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Author Topic: [Archive] BFL trolling museum  (Read 68171 times)
Askit2
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January 03, 2013, 10:20:27 AM
 #1541

I hope the speculation crack wasn't at me. I worked out what I could have made. Actually far less I am sure with the patterns and the like. Just a flat difference from when I wanted to order a single and where I am now. December of 2011 to Jan 2013. Several doubles in there etc.

I wasn't dissapointed. I just noted what I could have made. Realistically I could have made nothing or lost money in the same period. I could have made more in the New years 2012 doubling sold blah blah blah.... and made more that way.

I wasn't even surpised. I knew the numbers, the time frame and what I actually made. Now I could have placed my order in december 2011 as well and made some more coin in the dec 2011 to jan 2013 period. I didn't. I waited until a product shipped and people had them. Was it safer, sure. Did I do ok, You bet. Did I lose anything, not at all. I could have made more many different ways. The price to difficulty ratio was far better then I calculated for my worse case scenerio so far.

My point was I didn't view my purchase of hardware as an investment. I didn't view my XBOX 360 as one or a TV. Sure they could be concidered that way. To me I paid for a piece of hardware. Unlike other hardware I have owned over the years this one paid me for using it. I didn't invest in the hardware I purchased it was my point. At the end of the day I have made some bitcoins, have a hashing unit, and am happy with where I am.


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gopher
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January 03, 2013, 11:23:08 AM
 #1542

Yes, the speculation reference was about you, but not the second one about the cry-babies posting open questions about the status of their pre-orders, complaining loudly that someone has scammed them and it was not their fault for making the mistake of placing the pre-order (well, if they understand the difference between an order and a pre-order)...

"Mom, honestly, I am going to pay the money that I borrowed from you back, I promise...If it was not of these bad guys at XXX and YYY and ZZZ that took my money, I did not read the fine print, there must be a contract that I've entered into with them when I placed that order, they let me believe that they promise to send me the product before the reward-halving-day, if they had, I could have made a killing before Christmas, but now they scammed me, and I hate them, and I want to see them dead, and where is my product, but I also want to keep my pre-order in, just in case they are not as bad as I thought they were and they eventually deliver, and if I cancel my pre-orders now, I would see others making the killing and I will look even bigger looser to my friends, boo-hoo!"
greyhawk
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January 03, 2013, 12:37:16 PM
 #1543

Just gonna drop this here:

Update

The samples passed all functionality tests. The power consumption is also within the expected range. And as our overclocking tests had shown, they still have a lot of potentials compared to our original spec. This means that the biggest risk of our project is gone and our NRE is a fruitful spend.

The first production batch of chips will be out of the packaging service tomorrow. Our deploying is on its way.

Bogart
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January 05, 2013, 06:53:00 PM
 #1544

Just gonna drop this here:

Update

The samples passed all functionality tests. The power consumption is also within the expected range. And as our overclocking tests had shown, they still have a lot of potentials compared to our original spec. This means that the biggest risk of our project is gone and our NRE is a fruitful spend.

The first production batch of chips will be out of the packaging service tomorrow. Our deploying is on its way.

Presumably that means they have now given the go-ahead to make of a new maskset for full-wafer production, in order to reach their planned 50TH/s capacity.

If these ASIC vendors don't get their production moving along quickly, we may see a significant (> 50%) consolidation of network hashing power.

Whether it's abused or not, the mere potential will undermine confidence in the security of the network and the currency it supports, IMO.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
PuertoLibre
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GET IN - Smart Ticket Protocol - Live in market!


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January 05, 2013, 08:51:03 PM
 #1545

Just gonna drop this here:

Update

The samples passed all functionality tests. The power consumption is also within the expected range. And as our overclocking tests had shown, they still have a lot of potentials compared to our original spec. This means that the biggest risk of our project is gone and our NRE is a fruitful spend.

The first production batch of chips will be out of the packaging service tomorrow. Our deploying is on its way.

Presumably that means they have now given the go-ahead to make of a new maskset for full-wafer production, in order to reach their planned 50TH/s capacity.

If these ASIC vendors don't get their production moving along quickly, we may see a significant (> 50%) consolidation of network hashing power.

