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Author Topic: [ANN][LSK] Lisk | Blockchain Application Platform for JavaScript Developers  (Read 3058492 times)
Beoga
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September 22, 2017, 12:47:52 PM
 #41761

@Beoga : How/where did you get all these statistics ? Manual reports ? Or with an online tool ?

Still not too much payouts so I transfered its manually in MsAccess and made few queries to analysis.
It would be more gracefully to get data from Lisk blockexplorer directly but it's a little difficult for me so far.


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Beoga
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September 22, 2017, 12:56:43 PM
 #41762


Well, I must admit you are the first one here who argue it's votes ! And this is a very good presentation ...
As you, there are some things that are disgusting :
- delegates who pay when balance reaches 5 Lisk or more ! For a small wallet, it's insane;
- delegates who share barely "nothing" - let' say minus 25% for exemple.

I noticed some error :
- Hagie pays via this account : hagie_say_thank_you
- Corsaro pays via this account : corsaro

The others : I don't know. I didn't receive any reward even if I voted them.

In you Excel sheet, just change our reward : we will share 50% ! Not 25%.
At the 1st of October, even if we don't forge, we will give 20% (1 LSK per forged block) to the RobinHood Pool - FROM OUR OWN POCKET !
Then, when we will forge, we will share more to reach 50%.

 Cool

Indeed, RobinHood is a good pool whatever FUDders say ! Good payout, high reward, excellent for small Lisk holders !
http://robinhood.liskpro.com

Thank you for new information it will help me to do more accurate analysis.
Consern liskpro.com - it is not clear for me - your pool and liberspirita will add 50% to robihood payouts. So liberspirita will pay 25% and you 25%, doesn't it?


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September 22, 2017, 03:20:02 PM
 #41763

Thank you for new information it will help me to do more accurate analysis.
Consern liskpro.com - it is not clear for me - your pool and liberspirita will add 50% to robihood payouts. So liberspirita will pay 25% and you 25%, doesn't it?

Well, right now, RobinHood share 100% (if you vote for RobinHood and LiberSpirita).
At the 1st of October, Liskpro.com will "offer" 1 LSK per forged block (about 20%) to the pool (from our own pocket).
The RobinHood pool will be at 120%/
After the reward reduction, LiberSpirita will offer 1 LSK too. The RobinHood pool will so have 150% of reward !

So basiclly, we could say that Liskpro.com will share 25% and LiberSpirita will share 25%. But % are not accurate because of the reward reduction (19 november).

Ex : now, 100% is 5 LSK per forged block.
If we add 1 LSK, the pool will get 120% - It's math.

At the 19 november, it's the reward reduction.
So 100% will be 4 LSK per forged block.
Liskpro.com will continue to share 1 LSK per block. (So 25% of it's forged Lisk (if we will forge).
LiberSpirita will share 1 LSK per block.
So the total pool reward will not be 4 LSK but 6 LSK so 150% !

Smiley More for our voters !

And maybe even more in the future !

(Hope I'm clear).

Let's go to the moon.
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September 22, 2017, 04:10:24 PM
 #41764

i just unvoiced all liskelite. i only vote for delegates that share at least 50%. i am fed up with this mafia. lets make a change and kick out the dust-pools. and don't vote them again if they start sharing more. they earned enough. so they have two start with an new name.
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September 22, 2017, 06:01:10 PM
 #41765


Hey Beoga

Check if you earned more than 0.5 LISK: http://vliskpool.com/stats/miner/

A few minutes ago I sent the payments to vrlc92 voters.

This pool proportionally share 50% of forged blocks revenue to people who voted for vrlc92.
Payments interval is 3d if earned more than 0.5 LISK.
The next one will be in 3 days.

For more information go to: http://vliskpool.com

Hi, I see my stat. That's OK, thank you for sharing 50%.


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kaedcoin
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September 22, 2017, 07:30:34 PM
 #41766

i just unvoiced all liskelite. i only vote for delegates that share at least 50%. i am fed up with this mafia. lets make a change and kick out the dust-pools. and don't vote them again if they start sharing more. they earned enough. so they have two start with an new name.

Mate, i'll do the same soon.

I urge everyone to do the same.

When they'll see their empire falling, maybe they'll reconsider how much they share.

We should have an alternative voting list to be able to replace them by delegates sharing >50%.

