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Author Topic: [ANN][XEL] Elastic Project - The Decentralized Supercomputer  (Read 449728 times)
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13Darko
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February 22, 2017, 04:53:50 PM
Last edit: February 22, 2017, 09:58:40 PM by 13Darko
 #3941

But by limiting the number of SN we limit the overall supercomputer calculating power, isn't it? If it's gonna be 300k XEL then we'll have the maximum number of 333 supercomputer clusters, 30k XELs means 3330 SN (in the best case scenario, of course).
I agree with ttook that maybe we could make this number a variable? But only not an increasing, but a decreasing one: from 300k to, let's say, 3k over time due to XEL's price increase and increasing resources consumption.

From my understanding the SN's are only validating the computational jobs done by the individual network nodes. I dont see the number of SN's as a factor in overall network computational potential, but I do recognize that having a low # of SN's could create a bottleneck... But either way, the data supporting my claims here doesnt exist yet.

A variable amount for operating SN's might help out. But it seems most are concerned with the Fiat cost of ownership at this point - We cant peg XEL to fiat and expect it to be a accurate 6 months down the road. In addition to that fact, a Fiat / Xel calculation that determines the amount of XEL required for a supernode has absolutely no technical implications on the network.

TLDR: XEL Supernodes =/= Masternodes (DASH, PIVX, ect.) - Network computational power is not supplied by Supernodes alone. You can mine / compute with the other nodes.

Thanks. Probably I just misunderstood the concept behind SN. If individual nodes can also mine, that will bring lots of computational power I believe, and maybe we'll be able even to bypass some TOP500 Supercomputers of the World? Smiley

Pegging Xel to Fiat is a bad idea, true, but I think we can easily change SN number manually by updating network software (do hardforks if needed).

Edit: Nah, bad idea. Rich SN possibly won't like competition and just won't update...
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February 22, 2017, 05:01:01 PM
 #3942

Why not make it so the network requires X number of supernodes to always be running. And have the collateral be auction based.

i.e. say X is 100 - i.e. we want 100 super nodes to run.

It will self adapt - if someone wants to run 10 super nodes at 300K collateral each so be it.

But if there are 90 who only want to put up 100K, they will be able to participate as well.

The moment someone puts bigger collateral - they take someone else's place in the super node ladder.

Thoughts?
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February 22, 2017, 05:21:38 PM
 #3943

Hey all, I've been quiet in this thread thus far (I haven't a very technical skilset), but donated at the start of the project and have been thrilled watching all the progress and updates to the project over the past several months.  There was some talk earlier in the thread about getting added to trading exchanges, which I think is an important aspect of building a strong community, as it facilitates new interested parties getting involved in the project.

While I would love for XEL to get on Poloniex.com (widely viewed as the most prominent altcoin exchange), they are pretty random with they aren't very clear on what they look for in their coin additions, so I wouldn't count on it, at least not at launch. But it cannot hurt for us to submit coin addition requests: https://temp.poloniex.com/coinRequest

I think our best bet would be to get added on Bittrex.com. Unfortunately they are pretty stringent with requesting information from the developers of a coin before adding it, namely due to the fact that they want a point of contact if they have any issues with the chain, et cetera. Here is more information on the Bittrex.com addition requirements: https://bittrex.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/202583854-Submitting-a-Coin-to-Bittrex.

https://novaexchange.com, and https://www.cryptopia.co.nz are two other exchanges that might expose us to a wider userbase, though they are not as established as the two listed above.


Cheers to the devs doing all the great work on the project!

Pushing to get XEL on nova or cryptopia might actually be counterproductive. XEL is a big coin with big potential, and to push for listing on a bottom tier exchange shows an air of desperation and lack of legitimacy which certainly shouldn't be the attitude towards Elastic. Bittrex would be good, although it's pretty largely known that a bribe is required to get listed there. Poloniex might be the best and only good bet, although yobit is also an option.
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February 22, 2017, 05:32:30 PM
 #3944

although yobit is also an option.

Seriously you prefer yobit over nova or cryptopia?

Yobit is notorious for being a sleazy exchange.

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February 22, 2017, 05:35:59 PM
 #3945

what will be the rewards for hosting a supernode?

.


.
.



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L B X.


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February 22, 2017, 06:06:52 PM
 #3946

How much would one need to have donated to have the 300k XEL for a masternode?

Approx 1.5 btc at initial ICO last Feb. would put you at around 300k XEL if my math is correct.


That´s about 1 or 2 guys  Grin
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February 22, 2017, 06:26:57 PM
 #3947

although yobit is also an option.

Seriously you prefer yobit over nova or cryptopia?

Yobit is notorious for being a sleazy exchange.

