STFU. Stop telling newcomers about mining. DON'T.

[RyanRed]

I've told a few people, but most of them don't think much of it. But I have had a few people take interest. Overall, most people I've introduced it too think its just to much of a radical idea.

[DannyHamilton]

Be very careful when introducing someone to Bitcoin. Those who don't give a damn about how it works even a bit are
the same ones that will inevitably end up scammed, lose their wallet or something along those lines and than cry loud
and for years at social sites and elsewhere how Bitcoin sucks, and probably acuse you for everything that happened.

Save yourself and us - do not bring more stupid people here, thanks!

I could not agree with you more. We will have to wait for a younger and more tech savvy generation. Any one over the age of 40 is a lost cause.

Nah. Age has nothing to do with it. I'm over 40 and feel that I've got a pretty good grasp of bitcoin.  I've talked with several people here who were clearly younger than 40 and couldn't seem to wrap their head around the necessary concepts.

[nobbynobbynoob]

I've told a few people, but most of them don't think much of it. But I have had a few people take interest. Overall, most people I've introduced it too think its just to much of a radical idea.

Just like Scientific American laughed off poor genius Stephen Wiesner when he wrote his quantum cryptocurrency thesis in the 1960s. (Though he envisaged the QC being used to protect central bank notes from counterfeiting, at the time.)

[AngelusWebDesign]

Be very careful when introducing someone to Bitcoin. Those who don't give a damn about how it works even a bit are
the same ones that will inevitably end up scammed, lose their wallet or something along those lines and than cry loud
and for years at social sites and elsewhere how Bitcoin sucks, and probably acuse you for everything that happened.

Save yourself and us - do not bring more stupid people here, thanks!

I could not agree with you more. We will have to wait for a younger and more tech savvy generation. Any one over the age of 40 is a lost cause.

Yeah, those "40 year olds" went to drive-in movies and soda fountains with their slicked-back hair, etc. when they were young.

That was all true back in the 80's, but this isn't the 80's anymore.

The long and short of it: A 40 year old is not a "Baby Boomer". He was born in 1972. He was 23 when Windows 95 came out. The "personal computer" really took off a few years earlier, when he was 20.

I doubt such a guy/gal would be ignorant of computers, like some stubborn strain of Baby Boomer (I say "stubborn strain" because plenty of Baby Boomers use PCs today).

I am 36 myself, and "U Can't Touch This" was all the rage when I was in 8th grade. I suppose some members here were just babies in 1990 -- if they existed at all

[AngelusWebDesign]

Unfortunately, the most of "tech savy" generation abilities peak at knowing how to use mobile phones and Facebook or Twitter.

I agree.

If anything, TOO young is a handicap, because "too much tech, too soon" results in learning disabilities of various sorts.

Just look at any "Millennial" and compare him/her to an equivalent who grew up in the 80's. No contest.

I can see how not having computers as a young child really helped me and all the others in my generation.

Regarding parents these days -- They're giving more technology to their children, thinking that there is no limit to what technology can do for our brains.
(How many Millennials would screw up that last sentence!)

A magazine is a broken iPad that doesn't work:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXV-yaFmQNk

You tell me that kid isn't going to be affected in very profound ways in her brain development by handling that iPad as a toddler.
She's going to have learning disabilities. It's no joke.

[ElectricMucus]

Mining is usually the first or second thing I talk about with people when telling them.
umad?

[zvs]

Be very careful when introducing someone to Bitcoin. Those who don't give a damn about how it works even a bit are
the same ones that will inevitably end up scammed, lose their wallet or something along those lines and than cry loud
and for years at social sites and elsewhere how Bitcoin sucks, and probably acuse you for everything that happened.

Save yourself and us - do not bring more stupid people here, thanks!

I could not agree with you more. We will have to wait for a younger and more tech savvy generation. Any one over the age of 40 is a lost cause.

Yeah, those "40 year olds" went to drive-in movies and soda fountains with their slicked-back hair, etc. when they were young.

That was all true back in the 80's, but this isn't the 80's anymore.

The long and short of it: A 40 year old is not a "Baby Boomer". He was born in 1972. He was 23 when Windows 95 came out. The "personal computer" really took off a few years earlier, when he was 20.

I doubt such a guy/gal would be ignorant of computers, like some stubborn strain of Baby Boomer (I say "stubborn strain" because plenty of Baby Boomers use PCs today).

I am 36 myself, and "U Can't Touch This" was all the rage when I was in 8th grade. I suppose some members here were just babies in 1990 -- if they existed at all

i was in junior high school when i started freeloading off of SMU, UTA, SSC (superconducting super collidor) & others.  back then you could just dial-in to these universities and telnet out.  some even allowed you guest access on their machines.   being able to access sscvx1.ssc.gov being one of those cases.  this was back in the late 80's & early 90's

[thoughtfan]

I think the mining metaphor was a fantastic way to get enough people interested and involved to get Bitcoin to where it is today.

However, I'm reluctant to raise it myself or to point people to the weusebitcoins video because by now I think the mining metaphor is a distraction to today's bigger Bitcoin picture.

I am a relative Bitcoin newcomer and I spent quite a long time thinking through, reading and writing about the whole mining thing but it's its potential use I find much more interesting by now.

... the network rewards the transaction processors with new coins...

+1 for this one.

I might add if interest is shown that for historic reasons it is called 'mining' because for a good while running this software was the equivalent of early-days gold mining where it was not very difficult to obtain something you could sell for a substantial profit.  However, these days although money can still be made it's heading more towards enthusiasts getting a small reward back for buying some specialised hardware and running it 24/7 to support the network.

