Bitcoin Exchange Gemini Approved for Launch in New York

[OmegaStarScream]

After I made this thread couple of days ago : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1198349.0 , now seems like they got the full approval and they are ready to go .

Gemini, the much-anticipated bitcoin exchange led by entrepreneurs and investors Cameron and Tyler Winklevoss, has received approval from the New York State Department of Financial Services to begin serving US customers in 26 states as well as Washington, DC.


Article on Coindesk : http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-exchange-gemini-new-york/
Article on TechCrunch : http://techcrunch.com/2015/10/05/winklevoss-twins-receive-approval-to-launch-bitcoin-exchange-gemini/

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[WhatTheGox]

Ok good, i did think this was already approved but oh well its all good.  Would be nice to have any updates on ETF.

[unamis76]

Will NY users flock to Gemini? I think they'll have a nice userbase, but the question is if investing to serve that userbase will be worth it in what concerns profit in the long run... I think they'll have success

[DooMAD]

I suppose it's good in the sense that it grants more legitimacy and helps shed the "wild west" image of crypto, with their regulator-friendly approach.  But at the same time, I'm not one of those people who thinks we're off to the moon just because of an exchange launching.  Good news, but nothing to get overly excited about.

[dre1982]

I suppose it's good in the sense that it grants more legitimacy and helps shed the "wild west" image of crypto, with their regulator-friendly approach.  But at the same time, I'm not one of those people who thinks we're off to the moon just because of an exchange launching.  Good news, but nothing to get overly excited about.

I don't think this need will fire BTC to the moon. But is finally some good news. The most news about Bitcoin is just negative publicity.

[chennan]

Does anyone know the list of states that are allowed to use gemini? I hope my state is one of them, because I hate dealing with circle and coinbase...

[Zombier0]

So do we expct btc to raise? Gemini bros have enough overpiced BTCs to sell before buying from other markts

[Mikestang]

Gemini, the much-anticipated bitcoin exchange led by entrepreneurs and investors Cameron and Tyler Winklevoss, has received approval from the New York State Department of Financial Services to begin serving US customers in 26 states as well as Washington, DC.

It's good to see this project moving forward, but I wish they took a stand againsty New York's ridiculous regulation environment and set up their business in a more btc friendly state.  Sure, NY is like the USA finance capital, but still, why build a bitcoin business in a state that is hostile to bitcoin?

[Brad Harrison]

Good to see things like this happening in bitcoin world

[Amph]

should help those that live there and where excluded from other major exchange like kraken and bitfinex if i'm not mistaken

i was expecting a better front to be honest, seems too generic...

[bct-user]

well looks like they have pretty much demand, because they have a long queue of individual and institutional of people waiting to sign up on their site. the site is looks professional.

Does anyone know the list of states that are allowed to use gemini? I hope my state is one of them, because I hate dealing with circle and coinbase...

nothing information about their list of states. 26 states has been listed.

[Rumichbit]

This should help Bitcoin, we need more stuff like this.

[Mickeyb]

I suppose it's good in the sense that it grants more legitimacy and helps shed the "wild west" image of crypto, with their regulator-friendly approach.  But at the same time, I'm not one of those people who thinks we're off to the moon just because of an exchange launching.  Good news, but nothing to get overly excited about.

Yes, I agree with you. It gives us another legit exchange and it moves us even further from Mt. Gox fiasco and all the bad taste in the mouth that all that left us with.

It's even more important that this exchange might be used more by serious, business people. Stock exchange type of people. They love stuff like that and even need an exchange as legit as this to get into Bitcoin world. Let's not forget all the New York people that however got shaked up a bit by all of the BitLicense stuff.

[intristin]

Can't tell you how annoying it is as a New Yorker to be locked out of just about every current exchange. I welcome the news though I don't really care for the Winklevoss. I'll hold my nose as there are really no other options for easy USD withdrawal and deposit. Cryptsy wanted me to mail something called a check, whatever the hell that is, lol. I think my Grandparents use to use them while they walked 10 miles uphill in the snow to get to school.

[Preen]

I'm pleasantly surprised that Gemini is launching so quickly. I was under the impression it would take another couple of months. This is a good step forward, hopefully we will see that ETF follow soon.

[CoinBateman]

So do we expct btc to raise? Gemini bros have enough overpiced BTCs to sell before buying from other markts

Clearly you don't understand how things like this work. These things take time, and if you think the winklevoss guys haven't been hedging their holdings this whole time then you are clearly none the wiser than the rest of the community who expect winklevoss to be the saviour.

Markets are created by the few, who want to make money from the many. They are a business.

We've had a completely different order of magnitude volume since the January low, and my guess is that they've been preparing for quite some time.

[Guido]

definitely good news

[popovicbit]

Very good news

[UserVVIP]

DONT TRUST THIS EXCHANGE!!!

I DEPOSIT 50BTC AND THEY MASSIVE SCAM KEPT ALL MY BTC SAYS I PUT 0 IN BUT THEY LIE DONT TRUST THEM!

[xyzzy099]

Does anyone know the list of states that are allowed to use gemini? I hope my state is one of them, because I hate dealing with circle and coinbase...

Gemini is currently operational in the following US states:

California
Colorado
Delaware
Florida
Idaho
Indiana
Kansas
Kentucky
Louisiana
Maryland
Michigan
Minnesotta
Mississippi
Missouri
Montana
New Hampshire
New Mexico
New York
North Carolina
Ohio
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Tennessee
Utah
Vermont
Washington, D.C.
Wyoming

We are working hard with regulators to open in other states and other countries around the world. If you live in a state or country where we are not yet operational, please feel free to continue the registration process and we will notify you once we are open for trading in your area.

[Pathi]

DONT TRUST THIS EXCHANGE!!!

I DEPOSIT 50BTC AND THEY MASSIVE SCAM KEPT ALL MY BTC SAYS I PUT 0 IN BUT THEY LIE DONT TRUST THEM!

Errr, I don't think they open for 3 more days??

[intristin]

Just got my invite code, it includes the list of states that can use it...

Hello from your friends at Gemini!

You have been granted early access to onboard to Gemini, a licensed and regulated bitcoin exchange in the United States. You can now fund your account in preparation for trading. Gemini will officially open for trading on Thursday, October 8th at 9:30 AM EDT.

To sign up, please go to Gemini.com, click the "Register" button and enter your unique invite code:

#########

Gemini is currently operational in the following US states:

California
Colorado
Delaware
Florida
Idaho
Indiana
Kansas
Kentucky
Louisiana
Maryland
Michigan
Minnesotta
Mississippi
Missouri
Montana
New Hampshire
New Mexico
New York
North Carolina
Ohio
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Tennessee
Utah
Vermont
Washington, D.C.
Wyoming

We are working hard with regulators to open in other states and other countries around the world. If you live in a state or country where we are not yet operational, please feel free to continue the registration process and we will notify you once we are open for trading in your area.

Welcome aboard,

Team Gemini

[chennan]

So I forgot that I "pre arranged" me to set up my account and got an email just now to setup my account... so I was looking through the user agreement terms, and it seems they give quite literally ALL your information to the government to keep track of you and your purchases and everything else.  They also do background checks and possibly everything else to invade your privacy... I don't like this, did any one else see this?

[Enjorlas]

So I forgot that I "pre arranged" me to set up my account and got an email just now to setup my account... so I was looking through the user agreement terms, and it seems they give quite literally ALL your information to the government to keep track of you and your purchases and everything else.  They also do background checks and possibly everything else to invade your privacy... I don't like this, did any one else see this?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

OH BOY!

That's what you all wanted isn't it? A 'Regulated' exchange. This is what regulated means folks. If you don't want regulation use one of the other hundreds of ways to trade bitcoin.

[Lauda]

So I forgot that I "pre arranged" me to set up my account and got an email just now to setup my account... so I was looking through the user agreement terms, and it seems they give quite literally ALL your information to the government to keep track of you and your purchases and everything else.  They also do background checks and possibly everything else to invade your privacy... I don't like this, did any one else see this?

Did you honestly expect that they could have gotten such an approval in any other way? People need to stop living in fairy tales. Nobody is forcing you to use this exchange in particular.

[chennan]

So I forgot that I "pre arranged" me to set up my account and got an email just now to setup my account... so I was looking through the user agreement terms, and it seems they give quite literally ALL your information to the government to keep track of you and your purchases and everything else.  They also do background checks and possibly everything else to invade your privacy... I don't like this, did any one else see this?

