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Question: When will you start to sell half of your coins?
I do it daily
at $30
at $100
at $1000
at $10,000
Below 200day SMA
Not in latest 10 years

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Author Topic: When are you going to cash out?  (Read 10761 times)
bitcoinBull
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February 08, 2013, 07:33:25 PM
 #81

They have paid thousands BTC for dividend: http://mpex.co/?mpsic=S.DICE

Maybe it's just a pump-and-dump trick. Not only the players are fake, they also pretend to be investors. They may just buy 90% of their IPO so the actual dividend they paid is minimal. By pumping the profits, they can sell their shares with very high premium. When they have sold most of their shares, those fake players will disappear.

Thanks for the link.


First off, to my knowledge so far they haven't sent any profits to any shareholders.
I'm afraid to have to inform you that says more about your failure to do even the most basic fact checking than it does about what is going on with S.DICE

I see now that the most recent dividend payment was on Feb 1st and 2nd. I see that the IPO back in August 2012 was 10M out of 100M shares, but I'm not seeing a list of share issues / tranches since then. Is there a list of quantities issued since?

I see your point about fact checking. I wish I could put in enough time to read thread-upon-thread to locate quality info about SatoshiDice more recent than August 2012. In the past, I did have time to browse threads collecting info on the big scams going around (pirateat40) and warn others to the best of my ability. But nobody pays me to do Due Diligence on likely scams, so I appreciate direct links to quality info. Its reassuring both to myself and others who are rightly skeptical.


And secondly, if they do start paying dividends, they could just be paying them from the principal/IPO cost of the shares.
Again, one of the beauties of this business model with Bitcoin is that it is largely transparent.  The statistical analysis that is done on a daily basis by someone independent of evoorhees (and can be checked by anyone with the the requisite understandably of how it works) gives us figures that tell us what the monthly profit is.  From that it can be calculated approximately what the dividend will be.  So if the dividend is paid and it is what is expected I'm failing to see the potential you're claiming for skulduggery.

Like I already said, of course anyone can check the math on the volume of coins which pass through the satoshidice addresses. But it would be quite a bit harder to verify those coins are genuine players and not house funds being spun through.

On the 'insider playing' point, technically you may have a point in that somebody with an interest in inflating the value of the business could be playing the game all the time and getting the losses back as part of their dividend.  However this is more likely to have been the case before any shares were made public.  The higher the proportion of existing stock is owned publicly, the higher the proportion of the profits made from 'insider playing' that doesn't go back to the player.  I'm not saying it's not possible but it is getting less likely.

If they're playing with house funds, any losses go back directly to the house, not through dividends. But you are right that fraud is less likely the longer that dividends are being paid (unless new capital is being raised, which makes fraud more likely).



Also, if the purpose of this whole underhand exercise was to maximise the demand for and the price of the stock why on earth would the Monday tranche of stocks have been put on the market without announcement at ~60% of what they were trading for at the time?

The purpose is maximum gain for the issuer, at whatever price they can sell shares. The price of the stock is only important to the buyers hopeful to resell for gains later.

Question: is that ~60% price less than stated here: "All future share issuance will be made only a) subject to approval by MPEx and b) at a price no less than the higher of the 1 day average price and the 30 day average price then current on MPEx." 2.2. The Terms of the IPO. section a


Please by all means keep up with the scepticism. I guess we're all vulnerable to some degree of getting carried away with excitement, confidence and trust to our own detriment so it is healthy for us all that some here are airing their doubts.  However you'd come over as more credible and be of better service to the rest of us if you'd do some fact checking and research first.

Edit:  Apologies all for being off-topic but bitcoinBull has been raising this point on a number of threads and I thought should be put right on the most blatantly incorrect aspects (so the casual reader is not misinformed).  Maybe bitcoinBull and EskimoBob should start their own thread to put forward the theory that SD is a scam.  Their intentions may be good but bringing the same points up repetitively in different threads I'm afraid makes it come across (to me at least) as conspiracy-theory FUD.