[smoothie]

Translation of OP:

"WAAAAH STOP TELLING THEM ABOUT MINING. I WANT TO MAKE MORE BTC MINING..BOO HOO!"

 

[ElectricMucus]

Translation of OP:

"WAAAAH STOP TELLING THEM ABOUT MINING. I WANT TO MAKE MORE BTC MINING..BOO HOO!"

 

Exactly this.
It's not as many people would go into the mining game nowadays anyway. The quality of life impact you have to endure is significant as long as there isn't a dedicated room, which not many people are willing to do or afford.

And seriously, on converting electricity to a valuable asset growing pot beats mining hands down. And even in that perspective it is similar since self mined bitcoin has better privacy associated with it much as homegrown weed has better quality.

[fcmatt]

Mining, to me, was the real reason, or novelty if you will, why it became popular. It gave people something to do
or participate in. Not everyone can discuss currency/economy/crypto etc... but everyone can download a program
and start mining which was fun. It meant they were part of things.

Without mining.. i doubt it would be this popular.

[mccorvic]

I agree.  Mining is not something that newcomers need to know about.  It'll either confuse them or turn them off from BTC.

Early last year when mining was still a relatively efficient way of generating BTC I told a few friends about it.  Even now, nearly 1.5 years later, they are still fixated on mining and think that's the ONLY way of acquiring BTC. I have tried to explain to them that it is much easier to just buy them off the market or trade for them, but mining has gotten stuck in their head. 

Even after my warnings one just recently bought a $200+ graphics card and got super pissed when he only got a measly amount of return.  He now refuses to consider BTC anymore because he, in his words,  "got ripped off".

Telling them about mining was my biggest mistake

[mccorvic]

STFU. stop feeding this thread. DON'T.

I'm gonna reread the whole thing now.

[AngelusWebDesign]

I agree.  Mining is not something that newcomers need to know about.  It'll either confuse them or turn them off from BTC.

Early last year when mining was still a relatively efficient way of generating BTC I told a few friends about it.  Even now, nearly 1.5 years later, they are still fixated on mining and think that's the ONLY way of acquiring BTC. I have tried to explain to them that it is much easier to just buy them off the market or trade for them, but mining has gotten stuck in their head. 

Even after my warnings one just recently bought a $200+ graphics card and got super pissed when he only got a measly amount of return.  He now refuses to consider BTC anymore because he, in his words,  "got ripped off".

Telling them about mining was my biggest mistake

This anecdote is the point of this thread.

It's not about "should we encourage mining from new BTC users" and how it will impact the difficulty level. That's another story.

The question is: will bringing up the "mining" element actually hinder the popularity/spread of Bitcion, because of how the times, they have-a-changed?
Remember, GPU Mining isn't profitable anymore for the average person.

For it to be profitable, you have to have:
A) cheap electricity
B) knowledge of computer hardware (feel comfortable ordering Mobos, Cablesaurus extender cables, rigging cooling systems, setting up Linux, etc.)
C) desire/ability to pore over MH/J tables for the various GPUs, or at least pick decently efficient video cards
etc.

to make it work. Just popping in ONE card -- or even two, which is the most you can fit in the average motherboard, is not going to give a very good MH/J (efficiency).

Reading the miner's subforum, you'd swear that most motherboards come with 5 slots for PCI-X cards. Not true! I bought motherboards on purpose for mining, and the most I've seen is 2 PCI-X (full) and 3 PCI-X (small). Using a Cablesaurus extender cable, I manage to get most rigs up to THREE cards.

[mjc]

Just tell them to pick up a copy of Bitcoin Step by Step from Amazon.

[ElectricMucus]

Remember, GPU Mining isn't profitable anymore for the average person.

That has nothing to do on whatever telling people about it though. The question about generating bitcoin comes out of the discussion naturally and in order to avoid the subject deception would be necessary.
I don't see the point in that.


How about it: Tell it right as above, that's how it works. There is no point in anything else.

[Evolvex]

As soon as you use the word "I mine for bitcoins" - that looses people, they automatically then link it with a ponzi scheme or some conspiracy, because the concept is to abstract to the average person.

Its not that you shouldnt tell people the details if they wish, its that not everyone needs to hear them up front. Depending on the person I'm talking to I'll change the terminology I use. I do think bitcoin could do with a rebrand in some fashion sometimes.

[Mr.Coin]

When the subject of mining comes up. I tell them it's how transactions are verified, and that you get a very small compensation for your work.  The more miners there are the stronger bitcoin will be.  Not just from a 51% attack. If mega-miners(individuals with a large % of the hashing power)start ddosing each other, or one of them goes off-line.  It would more than likely start to destabilize the trust that novices and new comers have.  There sell off probably won't make much of a dent, but it would stall bitcoin growth.  Thankfully bitcoin hasn't been hurt by its growing pains, the sooner its full grown the better.

[furrycoat]

I agree mining should be kept away from the newbies ears, not only is it bad return it doesnt help the Bitcoin economy.

[thoughtfan]

Mining ... doesnt help the Bitcoin economy.

That's an intriguing sentence to me.  Would you mind elaborating?  As I understand it not only is it is essential for Bitcoin but more distributed mining also increases security.  My argument would then go that therefore indirectly, by giving people reason to be more confident in the security of Bitcoin, they can have more confidence to participate.  If the activities that have the biggest long-term impact on the Bitcoin economy require personal and financial investment then anything that increases confidence in its security, in the likelihood of it ever becoming more than an experiment I would have thought makes a massive difference.

But I'm ready to listen...