Did you honestly expect that they could have gotten such an approval in any other way? People need to stop living in fairy tales. Nobody is forcing you to use this exchange in particular

I didn't really read into it as much when I wanted to be notified when they launched.  I don't live in any fairy tales, when it comes to regarding my information.

If anyone else on here is curious to read, you can find it here:

https://exchange.gemini.com/user-agreement

As for now, I'm just going to hold back from signing up and see what other people say about the sign up process... I'm in no way going to be the "test group" in giving out personal information.

[intristin]

 I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

[chennan]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Yeaaaaa... see? I'm not giving my SS # to any bitcoin related enterprise... I hope nothing bad happens to you man, I will be monitoring this though; I just don't see a large majority of bitcoin users to go flocking here if you have to give such personal information out readily.

[Slark]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

[NorrisK]

Really awesome! Can't wait to try this exchange out Have freed some funds up from different exchanges to move here!

Really interesting to see what the volume will do and if this is the boost we needed price wise.

[julian071]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

Well if you're looking for a way to avoid taxes by using bitcoin, you shouldn't have qualms about dealing with less then trustworthy people, e.g. Cryptsy and friends. That means losing your btc once in a while.

This libertarian idea of being free of any form of regulation (and taxation) by using btc is just a pipe dream. You libertarians choose the wrong solution to your problem. If you don't trust your government then elect other people, and if there are no good people to elect in your two-party system, maybe you should think about backing a third party or starting a fourth.

[Preen]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

Well if you're looking for a way to avoid taxes by using bitcoin, you shouldn't have qualms about dealing with less then trustworthy people, e.g. Cryptsy and friends. That means losing your btc once in a while.

This libertarian idea of being free of any form of regulation (and taxation) by using btc is just a pipe dream. You libertarians choose the wrong solution to your problem. If you don't trust your government then elect other people, and if there are no good people to elect in your two-party system, maybe you should think about backing a third party or starting a fourth.

Good points. Really, the regulation is there to protect investors at the end of the day.

[intristin]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Yeaaaaa... see? I'm not giving my SS # to any bitcoin related enterprise... I hope nothing bad happens to you man, I will be monitoring this though; I just don't see a large majority of bitcoin users to go flocking here if you have to give such personal information out readily.

I don't think this exchange is meant to appeal to the bitcoin community, it's meant to appeal to Wall Street types. And since it's regulated by the government, I'm not too worried about the information I gave up, I mean Citibank has the same info about me and is regulated by the same government oversight and nothing bad has happened to me so far. All the money deposited to this site will be held in a FDIC insured bank, including from what I understand, the bitcoins themselves, in some kind of cold storage vault. That's what the NYT article I read said anyway. The point I think is to make the big investors feel safe. After what happened to Mt Gox, noone on Wall Street is going to touch an unregulated exchange, but this one, they very well might. And if they do, the price of Bitcoins will most likely go up.

[chennan]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

Well if you're looking for a way to avoid taxes by using bitcoin, you shouldn't have qualms about dealing with less then trustworthy people, e.g. Cryptsy and friends. That means losing your btc once in a while.

This libertarian idea of being free of any form of regulation (and taxation) by using btc is just a pipe dream. You libertarians choose the wrong solution to your problem. If you don't trust your government then elect other people, and if there are no good people to elect in your two-party system, maybe you should think about backing a third party or starting a fourth.

Well, there are still a lot of people who support the libertarian ideals... these supporters, including me, have supported Ron and Rand Paul; but the media always do not take what they say seriously at all and they kind of mock them in a way.  I even helped organize some of the Rand Paul events in my area, but the truth is, is that even though you do everything to get your politician of choice to start making a change in the world, doesn't always mean that they are going to be elected... especially if they pose a real change to the status quo of Washington in general...

And to say that there is a realistic chance that backing a third or fourth party to win a nomination is a pretty optimistic view on politics... The fact is is that a majority of people stick to their political ideologies and their "party" no matter if they lock the nominee or not; has to do a lot with people pride in America.

[julian071]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

Well if you're looking for a way to avoid taxes by using bitcoin, you shouldn't have qualms about dealing with less then trustworthy people, e.g. Cryptsy and friends. That means losing your btc once in a while.

This libertarian idea of being free of any form of regulation (and taxation) by using btc is just a pipe dream. You libertarians choose the wrong solution to your problem. If you don't trust your government then elect other people, and if there are no good people to elect in your two-party system, maybe you should think about backing a third party or starting a fourth.

Well, there are still a lot of people who support the libertarian ideals... these supporters, including me, have supported Ron and Rand Paul; but the media always do not take what they say seriously at all and they kind of mock them in a way.  I even helped organize some of the Rand Paul events in my area, but the truth is, is that even though you do everything to get your politician of choice to start making a change in the world, doesn't always mean that they are going to be elected... especially if they pose a real change to the status quo of Washington in general...

And to say that there is a realistic chance that backing a third or fourth party to win a nomination is a pretty optimistic view on politics... The fact is is that a majority of people stick to their political ideologies and their "party" no matter if they lock the nominee or not; has to do a lot with people pride in America.

I know, good points. It's not easy changing things. But it's doable, just look at history. It's admirable you actually helped organizing.  

I also know from experience, I work for my local socialist party (not kidding here), and we managed to really change important things, like getting rid of bureaucracy in care for elderly trying to live at their own home for as long as possible, and care for young people in trouble. We let the professionals do their job and we implement stuff like "one family, one plan" instead of organising things around either the instutions or the money. In the end it works much better for all concerned (and is cheaper) and I'm really proud we actually did it, while elsewhere in my country care and wellfare are being broken down. Never thought it would've been possible a couple of years ago.

Anyhoo, an exchange like this might appeal to the masses a lot more then the afformentioned Cryptsy and friends.

[chennan]

I just finished signing up. You first have to confirm you email, then your cell number. Then give your SS number, full name, mailing address, and bank account and routing number. They are making two micro deposits into my account to verify it's my bank account. Nothing about the sign up process was surprising to me, it's the first regulated exchange after all. I have a feeling this might push the price of Bitcoin up if it takes off.

Quite a lot of personal information if you ask me. You are no longer even pseudo anonymous when using bitcoin and using Gemini.
The fact that your information will be given to IRS if you reach some money threshold of sold bitcoin is not that assuring either.

Well if you're looking for a way to avoid taxes by using bitcoin, you shouldn't have qualms about dealing with less then trustworthy people, e.g. Cryptsy and friends. That means losing your btc once in a while.

This libertarian idea of being free of any form of regulation (and taxation) by using btc is just a pipe dream. You libertarians choose the wrong solution to your problem. If you don't trust your government then elect other people, and if there are no good people to elect in your two-party system, maybe you should think about backing a third party or starting a fourth.

Well, there are still a lot of people who support the libertarian ideals... these supporters, including me, have supported Ron and Rand Paul; but the media always do not take what they say seriously at all and they kind of mock them in a way.  I even helped organize some of the Rand Paul events in my area, but the truth is, is that even though you do everything to get your politician of choice to start making a change in the world, doesn't always mean that they are going to be elected... especially if they pose a real change to the status quo of Washington in general...

And to say that there is a realistic chance that backing a third or fourth party to win a nomination is a pretty optimistic view on politics... The fact is is that a majority of people stick to their political ideologies and their "party" no matter if they lock the nominee or not; has to do a lot with people pride in America.

I know, good points. It's not easy changing things. But it's doable, just look at history. It's admirable you actually helped organizing. 

I also know from experience, I work for my local socialist party (not kidding here), and we managed to really change important things, like getting rid of bureaucracy in care for elderly trying to live at their own home for as long as possible, and care for young people in trouble. We let the professionals do their job and we implement stuff like "one family, one plan" instead of organising things around either the instutions or the money. In the end it works much better for all concerned (and is cheaper) and I'm really proud we actually did it, while elsewhere in my country care and wellfare are being broken down. Never thought it would've been possible a couple of years ago.

Anyhoo, an exchange like this might appeal to the masses a lot more then the afformentioned Cryptsy and friends.

Yeah, you're right that people might flock to here because of a false sense of security that their government is there to "protect them" from any "shady business" in the bitcoin field... but to be honest, the bitcoin scene is still a very "shady business", because many notable businesses don't accept them.  The feds would want to keep track of who purchased bitcoins from there and where they went too, to start trying to keep track of what's going on in the blockchain.

