Could a few rich, motivated people cripple bitcoin by buying price up &shorting?

[aynstein]

I was considering a quote from a gold investment manager, Peter Schiff (from a CNBC phone interview) . His take on bitcoin was the old "just a pyramid" that was weak on a good day. He claimed a few people will make a lot of money and many will lose big. Clearly he doesn't have any idea what bitcoin is, or how it works but it got me thinking.... What if several bright, forward thinking finance guys (they exist) took advantage of bitcoin markets by buying the price very high, shorting it and dumping. Is this realistic, or am I just overthinking this and missing a key piece.


I am not a hedge fund guy, so I don't know the mechanics of how this type of market manipulation would work, but it would even be legal right?


Could this be done on a scale that could hurt bitcoins value noticeably?


Just a thought....
Cheers

[Crazy]

Peter Schniff or something

I chuckled.

Edit: To be clear, Peter is considered by many to be brilliant, and by many to be an idiot. I'm one of the people that consider him to be a sage money manager. I'm confident if he's making an assertion, he has some basis for it.

[Crazy]

I'm sure the basis for the statement probably hinges on the fact that utility has gone up marginally, and the value has gone up exponentially. It's evident to practically everyone that this is merely another speculative bubble, just in a different region of the globe. There is really no basis for this valuation no matter what all the permabulls would love to claim. And it's not sustainable.

Edit: I don't know if you deleted your post or what, but my reply ended up above your response. Go figure.

[aynstein]

Peter Schniff or something

I chuckled.

Edit: To be clear, Peter is considered by many to be brilliant, and by many to be an idiot. I'm one of the people that consider him to be a sage money manager. I'm confident if he's making an assertion, he has some basis for it.

I couldn't tell if he just wasn't taking it seriously, it was a quote so I didn't see him. I am not a finance guy so no matter how good or credible he is I have no familiarity with him or the context.

What do you suppose that basis for his assumption may be?

I am totally pulling this out of left field, but I figured it might make an interesting topic...

[aynstein]

Peter Schniff or something

I chuckled.

Edit: To be clear, Peter is considered by many to be brilliant, and by many to be an idiot. I'm one of the people that consider him to be a sage money manager. I'm confident if he's making an assertion, he has some basis for it.

I couldn't tell if he just wasn't taking it seriously, it was a quote so I didn't see him. I am not a finance guy so no matter how good or credible he is I have no familiarity with him or the context.

What do you suppose that basis for his assumption may be?

I am totally pulling this out of left field, but I figured it might make an interesting topic...

Thats what I don't get, how can you be so certain, it's value seems so arbitrary. Though, a pseudo gold that can't be as easily manipulated seems like it would be worth a lot more then $500 for 21,000,000.00 but I don't know if we can say that is what bitcoin is. It is, but it's not. So I guess what I am wondering is, how can a reasonable person value something without any real context. Could you have given a reasonable value to radio waves when you saw the first few radios being showcased? Again, I don't see how one way or the other. 

[aynstein]

I'm sure the basis for the statement probably hinges on the fact that utility has gone up marginally, and the value has gone up exponentially. It's evident to practically everyone that this is merely another speculative bubble, just in a different region of the globe. There is really no basis for this valuation no matter what all the permabulls would love to claim. And it's not sustainable.

Edit: I don't know if you deleted your post or what, but my reply ended up above your response. Go figure.

Also, without speaking to utility or value, what about it's availability?


I reposted my response but with a quote to you in it. I am sorry for the disorder. I was trying to make it clear, go figure

[Crazy]

Also, without speaking to utility or value, what about it's availability?


I reposted my response but with a quote to you in it. I am sorry for the disorder. I was trying to make it clear, go figure

Hehe

Well you can get a hard value based on what it costs to mine. Everything beyond that is of course determined by the market, perhaps arbitrarily if you'd like to consider the free market arbitrary. Considering the fact that Bitcoin is still inflationary for a very long time (this of course speaks to your concern about availability), I don't see anything fundamentally that would drive enough new capital into the market to maintain this valuation. Just my opinion.

[Cunningham]

I was considering a quote from a gold investment manager. Peter Schniff or something. His take on bitcoin was the old "just a pyramid" that was weak on a good day. He claimed a few people will make a lot of money and many will lose big.

This was an CNBC phone interview with Peter Schiff on November 12th, 2013.

Source: http://www.cnbc.com/id/101192216

[aynstein]

Also, without speaking to utility or value, what about it's availability?


I reposted my response but with a quote to you in it. I am sorry for the disorder. I was trying to make it clear, go figure

Hehe

Well you can get a hard value based on what it costs to mine. Everything beyond that is of course determined by the market, perhaps arbitrarily if you'd like to consider the free market arbitrary. Considering the fact that Bitcoin is still inflationary for a very long time (this of course speaks to your concern about availability), I don't see anything fundamentally that would drive enough new capital into the market to maintain this valuation. Just my opinion.

I didn't mean to imply the free market is arbitrary, I meant the valuations I have read tend to be so arbitrary. That could very well be from my ignorance of markets in general. With that said, it still seems this experiment we know as bitcoin is too new (not just novelty new which it is) and the full value of it seems impossible to really know, regardless of background (Miss Cleo  not withstanding).

It may be wwwwwaaaayyyy over priced, but it is possible it may be waaaaaaayyyy under. It seems like religion, whichever you pick might be the right one, but only one is a winner.

[aynstein]

I was considering a quote from a gold investment manager. Peter Schniff or something. His take on bitcoin was the old "just a pyramid" that was weak on a good day. He claimed a few people will make a lot of money and many will lose big.

This was an CNBC phone interview with Peter Schiff on November 12th, 2013.

Source: http://www.cnbc.com/id/101192216

Thanks, I will edit that. I didn't see the original coverage, I read it, more then once though.

[Rupture]

They could try, but it wouldn't work cause to many people are hoarding

[aynstein]

They could try, but it wouldn't work cause to many people are hoarding

I hope they don't die and leave jr with a choice to buy his stripper girlfriend bigger boobs or hold. Boobs win every time.