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[wizzardTim]

0.26.0 will the latest version on which I work. I sold my share.

Sad to hear that! You did good work.   - I also got out but sadly before the latest pump.

I will join (buy again) if it falls < 10 satoshi

Edit: I always believed in qora, I wouldn't sell my share if I didn't have to.

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[fher98]

A Small Update and Announcement

Some of the Qora Devs members had a discussion concerning Microsoft Azure Baas Platform, and we've agreed to explore that option after the release of V.0.26.  One of the devs will be contacting Microsoft and see how we can cooperate in order to deploy Qora Blockchain on the Microsoft Azure Cloud and join the Microsoft Azure Blockchain Baas Program.

We believe by signing on to the Microsoft Azure program, it will add "prestige" and "legitimacy" to Qora Development.  The recognition alone will be worth the effort.  

I will like to hear what you guys think.

Feel free to voice your opinion in this thread. Thank you!  

PS: Everything discussed in relation to Azure BaaS should be considered "tentative." The reason I posted this now is to throw this idea out here, so we can discuss the Pros and Cons as a community. Thank you.

Today I was in the shower, thinking just that!

[turkojan]

Hi there,
I'm facing this "invalid fee" error in my QORA wallet, when i try to send some coins to another wallet, create a name or everything that i try, every time gives me this "invalid fee" message also my forging is disable even with the wallet unlocked and sync, i'm using Windows 7 and wallet version 0.25.1 if someone knows the solutions help me please. thanks


ps: here is a print screen, even if i chagen the fee value to 1000 gives me the same.

http://oi67.tinypic.com/8zqyp0.jpg

[kennyP]

0.26.0 will the latest version on which I work. I sold my share.

Why bro, Can you give details? Thanks for all your work too

[GoldenKnight369]

Hi there,
I'm facing this "invalid fee" error in my QORA wallet, when i try to send some coins to another wallet, create a name or everything that i try, every time gives me this "invalid fee" message also my forging is disable even with the wallet unlocked and sync, i'm using Windows 7 and wallet version 0.25.1 if someone knows the solutions help me please. thanks


ps: here is a print screen, even if i chagen the fee value to 1000 gives me the same.

Need to make sure you're on the right chain.    Try restarting your qora client and let it sync again.  If that still does not work, download the data from agran's data folder (replace the chain on your computer):

http://qora.co.in/?datafolder

And try re-sync the client again.. Hope that helps  

[kennyP]

Although perhaps unknown to many on this forum the CIYAM Developers have been developing a new kind of blockchain technology for the last couple of years (it isn't ready for use yet but is getting close to completion).

As the CIYAM Developers have been involved with Qora for some time we are now considering the idea of perhaps creating a clone of Qora that works using the principles of the CIYAM blockchain (which is not POS but instead a POW for account creation that then works on hash-chains for block creation) as a trial of the concept.

The final CIYAM blockchain won't be a coin and if this Qora clone is actually created then it won't be owned or controlled by CIYAM but instead according to rules that will be part of the coin's creation (perhaps involving those Qora holders prior to the block that was published before this post).

Such a clone would of course support AT and ACCT between Qora and itself (and Burst) so IMO it should actually help both Qora and Burst.

Also to perhaps put things in perspective (as to why I am suggesting a clone) please research Diaspora (which was a failed attempt at a decentralised social network). IMO you can't charge people to create blogs or web pages (as it will never take off) so you need a way that allows that to be free (which requires controlling the amount of accounts that can be created to avoid attacks).

Wow, this sounds very exciting, and we know most Qora holders were initially attracted by new tech rather than alt coin hype and P&D, and most have shown patience through a long period where trading and prices were pretty grim, so if you did involve Qora in the distribution mechanism for  new CIYAM blockchain you would start with a knowledgeable and supportive user-base.

[Breasal]

Update: We're currently debating whether Qora should be on MS Azure's BaaS blockchain service or not, and we welcome all inputs/suggestions from the community.  

I actually don't know much about the purpose of using Azure except to increase expose for those shopping for a blockchain to use...so I can't comment regarding its potential as a platform to improve qora's value. I suspect it would be a good idea to at least try, get a response from MS and then make a decision. But if MS gives a similar response as it gave NEM, forget it. Can anyone explain why coins want to be on Azure apart from an immediate and short term hype? What is BaaS?

[sparta_cuss]

Initially I was quite put off when I read what NEM revealed about the Microsoft contract for Azure. Why would people, developers, give up their rights to the thing they created?

But now I am wondering what rights the developers have with regard to an open source project. Rights that cannot be enforced are rights that cannot be claimed, right?

It makes sense that the Qora devs and even the investors would not want to sign away their rights to use the code or deploy the blockchain in whatever ways they see fit. But if Microsoft, or anyone else, can simply clone the code based on what is open source, then what does it mean to either keep or give up rights to this particular version of the code and this particular instantiation of the Qora blockchain?