As for the political views, are you from the US? I would suspect you would be a very big Bernie fan, since he's the closest socialist to be in the Oval office, ever since, well, ever...

[julian071]

Nah I'm from the other side of the pond. But go Bernie!! I love how this old jewish socialist guy actually appeals to young ppl, just by having a solid story (from my pov anyway and those he appeals to).

[Enjorlas]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

[chennan]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

Because unfortunately that's how politics work.. If you don't campaign and, in your words, force some guy on another person, then there will be no majority that will vote for said politician that you believe in.

[Preen]

This is really quite a good thing for all the NYC guys who had to leave Bitfinex..

[Mikestang]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

This is the old way of thinking, the pre-internet way things worked.  We are at the forefront of a revolution where the masses will be able to govern themselves via the connectivity of the internet.  21st century politics is based on principles hundreds of years old, they don't apply any longer and it's up to us to start changing them.

[CoinBateman]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

Voting gives the illusion that if the greater majority agree on something, then it is best. Of course, there are so many factors that can influence the majority of people. Sheep mentality, repressive societies etc.

[Enjorlas]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

Because unfortunately that's how politics work.. If you don't campaign and, in your words, force some guy on another person, then there will be no majority that will vote for said politician that you believe in.

Hmm.. that's not really an argument. If I questioned the institution of slavery 150 years ago, would you say, "That's just how things are"?

[chennan]

Why do I have to vote to get 'my guy' in office? I don't want to force 'my guy' on you and I don't want you to force your guy on me. Why do I have to get the approval of the collective to be free?

Because unfortunately that's how politics work.. If you don't campaign and, in your words, force some guy on another person, then there will be no majority that will vote for said politician that you believe in.

Hmm.. that's not really an argument. If I questioned the institution of slavery 150 years ago, would you say, "That's just how things are"?

I really wasn't trying to present an argument, just stating the truth about the mentality of people today.. But as Mikestang said:

This is the old way of thinking, the pre-internet way things worked.  We are at the forefront of a revolution where the masses will be able to govern themselves via the connectivity of the internet.  21st century politics is based on principles hundreds of years old, they don't apply any longer and it's up to us to start changing them.

This is a very good point and a valid argument.  There are already threads on here that are promoting to find a way to use the beauty of the blockchain to be able to do this... Things are definitely starting to change by more and more people waking up to the reality of the corruption of the government.  So in other words, the politicians who get elected now have some effect on how things go from here on out in the short term of things... People working for a cause like working to implement a new voting system and a new government and way of life is what's really going to change the future.

[intristin]

wow, this thread got derailed, lol. Why are we talking about politics on a bitcoin forums? 

[fuddudle]

wow, this thread got derailed, lol. Why are we talking about politics on a bitcoin forums? 

Because Bitcoin challenges central governance and leans more on libertarian socialism.

[chennan]

wow, this thread got derailed, lol. Why are we talking about politics on a bitcoin forums? 

Because Bitcoin challenges central governance and leans more on libertarian socialism.

Libertarian? Yes... Socialism? No... Socialism is pretty much as centralized as it gets. If the US sees Bernie Sanders to be president in 2016, then I don't see things going well for the outcome of the US. Then again, I couldn't be able to tell, just a educated guess based on my political ideologies...

But what's going on with Gemini is totally related to politics, because the government is now mandating the exchange services for bitcoin are to fully subservient to the government so they can begin to track all purchased bitcoins and where they end up and who's using them. In the beginning, bitcoin will see a pretty nice increase in price due to the nice and easy access for bitcoins now in half the states in the US... but I believe this is going to cause some weird/bad things in the future.

[fuddudle]

wow, this thread got derailed, lol. Why are we talking about politics on a bitcoin forums? 

Because Bitcoin challenges central governance and leans more on libertarian socialism.

Libertarian? Yes... Socialism? No... Socialism is pretty much as centralized as it gets. If the US sees Bernie Sanders to be president in 2016, then I don't see things going well for the outcome of the US. Then again, I couldn't be able to tell, just a educated guess based on my political ideologies...

But what's going on with Gemini is totally related to politics, because the government is now mandating the exchange services for bitcoin are to fully subservient to the government so they can begin to track all purchased bitcoins and where they end up and who's using them. In the beginning, bitcoin will see a pretty nice increase in price due to the nice and easy access for bitcoins now in half the states in the US... but I believe this is going to cause some weird/bad things in the future.

Bad things such as what?

[NorrisK]

wow, this thread got derailed, lol. Why are we talking about politics on a bitcoin forums? 

Because Bitcoin challenges central governance and leans more on libertarian socialism.

But what's going on with Gemini is totally related to politics, because the government is now mandating the exchange services for bitcoin are to fully subservient to the government so they can begin to track all purchased bitcoins and where they end up and who's using them. In the beginning, bitcoin will see a pretty nice increase in price due to the nice and easy access for bitcoins now in half the states in the US... but I believe this is going to cause some weird/bad things in the future.

This might be, but it will be a tremendous amount of work to track all those bitcoins. There are so many ways to leave false trails (mixers, altcoins, giftcards, etc) it would be way too difficult to track all.

I agree on the beginning part, this will be very good for the current holders.

[fuddudle]

I can't imagine the Winklevoss guys would open an exchange, pump the price and then leave their new clients feeling less than happy.

My guess is, the silk road auction coming up will have 44000 btc up for grabs, and they'll likely want the price higher in lieu of that auction.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Hopefully when this is all signed, sealed & delivered it will be bullish for the price. The Winklevoss twins are highly motivated in their bitcoin activity.

[Lauda]

Hopefully when this is all signed, sealed & delivered it will be bullish for the price. The Winklevoss twins are highly motivated in their bitcoin activity.

Apparently you only have to wait 2 more days for this. It's supposedly going to start business operations on Thursday (yes, this Thursday). The ETF however, is still on hold.

I can't imagine the Winklevoss guys would open an exchange, pump the price and then leave their new clients feeling less than happy.

That is very unlikely. There's more profit to be made long term, if that is their sole goal.

My guess is, the silk road auction coming up will have 44000 btc up for grabs, and they'll likely want the price higher in lieu of that auction.

44, 341 BTC to be exact which is currently valuated at ~$10m, will be sold on 5th of November.

[intristin]

Just a heads up guys, if you have any questions you want answered about this exchange Tyler Winklevoss is responding to every single question and comment over on this blog post: https://blog.gemini.com/and-were-live/ The comments section is a very intresting read.

[var53]

Jim Cramer just screamed "Boo YAAA !! "

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is what?  

...

another centralized exchange.  

yawn.  borrring.  

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is too regulated to Gox its customers. It's insured in case if it ever gets hacked, or finds its cold wallet has mysteriously leaked its coins, not that I think that's going to happen. Gemini is what Bitcoin needs to counteract all the damage Gox did to Bitcoin's image. I'd trust it 1000 times more than an exchange run by one fat bloke in Japan who's wanted for hacking crimes he committed in France.

[Mickeyb]

Jim Cramer just screamed "Boo YAAA !! "

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is what?  

...

another centralized exchange.  

yawn.  borrring.  

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is too regulated to Gox its customers. It's insured in case if it ever gets hacked, or finds its cold wallet has mysteriously leaked its coins, not that I think that's going to happen. Gemini is what Bitcoin needs to counteract all the damage Gox did to Bitcoin's image. I'd trust it 1000 times more than an exchange run by one fat bloke in Japan who's wanted for hacking crimes he committed in France.

I must agree with you. Exchanges like Gemini can only do good to us and they are necessary in order to fix all the crap that Mt. Gox has caused us and which all of the Bitcoin's opponents are so gladly remembering each time they have to bash Bitcoin all over again.

[freedomno1]

Was reading the techcrunch article and noticed this thread
It was about time it got approved so it will be fun to see if heavy trading volumes follow.

The platform will be open for trading this Thursday, October 8, but has already begun accepting signups.

Opens tomorrow apparently

[okae]

for me is really good that this exchange go out finally, IMHO this is just another small step to the adoption of the bitcoin, i was suscribe to his mailing list to check how was going on with them and seems like they are doing everything and faster possible.

i just hope that they open his doors to europeans, so we can start to play with them

I must agree with you. Exchanges like Gemini can only do good to us and they are necessary in order to fix all the crap that Mt. Gox has caused us and which all of the Bitcoin's opponents are so gladly remembering each time they have to bash Bitcoin all over again.

i hope so, they seem to be really good, lets see if they dont fu*k it later

[7788bitcoin]

Glad that the long waited exchange is finally launch. I think the team worked hard and didn't rush through the timeline. I am confident that it will become one of the major exchanges in the very near future.

