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Author Topic: Is Islam a religion of Peace?  (Read 9903 times)
af_newbie
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February 13, 2016, 09:00:48 PM
 #61

i dont know it....but there is total unrest in the world caused by people belonging to that religion...so cant say anything!!

The reasons why the true Muslims do violence are listed here http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm.

Smiley

I'm thinking the quotes in Quran are part of the problem.  We have to ask ourselves why Muslims use them to commit violence.  Christians and Jews have similarly violent quotes in their holy books, but somehow we see less religion inspired violence from those cults.

Maybe it is the Jihadist, sharia law ideology in this holy book that gives Muslims an excuse to commit more violent acts. 

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BADecker
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February 13, 2016, 09:07:00 PM
 #62

Yeah, over 100 verses that call to violence. Religion of peace - right.

In addition, when you listen to the Muslim clerics who say that those words of violence really mean peace, they always talk so fast that you can't get your thoughts straight as to what they are saying. So, they turn Islam into peace.

Well, what they really do is turn it into peace for Muslims. They are very clever in the way they switch things around so that it looks like they are talking about everybody, but they are only really talking about peace for Muslims.

There is a sliver of Islam that is peace for non-Muslims. There is an unspecified time of outreach, where Muslims "must" offer peace to peaceful non-Muslims, during a time while they are trying to convert them to Islam. But nobody knows when this outreach time will end. And the peaceful Muslims have gone way beyond the time, and should have killed off a whole bunch of infidels long ago.

This is one of the things that ISIS is upset about... the fact that the other Muslims mostly are not being true Muslims.

Smiley
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February 13, 2016, 09:10:48 PM
 #63

Of course - every religion is making propaganda for itself.
So ISIS is being violent because other Muslims mostly are not being true Muslims.? Good job. They must be the good guys.

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February 13, 2016, 09:12:38 PM
 #64

i dont know it....but there is total unrest in the world caused by people belonging to that religion...so cant say anything!!

The reasons why the true Muslims do violence are listed here http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm.

Smiley

I'm thinking the quotes in Quran are part of the problem.  We have to ask ourselves why Muslims use them to commit violence.  Christians and Jews have similarly violent quotes in their holy books, but somehow we see less religion inspired violence from those cults.

Maybe it is the Jihadist, sharia law ideology in this holy book that gives Muslims an excuse to commit more violent acts. 



The difference is this. The Islamic directives to violence are live directives.

There were essentially two areas for ancient Israel violence against other nations. They were in self-defense, and for a time while Israel made itself into a strong nation.

Since ancient Israel fell away from God, God took their nation away from them for almost 1,900 years. They barely have it back again, since 1948-1949, and here they are, doing the violence in ways that God has not directed them this time.

Christianity has no directives to do violence in their religious writings. In fact, it is just the opposite - turn the other cheek.

Smiley
af_newbie
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February 13, 2016, 09:23:56 PM
 #65

i dont know it....but there is total unrest in the world caused by people belonging to that religion...so cant say anything!!

The reasons why the true Muslims do violence are listed here http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm.

Smiley

I'm thinking the quotes in Quran are part of the problem.  We have to ask ourselves why Muslims use them to commit violence.  Christians and Jews have similarly violent quotes in their holy books, but somehow we see less religion inspired violence from those cults.

Maybe it is the Jihadist, sharia law ideology in this holy book that gives Muslims an excuse to commit more violent acts. 



The difference is this. The Islamic directives to violence are live directives.

There were essentially two areas for ancient Israel violence against other nations. They were in self-defense, and for a time while Israel made itself into a strong nation.

Since ancient Israel fell away from God, God took their nation away from them for almost 1,900 years. They barely have it back again, since 1948-1949, and here they are, doing the violence in ways that God has not directed them this time.

Christianity has no directives to do violence in their religious writings. In fact, it is just the opposite - turn the other cheek.