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September 22, 2017, 08:03:40 PM
Last edit: September 23, 2017, 12:03:41 AM by MrPresident
 #41767

For those who would like to examine payouts and stuff, I do have the pool site which has stats, graphs, and searchable payout balances... https://vote.phoenix1969.win
I normally do not dwell in here but this has been posted several times.
I'm normally reachable in lisk.chat or on tradingview if anyone has questions.
here's my transparency page: https://forum.lisk.io/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=1141&p=8939#p8939 (updating today)
and my other little site  http://lisk.linkspage.online has relevant useful links in a handy page.
I pay out well over 50% back to the community. 30% distributed by elite, and another 20% directly from my delegate pool database listed above.
...and as you can see by the report, several generous donations.

Currently, the ADLISK foundation campaign is collecting for another great campaign like the last one I did, which will begin tomorrow.
I donated 1000 lisk to it, and elite donated another 500. Nobody else has bothered to donate, sadly.
https://explorer.lisknode.io/address/4548115287754700213L  ...add to it and you will be mentioned throughout the campaign.
yet it should be a signifigant enough with 1500 lisk to do something decent...
So, start desighning banner ads for Google... (phase 1) let's do this guys!
Phoenix


 Develop Custom Decentralized Blockchain Applications in JavaScript with LISK!
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NorrisK
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September 23, 2017, 11:33:32 AM
 #41768

I think with all the dpos drama that's cluttering this thread that is is becoming clear that dpos is not the best way to forge.

It was a nice experiment, but I do hope alternative methods are being considered.
kaedcoin
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September 23, 2017, 11:42:56 AM
 #41769

I think with all the dpos drama that's cluttering this thread that is is becoming clear that dpos is not the best way to forge.

It was a nice experiment, but I do hope alternative methods are being considered.

I think DPOS could be a good way to forge, if only the devs implement a "hard-coded low sharing limit".

For example no less than 50% (i'm obsessed with this 50% thing), or even 70%.

Thus delegates still can decide to share more than 50% (or 70%) if they do want to, but never under this limit.

Delegates sharing less than that actually are vampires feeding and growing on voters.


ATM little wallets/voters better trade and speculate than vote and "stake", if they want to make some profits.
Termie
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September 23, 2017, 12:09:32 PM
 #41770

what concerns me also since longer time is #1 delegate Thepool.io. Their acutally 75% share sounds fair, but their 0.2 Lisk payout threshold is such stupid. As smaller voter, I get average payouts of ~0.25 Lisk, but each time 0.10 Lisk network fee will be deducted. So the effective share is much smaller. Tried to contact them via PM, at forum.lisk.io etc. but never get any reaction from them.
esramarka
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September 23, 2017, 12:26:13 PM
 #41771

We cannot mine this coin. How have it been so popular. I do not understand. Huh
kaedcoin
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September 23, 2017, 01:26:19 PM
Last edit: September 23, 2017, 03:52:00 PM by kaedcoin
 #41772

We cannot mine this coin. How have it been so popular. I do not understand. Huh

Just because you don't understand how DPoS mining work doesn't mean we cannot mine it. Wink
Block are mined (forged) by 101 delegates, elected by those who hold LSK in their wallets (lisk nano, desktop or web wallet, but not in exchanges ones), with a system of votes (33 votes/delegates per batch and 1 LSK+fee per batch).
That's why it's called "Delegated Proof of Stake".

what concerns me also since longer time is #1 delegate Thepool.io. Their acutally 75% share sounds fair, but their 0.2 Lisk payout threshold is such stupid. As smaller voter, I get average payouts of ~0.25 Lisk, but each time 0.10 Lisk network fee will be deducted. So the effective share is much smaller. Tried to contact them via PM, at forum.lisk.io etc. but never get any reaction from them.

You're absolutely right about this "issue" with payouts from Thepool. They/he should at least set a 0.5 LSK payout threshold, or even 1 LSK.

Hard to be a small voter with the way this DPoS system works.
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September 23, 2017, 01:46:12 PM
 #41773

So if i change my votes and vote for you Liskpro, and i've already voted for Robinhood and Liberspirita before, i will get 1 LSK to reimburse my vote ?

Yeah, that's what LiberSpirita said.
People who will vote the trio - RobinHood, LiberSpirita, Liskpro.com prior the 1st of october will see the 1 LSK spend refund Smiley
Yes, i will add 1 LSK per pooler voting the 3 delegates on 1st of October.

By the way, do not forget one important thing : if you miss a vote on one of the partners (liberspirita & liskpro.com), you get a penalty of 25%
This penalty is shared among all "smart poolers" voting the partners. ANd for these guys, it could be bargain at the beginning !
With current figures, i would not be surprised if smart poolers get around 250%

For security, your account has been locked. Email acctcomp15@theymos.e4ward.com
kaedcoin
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September 23, 2017, 01:53:31 PM
 #41774

So if i change my votes and vote for you Liskpro, and i've already voted for Robinhood and Liberspirita before, i will get 1 LSK to reimburse my vote ?