[LiteCoinGuy]

[VCLChief]

While this is definitely positive, how more exchanges do we need?

Crytpsy and Bitrexx volume is off approx 85% for their peaks.   

The excitement is like when Coinsetter was announced...and now you never hear anything about them.

Not a game changer.
 
A fully decentralized exchange is a game changer. Something that cant be touched by the powers that be.

[Alley]

Can anybody with a registered account tell us if there is a visable order book and post a pic or tell us the depth?

[intristin]

Can anybody with a registered account tell us if there is a visable order book and post a pic or tell us the depth?

Here is what the buy screen looks like right now

[mayax]

Jim Cramer just screamed "Boo YAAA !! "

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is what?  

...

another centralized exchange.  

yawn.  borrring.  

Wall Street's answer to MtGox is too regulated to Gox its customers. It's insured in case if it ever gets hacked, or finds its cold wallet has mysteriously leaked its coins, not that I think that's going to happen. Gemini is what Bitcoin needs to counteract all the damage Gox did to Bitcoin's image. I'd trust it 1000 times more than an exchange run by one fat bloke in Japan who's wanted for hacking crimes he committed in France.

I must agree with you. Exchanges like Gemini can only do good to us and they are necessary in order to fix all the crap that Mt. Gox has caused us and which all of the Bitcoin's opponents are so gladly remembering each time they have to bash Bitcoin all over again.

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

[OmegaStarScream]

It's 8 October here , anyone knows if they launched yet ? because I don't see anything on their website says that they launched (not sure if they are supposed to show anything on the first place)

[Lauda]

It's 8 October here , anyone knows if they launched yet ? because I don't see anything on their website says that they launched (not sure if they are supposed to show anything on the first place)

I doubt so. It is early in the morning in Europe. I doubt that they would be launching Europe time. It's probably going to launch within a few hours hopefully without any errors or problems. If someone has an account please post picture of the order book or something. I wonder how the price will react if this launch is successful.

[BitmoreCoin]

While this is definitely positive, how more exchanges do we need?

Crytpsy and Bitrexx volume is off approx 85% for their peaks.   

The excitement is like when Coinsetter was announced...and now you never hear anything about them.

Not a game changer.
 
A fully decentralized exchange is a game changer. Something that cant be touched by the powers that be.

In the future, if people get paid and use bitcoin directly, we do not need so many exchanges.

[Ayle56]

It's 8 October here , anyone knows if they launched yet ? because I don't see anything on their website says that they launched (not sure if they are supposed to show anything on the first place)

I doubt so. It is early in the morning in Europe. I doubt that they would be launching Europe time. It's probably going to launch within a few hours hopefully without any errors or problems. If someone has an account please post picture of the order book or something. I wonder how the price will react if this launch is successful.

There is about three hours and 15 minutes remaining until trading begins. It's 06:14:09 am EDT time in New York, and trading officially begins at 9:30 AM EDT. I found out the time in New York at this website.

http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/usa/new-york

I hope they publish a page on the Gemini website showing the order book after trading starts. It's annoying if the only way to view it is to log in, especially if you aren't registered.

[Denker]

So in 3 hours Gemini will launch. Let's see what influence this will have on the price the next few hours. I say that price will stay the same.However it is kind of exciting to follow the Gemini launch because it took them so much time.
Winkle twins back in Bitcoin action right?!

[Lauda]

There is about three hours and 15 minutes remaining until trading begins. It's 06:14:09 am EDT time in New York, and trading officially begins at 9:30 AM EDT. I found out the time in New York at this website.
I hope they publish a page on the Gemini website showing the order book after trading starts. It's annoying if the only way to view it is to log in, especially if you aren't registered.

That would definitely be quite annoying and a bad move. I will definitely not be registering just to view the order book, even though I often like looking at it and analyzing in my free time. We're pretty close to launch now. Hopefully there will be no bugs or problems at initial release.

So in 3 hours Gemini will launch. Let's see what influence this will have on the price the next few hours. I say that price will stay the same.However it is kind of exciting to follow the Gemini launch because it took them so much time.
Winkle twins back in Bitcoin action right?!

They never left Bitcoin. Nobody is saying that the price will skyrocket. I'm asking myself what affect it is going to have? This means that the price could: A) Increase; B) Decrease; C) Stay the same.

[OmegaStarScream]

There is about three hours and 15 minutes remaining until trading begins. It's 06:14:09 am EDT time in New York, and trading officially begins at 9:30 AM EDT. I found out the time in New York at this website.
I hope they publish a page on the Gemini website showing the order book after trading starts. It's annoying if the only way to view it is to log in, especially if you aren't registered.

That would definitely be quite annoying and a bad move. I will definitely not be registering just to view the order book, even though I often like looking at it and analyzing in my free time. We're pretty close to launch now. Hopefully there will be no bugs or problems at initial release.

So in 3 hours Gemini will launch. Let's see what influence this will have on the price the next few hours. I say that price will stay the same.However it is kind of exciting to follow the Gemini launch because it took them so much time.
Winkle twins back in Bitcoin action right?!

They never left Bitcoin. Nobody is saying that the price will skyrocket. I'm asking myself what affect it is going to have? This means that the price could: A) Increase; B) Decrease; C) Stay the same.

Total bullshit , they should at least let us register even if we aren't from USA ... It needs your phone number when you make an account to finish registration I guess ...
I tried my country , nothing , France nothing .. UK nothing ..  Not sure what's the point to only make an exchange in USA only .

[intristin]

There is about three hours and 15 minutes remaining until trading begins. It's 06:14:09 am EDT time in New York, and trading officially begins at 9:30 AM EDT. I found out the time in New York at this website.
I hope they publish a page on the Gemini website showing the order book after trading starts. It's annoying if the only way to view it is to log in, especially if you aren't registered.

That would definitely be quite annoying and a bad move. I will definitely not be registering just to view the order book, even though I often like looking at it and analyzing in my free time. We're pretty close to launch now. Hopefully there will be no bugs or problems at initial release.

So in 3 hours Gemini will launch. Let's see what influence this will have on the price the next few hours. I say that price will stay the same.However it is kind of exciting to follow the Gemini launch because it took them so much time.
Winkle twins back in Bitcoin action right?!

They never left Bitcoin. Nobody is saying that the price will skyrocket. I'm asking myself what affect it is going to have? This means that the price could: A) Increase; B) Decrease; C) Stay the same.

Total bullshit , they should at least let us register even if we aren't from USA ... It needs your phone number when you make an account to finish registration I guess ...
I tried my country , nothing , France nothing .. UK nothing ..  Not sure what's the point to only make an exchange in USA only .

They are doing everything by the book as they don't want to offend regulators in any jurisdiction they want to enter. They want to be seen and known as totally legitimate and in 100% compliance with all local laws in every market they serve. So they are unlikely to allow users to register that live in a market that they are not fully licenced in. As such a move could offend officials in the market. It's kind of a brilliant strategy to be honest, they are kind of stroking the egos of regulators which will most likely lead to faster and better acceptance and a seat at the table when new regulations are proposed that might affect their service.

[Lauda]

Total bullshit , they should at least let us register even if we aren't from USA ... It needs your phone number when you make an account to finish registration I guess ...
I tried my country , nothing , France nothing .. UK nothing ..  Not sure what's the point to only make an exchange in USA only .
-snip-

-snip-
It's kind of a brilliant strategy to be honest, they are kind of stroking the egos of regulators which will most likely lead to faster and better acceptance and a seat at the table when new regulations are proposed that might affect their service.

I concur. This is actually a good move as regulators from other countries will not want to be left behind. Gemini has a great potential if they try to get fully regulated in as many markets as possible. Customers should not complain though as they have plenty of alternatives that will allow them to register and trade. We're nearing launch and the price of Bitcoin has reached its highest level since mid August (yesterday) already.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Today is the day then, it's early morning in the US, outside of business hours in most States.
Will we see any kind of reaction in the price today or is this another false dawn?

[intristin]

Today is the day then, it's early morning in the US, outside of business hours in most States.
Will we see any kind of reaction in the price today or is this another false dawn?

We will find out in about 15 minutes.