Smiley

That is what you think but unfortunately that is not a reality.  I thought we already went through that argument in other threads.  No point to rehash the quotes and the contemporary examples of Christian inspired violence here. 

I'm curious as to why Muslims are more inclined to commit violence.  I'm sure Quran has nice "turn the other cheek", "help your brothers and sisters" quotes as well.  Maybe some Muslim members here can provide examples of nice quotes from Quran.  I have no desire to go through this vile book again....

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February 13, 2016, 09:27:29 PM
 #66

i dont know it....but there is total unrest in the world caused by people belonging to that religion...so cant say anything!!

The reasons why the true Muslims do violence are listed here http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm.

Smiley

I'm thinking the quotes in Quran are part of the problem.  We have to ask ourselves why Muslims use them to commit violence.  Christians and Jews have similarly violent quotes in their holy books, but somehow we see less religion inspired violence from those cults.

Maybe it is the Jihadist, sharia law ideology in this holy book that gives Muslims an excuse to commit more violent acts. 



The difference is this. The Islamic directives to violence are live directives.

There were essentially two areas for ancient Israel violence against other nations. They were in self-defense, and for a time while Israel made itself into a strong nation.

Since ancient Israel fell away from God, God took their nation away from them for almost 1,900 years. They barely have it back again, since 1948-1949, and here they are, doing the violence in ways that God has not directed them this time.

Christianity has no directives to do violence in their religious writings. In fact, it is just the opposite - turn the other cheek.

Smiley

That is what you think but unfortunately that is not a reality.  I thought we already went through that argument in other threads.  No point to rehash the quotes and the contemporary examples of Christian inspired violence here. 

I'm curious as to why Muslims are more inclined to commit violence.  I'm sure Quran has nice "turn the other cheek", "help your brothers and sisters" quotes as well.  Maybe some Muslim members here can provide examples of nice quotes from Quran.  I have no desire to go through this vile book again....



I tried once to read the Quran. If I'm not mistaken, on the first page, I think, there was something like "all non-muslims are bad people and must die", or something like that. So that was it. Threw it away.
Kudos to you for reading it all. I couldn't.

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February 13, 2016, 09:29:02 PM
 #67

i dont know it....but there is total unrest in the world caused by people belonging to that religion...so cant say anything!!

The reasons why the true Muslims do violence are listed here http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm.

Smiley

I'm thinking the quotes in Quran are part of the problem.  We have to ask ourselves why Muslims use them to commit violence.  Christians and Jews have similarly violent quotes in their holy books, but somehow we see less religion inspired violence from those cults.

Maybe it is the Jihadist, sharia law ideology in this holy book that gives Muslims an excuse to commit more violent acts.  



The difference is this. The Islamic directives to violence are live directives.

There were essentially two areas for ancient Israel violence against other nations. They were in self-defense, and for a time while Israel made itself into a strong nation.

Since ancient Israel fell away from God, God took their nation away from them for almost 1,900 years. They barely have it back again, since 1948-1949, and here they are, doing the violence in ways that God has not directed them this time.

Christianity has no directives to do violence in their religious writings. In fact, it is just the opposite - turn the other cheek.

Smiley

That is what you think but unfortunately that is not a reality.  I thought we already went through that argument in other threads.  No point to rehash the quotes and the contemporary examples of Christian inspired violence here.  

I'm curious as to why Muslims are more inclined to commit violence.  I'm sure Quran has nice "turn the other cheek", "help your brothers and sisters" quotes as well.  Maybe some Muslim members here can provide examples of nice quotes from Quran.  I have no desire to go through this vile book again....



Simply because Christians do what is against the directives that God has laid down in the New Testament, does not mean that new directives are formed.

As I said in another post, Muslims are required to be peaceful to faithful Muslims, and to peaceful non-Muslims during a time of attempted conversion.

Smiley
mrflibblehat
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February 13, 2016, 09:31:48 PM
 #68

"attempted conversion"? So what happens if the conversion fails or doesn't work? Those who attempted are fair game and can be killed?

