 asking for this and he said Kanapka account was sold using his escrow when I asked when it was sold then he said it was sold after he did any trade with me(When I asked for date when the account was sold he refused).Then I asked him for some proofs that the account was sold so I know that it is not the original user who done trade with me and he didn't answered and started making fake excuses like"its my son's birthday and I am busy"


then I checked forum security log and found that password of account "Kanapka" was not changed since last 1 month? (my trade was 9-10 sepetember)
so it means that Defcon23 lied about this and account Kanapka was never sold using his escrow, this prove that "Kanapka" is his alt account and he is defending it using hero account Defcon23


also he left positive feedback to Kanapka for this transaction and also took fees from buyer for the trade between buyer and "Kanapka"(his potential alt)
that is against forum rules.

Here are Proofs where he said that the account was sold

trust page of kanapka => https://i.imgur.com/DFebY2i.png


Pms from defcon23 =>

helo

yes i have escrowed the sale of this account recently... nothing more to say. ( as you can read in the + 1 i let him , after this sale.)


regards.

old user "Kanapka" i nerver knew before, had sold this account to an another user ( ACTUAL owner ) , and it seems he hasn't change the account name.

so, if you had anny issue with the user "Kanapka" in the past , you have to know the actual owner of this account is NOT the same person.
( cause i recently had to escrow this account sale , as i already told you )

Hope this could help you..

Best regards

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[vodaljepa]

Oh god this seems like a normal thing to do around here

[Jhanzo]

looks like he left you a retaliation feedback. lol look at that spelling. he's so mad he can't even spell properly.

notice that both feedback have a space before the question/exclamation marks (someone screenshot them. I'm lazy). that might mean nothing, but who knows.

[Neotox]

Lol yes
He left me negative feedback because I exposed him,but nothing new it was expected action by him

I don't care about this,if I get one negative feedback for each scammer I trap, I am ready to accept hundreds of negative feedbacks because everyone know they are false one

[Athertle]

So this might mean that users who use Defcon's escrow service for large funds might find themselves coughing in his dust while he runs away with them. He might be one of those members who keep buying accounts, getting trust, doing escrow, and running.

Oh god this seems like a normal thing to do around here

It's not, and you should never think of it like that.

[hedgy73]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

[Jhanzo]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

how? it'll make it even more harder to monitor account trades if the traders take their sales outside of this site.

[Athertle]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

However, if accounts are banned, people will believe that all accounts were created by the original owner and thus will be a bit more trustworthy, so accounts sold under the table will have greater scam opportunities.

[doxxening]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

However, if accounts are banned, people will believe that all accounts were created by the original owner and thus will be a bit more trustworthy, so accounts sold under the table will have greater scam opportunities.

did I get you right?
coz if yes, we should a;so legalize rape and murder, or people would forget that they could be raped & murdered & drop their guard.  

[Athertle]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

However, if accounts are banned, people will believe that all accounts were created by the original owner and thus will be a bit more trustworthy, so accounts sold under the table will have greater scam opportunities.

did I get you right?
coz if yes, we should a;so legalize rape and murder, or people would forget that they could be raped & murdered & drop their guard.  

You should understand that I'm not going to troll you if you post on your main.

I see your point; however, rape and murder happen so often IRL that it's practically impossible to forget it. Plus, you know when someone gets raped/murdered because it's on the news; however, the buying/selling of accounts can't be found out until either

a) the new owner of the account messes up
b) he pulls the scam.

Also, escrows would not escrow for account trades, which means that people would be forced to have someone send first in those under-the-table deals, which means that many people would get scammed like that.

[doxxening]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

However, if accounts are banned, people will believe that all accounts were created by the original owner and thus will be a bit more trustworthy, so accounts sold under the table will have greater scam opportunities.

did I get you right?
coz if yes, we should a;so legalize rape and murder, or people would forget that they could be raped & murdered & drop their guard.  

You should understand that I'm not going to troll you if you post on your main.

I see your point; however, rape and murder happen so often IRL that it's practically impossible to forget it.

ORLY?  never been raped or murdered myself.

Plus, you know when someone gets raped/murdered because it's on the news; however, the buying/selling of accounts can't be found out until either

a) the new owner of the account messes up
b) he pulls the scam.

you know what tho?  I didn't know that accounts were bought & sold on bitcointalk before chancing into the auctions sub.  even reported a couple, before I learned that it's a thing here.

so maybe we should put something like "ACCOUNTS ARE BOUGHT AND SOLD HERE, LOL" on the signup page, so noobs would know?