[n2004al]

It is very good news. More are the exchanges more are the chances to have good prices in buying and selling bitcoins. Hope that others will open and be live in the future. And hope long life of every of those.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It is very good news. More are the exchanges more are the chances to have good prices in buying and selling bitcoins. Hope that others will open and be live in the future. And hope long life of every of those.

I wasn't aware they were only operating in the US. That's slightly disappointing but like you said the more avenues people have to buy bitcoin the better.

Come on Yanks get buying.

[intristin]

well they have been open for 9 minutes and so far not a single trade.

EDIT: Oh wait, we have our first trade, at 9:40:07 AM 0.05 BTC was purchased at a value of $242.50 per bitcoin.

2nd EDIT : here's what the orderbook looks like :

 

[Ayle56]

There is about three hours and 15 minutes remaining until trading begins. It's 06:14:09 am EDT time in New York, and trading officially begins at 9:30 AM EDT. I found out the time in New York at this website.
I hope they publish a page on the Gemini website showing the order book after trading starts. It's annoying if the only way to view it is to log in, especially if you aren't registered.

That would definitely be quite annoying and a bad move. I will definitely not be registering just to view the order book, even though I often like looking at it and analyzing in my free time. We're pretty close to launch now. Hopefully there will be no bugs or problems at initial release.

I found an API link for their order book, but there's only a few trades showing on it, and they all have exactly the same unix timestamp. That makes me wonder if the data is correct, or test data.

https://api.gemini.com/v1/book/BTCUSD

Can someone who's registered there post a screenshot of the order book, or let us know if their API is showing correct data please?

edit]

Thanks  intristin

[intristin]

No problem, price is up to $245 now and trading is really starting to pick up.

[Ayle56]

No problem, price is up to $245 now and trading is really starting to pick up.

I just found this bitcoinity link to the Gemini order book.

http://bitcoinity.org/markets/gemini/USD

It might be a bit out of sync with the real exchange, but it's easier to view than the raw data from the API.

[Kprawn]

There is no big rush to buy at the moment... I hoped to see some more action by now.. I guess it's better to give it some time to give traders a chance to get accustomed with the

new kid on the block. 

It's still early days and virgin territory for most investors in Crypto currencies, but they will eventually get there.  It's just a pity that you have to adhere to all those KYC/AML

regulations. 

[UserVVIP]

I believe that gemini and new york need to lessen there laws.


NY isn't helping anyone by not allowing ppl to use btc.

[Keyser Soze]

The AML/KYC requirements should be of no surprise to anyone. It sounds similar to what you would need to open a bank account or brokerage account.

It is still early, but I am sure volume will pick up in the coming weeks. Takes time for people to sign up and fund accounts...

[Gleb Gamow]

I assume this is 24/7/365 trading and not ending at the bell, correct?

[maku]

I believe that gemini and new york need to lessen there laws.


NY isn't helping anyone by not allowing ppl to use btc.

That is the point. I am surprised that Winklevii really subjected to BitLicense, I have a grim feeling that opening Gemini under New York jurisdiction is just publicity stunt aimed to show people that Bitcoin business in NY can be successful. Time will tell if I was right.

[mayax]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

[n2004al]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

[DooMAD]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

Should the Bitcoin protocol be regulated?

In short, no. Every so often, someone calls for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated by a trusted body in the mistaken belief that it would help prevent scams, thefts and frauds. Although it sounds like a good idea, this is actually a dangerous line of thinking and could potentially jeopardise Bitcoin's future.

Bitcoin is designed as a transaction between two people, without relying on a trusted third party. Any attempt to add regulation to the protocol would introduce a controlling third party, which could potentially block, freeze or otherwise restrict transactions. This would damage Bitcoin's fungibility and could break the currency as a whole. Once a regulator has control, there is nothing to stop them doing what they like. There's also no evidence to suggest that central regulation would in fact lessen the number of thefts or scams.

People who ask for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated are generally considered to have misunderstood the fundamental concept of the Bitcoin network. Bitcoin is decentralised by design, as this guarantees it being neutral, incorruptible and secure. See the "Why is decentralisation important?" section to explain further.

It's good that people have the option to use a regulated exchange if that's what makes them feel secure, but that choice shouldn't be forced on everyone.

[mayax]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

Should the Bitcoin protocol be regulated?

In short, no. Every so often, someone calls for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated by a trusted body in the mistaken belief that it would help prevent scams, thefts and frauds. Although it sounds like a good idea, this is actually a dangerous line of thinking and could potentially jeopardise Bitcoin's future.

Bitcoin is designed as a transaction between two people, without relying on a trusted third party. Any attempt to add regulation to the protocol would introduce a controlling third party, which could potentially block, freeze or otherwise restrict transactions. This would damage Bitcoin's fungibility and could break the currency as a whole. Once a regulator has control, there is nothing to stop them doing what they like. There's also no evidence to suggest that central regulation would in fact lessen the number of thefts or scams.

People who ask for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated are generally considered to have misunderstood the fundamental concept of the Bitcoin network. Bitcoin is decentralised by design, as this guarantees it being neutral, incorruptible and secure. See the "Why is decentralisation important?" section to explain further.

It's good that people have the option to use a regulated exchange if that's what makes them feel secure, but that choice shouldn't be forced on everyone.

To be regulated means that the GOVs know about you, you will pay taxes and so on. Regulations for an exchanger means to be a financial company like any other existing one.

My question is: Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?

Why would I need Bitcoin if I am forced to provide the same documents in order to buy and sell BTC as I provide to any bank?

More than that, I can pay more quickly by using a credit card for example and almost any merchant is accepting credit cards these days...

[DooMAD]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

Should the Bitcoin protocol be regulated?

In short, no. Every so often, someone calls for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated by a trusted body in the mistaken belief that it would help prevent scams, thefts and frauds. Although it sounds like a good idea, this is actually a dangerous line of thinking and could potentially jeopardise Bitcoin's future.

Bitcoin is designed as a transaction between two people, without relying on a trusted third party. Any attempt to add regulation to the protocol would introduce a controlling third party, which could potentially block, freeze or otherwise restrict transactions. This would damage Bitcoin's fungibility and could break the currency as a whole. Once a regulator has control, there is nothing to stop them doing what they like. There's also no evidence to suggest that central regulation would in fact lessen the number of thefts or scams.

People who ask for Bitcoin to be centrally regulated are generally considered to have misunderstood the fundamental concept of the Bitcoin network. Bitcoin is decentralised by design, as this guarantees it being neutral, incorruptible and secure. See the "Why is decentralisation important?" section to explain further.

It's good that people have the option to use a regulated exchange if that's what makes them feel secure, but that choice shouldn't be forced on everyone.

To be regulated means that the GOVs know about you, you will pay taxes and so on. Regulations for an exchanger means to be a financial company like any other existing one.

My question is: Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?

Why would I need Bitcoin if I am forced to provide the same documents in order to buy and sell BTC as I provide to any bank?

That's what I'm saying, you shouldn't be forced.  If some people want to use a regulated and insured exchange to have guarantees that they'll get their funds back if someone tries to run off with them, they'll have to counterbalance that with the cost of everything that regulation entails.  Like handing over identifiable information and the possibility of those details being lost or stolen.  For those who don't want to use a regulated exchange and feel their information and privacy is more important to them that the value of their funds, they can use one of the many other unlicensed exchanges.  Their personal details will be safer, but their money potentially less so, as it won't be insured against loss or theft.  It's a fair tradeoff.

Although better still would be a system where users aren't trusting their funds to a third party at all, since it rather defeats the point of a peer to peer network.  It's already possible to trade certain altcoins directly from one blockchain to another without using an exchange, but fiat-to-crypto is a more difficult problem to crack.

 

[Febo]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

Bitcoin never was anonym. Lots people still think it is, but even if you have no tech knoleage and only monitor press you see it is not. Monero is coin with anonymity features.

My question is: Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?

Because is cheaper and faster (maybe right now in many cases that is not correct but in long run should be).

[chennan]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

Bitcoin never was anonym. Lots people still think it is, but even if you have no tech knoleage and only monitor press you see it is not. Monero is coin with anonymity features.

Monero is the head leader of the cryptonite PoW structure, but there are a lot of other cryptonite coins out there.  But I totally agree with you. A majority of people still think that Bitcoin is completely anonymous while not realizing it's pseudonymous or what that really means.

With bitcoins blockchain you can trace every single transaction that ever happened to certain wallet addresses.  With Cryptonite coins like Monero, it utilizes a way to build in a "mixer" that mixes up coins in a certain block and then it pays out to the corresponding wallets, giving it more of an anonymous feature.