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February 13, 2016, 11:21:35 PM
 #69

I think some are peaceful and open minded and others are extreme and closed minded.

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February 14, 2016, 06:50:02 AM
 #70

I think some are peaceful and open minded and others are extreme and closed minded.

The problem is that the "peaceful and open minded" types, who claim that they constitute the majority of the Muslims, don't condemn the actions by their "extremist and close-minded" coreligionists. In the end, it is the silence by the majority which makes it impossible to prevent the terrorist activities by the fringe elements.

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arbitrage
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February 14, 2016, 10:55:53 AM
 #71

I don't see that Islam is doing anything to distinguish themselves from those extremists..
They must clearly every day direct call for peace and understanding..
They must call people to protest against terrorism or they know something that we dont?
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February 14, 2016, 11:36:05 AM
 #72

Islam or any other beliefs are not way to reach peace at all.
They will always reach one point so save its believers but kill its non believers.
It is truth for every religion. Sorry.

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February 14, 2016, 02:56:20 PM
 #73

Islam or any other beliefs are not way to reach peace at all.
They will always reach one point so save its believers but kill its non believers.
It is truth for every religion. Sorry.
for every religion?Huh

I think some are peaceful and open minded and others are extreme and closed minded.

The problem is that the "peaceful and open minded" types, who claim that they constitute the majority of the Muslims, don't condemn the actions by their "extremist and close-minded" coreligionists. In the end, it is the silence by the majority which makes it impossible to prevent the terrorist activities by the fringe elements.

When they don't condemn the violence, do they still have the right to claim "Islam is peace?"

If and when they claim Islam is Peace regardless, should they just be laughed at?

Or what???
af_newbie
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February 14, 2016, 03:27:02 PM
 #74

Islam or any other beliefs are not way to reach peace at all.
They will always reach one point so save its believers but kill its non believers.
It is truth for every religion. Sorry.
for every religion?Huh

I think some are peaceful and open minded and others are extreme and closed minded.

The problem is that the "peaceful and open minded" types, who claim that they constitute the majority of the Muslims, don't condemn the actions by their "extremist and close-minded" coreligionists. In the end, it is the silence by the majority which makes it impossible to prevent the terrorist activities by the fringe elements.

When they don't condemn the violence, do they still have the right to claim "Islam is peace?"

If and when they claim Islam is Peace regardless, should they just be laughed at?

Or what???

Muslims don't criticize obvious problems with their religion because any criticism is punishable by death.
This religion will have a hard time reforming itself.

Try to draw a picture of Mohammad raping a 9 yr old child.

What I'm not getting is why Western countries succumb to their demands for irrational behavior by openly not criticizing their religion.  Obama cannot even admit it is a problem. 

How can you reform this religion if you don't even admit there is a problem?


 
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February 14, 2016, 06:20:55 PM
 #75

Islam or any other beliefs are not way to reach peace at all.
They will always reach one point so save its believers but kill its non believers.
It is truth for every religion. Sorry.
for every religion?Huh

I think some are peaceful and open minded and others are extreme and closed minded.

The problem is that the "peaceful and open minded" types, who claim that they constitute the majority of the Muslims, don't condemn the actions by their "extremist and close-minded" coreligionists. In the end, it is the silence by the majority which makes it impossible to prevent the terrorist activities by the fringe elements.

When they don't condemn the violence, do they still have the right to claim "Islam is peace?"

If and when they claim Islam is Peace regardless, should they just be laughed at?

Or what???

Muslims don't criticize obvious problems with their religion because any criticism is punishable by death.
This religion will have a hard time reforming itself.

Try to draw a picture of Mohammad raping a 9 yr old child.

What I'm not getting is why Western countries succumb to their demands for irrational behavior by openly not criticizing their religion.  Obama cannot even admit it is a problem. 

How can you reform this religion if you don't even admit there is a problem?


