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Author Topic: What if USD collapses and they issue new currency.  (Read 2360 times)
steelhouse
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November 08, 2012, 07:27:54 AM
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Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.
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November 08, 2012, 07:48:16 AM
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Bitcoin doesn't rely on USD,

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November 08, 2012, 09:32:03 AM
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If USD collapsed I'm sure my bitcoin balance would be the least of my worries.
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November 08, 2012, 09:33:53 AM
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Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.
The case for bitcoins would be a bit weaker, but it'd still be pretty strong. First, other countries would still have crappy currencies. Second, Bitcoins can be cheaply and instantly transported around the world without having to ask anyone for permission.

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November 08, 2012, 02:18:10 PM
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Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.

Not complete -- The decentralization is of utmost importance, because it prevents central control by any authority that would wish to corrupt it.  The usual argument I hear against this point is, "What if someone accumulates => 51% of hashing power?  or What if someone buys out the network? or ... accumulates most of the BTC?"  None of those arguments hold any soundness; the concept of decentralized cryptocurrency has been formally proven possible in practice and some other instantiation would replace Bitcoin in this case.
Another important fundamental concept of Bitcoin and the cryptocurrency concept in general is the proof of work done by the hashing algorithm, which prevents counterfeiting and more-than-once spending of units.

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November 08, 2012, 04:44:09 PM
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Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.


Internet transactions all over the world. Thats not "only"...
How will you send your friend a real piece of gold or shop on Amazon with gold?
Would you rather go around carrying gold in your pockets or Bitcoins that only you can access?

Bitcoin are:

...Sending value all over the world 24/7. Thats never out of fashion.
...No chargebacks. Its allways useful.
...Is being in total control of your own digital currency, being in total control of your own things will never be out of fashion.
...Privacy, privacy is allways useful and valued, its not a trend.
...Cheap transactions, cheap transactions is not a trend it will allways be better than expensive transactions.

Bitcoin is freedom, freedom will never be out of fashion.
Bitcoin and or any other cryptocurrency is here to stay.



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molecular
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November 08, 2012, 07:38:00 PM
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Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.

The currency would very unlikely be gold. That has high transaction and storage cost and such. You can't just mail your taxes to the government in gold. It might be some currency backed by gold, but that carries 3rd party risk, which bitcoin doesn't.

Bitcoin is like gold (scarce, no third-party risk, fungible, divisible, etc...), except the transaction and storage cost are way lower (even lower than with fiat currencies).

Bitcoin is "liquid digital gold".

And no, it's not tangible, because liquid gold is just too hot!

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November 08, 2012, 09:57:46 PM
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If USD collapsed I'm sure my bitcoin balance would be the least of my worries.

This.

Seems BTC is still just digits of electricity.  Now if the new currency is gold, would not BTC collapse as we don't need BTC anymore.  The only value would be ease of transactions.


Internet transactions all over the world. Thats not "only"...
How will you send your friend a real piece of gold or shop on Amazon with gold?
Would you rather go around carrying gold in your pockets or Bitcoins that only you can access?

Bitcoin are:

...Sending value all over the world 24/7. Thats never out of fashion.
...No chargebacks. Its allways useful.
...Is being in total control of your own digital currency, being in total control of your own things will never be out of fashion.
...Privacy, privacy is allways useful and valued, its not a trend.
...Cheap transactions, cheap transactions is not a trend it will allways be better than expensive transactions.

Bitcoin is freedom, freedom will never be out of fashion.
Bitcoin and or any other cryptocurrency is here to stay.

And this.

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November 09, 2012, 05:11:06 PM
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Why bother changing the name and hiring people to do new artwork? That would be unnecessary extravagance in these tough times. Grin

It's all about perception.

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November 12, 2012, 01:17:48 AM
 #10

history is littered full of currency crisis. the average age of a currency is 30-40 years. people always resort to whatever is stable at the time of collapse.
will bitcoin be stable?

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November 12, 2012, 11:35:51 AM
 #11

history is littered full of currency crisis. the average age of a currency is 30-40 years. people always resort to whatever is stable at the time of collapse.
will bitcoin be stable?

Since stability of a currency derives from the currency's properties, and Bitcoin is non-inflationary and non-centrally-controllable, I would put some solid money on the hypothesis that Bitcoin will be more stable than other currencies.

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DanielBTC
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November 12, 2012, 12:05:25 PM
 #12

"The 'bathroom box' door says: While you're shitting, F E D is printing more money.  "

How many years USD paper have before collapsing? 3? 4?
The prices are growing up there in US, right?  Gas, Hamburguer etc
Or I'm wrong? So the USD 'value' is decreasing.

If bitcoin price continues to follow USD in this ~$10 wall, the bitcoin price will decrease in the next years following USD...


The  FED "Operation Twist" is a BIG trap.

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Lethn
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November 12, 2012, 12:08:56 PM
 #13

When inflation happens you get a rise in the amount of money you have and things will seem better for a little while but then when you look at things like gold and silver you'll realise you're completely fucked, it's happening with the UK now, I see the conservatives boasting about how much they're going to get the deficit down but I still see debt and I still see lots and lots of printing. Just wait until the prices start rising again and it will be like 2008 except worse.

The only question is how long they'll be able to keep it up and how long the rest of the world is going to go along with it.

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November 12, 2012, 12:28:21 PM
 #14

In Brazil, the salary does not follow the real(and $Real) inflation in the past 20 years. So you need to work more and more (overtime) to buy the same things .
You acquisition power is going to the hole.