[mayax]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

Bitcoin never was anonym. Lots people still think it is, but even if you have no tech knoleage and only monitor press you see it is not. Monero is coin with anonymity features.

My question is: Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?

Because is cheaper and faster (maybe right now in many cases that is not correct but in long run should be).

Cheaper and faster? I can buy anything I want with credit cards/debit cards for "free"(no fee) and in a blink of eye. What you mean with BTC is cheaper and faster? Now, you are waiting 15 min or more for a transaction to be confirmed.

[toinew]

Bitcoin only charge you about 0.0001BTC-0.0002BTC or 2-5 cents per transaction.
Furthermore, there are places where you can pay with bitcoin instantly with shops which accept 0 confirmation

your argument about low fees for bitcoin transaction is invalid since the main source of income for miners will gradually become the fees (source : Satoshi)
Miners and banks will very soon have a common way of making money.

I mean come on, all the network is deemed to works on fees, and you're not even mentionning it

[errornone]

what are the advantages of gemini VS coinbase?

[mayax]

You forget something which must be VERY important to BTC community. It seems it was forgotten; The anonymity. The core of BTC.

Gemini, Coinbase and others like them are bringing what you didn't want.... regulation, taxes, GOVs which will know everything you make with your coins and so on.

How is with stories like BTC is made for anonymity, privacy?

Bitcoin never was anonym. Lots people still think it is, but even if you have no tech knoleage and only monitor press you see it is not. Monero is coin with anonymity features.

My question is: Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?

Because is cheaper and faster (maybe right now in many cases that is not correct but in long run should be).

Cheaper and faster? I can buy anything I want with credit cards/debit cards for "free"(no fee) and in a blink of eye. What you mean with BTC is cheaper and faster? Now, you are waiting 15 min or more for a transaction to be confirmed.

Don't you know that bank charge few percent (usually 1%-3%) from every transaction with credit cards/debit cards? Bitcoin only charge you about 0.0001BTC-0.0002BTC or 2-5 cents per transaction.
Furthermore, there are places where you can pay with bitcoin instantly with shops which accept 0 confirmation

I am charged with 0% (nothing) for any online shopping that I make by debit cards/credit cards. That's why I am asking "Why would I use BTC in this case while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards, traditional financial instruments?"

[n2004al]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

I don't understand what do you mean with "network" but if "the network" you wrote above mean blockchain (for you) you must know that blockchain and bitcoin are two different concepts and not the same thing. They have to do with each other and cannot exist without each other but are two different things.  The regulation of bitcoin have nothing to do with blockchain but only with bitcoin and its use as a currency.

[DooMAD]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

I don't understand what do you mean with "network" but if "the network" you wrote above mean blockchain (for you) you must know that blockchain and bitcoin are two different concepts and not the same thing. They have to do with each other and cannot exist without each other but are two different things.  The regulation of bitcoin have nothing to do with blockchain but only with bitcoin and its use as a currency.

Services that use Bitcoin, like exchanges, web wallets and merchants can be regulated if that's what the regions they operate in require.  But people will always have the option of using a service that's not regulated if that's what they prefer.  Any nation or jurisdiction can try to impose regulations on the general use of Bitcoin if they want, but they're not going to have much success with that.  For starters, not all jurisdictions will agree on how it should be regulated and, secondly, it's about as productive as trying to regulate peer-to-peer file-sharing.  It can't be done.  Bitcoin is self regulating.  The protocol determines what is and is not permissible, not regulators.  

Also, regulation in practice does very little to stop "the evildoers" as you call them, as we don't do regulation properly anymore.  Banks and investment firms are regulated, but they're still a bunch of lowlife, criminal scum.  This is because regulators tend to be as corrupt as the governments responsible for implementing them.  If it benefits the financial sector to only be subject to the occasional slap on the wrist when they've done something illegal, then the regulators won't be too harsh on them.  It's just another one of the many frauds that Bitcoin is better equipped to fight without so-called regulation.  To hell with the bean counters, the middlemen and the other useless third party intermediary puppets that do little else but bog down the system in red tape and bureaucracy.

Something enforced in code is far more powerful and robust than something supposedly enforced in law.

[Sir Lagsalot]

I expect Gemini to be just another Bitcoin bank, much the same as Coinbase or Circle. The goal of such services, as stated by Jeremy Allaire, is to make Bitcoin "part of the global banking order." Bitcoin was designed as an alternative to that broken, fraudulent system and no amount of FUD about "evildoers" will change that.

Please help me get the word out, to newbies especially, that decentralised exchanges and those which don't demand all your Personally Identifying Information are the only way to go! I wrote a newbie-friendly guide which covers the disadvantages of Bitcoin banks in comparison to services like LocalBitcoins.

[mayax]

I expect Gemini to be just another Bitcoin bank, much the same as Coinbase or Circle. The goal of such services, as stated by Jeremy Allaire, is to make Bitcoin "part of the global banking order." Bitcoin was designed as an alternative to that broken, fraudulent system and no amount of FUD about "evildoers" will change that.

Please help me get the word out, to newbies especially, that decentralised exchanges and those which don't demand all your Personally Identifying Information are the only way to go! I wrote a newbie-friendly guide which covers the disadvantages of Bitcoin banks in comparison to services like LocalBitcoins.

You are right but as you can see, the people trust more in "regulation"(control). Now, Bitcoin wanted to be an anonymous and free e-currency which it is not. Why? Because the regulations  made it to be as any other e-currency from market.
More than that, it's hard to be used and it's not cheap at all.

Why would a newbie use Bitcoin instead Paypal? There are is no advantage in using Bitcoin anymore. You have to provide a lot of documents in order to fund and to cash out Bitcoin...same as with Paypal.

[BitmoreCoin]

Why would a newbie use Bitcoin instead Paypal? There are is no advantage in using Bitcoin anymore. You have to provide a lot of documents in order to fund and to cash out Bitcoin...same as with Paypal.

When bitcoin is "regulated", we can be paid salary with bitcoin and use it as we wish legally.

[mayax]

Why would a newbie use Bitcoin instead Paypal? There are is no advantage in using Bitcoin anymore. You have to provide a lot of documents in order to fund and to cash out Bitcoin...same as with Paypal.

When bitcoin is "regulated", we can be paid salary with bitcoin and use it as we wish legally.

Why would you be paid with Bitcoin when you can be paid in your country currency? What would be the difference?

I think many people do not understand that a Bitcoin regulated market means the end of Bitcoin because there are many other regulated payment systems/e-currencies in world which provide instant transfers and they have many other features.

Getting a financial license as many exchangers are looking because they cannot operate with it, means to OBEY to a Gov.
That's make you part of a financial system full or laws/rules/. The banks dictate these rules so they are the boss.

Now, Gemeni is just like a simple Forex company and nothing more.

Again, a regulated Bitcoin industry(with licences which includes AML, compliance, etc...) means the end for this e-currency because the core of those who are using BTC, want anonymity.
Anonymity is not possible in a regulated market so they will go to Altcoins(other non-regulated e-currencies) and so on...

Paypal, Netteller, Skrill +1000 other similar payment processors are regulated too. Why would you be paid in Bitcoin which is almost useless and not in Paypal which is accepted everywhere? Why not in gold?
...or why not accepting the salary in the traditional way(in a bank account) while using BTC became so hard? (a lot of papers to be provided)

[n2004al]

Bitcoin must be regulated. There is no other way if bitcoin will want to survive, to have the right to be and to have the same status as the other currencies. The anonymity of bitcoin can be used, or better misused, from the evildoers. This can cause only bad reputation and banning of it from every country. Everyone which love bitcoin must fight that it can be accepted through the regulations in its country.

Maybe while we're at it, we can set up some credit reference agencies to lose all our personal data.  

Adding central points of failure doesn't make the system better.  Certain Bitcoin services should be regulated if they deal with fiat, but the network itself would only be weakened by adding authorities to hoard personal data or decide what should and shouldn't be allowed.

I don't understand what do you mean with "network" but if "the network" you wrote above mean blockchain (for you) you must know that blockchain and bitcoin are two different concepts and not the same thing. They have to do with each other and cannot exist without each other but are two different things.  The regulation of bitcoin have nothing to do with blockchain but only with bitcoin and its use as a currency.