Yeah, that's what LiberSpirita said.
People who will vote the trio - RobinHood, LiberSpirita, Liskpro.com prior the 1st of october will see the 1 LSK spend refund Smiley
Yes, i will add 1 LSK per pooler voting the 3 delegates on 1st of October.

By the way, do not forget one important thing : if you miss a vote on one of the partners (liberspirita & liskpro.com), you get a penalty of 25%
This penalty is shared among all "smart poolers" voting the partners. ANd for these guys, it could be bargain at the beginning !
With current figures, i would not be surprised if smart poolers get around 250%


I think it's time we vote for you guys (even if i think you could share more if/when liskpro enters the top 101) and we unvote all the vampires sharing almost nothing.

Because each voter who will vote Liberspirita+Robinhood+Liskpro (and unvote every delegate he no longer wants forging) before October 1st will vote for free. Right ?
liberspirita
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September 23, 2017, 02:27:38 PM
 #41775

So if i change my votes and vote for you Liskpro, and i've already voted for Robinhood and Liberspirita before, i will get 1 LSK to reimburse my vote ?

Yeah, that's what LiberSpirita said.
People who will vote the trio - RobinHood, LiberSpirita, Liskpro.com prior the 1st of october will see the 1 LSK spend refund Smiley
Yes, i will add 1 LSK per pooler voting the 3 delegates on 1st of October.

By the way, do not forget one important thing : if you miss a vote on one of the partners (liberspirita & liskpro.com), you get a penalty of 25%
This penalty is shared among all "smart poolers" voting the partners. ANd for these guys, it could be bargain at the beginning !
With current figures, i would not be surprised if smart poolers get around 250%


I think it's time we vote for you guys (even if i think you could share more if/when liskpro enters the top 101) and we unvote all the vampires sharing almost nothing.

Because each voter who will vote Liberspirita+Robinhood+Liskpro (and unvote every delegate he no longer wants forging) before October 1st will vote for free. Right ?

right, that is the purpose actually. Voting is becoming to be so expensive by now that small poolers can't simply change anything in their voting system. So if you vote robinhood + liskpro.com + liberspirita before 1st of october, consider it is a free vote. I'll pay it

For security, your account has been locked. Email acctcomp15@theymos.e4ward.com
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September 23, 2017, 03:39:06 PM
 #41776

How long is the average time to receive coins from the delegate pools? I am waiting 11 days now, nothing there yet. Is that normal?

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September 23, 2017, 03:46:36 PM
 #41777

it's depend of delegate, by the end of the month  should be fine, sometime delegate wait you to get 1 lisk before doing a transfer.
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September 23, 2017, 03:56:57 PM
Last edit: September 23, 2017, 04:18:03 PM by kaedcoin
 #41778


I believe that the fee should be changed from 0.1 to 0.01 lisk. This would require a soft fork but would benefit the all voters / community.

Yeah it would be a good thing too.

Changes i'd like to see :

  • Lower transaction fees (0.1 to 0.01 LSK or 0.05 LSK max)
  • Maybe lowering voting fees too (1 to 0.5 LSK ?)
  • Hard-coded minimal sharing for delegates (50% ?Smiley)
  • More delegates (200, 1000 ?) with more delegates per batch of course, and/or far lower voting fees

With the recent "surge" in LSK price, entry ticket is far more expensive. If we want mass adoption for LSK, i think fees have to be cheaper AND rewards better.


How long is the average time to receive coins from the delegate pools? I am waiting 11 days now, nothing there yet. Is that normal?

It depends on
1) Each delegate sharing %. The higher the % is, the shorter you'll have to wait
2) If a pool is involved, and pool rules
3) Your wallet wealth (or "vote power")
4) Minimal payout threshold for each delegate and each pool involved
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September 23, 2017, 04:28:42 PM
 #41779

what concerns me also since longer time is #1 delegate Thepool.io. Their acutally 75% share sounds fair, but their 0.2 Lisk payout threshold is such stupid. As smaller voter, I get average payouts of ~0.25 Lisk, but each time 0.10 Lisk network fee will be deducted. So the effective share is much smaller. Tried to contact them via PM, at forum.lisk.io etc. but never get any reaction from them.

Indeed. It is not good idea to make minimum 0.2 Lisk. The minimum should be no less 0.5. Better 1Lisk.


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September 23, 2017, 05:53:51 PM
 #41780

Voters, if you want to earn more please consider unvote the following delegate

+ corsaro: 10% share only
+ tembo: 15% share only
+ mrv: 5% share only
+ redsn0w: 10% share only
+ splatters: 10% share only

There are a lot of standby delegates who share 50%+ profit
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