Whether it's abused or not, the mere potential will undermine confidence in the security of the network and the currency it supports, IMO.
By the way, the posts above are talking about ASICMiner, not BFL.

BFL is still in a holding pattern for the next delay (very likely IMO).


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repentance
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January 05, 2013, 09:12:02 PM
 #1546


Presumably that means they have now given the go-ahead to make of a new maskset for full-wafer production, in order to reach their planned 50TH/s capacity.

If these ASIC vendors don't get their production moving along quickly, we may see a significant (> 50%) consolidation of network hashing power.

Whether it's abused or not, the mere potential will undermine confidence in the security of the network and the currency it supports, IMO.

From memory, they way they did this run was to fully complete half the chips in the batch - so there's already a similar amount of chips which is half-way through production and which now only need the second half of layers added (because they know the first lot worked they don't need to make any changes to the process).

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
Bogart
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January 05, 2013, 10:47:34 PM
 #1547


Presumably that means they have now given the go-ahead to make of a new maskset for full-wafer production, in order to reach their planned 50TH/s capacity.

If these ASIC vendors don't get their production moving along quickly, we may see a significant (> 50%) consolidation of network hashing power.

Whether it's abused or not, the mere potential will undermine confidence in the security of the network and the currency it supports, IMO.

From memory, they way they did this run was to fully complete half the chips in the batch - so there's already a similar amount of chips which is half-way through production and which now only need the second half of layers added (because they know the first lot worked they don't need to make any changes to the process).

Yeah, the first half of the first batch is supposed to sum up to 6Th/s, with the second half being another 6TH/s.

After that it's on to full wafer production to scale up to 50Th/s (or beyond), which I'm speculating has already been set into motion.  I would at this point if I were them.

 Self-Mining with First Batch of Chips At least 12TH/s in
total
...
  Self-Mining after Mass Production Unlimited hashrate in
theory because of the low margin cost. But in reality we have to consider the
cost of management (labor) and place (rent). We believe an expansion to 50TH/s
is not hard to achieve.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
Mushroomized
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Hello!


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January 07, 2013, 07:00:50 PM
 #1548


hello
crazyates
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January 07, 2013, 07:27:44 PM
 #1549

[img]http://i.imgur.com/jKcxC.png
I'm confused as to what you're trying to imply. You do know that Inaba maintains a pool (that has nothing to do with BFL)? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=16385.0

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lucif
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January 07, 2013, 08:28:18 PM
 #1550

Good profit ponzi scheme

Having: 100 FPGA and 200 ppl wiling to buy it.

1. Sell 100 FPGA to 100 ppl
2. Announce super-puper ASIC
3. Accept pre-payment, offer FPGA -> ASIC upgrade
4. Receive 100 FPGA back, send them to other 100 ppl
5. Offer them update, take money
6. Receive back 100 FPGA, dissapear
...
PROFIT: 100 FPGA + 200 FPGA payments + over 200 ASIC payments
SgtSpike
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January 07, 2013, 08:30:45 PM
 #1551

Good profit ponzi scheme

Having: 100 FPGA and 200 ppl wiling to buy it.

1. Sell 100 FPGA to 100 ppl
2. Announce super-puper ASIC
3. Accept pre-payment, offer FPGA -> ASIC upgrade
4. Receive 100 FPGA back, send them to other 100 ppl
5. Offer them update, take money
6. Receive back 100 FPGA, dissapear
...
PROFIT: 100 FPGA + 200 FPGA payments + over 200 ASIC payments
Not near as much profit as actually running a legitimate business, funnily enough.  Which is why BFL is running a legitimate business, not a ponzi scheme.
crazyates
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January 07, 2013, 08:34:51 PM
 #1552

4. Receive 100 FPGA back, send them to other 100 ppl
5. Offer them update, take money
6. Receive back 100 FPGA, dissapear

2 problems with this:

1) BFL has stopped selling the old FPGA Singles, and AFAIK, they don't have any outstanding orders.

2) BFL hasn't received any FPGA Singles to count towards the ASICs. I myself have an upgrade from a Single to a SC Single, but I'm still hashing away on the FPGA Single until the actual hardware is released.