^this.  Also, while some of the smaller exchanges have impressive volume (yobit), this is largely due to fake volume. Which while attractive to traders, isn't indicative of a large an interested userbase, which is what I believe the goal of getting XEL on an exchange is. Actual additional fundamental investors in the project.  And yes, as stated Poloniex would be optimal, but good luck with that.

As far as I know Bittrex does not take a "bribe" to add a coin. They do, however, sometimes charge a fee for legal costs if they think the coin could have regulatory issues. One of main flags for this is are coins with a focus on gambling (since Bittrex is licensed in the USA), or ICOs that were funded elsewhere, as they wish to ensure the coin isn't a security, et cetera. Anyway, not fan boying for any one exchange, Just pointing out some options the community and community leaders could pursue, and noting that some of the exchange addition requests have to be led by a community leader/dev. 

Regardless, while I think getting on an exchange eventually will help grow and strengthen our community, it is nice to see the devs focused on the actual programming work at hand.
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February 22, 2017, 06:28:28 PM
 #3948

How much would one need to have donated to have the 300k XEL for a masternode?

Approx 1.5 btc at initial ICO last Feb. would put you at around 300k XEL if my math is correct.


That´s about 1 or 2 guys  Grin

Lots of people are holding 300k+ XEL, and additional interested parties will soon be able to acquire their own. While not committing to it just yet as the details are still being fleshed out, I am definitely interested in the prospect of running a MN.
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February 22, 2017, 06:30:47 PM
 #3949

Why not make it so the network requires X number of supernodes to always be running. And have the collateral be auction based.

i.e. say X is 100 - i.e. we want 100 super nodes to run.

It will self adapt - if someone wants to run 10 super nodes at 300K collateral each so be it.

But if there are 90 who only want to put up 100K, they will be able to participate as well.

The moment someone puts bigger collateral - they take someone else's place in the super node ladder.

Thoughts?

TL;DR; Have the network self adjust the collateral for running a super node.

Still want to hear some thoughts on this. Why hard code 300K? Could it be dynamically adjusted?

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February 22, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
 #3950

although yobit is also an option.

Seriously you prefer yobit over nova or cryptopia?

Yobit is notorious for being a sleazy exchange.

^this.  Also, while some of the smaller exchanges have impressive volume (yobit), this is largely due to fake volume. Which while attractive to traders, isn't indicative of a large an interested userbase, which is what I believe the goal of getting XEL on an exchange is. Actual additional fundamental investors in the project.  And yes, as stated Poloniex would be optimal, but good luck with that.

As far as I know Bittrex does not take a "bribe" to add a coin. They do, however, sometimes charge a fee for legal costs if they think the coin could have regulatory issues. One of main flags for this is are coins with a focus on gambling (since Bittrex is licensed in the USA), or ICOs that were funded elsewhere, as they wish to ensure the coin isn't a security, et cetera. Anyway, not fan boying for any one exchange, Just pointing out some options the community and community leaders could pursue, and noting that some of the exchange addition requests have to be led by a community leader/dev. 

Regardless, while I think getting on an exchange eventually will help grow and strengthen our community, it is nice to see the devs focused on the actual programming work at hand.

Exchange listing will allow work order providers to get XEL for their jobs.
Otherwise they can only buy from ICO hodlers.
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February 22, 2017, 07:19:45 PM
 #3951

Where can I buy XEL? Any exchange?
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February 22, 2017, 07:33:11 PM
 #3952

Why not make it so the network requires X number of supernodes to always be running. And have the collateral be auction based.

i.e. say X is 100 - i.e. we want 100 super nodes to run.

It will self adapt - if someone wants to run 10 super nodes at 300K collateral each so be it.

But if there are 90 who only want to put up 100K, they will be able to participate as well.

The moment someone puts bigger collateral - they take someone else's place in the super node ladder.

Thoughts?

TL;DR; Have the network self adjust the collateral for running a super node.

Still want to hear some thoughts on this. Why hard code 300K? Could it be dynamically adjusted?



I really like this idea. And if we focus on the right data when main-net goes live, this should be theoretically easy to optimize.. i cannot comment on how feasible / complex it would be to implement.  

PRO
- Assuming Supernode job validators become a bottleneck in future - reactive SN scaling as needed
- Incentives for Supernode operator hopefuls to build community and project --- Promote network --> Resource / compute demand increase --> Dynamic SN adjusts as job validator requirements increase --> lower XEL entry point to become SN operator

CON
- Hardfork
- Need data still
- Need to handle possiblity of all nodes becoming supernodes at some point - Or establish ceilings for # of SN's (e.g. If All nodes = SN's - Validator NOT self) Half baked example but I see potential issues with nodes validating their own compute work.



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February 22, 2017, 07:39:42 PM
 #3953

Where can I buy XEL? Any exchange?