[jwinterm]

Initially I was quite put off when I read what NEM revealed about the Microsoft contract for Azure. Why would people, developers, give up their rights to the thing they created?

But now I am wondering what rights the developers have with regard to an open source project. Rights that cannot be enforced are rights that cannot be claimed, right?

It makes sense that the Qora devs and even the investors would not want to sign away their rights to use the code or deploy the blockchain in whatever ways they see fit. But if Microsoft, or anyone else, can simply clone the code based on what is open source, then what does it mean to either keep or give up rights to this particular version of the code and this particular instantiation of the Qora blockchain?

I'm interested what this could possibly mean as well. NEM and Qora are both using the MIT license.

[GoldenKnight369]

Thanks for the input, guys.    Appreciate it.

In a nutshell, MS Azure BaaS platform is the cloud computing/deployment platform designed specifically for blockchain-as-a-service (BaaS) purpose. By deploying the blockchain on Azure, it would be easier for potential developers and companies to interact and experiment with the blockchain, and create custom apps on top of the platform using existing MS technologies.
 
Initially, we were thinking that since all the blockchain providers (such as Qora) who wish to sign up for the program will need to undergo certain "security vetting" conducted by Microsoft, it would act as some sort of certification, and we thought going with it might add  "clout" or "prestige" to a cryptocurrency project like Qora that is accepted into the program. Plus, they always make announcement when they accept a new Blockchain partner, so as a partner, we will receive some free press and recognition from Microsoft as well as the tech community.

Now after reading Microsoft's Licensing Agreement, I am not so sure about it anymore.. It sounds pretty bad: http://windowsazure.github.io/docs/Contribution%20License%20Agreement.pdf

Licenses.

a. Copyright License.
You grant Microsoft, and those who receive the Code directly or indirectly from Microsoft, a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty free, irrevocable license in the Submission to reproduce, prepare derivative works of, publicly display, publicly perform, and distribute the Submission and such derivative works, and to sublicense any or all of the foregoing rights to third parties.

b. Patent License.
You grant Microsoft, and those who receive the Code directly or indirectly from Microsoft, a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, irrevocable license under your patent claims that directly read on the Code to make, have made, use, offer to sell, sell and import or otherwise dispose of the Code.

To be honest, I am not so sure of the ramifications of signing such contract (albeit non-exclusive). But after read this blog post: http://bitcoinist.net/microsoft-bullies-open-source-is-the-blockchain-their-next-target/, I am getting a little wary of signing such licensing contract...  Perpetual... worldwide.. royalty-free?    I know we're an open-source project.. But wording like this (irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual) really makes me suspicious of Microsoft's motives. 

I am not a lawyer so I cannot say for certain how dangerous this contract is.. But I have to admit I'm getting worried..

[sparta_cuss]

Here is a different way of getting at the same set of issues: Why does Microsoft need Qora to sign anything at all if they can just clone the project and run their own version?

One answer to this question is: A project is only viable if it has investors/users who will secure the network and build applications on it or use it.

So, my cynical side says that MS would like to use the Qora dev team and current investors/users in order to test out possible uses for this technology. When it has proven its worth, MS will simply use the existing Qora blockchain for its own purposes. It would have to provide incentives to the current users so they don't all try to sell and leave the network unsecure, but MS has the deep pockets to do this. Technically, though, I am not sure how it would work.

Some of my best guesses about what is happening or likely to happen with Azure projects are based on my admittedly limited experience in software development. In the 1990s and 2000s, MS would identify interesting pieces of software that they wanted to add to their suite. They would make a reasonable offer to a company, usually a startup. The offer would essentially be, "We would like to pay you X amount of money for all of your code and developers. This is a good offer. If you refuse to sell to us, then we will design our own product that duplicates yours, and in two years we will easily outcompete you and you will be out of business. So what would you like to do?"

[GoldenKnight369]

Some of my best guesses about what is happening or likely to happen with Azure projects are based on my admittedly limited experience in software development. In the 1990s and 2000s, MS would identify interesting pieces of software that they wanted to add to their suite. They would make a reasonable offer to a company, usually a startup. The offer would essentially be, "We would like to pay you X amount of money for all of your code and developers. This is a good offer. If you refuse to sell to us, then we will design our own product that duplicates yours, and in two years we will easily outcompete you and you will be out of business. So what would you like to do?"

Lol.. very, very, good point!    I understand what you're getting at... they're basically saying "Accepting our offer now.. or we will come up with a competing product, and then we will CRUSH you!"    Microsoft is still evil and ruthless after so many years.   I just re-read their licensing agreement, and it clearly stated that they will own the rights to all "derivative works."  So I guess basically, by signing such contract, other people will NOT be able to clone Qora, or they will risk having Microsoft going after them.  