I'm also sorry to hijack the thread. I didn't start my own thread for exactly what you mention, that I would prefer to have quality research and fact checking. But that's a huge time sink when most of the info is scattered among various forum threads (another red flag in itself). As for FUD, I don't consider myself a conspiracy-minded individual. You don't see me all over the BFL threads accusing them of fraud (enough BFL doubters already). I called out pirate (and as many of his associates as I had time for) not because of "sour grapes" nor because I get kicks from conspiracy-trolling. I called them out because I was rightly skeptical.

You are right that some SD skeptic (just myself and EskimoBob, anyone else?) should start a consolidated thread. That somebody hasn't already goes to show the gullibility (or willing-to-believe) of many "investors" in bitcoin "Securities".

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February 08, 2013, 07:40:12 PM
 #82

The assumption of "cashing out" is that you would be done with bitcoin.
                                             =    
Really what happens is  "recieving reward for distribution"!

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February 09, 2013, 11:09:28 AM
 #83

When trading:

I only buy panic
I usually sell euphoria

That's it. But I don't trade bitcoins. I'm not in BTC to "cash out". I'm in it because I believe in it. Because it's a clever and sound currency. I don't want to exchange my BTC for fiat, I want to exchange my BTC for goods and services.

But seriously: what can we buy with BTC, apart from drugs on SR? I'm not a blogger, I don't need web hosting at the moment. This is something we need to address ASAP.

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February 09, 2013, 11:28:20 AM
 #84

But seriously: what can we buy with BTC, apart from drugs on SR? I'm not a blogger, I don't need web hosting at the moment. This is something we need to address ASAP.

You actually can buy almost anything these days. What are you looking to buy?

Electronics: http://www.bitcoinstore.com (500 000 products and good prices)

Precious metals: http://www.coinabul.com/

Mobile phone credit: http://www.bitcoinwireless.com/

Coffee: http://bitcoincoffee.com/ & http://bitbrew.net/

Chocolate: http://bitchocolate.com/

Jewelry: http://allthingsluxury.biz/ (I've used this store myself so I can recommend it personally)

These are just a few examples, I'm not going to list everything. With the exception of physical grocery stores, there is actually not that much that you can't buy with bitcoins already.


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February 09, 2013, 11:50:03 AM
 #85

But seriously: what can we buy with BTC, apart from drugs on SR? I'm not a blogger, I don't need web hosting at the moment. This is something we need to address ASAP.

You actually can buy almost anything these days. What are you looking to buy?

Electronics: http://www.bitcoinstore.com (500 000 products and good prices)

Precious metals: http://www.coinabul.com/

Mobile phone credit: http://www.bitcoinwireless.com/

Coffee: http://bitcoincoffee.com/ & http://bitbrew.net/

Chocolate: http://bitchocolate.com/

Jewelry: http://allthingsluxury.biz/ (I've used this store myself so I can recommend it personally)

These are just a few examples, I'm not going to list everything. With the exception of physical grocery stores, there is actually not that much that you can't buy with bitcoins already.



Yes, but I can buy these things locally with fiat or credit card, at a lower price

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February 09, 2013, 12:24:47 PM
 #86

Yes, but I can buy these things locally with fiat or credit card, at a lower price

In that case you can simply exchange your bitcoins to fiat, which is getting easier every day. Or use a Bitcurex Electron card which works quite well afaik. In the future one can probably use a BitInstant debit card as well.

Many of the products in Bitcoin Store can't be bought cheaper anywhere. I don't buy the "stuff bought with bitcoins are expensive" argument at all, not anymore at least.

Although I'm from Finland which is not one of the cheapest countries in the world, on the contrary. That perspective might affect my views.

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February 09, 2013, 02:50:55 PM
 #87

BTC will be used as a saving target. Suppose each IT generation people knows about BTC and put some of their savings in BTC, they are at least 100 million, even average saving is only $1000, that is $4762 per BTC. Since most of the coins are hoarded, the actual price will be much higher, so it is not very difficult to reach a market price of $50000 per coin, if more people join, that price will be even higher

Of course this is a long term projection and there are many potential risks in BTC itself, currently the biggest uncertainty comes from the block chain's transaction limit

waspoza
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February 09, 2013, 03:50:20 PM
 #88

Hoarding = spending. Just delayed in time.
sublime5447
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February 09, 2013, 05:40:55 PM
 #89

You dont create wealth by holding bitcoins you create wealth when you sell btc and buy something real.

