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Author Topic: Surge Protection for several S7's  (Read 1890 times)
dannygroove
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February 10, 2016, 11:06:06 PM
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I have 14 S7 and I am starting to wire them up and I need some advice on what surge protection do I need for EACH S7 or is there a way to surge protect them in bulk?. Any help will be greatly appreciated.
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philipma1957
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February 10, 2016, 11:12:13 PM
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Do a whole house surge protector at your main panel.

Square deal makes them.

You need two open circuits on the panel.

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dannygroove
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February 10, 2016, 11:26:40 PM
 #3

Thanks for the quick reply.
I found this on amazon, http://www.amazon.com/Square-Schneider-Electric-HOM2175SB-SurgeBreaker/dp/B008DIYAPM/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1455146196&sr=8-6&keywords=Whole-House+Surge+Protector

Is this what I am looking for? Sorry for the questions but I am stuck at this point.
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February 11, 2016, 02:53:39 AM
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Thanks for the quick reply.
I found this on amazon, http://www.amazon.com/Square-Schneider-Electric-HOM2175SB-SurgeBreaker/dp/B008DIYAPM/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1455146196&sr=8-6&keywords=Whole-House+Surge+Protector

Is this what I am looking for? Sorry for the questions but I am stuck at this point.

Yes that should be good.

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nexus99
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February 11, 2016, 05:03:40 AM
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I have 14 S7 and I am starting to wire them up and I need some advice on what surge protection do I need for EACH S7 or is there a way to surge protect them in bulk?. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Are you running these on 4 30 amp 240v circuits?
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February 11, 2016, 03:05:09 PM
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Is this what I am looking for? Sorry for the questions but I am stuck at this point.
First, remember what an effective protector does. Best protection is a hardwire to what absorbs hundreds of thousands of joules.  That is the earth ground.  Unfortunately we cannot connect every wire in every incoming cable (AC electric, phone) directly to earth.  So a protector does what a hardwire does better.

Critical is that hardwire (or protector) connect be low impedance (ie less than 10 feet, no sharp wire bends, etc). That connection to and quality of earth ground electrodes should have most of your attention.

Lightning (a typical surge) is 20,000 amps.  So a minimal 'whole house' protector should be 50,000 amps.  Unfortunately that Square D is rated only 22,500 amps.  So at least two should be installed.  Other manufacturers also provide a 50,000 amp version for a similar price.  Many manufacturers of integrity provide these effective solutions.  Available in Lowes, Home  Depot, and electrical supply houses.

50,000 amps defines protector life expectancy over many surges.  Earth ground defines protection during each surge.

Again, a protector is only as effective as its earth ground.
dannygroove
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February 11, 2016, 07:20:04 PM
 #7

I have 14 S7 and I am starting to wire them up and I need some advice on what surge protection do I need for EACH S7 or is there a way to surge protect them in bulk?. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Are you running these on 4 30 amp 240v circuits?

Im running each of them on 2x20 AMP circuit breakers.
dannygroove
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February 11, 2016, 07:22:05 PM
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Is this what I am looking for? Sorry for the questions but I am stuck at this point.
First, remember what an effective protector does. Best protection is a hardwire to what absorbs hundreds of thousands of joules.  That is the earth ground.  Unfortunately we cannot connect every wire in every incoming cable (AC electric, phone) directly to earth.  So a protector does what a hardwire does better.

Critical is that hardwire (or protector) connect be low impedance (ie less than 10 feet, no sharp wire bends, etc). That connection to and quality of earth ground electrodes should have most of your attention.

Lightning (a typical surge) is 20,000 amps.  So a minimal 'whole house' protector should be 50,000 amps.  Unfortunately that Square D is rated only 22,500 amps.  So at least two should be installed.  Other manufacturers also provide a 50,000 amp version for a similar price.  Many manufacturers of integrity provide these effective solutions.  Available in Lowes, Home  Depot, and electrical supply houses.

50,000 amps defines protector life expectancy over many surges.  Earth ground defines protection during each surge.

Again, a protector is only as effective as its earth ground.


Thank you very much for the detailed answer, took note of everything
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February 11, 2016, 07:42:54 PM
 #9

As an electrician, I recommend you to have an electrician do the job.

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February 14, 2016, 04:03:09 AM
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As an electrician, I recommend you to have an electrician do the job.

Why don't you, as an electrician, give him the proper information instead, and let him make the decision?
philipma1957
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February 14, 2016, 05:10:13 AM
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in the state of New Jersey a home owner would be allowed install it in their own home.  In most but not all towns.

it is an easy install for someone that is a
 good diyer.  but if you make a mistake bad things can happen.


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HagssFIN
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February 14, 2016, 02:52:57 PM
 #12

As an electrician, I recommend you to have an electrician do the job.

Why don't you, as an electrician, give him the proper information instead, and let him make the decision?
It is just my opinion.
Here in Finland it is prohibited to do such installations if you are not professional electrician.

I know though that it is a different case in some countries, which only require an inspection done by electrician after you do your installations yourself.

For info I can say that look for the proper basics in electrical installations and see for example IEC standards regarding surge protection.
Use proper tools for the job, such as reliable voltage tester or multimeter, insulated screwdrivers etc.

philipma1957
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February 14, 2016, 03:01:21 PM
 #13

As an electrician, I recommend you to have an electrician do the job.

Why don't you, as an electrician, give him the proper information instead, and let him make the decision?
It is just my opinion.
Here in Finland it is prohibited to do such installations if you are not professional electrician.

I know though that it is a different case in some countries, which only require an inspection done by electrician after you do your installations yourself.