Having said that, I think we should focus on the root of the question: Let's just say we sign off the rights and don't care..  Does "getting Qora on Azure" really offer Qora the kind of benefits and advantages that we desire? There are only 3-4 benefits/advantages I can think of:

1. Getting a very large "Certified By Microsoft" label for Qora after we got vetted and accepted in the program.  

2. Getting to use Azure cloud platform for free.

3. Attracting certain "Enterprise" or high-profile customers who are already familiar with MS technologies (with no previous exposure to crypto) to incorporate Qora in their product.  

4. Getting known by the wider, non-Crypto tech community.  Introducing people who are not already familiar with Crypto to Qora technologies.

I am not sure if all this effort will lead to wider adoption or not, so it's a gamble.

However, we must also keep in mind, to my knowledge, there are at least 6 Cryptos already being accepted into the program: Ethereum, Factom, Bitshare, Syscoin, Rapple.. etc So it is in NO way an exclusive club.

Therefore, I highly doubt that it will offer the same prestige as before when only one or two cryptos was in the program.  

[CIYAM]

Giving up rights to the software is a very bad idea and it would likely mean that the plans for the CIYAM Developers to create a clone of Qora would have to be scrapped.

That being said it is up to the Qora community and developers to decide their future direction (so for now I will simply watch and see what unfolds).

Note that if the CIYAM Developers do end up creating a clone we would very much desire the assistance of the existing Qora developers and community (if there is no such support then it would be less likely to be worth the effort).

[sparta_cuss]

My preference, in case it isn't obvious from my posts, is to resist any attempt at restricting the autonomy of the developers and users. Never surrender your rights to innovate and build something.
Microsoft was lord over the old world. But we are trying to build a new world, without the need of a corporate overlord.

[eli_lyd1]

Giving up rights to the software is a very bad idea and it would likely mean that the plans for the CIYAM Developers to create a clone of Qora would have to be scrapped.

That being said it is up to the Qora community and developers to decide their future direction (so for now I will simply watch and see what unfolds).

Note that if the CIYAM Developers do end up creating a clone we would very much desire the assistance of the existing Qora developers and community (if there is no such support then it would be less likely to be worth the effort).

Don't worry, I don't support to join ms. I am the author of https://github.com/soliury/qora-wallet

[jwinterm]

How can you give up rights on an MIT licensed piece of software?

Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining a copy of this software and associated documentation files (the "Software"), to deal in the Software without restriction, including without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom the Software is furnished to do so, subject to the following conditions:

The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software.

THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM, DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE, ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE.

If you created a fork and changed the license, then maybe, but what part of "without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software" would allow MS to direct the development of Qora or control the blockchain?

Even if they/you changed the license, people would still be free to run the versions which are MIT licensed.

[eli_lyd1]

Giving up rights to the software is a very bad idea and it would likely mean that the plans for the CIYAM Developers to create a clone of Qora would have to be scrapped.

That being said it is up to the Qora community and developers to decide their future direction (so for now I will simply watch and see what unfolds).

Note that if the CIYAM Developers do end up creating a clone we would very much desire the assistance of the existing Qora developers and community (if there is no such support then it would be less likely to be worth the effort).

And Maybe I can help you to build the qora clone. I have talked about with vbcs, I will add at qora-btc to qora-wallet soon.

[sparta_cuss]

How can you give up rights on an MIT licensed piece of software?

Permission is hereby granted, ...

If you created a fork and changed the license, then maybe, but what part of "without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software" would allow MS to direct the development of Qora or control the blockchain?

Even if they/you changed the license, people would still be free to run the versions which are MIT licensed.

It might take a lawyer of someone experienced in intellectual property rights to say for sure. But here is what I suspect: Qora devs sign the Azure contract. After several months of development under the Azure veil, MS can claim that the "new" Qora is significantly different from the "old" Qora, which was MIT licensed. And as such, they now have legal dominion over the "new" Qora.

If a company takes something that exists in the wild, something very common, and enhances it with some new design that significantly improves on the old design, then they can apply for protection (a copyright or patent) for their enhancements to the original, public design.

I admit that I am not an expert in these matters. I am simply trying to contribute a healthy dose of suspicion to this opportunity.

[CIYAM]

And maybe I can help you to build the qora clone. I have talked about with vbcs, I will add at qora-btc to qora-wallet soon.

That would be most helpful as UI is one major area that CIYAM Developers don't currently have covered.

[eli_lyd1]

And maybe I can help you to build the qora clone. I have talked about with vbcs, I will add at qora-btc to qora-wallet soon.

That would be most helpful as UI is one major area that CIYAM Developers don't currently have covered.

But I don't know how to contact you,  I am in slack, my name is soliury