Cannot buy XEL at exchange yet. Mainnet is not live. Updates should continue to come out over the next couple weeks on exchange discussions.


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February 22, 2017, 08:24:25 PM
 #3954

Why not make it so the network requires X number of supernodes to always be running. And have the collateral be auction based.

i.e. say X is 100 - i.e. we want 100 super nodes to run.

It will self adapt - if someone wants to run 10 super nodes at 300K collateral each so be it.

But if there are 90 who only want to put up 100K, they will be able to participate as well.

The moment someone puts bigger collateral - they take someone else's place in the super node ladder.

Thoughts?

TL;DR; Have the network self adjust the collateral for running a super node.

Still want to hear some thoughts on this. Why hard code 300K? Could it be dynamically adjusted?



I think for now, we are fine with the way it is set up.

Maybe in the future, we could think about implementing a Lisk-style voting system for supernodes? This would effectively dynamically adjust the amount of XEL needed and would help acting against malicious supernodes.

I wouldn't implement it right now, though. Just a thought.
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February 22, 2017, 09:07:05 PM
Last edit: February 22, 2017, 09:19:16 PM by clivemy
 #3955

@EK

Do you have access to the website EK?  I'm just wondering about updating it and using the official email address as contact@elastic-project.com.

When the website is updated, we can send out the Press Releases, but we need to do it from an 'official' email address (contact@elastic-project.com), with someone monitoring it so we can ensure any enquires are dealt with promptly.

Selsonblue has offered to work with me on this.
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February 22, 2017, 09:42:27 PM
 #3956

I've became a father today! Little Michael came to our (crypto driven) world. I don't know why but I felt I need to share this with you all guys! Happy XEL and new life!

I know this is big offtop but I thought it's big news for all of us that new crypto-sick child is aware of the world Smiley.

News from my own perspective:

I'm working on XEL PR website. I hope I'll deliver it soon. It will be not CMS but all source will be on github/bitbucket. So anyone who want to update content will have free will (pull requests). Full open source.

Just short update from me.

I'm 24h on foot without sleep. I'm going to bed. Good night for all XEL freaks.


BTC: 1CMgHWx4wkAaAy2FfeCyPdedUExmhGhfi5
XEL: XEL-HCM8-KB6E-YFLK-8BWMF
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February 22, 2017, 09:56:08 PM
 #3957

I've became a father today! Little Michael came to our (crypto driven) world. I don't know why but I felt I need to share this with you all guys! Happy XEL and new life!

I know this is big offtop but I thought it's big news for all of us that new crypto-sick child is aware of the world Smiley.

News from my own perspective:

I'm working on XEL PR website. I hope I'll deliver it soon. It will be not CMS but all source will be on github/bitbucket. So anyone who want to update content will have free will (pull requests). Full open source.

Just short update from me.

I'm 24h on foot without sleep. I'm going to bed. Good night for all XEL freaks.



Congrats!
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February 22, 2017, 10:08:29 PM
 #3958

I've became a father today! Little Michael came to our (crypto driven) world. I don't know why but I felt I need to share this with you all guys! Happy XEL and new life!

I know this is big offtop but I thought it's big news for all of us that new crypto-sick child is aware of the world Smiley.

News from my own perspective:

I'm working on XEL PR website. I hope I'll deliver it soon. It will be not CMS but all source will be on github/bitbucket. So anyone who want to update content will have free will (pull requests). Full open source.

Just short update from me.

I'm 24h on foot without sleep. I'm going to bed. Good night for all XEL freaks.



Awesome! Congratulations!

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clivemy
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February 22, 2017, 10:13:31 PM
 #3959

I've became a father today! Little Michael came to our (crypto driven) world. I don't know why but I felt I need to share this with you all guys! Happy XEL and new life!

I know this is big offtop but I thought it's big news for all of us that new crypto-sick child is aware of the world Smiley.

News from my own perspective:

I'm working on XEL PR website. I hope I'll deliver it soon. It will be not CMS but all source will be on github/bitbucket. So anyone who want to update content will have free will (pull requests). Full open source.

Just short update from me.

I'm 24h on foot without sleep. I'm going to bed. Good night for all XEL freaks.



Congratulations unvoid!  I hope mother and little Michael are both doing well.  :-)

And thank you for the news about the website.  Now we just need to sort out the official email address.
HomoHenning
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February 22, 2017, 10:27:01 PM
 #3960

How much would one need to have donated to have the 300k XEL for a masternode?

Approx 1.5 btc at initial ICO last Feb. would put you at around 300k XEL if my math is correct.


That´s about 1 or 2 guys  Grin
and? it should be around 30 btc when we hit exchange. i think this is a lot
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