I have lived in four USA states.  CA NY MD NJ only NJ allows Diy electrical work of those four states.
You need to have the town inspect it when finished.

This particular install involves opening the circuit breaker box so a lot of power is involved you could hurt yourself. 

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HagssFIN
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February 14, 2016, 03:06:05 PM
 #14

As an electrician, I recommend you to have an electrician do the job.

Why don't you, as an electrician, give him the proper information instead, and let him make the decision?
It is just my opinion.
Here in Finland it is prohibited to do such installations if you are not professional electrician.

I know though that it is a different case in some countries, which only require an inspection done by electrician after you do your installations yourself.

I have lived in four USA states.  CA NY MD NJ only NJ allows Diy electrical work of those four states.
You need to have the town inspect it when finished.

This particular install involves opening the circuit breaker box so a lot of power is involved you could hurt yourself. 
That's right! (bold text)
That is one reason why I recommend a professional.

westom
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February 14, 2016, 03:45:56 PM
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You need to have the town inspect it when finished.
Depends on the scope of the work.  No inspections are needed to replace receptacles, switches, or light fixtures.  Inspections are required (more often determined by local codes) when major electrical work is performed such as running new circuits.  Anyone can change a circuit breaker - no inspection required.

State defines what codes apply.  Local jurisdictions determine what requires inspection.

Scope of the work determines if that town requires an electrical inspection.

Meanwhile, only an informed DIYer should do electrical work.  That means first learning from an electrician or from someone else who knows this stuff.  That means he is on site to observe you or demonstrate how it is done.  After you read how it should be done.

Any guy should have learned and be able to do the simple stuff.
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February 15, 2016, 04:53:19 PM
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You need to have the town inspect it when finished.
Depends on the scope of the work.  No inspections are needed to replace receptacles, switches, or light fixtures.  Inspections are required (more often determined by local codes) when major electrical work is performed such as running new circuits.  Anyone can change a circuit breaker - no inspection required.

State defines what codes apply.  Local jurisdictions determine what requires inspection.

Scope of the work determines if that town requires an electrical inspection.

Meanwhile, only an informed DIYer should do electrical work.  That means first learning from an electrician or from someone else who knows this stuff.  That means he is on site to observe you or demonstrate how it is done.  After you read how it should be done.

Any guy should have learned and be able to do the simple stuff.


I you want the work to be permanent, i.e. sell the house with it, it probably is best to get an electrician to do it. I am a former electrical engineer and certainly knew what I was doing when I added a second breaker panel and some additional circuits in my old house. However, I was not familiar with all the arcane codes and when I sold the house I had to have some of the wiring redone. The electrician doing the rework said that what I had done was safe, solid and even over-engineered. However it was not up to code in a few minor details.
philipma1957
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February 15, 2016, 06:45:32 PM
 #17

You need to have the town inspect it when finished.
Depends on the scope of the work.  No inspections are needed to replace receptacles, switches, or light fixtures.  Inspections are required (more often determined by local codes) when major electrical work is performed such as running new circuits.  Anyone can change a circuit breaker - no inspection required.

State defines what codes apply.  Local jurisdictions determine what requires inspection.

Scope of the work determines if that town requires an electrical inspection.

Meanwhile, only an informed DIYer should do electrical work.  That means first learning from an electrician or from someone else who knows this stuff.  That means he is on site to observe you or demonstrate how it is done.  After you read how it should be done.

Any guy should have learned and be able to do the simple stuff.


I you want the work to be permanent, i.e. sell the house with it, it probably is best to get an electrician to do it. I am a former electrical engineer and certainly knew what I was doing when I added a second breaker panel and some additional circuits in my old house. However, I was not familiar with all the arcane codes and when I sold the house I had to have some of the wiring redone. The electrician doing the rework said that what I had done was safe, solid and even over-engineered. However it was not up to code in a few minor details.

Yeah mechanically sound work may not meet code even when it is superior work.
I did my entire home in 1995 and 1996 all diy I hired an electrican to do the main panel out of fear of the 240 volts coming in.

Every thing I did was good and passed code except for using six 10 gauge wires  as the whole house ground  code was one 6 gauge wire for the ground.

Even though my ground had more copper and most likely would be harder for it to fail it was not code so I had a 6 gauge ground wire put in.


ps I left the six ten gauge wires in place. added the one six so I have a very solid grounded home.

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wikkidtt
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February 16, 2016, 01:35:28 PM
 #18

Buy some real surge protection from SurgeX. Best in the business been using them for over 10years on $200k plus installs and on my personal stuff.
westom
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February 16, 2016, 05:09:36 PM
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Buy some real surge protection from SurgeX.
Anybody can learn from numbers. Surgex is electrically equivalent to a 600 joules protector.  Only UPS typically have less protection.  Surgex is promoted using half truths and outright lies - to many who only learn from advertising, hearsay, and urban myth.
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February 17, 2016, 04:36:43 AM
 #20

Buy some real surge protection from SurgeX.
Anybody can learn from numbers. Surgex is electrically equivalent to a 600 joules protector.  Only UPS typically have less protection.  Surgex is promoted using half truths and outright lies - to many who only learn from advertising, hearsay, and urban myth.


That's false. In house test by me and others found no other surge protector was able to take a 200,000 volt hit and protect the gear on the other end other than a surgeX and Furman ice. And I have a pile of surge protectors sitting on our test bench to prove it. We were paid by the local energy company to provide government bids for surge protection and had us test each piece of equipment and all others failed and half caught fire. At CEDIA 6 years ago they did a similar test where they had people bring in other Manufacturer's products to test and same outcome. There's a video on YouTube that shows as well.
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