You are describing consumption, which is actually the opposite of wealth creation.

In truth, you create wealth when you acquire bitcoin.  And if you hold them, you are abstaining from consuming that wealth, which makes all of us wealthier.  So, go on and "hoard" guys!

Looks like you only know one way to spend money. When I spend money most of the time I am not consuming, I am investing, Holding bitcoins does not create wealth it doesn't create a thing when you acquire btc. . When I invest in my business that creates wealth. When you hold bitcoins you create nothing! Really a poor post here I am guessing this is sarcasm.

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February 09, 2013, 05:53:33 PM
 #90

sell them all every chance I get

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February 09, 2013, 07:37:35 PM
 #91

I'm not going to "Cash out". There will just come a time where it makes as much sense to spend them as acquire them.

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ajk
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February 09, 2013, 07:39:14 PM
 #92

Im definitely more of a hoarder than seller, more times than not I would rather have BTC since its been proving to be better than actually having money,

i think like most I follow suit where I just buy things either directly with bitcoin or sell when I want to buy something with paper cash, cant see how people view bitcoin negatively especially in the past year

my only guess is that they are sad they didnt get in sooner!
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February 09, 2013, 09:38:34 PM
 #93

If you are in a position where bitcoins are too valuable for you to spend you are making or have made some bad mistake.

Decide what % you want in bitcoins, wait, sell bitcoins to get back to that %.

If you get stupidly rich you aren't going to keep living like you were forever.

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February 09, 2013, 09:47:39 PM
 #94

If you are in a position where bitcoins are too valuable for you to spend you are making or have made some bad mistake.

Decide what % you want in bitcoins, wait, sell bitcoins to get back to that %.

If you get stupidly rich you aren't going to keep living like you were forever.



Your statement is to definite for my liking, your saying No one has gotten stupidly rich and has lived like that for an extended period of time because of 1 monumental good decision that set them for life? the hardest is to get to the top i dont think staying there is the difficult part as long as your a level headed human being and make conscious well thought out decisions, others might say the opposite but this is just my view,

maybe your trading style is half here half there, but some not saying myself, like to trade and have everything on the line because they are confident in their decision making and they stand to make the most potential gain, not saying smart at all since having everything on the line is retarded if it doesnt work out but there are those who have had it all on the line, things work their way, and are SUPER RICH because of it

Edit:
i think i misunderstood the last part I thought you meant if you get rich to quickly you wont stay like that forever but your saying when you get rich you wont live like you did before which I can agree with,

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February 09, 2013, 10:11:56 PM
 #95

If you are in a position where bitcoins are too valuable for you to spend you are making or have made some bad mistake.

Decide what % you want in bitcoins, wait, sell bitcoins to get back to that %.

If you get stupidly rich you aren't going to keep living like you were forever.


if people followed this advice last month they would have missed out on huge gains
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February 10, 2013, 09:24:15 AM
 #96

I'm selling when I see a relatively large price drop hopefully just before the crash.

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February 10, 2013, 06:59:21 PM
 #97

I'm selling when I see a relatively large price drop hopefully just before the crash.

You and everyone else Wink

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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February 10, 2013, 08:17:23 PM
 #98

I'm selling when I see a relatively large price drop hopefully just before the crash.

You and everyone else Wink

I'm no expert here, but shouldn't one be buying on the large price drops and selling on the increases?

That's what I do, but the herd will stampede.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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February 10, 2013, 10:58:18 PM
 #99

Into fiat? Never, aside from day-to-day for things I can't get with btc.
That said, if/when a .gov tries to destroy it I'll probably be holding something else for a while, whether it be paper, metal, or otherwise.
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February 10, 2013, 11:08:54 PM
 #100

Looks like somebody has been cashing out (see the last two steep spikes):


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