Also, escrows would not escrow for account trades, which means that people would be forced to have someone send first in those under-the-table deals, which means that many people would get scammed like that.

as it stands now, escrow means two different accounts controlled by the same user.  besides, disallowing CP sales on bitcointalk means such sales won't be properly escrowed i'd lose no sleep if a guy buying CP or accounts got ripped off.

[Athertle]

ORLY?  never been raped or murdered myself.

Doesn't mean that it happens often in the real world. I've never been scammed, but look around at the forum; plenty of scams occur here.

you know what tho?  I didn't know that accounts were bought & sold on bitcointalk before chancing into the auctions sub.  even reported a couple, before I learned that it's a thing here.

so maybe we should put something like "ACCOUNTS ARE BOUGHT AND SOLD HERE, LOL" on the signup page, so noobs would know?

I think I phrased my statement wrongly. I meant to say, "however, the fact that an account is bought/sold can't be found out until either".

Plenty of people know the fact that accounts are bought/sold; how early you know that really depends on where you spend your time in sections.

I think the community does a good job keeping newbies cautious against everyone and encouraging escrow.

i'd lose no sleep if a guy buying CP or accounts got ripped off.

Just because someone buys an account doesn't mean that they are 100% buying it to scam. There are tons of honest people who buy accounts to participate in signature campaigns; you wouldn't care if they got ripped off, but you would if someone else did? I guess that's just your opinion.

[doxxening]

ORLY?  never been raped or murdered myself.

Doesn't mean that it happens often in the real world. I've never been scammed, but look around at the forum; plenty of scams occur here.

you know what tho?  I didn't know that accounts were bought & sold on bitcointalk before chancing into the auctions sub.  even reported a couple, before I learned that it's a thing here.

so maybe we should put something like "ACCOUNTS ARE BOUGHT AND SOLD HERE, LOL" on the signup page, so noobs would know?

I think I phrased my statement wrongly. I meant to say, "however, the fact that an account is bought/sold can't be found out until either".

in that case, not sure I understand you.  are you saying noobs won't know if accounts are bought and sold until they poke around the forum & stumble across an account for sale?  If you're so intent on protecting the noobs from getting scammed by a bought account, why not simply put...
"WARNING: WHILE THE SALE OF USER ACCOUNTS IS PROHIBITED ON BITCOINTALK, ACCOUNTS COULD BE BOUGHT AND SOLD OFF-SITE. DUH!"
...on the signup page?

besides, according to most account dealers/users around here, bought accounts are seldom involved in scams, so why not focus on more generalized warnings, like
"CAUTION! SOMETIMES, PEOPLE LIE! BE CAREFUL!"

Just because someone buys an account doesn't mean that they are 100% buying it to scam. There are tons of honest people who buy accounts to participate in signature campaigns; you wouldn't care if they got ripped off, but you would if someone else did? I guess that's just your opinion.

sure it does.  unless newbie restrictions are put in place simply to encourage account sales.
edit: no, i would not care if some mercenary posters got ripped off.  they collectively are making this forum a spammy piece of shit that it has become.
my only regret is they could not lose MORE.

[Athertle]

in that case, not sure I understand you.  are you saying noobs won't know if accounts are bought and sold until they poke around the forum & stumble across an account for sale?  If you're so intent on protecting the noobs from getting scammed by a bought account, why not simply put...
"WARNING: WHILE THE SALE OF USER ACCOUNTS IS PROHIBITED ON BITCOINTALK, ACCOUNTS COULD BE BOUGHT AND SOLD OFF-SITE. DUH!"
...on the signup page?

besides, according to most account dealers/users around here, bought accounts are seldom involved in scams, so why not focus on more generalized warnings, like
"CAUTION! SOMETIMES, PEOPLE LIE! BE CAREFUL!"

That's why I put the last bit in.

I think the community does a good job keeping newbies cautious against everyone and encouraging escrow.

sure it does.  unless newbie restrictions are put in place simply to encourage account sales.
edit: no, i would not care if some mercenary posters got ripped off.  they collectively are making this forum a spammy piece of shit that it has become.
my only regret is they could not lose MORE.

You're not making much sense here. I think you obviously know that newbie restrictions are not put in place to encourage account sales; instead, to prevent spam and etc. And so you're saying that every single account that is bought is used for spamming? That's obviously not true.

Okay... So every single person here on the forum with a signature ad deserves to be scammed. This is the point where I understand that I cannot have an intellectual discussion with you. Again, that's your opinion. You should go discuss it in this thread.

