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Author Topic: Has anyone actually filed an FTC complaint?  (Read 4025 times)
creativex
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March 15, 2013, 03:09:16 AM
 #21

I didn't forget about greed as a factor, I just recognize that BFL recognized the greed factor when they planned their scammy bait and switch. The order line queue system has ensured that the vast majority of people that have been swindled will not cancel due to the perceived value of their order position. That's what makes them captives, so that they can experience the 3rd degree Stockholm syndrome previously alluded to.

Perceived value of order position really only applies to those who ordered very early, though.  It doesn't explain the willingness of people to order now, knowing that they'll be waiting at least 2-3 months to receive their units and it doesn't explain those who can't wait to use their discount vouchers (having already waited 9 months for their first units, they're willing to order more and wait months to receive those - knowing that the hash rate will have risen considerably by the time those units arrive).  

The only way BFL ASICs are going to be delivered in a reasonable amount of time is if production greatly outstrips the rate of new orders - and that's not likely to happen any time soon given that people have only 60 days to use their discount vouchers once BFL ships.  No-one at BFL is even giving an estimate on when they expect to have caught up on back-logged orders any more, but it's not likely to be in the first half of this year.  As things stand now, it's going to be a very long time before BFL has ASICs available for immediate delivery and anyone who can step in to fill that gap has the chance to take market share away from them.

That's the beauty here! The BFL captives investors watch as ASICMiner brings 6+Th online and Avalon guys start getting their rigs, so they get antsy and complain to BFL, who mysteriously has a new policy of transparency. Never mind that none of their new fairytales timetables are met either, it keeps the captives investors from getting too restless, their products are JUST around the corner afterall...just as they have been since June of 2012. When that begins to wear thin the magical unicorn blood chips go to the 24hr bumping facility for a couple weeks, the packagers, testers, blah blah. There's always some new juicy tidbit or perty picture to keep people thinking their money making machines are JUST around the corner.

As to new customers where are they supposed to go? bASIC is gone and Avalon is only doing batches. Meanwhile Josh and BFL customer service are inexplicably on different pages about just how long an order placed now will take to deliver. The most public version being the most favorable to BFL's bottom line of course.

It doesn't make any sense at all to me to hold onto an order through all that scammy shell game crap, but obviously people are doing it, and many of those people are otherwise perfectly reasonable folks. Ask them what they're thinking. I know a lot of the newbies that are mulling it over have no idea about BFL's history and haven't a clue who they're getting into bed with. Certainly if there was another vendor with a bottomless pre-order window and a slick deceptive marketing strategy then people would be torn between the two, but Tom already closed shop and got HIS scammer tag. BFL is still kickin and now people have only one scammy vendor to order from.  

repentance
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March 15, 2013, 03:31:46 AM
 #22

By the way, on BFL forums, there are a few users complaining they can't pay with Paypal. Some think it is a site error and BFL staff says they don't know, just try again.

I wonder if Paypal found out that BFL is doing Bitcoin Related transactions. I recall on the forum people said Paypal will cancel orders if they know it is Bitcoin related. Any truth to this?

PayPal does have a policy relating to processing transactions for the sale of digital currencies.  I can't see that policy extending cover anything and everything Bitcoin related, though.  If they intervened here, it would be more likely to be because products haven't been delivered in a timely manner than because the hardware itself is Bitcoin related (there's nothing stopping you using PayPal to sell Bitcoin T-shirts, for instance).  Again, this isn't likely to happen unless customers open disputes with PayPal and they have no incentive to do that while BFL is honouring refund requests.

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As to new customers where are they supposed to go? bASIC is gone and Avalon is only doing batches.

It's precisely this "must have an ASIC ASAP" attitude which allows BFL to do what it's doing.  People could cancel their orders/hold off ordering until BFL has actually delivered and closed the order/delivery time gap but they want to be "in on the ground floor of the next big thing".  BFL exploits that just as pirate did, but at the end of the day the choice to hang in there is being made by BFL customers - their fear of missing a "once in a lifetime chance" is greater than their fear of being screwed by BFL.  Nobody "needs" an ASIC right now just as no-one "needed" to give their BTC to pirate.  At the end of the day, people are responsible for their own bad choices even when those bad choices have been encouraged by others. 

Hell, you don't even hear BFL customers complaining that the timeline between delivery of Batch 1 and the bulk order (which would have given early adopters a significant advantage) has been compressed any more - lots of them are planning to order more units and they want those units sooner rather than later even if it means hash rate will climb much faster than under the original timeline.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
Bicknellski
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March 15, 2013, 04:07:50 AM
Last edit: March 15, 2013, 04:32:42 AM by Bicknellski
 #23

There is obviously a WIDE gap in the market place and anyone with the know how and ties in India, China or Europe could just as easily start up a run and get something to market as fast or faster than BFL. If Avalon can do it... there are certainly people who could do it as well and even faster. I can't see this being a 1 horse race with Avalon being the only supplier too much longer. At some point there will be a new player in this fight. In the mean time the FPGA's and GPU's are making bitcoin well enough for the next few months to come, maybe more, considering the slow trickle of Avalon's that will come online. I can't see why anyone would buy any BFL products from this point forward... and hopefully we all will see a new player come to the market place soon. The market could see someone come in with a much smaller and more efficient chip and at a lower cost simply to bury BFL before it even gets anything out the door. 

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