Services that use Bitcoin, like exchanges, web wallets and merchants can be regulated if that's what the regions they operate in require.  But people will always have the option of using a service that's not regulated if that's what they prefer.  Any nation or jurisdiction can try to impose regulations on the general use of Bitcoin if they want, but they're not going to have much success with that.  For starters, not all jurisdictions will agree on how it should be regulated and, secondly, it's about as productive as trying to regulate peer-to-peer file-sharing.  It can't be done.  Bitcoin is self regulating.  The protocol determines what is and is not permissible, not regulators.  

Also, regulation in practice does very little to stop "the evildoers" as you call them, as we don't do regulation properly anymore.  Banks and investment firms are regulated, but they're still a bunch of lowlife, criminal scum.  This is because regulators tend to be as corrupt as the governments responsible for implementing them.  If it benefits the financial sector to only be subject to the occasional slap on the wrist when they've done something illegal, then the regulators won't be too harsh on them.  It's just another one of the many frauds that Bitcoin is better equipped to fight without so-called regulation.  To hell with the bean counters, the middlemen and the other useless third party intermediary puppets that do little else but bog down the system in red tape and bureaucracy.

Something enforced in code is far more powerful and robust than something supposedly enforced in law.

But people will always have the option of using a service that's not regulated if that's what they prefer.

Disagree. If the Authorities will want and will decide that the people should not use a non regulated service the people cannot use it. Authorities will not allow this and only the people which normally break the lows will use it. I don't like this and I don't agree with this. The people must follow the rules which regulate the society. So don't break the laws. Otherwise it will be anarchy. This is bad for everyone. Only for the evildoers not.

Any nation or jurisdiction can try to impose regulations on the general use of Bitcoin if they want, but they're not going to have much success with that.

Disagree. Regulation will make bitcoin free, legal and known by everyone in every country. Regulation it will be always better that ignoring bitcoins as it was now in most of the world countries. Regulation will give at bitcoin the right to stay in the same status as the other currencies used in every country. Leaving it without regulations mean ignoring it. This will undervalue it always.

Bitcoin is self regulating.

Disagree your meaning. Bitcoin is self-regulated as an informatic product but not as an currency. The right and the possibility to regulate an currency (the money) can be exercised only by a Central Bank of one country or an similar Authority. If bitcoin will want to be accepted and used as a currency there are not other way to be such, except its regulation from such Authorities in collaboration with the various governmental agencies which have as object of their work money laundering.

Also, regulation in practice does very little to stop "the evildoers" as you call them, as we don't do regulation properly anymore.

Disagree totally. In my country is not so. And we are a medium developed country. I think even in your country your words are not true. It is not imaginable that a Central Bank don't do the right regulation and the right management of regulation. This kind of behavior will bankrupt immediately the state of that country and will cause an economic collapse. The regulation of money in one country is the most economic important thing. Not coincidentally the Authorities which regulate it (normally Central Banks) are independent from everything (even from the Government). They are selfgoverned. They want every day to stop the evildoers with the various regulations and even their evolution. Everything evolve. Evildoers maybe firsts. The Central Bank do new rules to stop them. This is the normal fight between the right and the wrong, the good and the bad. Until today the right and the good have won. As for me, it will be so forever.

All the rest of your post can find answer (according to me) in the above explanations.

[mayax]

BTC being regulated (that means I have to provide my documents to "someone" in order to get verified), why would I use BTC while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards and other traditional financial instruments?

I can do whatever I want by using a credit/debit card already and instantly with zero fees on my side.

[n2004al]

BTC being regulated (that means I have to provide my documents to "someone" in order to get verified), why would I use BTC while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards and other traditional financial instruments?

I can do whatever I want by using a credit/debit card already and instantly with zero fees on my side.

It will the best thing you will (can) do. Do not use it and use all the others tool you mention in your post. Leave your bitcoin in your wallet. Theoretically the price of bitcoin can go very high. Only if regulated (otherwise with to much probability will be banned) and accepted legally as a normal currency in your country. That day you remember that you have bitcoin and again don't use those. Only do a change in your desired fiat money. You will have, using this way of action, much more profits than the actual use of it.

[mayax]

BTC being regulated (that means I have to provide my documents to "someone" in order to get verified), why would I use BTC while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards and other traditional financial instruments?

I can do whatever I want by using a credit/debit card already and instantly with zero fees on my side.

It will the best thing you will (can) do. Do not use it and use all the others tool you mention in your post. Leave your bitcoin in your wallet. Theoretically the price of bitcoin can go very high. Only if regulated (otherwise with to much probability will be banned) and accepted legally as a normal currency in your country. That day you remember that you have bitcoin and again don't use those. Only do a change in your desired fiat money. You will have, using this way of action, much more profits than the actual use of it.

This is a dream that it is impossible in this world. The banks will never allow what you say here.
The people follows the banks and not an utopia.

The banks want their own currency(they want control) not Bitcoin. The banks may only use some of the tech of BTC and nothing more. The banks already have the debit cards and also the mobile payments which will be a BOOM soon. They don't need any BTC with its +15 min processing transaction and with +80% black market.

You have to understand that BTC is a niche market and this is how it will remain. BTC regulated = Paypal or any other similar payment processor. Why would the people using it? Yes, it's ok for speculation for now but don't have dreams regarding to Bitcoin.

When MTGox went down, the price drooped with 50% in 48 hours; same with Silk Road....BTC has around of 3 mil users and much less are owning funds in BTC. BTC has a BIG buzz in media and the results are modest.  What are we talking about?

[chennan]

BTC being regulated (that means I have to provide my documents to "someone" in order to get verified), why would I use BTC while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards and other traditional financial instruments?

I can do whatever I want by using a credit/debit card already and instantly with zero fees on my side.

It will the best thing you will (can) do. Do not use it and use all the others tool you mention in your post. Leave your bitcoin in your wallet. Theoretically the price of bitcoin can go very high. Only if regulated (otherwise with to much probability will be banned) and accepted legally as a normal currency in your country. That day you remember that you have bitcoin and again don't use those. Only do a change in your desired fiat money. You will have, using this way of action, much more profits than the actual use of it.

This is a dream that it is impossible in this world. The banks will never allow what you say here.
The people follows the banks and not an utopia.

The banks want their own currency(they want control) not Bitcoin. The banks may only use some of the tech of BTC and nothing more. The banks already have the debit cards and also the mobile payments which will be a BOOM soon. They don't need any BTC with its +15 min processing transaction and with +80% black market.

You have to understand that BTC is a niche market and this is how it will remain. BTC regulated = Paypal or any other similar payment processor. Why would the people using it? Yes, it's ok for speculation for now but don't have dreams regarding to Bitcoin.

When MTGox went down, the price drooped with 50% in 48 hours; same with Silk Road....BTC has around of 3 mil users and much less are owning funds in BTC. BTC has a BIG buzz in media and the results are modest.  What are we talking about?

You maybe right about saying banks don't want to have to deal with bitcoins and only take bitcoin's blockchain technology and use it... but you still have to regard the fact that bitcoins still hold more purchasing power than any fiat in the world, by a long shot.

So even if they were to create there own "crypto" using a blockchain technology.. they are still going to be dealing in fiat.  So I guess my argument is, if banks do use the blockchain and in a way promote it, it might turn more people on to figuring out what this whole block chain thing is about.  Then people maybe start realizing that bitcoins just hold a value to its name that no other currency holds.

[BitmoreCoin]

This is a dream that it is impossible in this world. The banks will never allow what you say here.
The people follows the banks and not an utopia.

The banks want their own currency(they want control) not Bitcoin. The banks may only use some of the tech of BTC and nothing more. The banks already have the debit cards and also the mobile payments which will be a BOOM soon. They don't need any BTC with its +15 min processing transaction and with +80% black market.

You have to understand that BTC is a niche market and this is how it will remain. BTC regulated = Paypal or any other similar payment processor. Why would the people using it? Yes, it's ok for speculation for now but don't have dreams regarding to Bitcoin.

When MTGox went down, the price drooped with 50% in 48 hours; same with Silk Road....BTC has around of 3 mil users and much less are owning funds in BTC. BTC has a BIG buzz in media and the results are modest.  What are we talking about?

Will all the banks unite and use a single currency?

[mayax]

This is a dream that it is impossible in this world. The banks will never allow what you say here.
The people follows the banks and not an utopia.

The banks want their own currency(they want control) not Bitcoin. The banks may only use some of the tech of BTC and nothing more. The banks already have the debit cards and also the mobile payments which will be a BOOM soon. They don't need any BTC with its +15 min processing transaction and with +80% black market.