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freeAgent
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January 07, 2013, 11:00:59 PM
 #1553

Yeah, the trade-in program doesn't work like that and as was already mentioned, that big orange bar is the EclipseMC pool run by Inaba/BFL Josh.  It's been one of the largest pools since before Josh had any connection to BFL.
punin
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January 07, 2013, 11:16:03 PM
 #1554

I wonder why Smiley

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repentance
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January 07, 2013, 11:22:31 PM
 #1555



2) BFL hasn't received any FPGA Singles to count towards the ASICs. I myself have an upgrade from a Single to a SC Single, but I'm still hashing away on the FPGA Single until the actual hardware is released.

I know it's been mentioned recently that people are going to need to send BFL an amount equivalent to the value of their FPGA if the want their ASIC shipped before they return their existing hardware, but I'm curious about whether buyers assumed from the outset that this is how upgrades would work.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
nathanrees19
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January 08, 2013, 01:02:32 AM
 #1556

Good profit ponzi scheme

Having: 100 FPGA and 200 ppl wiling to buy it.

1. Sell 100 FPGA to 100 ppl
2. Announce super-puper ASIC
3. Accept pre-payment, offer FPGA -> ASIC upgrade
4. Receive 100 FPGA back, send them to other 100 ppl
5. Offer them update, take money
6. Receive back 100 FPGA, dissapear
...
PROFIT: 100 FPGA + 200 FPGA payments + over 200 ASIC payments

Simpler scheme:

1. Announce ASIC and take pre orders
2. ??
3. Profit
boonies4u
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January 08, 2013, 01:53:19 AM
 #1557



2) BFL hasn't received any FPGA Singles to count towards the ASICs. I myself have an upgrade from a Single to a SC Single, but I'm still hashing away on the FPGA Single until the actual hardware is released.

I know it's been mentioned recently that people are going to need to send BFL an amount equivalent to the value of their FPGA if the want their ASIC shipped before they return their existing hardware, but I'm curious about whether buyers assumed from the outset that this is how upgrades would work.

I didn't even know that I could send them an equivalent amount.  This must have been some option that came up recently. I just assumed that when my order was ready I 'd have to send in my FPGA.
repentance
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January 08, 2013, 02:15:53 AM
 #1558


I didn't even know that I could send them an equivalent amount.  This must have been some option that came up recently. I just assumed that when my order was ready I 'd have to send in my FPGA.

Here you go.

Quote
We plan on giving at least a weeks notice. If you want to send us BTC as a deposit while we ship your ASICs, we will do that as well and then refund you back the BTC when we receive the FPGA unit.


https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/606-shipping-back-fpgas.html

This is why no-one's going to believe delivery of BFL ASICs is imminent until Josh tells people to start sending back their FPGAs.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
crazyates
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January 08, 2013, 02:19:09 AM
 #1559

2) BFL hasn't received any FPGA Singles to count towards the ASICs. I myself have an upgrade from a Single to a SC Single, but I'm still hashing away on the FPGA Single until the actual hardware is released.
I know it's been mentioned recently that people are going to need to send BFL an amount equivalent to the value of their FPGA if the want their ASIC shipped before they return their existing hardware, but I'm curious about whether buyers assumed from the outset that this is how upgrades would work.
I didn't even know that I could send them an equivalent amount.  This must have been some option that came up recently. I just assumed that when my order was ready I 'd have to send in my FPGA.
It was my impression that you do NOT need to send them any coins to get your upgrade. If you wanted to send them coins as collateral for your upgrade while you ship the old Single back, you can.

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Phinnaeus Gage
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January 08, 2013, 02:19:50 AM
 #1560


I didn't even know that I could send them an equivalent amount.  This must have been some option that came up recently. I just assumed that when my order was ready I 'd have to send in my FPGA.

Here you go.

Quote
We plan on giving at least a weeks notice. If you want to send us BTC as a deposit while we ship your ASICs, we will do that as well and then refund you back the BTC when we receive the FPGA unit.


https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/606-shipping-back-fpgas.html

This is why no-one's going to believe delivery of BFL ASICs is imminent until Josh tells people to start sending back their FPGAs.

I believe you meant sending BTC, not the FPGAs, a fair option so that no mining time is lost.
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