I figure we should bring the discussion to a thread in Meta. I'm sure there are quite a number of threads that are suitable for this, but we're clogging up this thread.

And if you're so intent on arguing your point, create a new thread in Meta and I'm sure you could get a number of replies, not just me.

[doxxening]

in that case, not sure I understand you.  are you saying noobs won't know if accounts are bought and sold until they poke around the forum & stumble across an account for sale?  If you're so intent on protecting the noobs from getting scammed by a bought account, why not simply put...
"WARNING: WHILE THE SALE OF USER ACCOUNTS IS PROHIBITED ON BITCOINTALK, ACCOUNTS COULD BE BOUGHT AND SOLD OFF-SITE. DUH!"
...on the signup page?

besides, according to most account dealers/users around here, bought accounts are seldom involved in scams, so why not focus on more generalized warnings, like
"CAUTION! SOMETIMES, PEOPLE LIE! BE CAREFUL!"

That's why I put the last bit in.

I think the community does a good job keeping newbies cautious against everyone and encouraging escrow.

if by "a good job" you mean "trading on bitcointalk is less dangerous  than jumping head-firs into a wood chipper, but just barely" & by "the community" you mean to say "dood who is both the escrow and the seller," then I agree.
but how is this relevant to allowing account sales vs. simply putting this
"WARNING: WHILE THE SALE OF USER ACCOUNTS IS PROHIBITED ON BITCOINTALK, ACCOUNTS COULD BE BOUGHT AND SOLD OFF-SITE. DUH!"
...on the signup page?

Okay... So every single person here on the forum with a signature ad deserves to be scammed.

if the person got scammed trying to buy an account*, presumably the person wouldn't be in a sig campaign, because got scammed & didn't get the account to spam with.
a valuable lessen learned & justice served, Allah be praised.

This is the point where I understand that I cannot have an intellectual discussion with you. Again, that's your opinion. You should go discuss it in this thread.

it's alright tho, you still got your satoshis from your sig ad, so count it as a win, i guess

*thus breaking the forum rules; no escrow because account dealing is verboten; your argument, remember? prolly not, so here:

... escrows would not escrow for account trades, which means that people would be forced to have someone send first in those under-the-table deals, which means that many people would get scammed like that.

[ajareselde]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

Exactly. It would be much easier to at the least to know with who you are dealing with if account sales were to be prohibited.

I'm wondering if this one will finish with the same mob fury as QS did.

[Jhanzo]

Yet another good reason why selling accounts should be banned.

Exactly. It would be much easier to at the least to know with who you are dealing with if account sales were to be prohibited.

I'm wondering if this one will finish with the same mob fury as QS did.

probably not. defcon23 doesn't have as many people hating his guts as QS does.
and I don't see anyone here saying fact this and fact that.

not sure if it's good or bad.

[Kanapka]

This account is mine since its creation. I can sign a message

And of course I'm not defcom.

I sold another account. Won't say what account because you'll neg it only to annoy me and sellers never reveal what account has been sold

Please refrain to try to bully and ruin the reputation of random people that never traded with you and have no idea WTF are you talking about

Regards

PS: we all know you have an army of alts, please don't do too much shilling in this topic

[Athertle]

This account is mine since its creation. I can sign a message

And of course I'm not defcom.

I sold another account. Won't say what account because you'll neg it only to annoy me and sellers never reveal what account has been sold

Please refrain to try to bully and ruin the reputation of random people that never traded with you and have no idea WTF are you talking about

Regards

PS: we all know you have an army of alts, please don't do too much shilling in this topic

The debate wasn't for your account not being sold. On the contrary, it was about it not being sold; about you/defcon lying about it being sold despite it not being sold in the last month.

[Kanapka]

Your feedback doesn't even has a reference link and you don't even say what are the PMs about. My guess is that you are just lying and trying to bully people for God's know what reason

This account is mine since its creation. I can sign a message

And of course I'm not defcom.

I sold another account. Won't say what account because you'll neg it only to annoy me and sellers never reveal what account has been sold

Please refrain to try to bully and ruin the reputation of random people that never traded with you and have no idea WTF are you talking about

Regards

PS: we all know you have an army of alts, please don't do too much shilling in this topic

The debate wasn't for your account not being sold. On the contrary, it was about it not being sold; about you/defcon lying about it being sold despite it not being sold in the last month.

Who said that my account was sold ?

I made an auction for an account that has nothing to do with my account