You have to understand that BTC is a niche market and this is how it will remain. BTC regulated = Paypal or any other similar payment processor. Why would the people using it? Yes, it's ok for speculation for now but don't have dreams regarding to Bitcoin.

When MTGox went down, the price drooped with 50% in 48 hours; same with Silk Road....BTC has around of 3 mil users and much less are owning funds in BTC. BTC has a BIG buzz in media and the results are modest.  What are we talking about?

Will all the banks unite and use a single currency?

Yes, it is possible.
Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

[n2004al]

BTC being regulated (that means I have to provide my documents to "someone" in order to get verified), why would I use BTC while I already have a bank account, credit cards, debit cards and other traditional financial instruments?

I can do whatever I want by using a credit/debit card already and instantly with zero fees on my side.

It will the best thing you will (can) do. Do not use it and use all the others tool you mention in your post. Leave your bitcoin in your wallet. Theoretically the price of bitcoin can go very high. Only if regulated (otherwise with to much probability will be banned) and accepted legally as a normal currency in your country. That day you remember that you have bitcoin and again don't use those. Only do a change in your desired fiat money. You will have, using this way of action, much more profits than the actual use of it.

This is a dream that it is impossible in this world. The banks will never allow what you say here.
The people follows the banks and not an utopia.

The banks want their own currency(they want control) not Bitcoin. The banks may only use some of the tech of BTC and nothing more. The banks already have the debit cards and also the mobile payments which will be a BOOM soon. They don't need any BTC with its +15 min processing transaction and with +80% black market.

You have to understand that BTC is a niche market and this is how it will remain. BTC regulated = Paypal or any other similar payment processor. Why would the people using it? Yes, it's ok for speculation for now but don't have dreams regarding to Bitcoin.

When MTGox went down, the price drooped with 50% in 48 hours; same with Silk Road....BTC has around of 3 mil users and much less are owning funds in BTC. BTC has a BIG buzz in media and the results are modest.  What are we talking about?

Lets wait and lets see.

For the moment I can tell that the banks are only a common business like thousand others. If the economy of the country, the Central Banks, the Government and the other Authorities of one country will hear what every kind of business tell that country will not have more an economy but only anarchy. Every business want things that fit with it interest. If this will be heard by the various authorities never can be arrived in one decision. Because the needs of various businesses sometimes might be opposites between those. So the bakery want low price of the flour while the merchant who sell flour want high price this product. All the businesses want low or at all taxes but the Government don't fulfill their requests. For the simple reason that without or low taxes will be less or at all resources for the development or the existence of the state and the economy of that country.

I can bring here to many examples like above but I think that those are enough to got the idea. Repeat: banks are only an commune business. Like every other business. Their voice have the same power of the other businesses. No more and no less. They cannot be able never and will not be able never to decide the destiny of bitcoin. Are other "powers" those which make decisions.

[BitmoreCoin]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

[mayax]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

The people can do that by using the existing currencies like USD, Euro and other local ones. Why do they need BTC? I can pay already with my phone. The debit cards are accepted almost anywhere. Why would someone need BTC to pay something? I said for 100 times. BTC transactions take more than 15 min while the purchasing via credit card is instant

[BitmoreCoin]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

The people can do that by using the existing currencies like USD, Euro and other local ones. Why do they need BTC? I can pay already with my phone. The debit cards are accepted almost anywhere. Why would someone need BTC to pay something? I said for 100 times. BTC transactions take more than 15 min while the purchasing via credit card is instant

If the price of bitcoin is stable, it can be used as a store of value, unlike USD or other fiat, devalue all the time.

[gentlemand]

I expect Gemini to be just another Bitcoin bank, much the same as Coinbase or Circle.

Where have they ever mentioned that as a possibility? What's needed is exchanges that work and are trustworthy. That's what they're building towards. Becoming a Bitcoin bank is a totally different deal and would throw away all the marketing they've done.

[mayax]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

The people can do that by using the existing currencies like USD, Euro and other local ones. Why do they need BTC? I can pay already with my phone. The debit cards are accepted almost anywhere. Why would someone need BTC to pay something? I said for 100 times. BTC transactions take more than 15 min while the purchasing via credit card is instant

If the price of bitcoin is stable, it can be used as a store of value, unlike USD or other fiat, devalue all the time.

Do you know any commodity or currency which is stable?

Neither gold,platinum, oil are not stable.Nothing is stable. BTC is full of volatility and this is how it will remain until the end of it.
Speculative trading is the main use + dark market. How can it ever be stable?

[BitmoreCoin]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

The people can do that by using the existing currencies like USD, Euro and other local ones. Why do they need BTC? I can pay already with my phone. The debit cards are accepted almost anywhere. Why would someone need BTC to pay something? I said for 100 times. BTC transactions take more than 15 min while the purchasing via credit card is instant

If the price of bitcoin is stable, it can be used as a store of value, unlike USD or other fiat, devalue all the time.

Do you know any commodity or currency which is stable?

Neither gold,platinum, oil are not stable.Nothing is stable. BTC is full of volatility and this is how it will remain until the end of it.
Speculative trading is the main use + dark market. How can it ever be stable?

Stable mean not more than a few percentage a day volatility. Otherwise the goods will be priced in fiat, not bitcoin, even though you can pay with bitcoin, the vendor will change bitcoin into fiat instantly, they will not keep bitcoin. That is bad for the value of bitcon.

[mayax]

Now, each bank is working with USD so even they won't create a new currency, they already have it.

Why would they need Bitcoin? They are only interested in BTC tech and period. Bitcoin is hard to be used by the common people and this thing cannot be changed. Also,the BTC users are too few for banks (around of 1,5 mil. users who are holding BTC funds)

Time will change that. Ordinary people can store their bitcoin in smart phone and use it when more shops accept bitcoin.

The people can do that by using the existing currencies like USD, Euro and other local ones. Why do they need BTC? I can pay already with my phone. The debit cards are accepted almost anywhere. Why would someone need BTC to pay something? I said for 100 times. BTC transactions take more than 15 min while the purchasing via credit card is instant

If the price of bitcoin is stable, it can be used as a store of value, unlike USD or other fiat, devalue all the time.

Do you know any commodity or currency which is stable?

Neither gold,platinum, oil are not stable.Nothing is stable. BTC is full of volatility and this is how it will remain until the end of it.
Speculative trading is the main use + dark market. How can it ever be stable?

Stable mean not more than a few percentage a day volatility. Otherwise the goods will be priced in fiat, not bitcoin, even though you can pay with bitcoin, the vendor will change bitcoin into fiat instantly, they will not keep bitcoin. That is bad for the value of bitcon.

and why the vendor is doing that? because BTC is trendy, a part from media is buzzing about it. Also, the vendors are benefiting from free advertising ("that store is accepting BTC, it's cool!" )

But these vendors do not trust Bitcoin at all and they want cash. they don't need an e-currency as long they are payint taxes, suppliers with real money; and they are afraid of volatility. Don't you in their place?

[gentlemand]

Stable mean not more than a few percentage a day volatility. Otherwise the goods will be priced in fiat, not bitcoin, even though you can pay with bitcoin, the vendor will change bitcoin into fiat instantly, they will not keep bitcoin. That is bad for the value of bitcon.

There are plenty of 'real' currencies with way less stability than Bitcoin. Overall though I agree. I don't see how it could ever be stable, in fact it was specifically designed not to be with deflation built in.

The merchant instant fiat thing is a bit of a tried trope. Bitpay employees have said hardly a coin is sold on the open market. They already have buyers waiting for them. Whether that could continue if activity scaled up is a different matter, but that would also mean there were more buyers. Commerce is a bit of a side show for now.

[BitmoreCoin]

Stable mean not more than a few percentage a day volatility. Otherwise the goods will be priced in fiat, not bitcoin, even though you can pay with bitcoin, the vendor will change bitcoin into fiat instantly, they will not keep bitcoin. That is bad for the value of bitcon.

There are plenty of 'real' currencies with way less stability than Bitcoin. Overall though I agree. I don't see how it could ever be stable, in fact it was specifically designed not to be with deflation built in.

The merchant instant fiat thing is a bit of a tried trope. Bitpay employees have said hardly a coin is sold on the open market. They already have buyers waiting for them. Whether that could continue if activity scaled up is a different matter, but that would also mean there were more buyers. Commerce is a bit of a side show for now.

Several percentage points of deflation a year is not big.