The country is growing up only by the credit and debit.
To buy a car/house/motorcycle/mountain bike/blender/steamer/pan you need credit card to parcel.
The house prices soared, something like 300%+ due to gov credit in 4 years.
Everyone is smiling.

But inflation/taxes is eating us alive and no one is seeing.

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November 12, 2012, 12:32:33 PM
 #15

What if USD collapses and they issue new currency?

The bitcoin forum rejoices and points the all knowing finger and says.......See? I guess you should listened to us afterall  Grin. Then its, wanna buy some of our "cash" for gold from your fort knox building haha oh go on, you know you want to america.

People will start buying up the old bills for shits and giggles liike theyre doing with the trillion dollar bills, novelty effect.

Doomsday rolls around and the nutjobs who all have hoarded everything will race to mine the last of the coins and spend them on the new post apocalyptic silk road looking for plutonium 239 to power their rigs for mining alternate coins  Roll Eyes

In reality?

Probs a week or two of severe riots because the average joe is a moron and will think that he has to loot the bejesus out of his neighborhood because there is "no more money".

Currency usually fails around the half century mark if it is going that way. Dont quote me on this though as im not sure where im remembering this info from. Maybe it an old fiat documentary or ron paul video from youtube??

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November 12, 2012, 02:26:46 PM
 #16

In Brazil, the salary does not follow the real(and $Real) inflation in the past 20 years. So you need to work more and more (overtime) to buy the same things .
You acquisition power is going to the hole.

The country is growing up only by the credit and debit.
To buy a car/house/motorcycle/mountain bike/blender/steamer/pan you need credit card to parcel.
The house prices soared, something like 300%+ due to gov credit in 4 years.
Everyone is smiling.

But inflation/taxes is eating us alive and no one is seeing.


This makes me sad to see that even with such high inflation, people do not wake up. Shouldn't south-american people at some point figure it out?

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November 12, 2012, 03:02:35 PM
 #17

US won't go back to gold.  Not enough and it has many other issues that would limit the US from expanding it economy.  Digital currency could replace current forms and we should remember history, in the early 1900 gold was illegal to own and you were to trade it in for paper currency notes.  What would stop the US from developing their own digital currency that they make with their equipment and then pass a law calling all other digital currency illegal to own and or trade in?

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November 12, 2012, 03:21:39 PM
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US won't go back to gold.  Not enough and it has many other issues that would limit the US from expanding it economy.  Digital currency could replace current forms and we should remember history, in the early 1900 gold was illegal to own and you were to trade it in for paper currency notes.  What would stop the US from developing their own digital currency that they make with their equipment and then pass a law calling all other digital currency illegal to own and or trade in?

Nothing.  What would prohibit the US from reintroducing slavery?  Or making ownership of all foreign products punishable by public stoning?  Or requiring a $20M license to have more than 1 child?  Or sterilizing criminals? etc.  You either trust your govt or you don't.   You resist tyrrany by one of the "boxes" (soap box -> ballot box -> jury box -> ammo box).  There is no other option.  

This applies to all governments on all issues.  I mean governments are "magical" they are simply a set of rules agreed to by the people.  It all comes down to people.  People can do bad things therefore governments can do bad things.   When someone says the government will arrest you they really mean people working for the government will arrest you.  When people say the government engaged in genocide they really mean people engaged in genocide while the government wasn't able or wasn't willing to stop them.

However I would point out things like the SR show the limits of the governments ability to enforce its will.  Many people refused to participate in the forced sale of gold in the 1900s.  Many today would refuse to participate in the prohibition of virtual currencies.  Outlawing napster didn't make p2p go away.  Outlawing pgp (yes our govt tried to outlaw pgp) didn't make encryption go away.  You can't outlaw ideas.

Gerald Davis  CEO, Tangible Cryptography Inc.
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November 12, 2012, 03:22:45 PM
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If the USD collapses and they issue a new currency then not a lot changes, accounts get converted to newdollars or whatever, folks get very good at converting from the old to the new in their heads and the US becomes a casualty of the current economic war crippled by foreign debts.

What would make more sense would be to discretely develop an internet based decentralised currency superior any existing currencies and allow it to collapse the USD and so wipe out US debt with no blame attached to the US directly. All that would be needed to ensure future US prosperity is a greater initial uptake by US citizens and businesses than creditors citizens and businesses.

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November 12, 2012, 03:28:36 PM
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If the USD collapses and they issue a new currency then not a lot changes, accounts get converted to newdollars or whatever, folks get very good at converting from the old to the new in their heads and the US becomes a casualty of the current economic war crippled by foreign debts.

What would make more sense would be to discretely develop an internet based decentralised currency superior any existing currencies and allow it to collapse the USD and so wipe out US debt with no blame attached to the US directly. All that would be needed to ensure future US prosperity is a greater initial uptake by US citizens and businesses than creditors citizens and businesses.

The US could pay off its debt tomorrow.  Simply hyperinflate the dollar 10,000% and that national debt which is 100% of GDP becomes 1% of GDP.   No secret currency is needed.  If the USD maintained purchasing power, and the government lived within it means BTC represents no risk to USD.  If the USD2.0 doesn't mantain purchasing power and the US gov2.0 doesn't live within its means then history will simply repeat itself.

If the US doesn't repay its debt (and it won't) in a manner which makes creditors whole (i.e. avoiding hyperinflation) then the US will be blamed regardless of how/why.   We are talking the court of public opinion here.     The US govt is a sovereign there is no legal remedy if they simply don't pay it back but it won't be without consequence.

Gerald Davis  CEO, Tangible Cryptography Inc.
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