 

Here's my problem with this.  Any culture, nation, city, state, religion has it's "Enforcers."  They are a low percentage of the total in the group.  They may be not very nice people, or they may be nice people in a nasty job.  Does not matter.  The enforcers actually dictate the rules of the group, don't they?  (think cops, soldiers, Allah Ackbarists)

The actual rules are the rules that are enforced. By use of negative incentives such as prison, courts, violence, death, maiming.
popovicbit
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February 15, 2016, 05:35:39 AM
 #76

And when all those lands were under people like Gadafi,Husein,Asad there was peace and tolerance let say non violent also in Iran while Sah Pahlavi was there and  suddenly after their fall radical islam shows and rise up.

Both Saddam Hussein and Bashar al Assad were a part of the Arab nationalist Ba'áth party. Gaddhafi also was a proponent of Arab nationalism. They gave importance to Arab supremacy, and suppressed Islamic nationalism. Christian Arabs used to play an important role in the Ba'áth party and even now they are quite powerful.

Bryant, you are correct...arab nationalism and socialism were very popular form of protest in the middle east in the post colonial world. This was so because most of the third world turned to socialism to protest what they viewed as western hegemony. A book I would recommend is by Roy Oliviar, The Failure of Political Islam. In that book he shows how "Political Islam' grew out of the failure of Arab/Muslim states to create a better society through Arab nationalism and socialism.

If you look at the regimes during that period it is striking to see

Syria: Ba'athist party, Socialist, Secular
Egypt: Ba'athist, Socialist, Secular,
Jordan: Secular, Socialist
Iraq: Ba'athist, Socialist, Secular
Algeria: Socilaist
Libya: Socialist, Nationalist
Sudan: Socialist
Yemen: Socialist, Communist
PLO: Socialist
Afghanistan: Communist

"Political Islam" is an empty shell that uses religious terminology as political slogans. What you see is very similar to the reformation Christianity under went in Europe...every man thinks they have the right to interpret the religion how they see fit and is willing to kill anyone who opposes them, be they muslim or not.

My earlier post about the history of relations between muslims and non muslims was meant to show that historically muslims were very adept at living peacefully with others. This was so because the teachings of Islam, when interpreted by trained scholars, makes it compulsory to respect and more importantly protect people who aren't muslims.

What was Osama bin Laden by trade? A civil engineer.
And Ayman al Zawahiri? a doctor.

This is a free for all, where might makes right and religious terminology is used to appeal to their mass audience. Traditional scholars and universities of religious learning show that they do speak for the religion...but they (the extremist) are the ones with the guns and bombs.

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February 15, 2016, 12:45:00 PM
 #77

Well the good thing is that thanks to few Muslims and a lot of propaganda, people still have something useless to talk about...

What a wonderful woooooooooooooooorld ^^


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February 15, 2016, 07:05:56 PM
 #78

In my opinion, all religions are religions of peace.....

Prove it.  Some religions actually are religions of peace, such as the Christian Quaker sect.  Others are not the same.

It is a logical error to claim they are the same, is it not?  And we know that different sects of Islam teach wildly different behavior.  Again, they are not the same.

yes , i agree with you.. not all the religions are peacefull, some of then even let people make war... this is so illogical..

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February 15, 2016, 08:16:05 PM
 #79

....

"Political Islam" is an empty shell that uses religious terminology as political slogans. What you see is very similar to the reformation Christianity under went in Europe...every man thinks they have the right to interpret the religion how they see fit and is willing to kill anyone who opposes them, be they muslim or not.....

But if the religion Islam itself proposes and requires as a goal Islamic theocracy, then you can neither shrug off "political Islam" as an empty shell, nor consider it as separate from Islam itself.

Like it or not, it is what it is.

I conclude that political manifestations related to Islam are Islam itself.  Is any other interpretation possible?  You can't just pick and choose what goes in the "Islam" box and the "Not Islam" box to reach any desired conclusions.
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February 15, 2016, 08:18:15 PM
 #80

Most religion are for peace if it want always war its not ISLAM.

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