Why tax money/BTC?

[intec]

"Money was created to be a payment way for "value" , it should be universal as bitcoin is and without barriers. It shouldn't be taxed by the gov's cause it makes them act like a "global company" and subject to differences, meaning advantage/disadvantage on each country.

Bitcoin was not created by humanity cause a single/group of individuals had to do it, but it is made for humanity. Gov's should not have the right to tell something should be taxable if humanity accepts it as a whole, the same applies for other coins, if they are doing it they are going against human rights, they are also saying it is "money" cause there isnt such thing of "virtual money" if it has the same applications.

Bitcoin users and supporters should go against whoever is against the human rights."

[1715184242]

1715184242

[1715184242]

1715184242

[intec]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-10-22/bitcoin-virtual-currency-exchange-is-tax-free-eu-court-says-ig21wzcd


"Bitcoin got a boost at the European Union’s top court after judges said exchanging virtual currencies should be exempt from value-added tax in the same way as traditional cash."

Do it right Japan.

[Amph]

they want to taxe it since they are not contorlling it, so this si a way for them to have at least a portion of the revenue, you can not compare it to fiat, were they earn interest from fractional reserve and opther legal scam behavior

but i do agree that bitcoin should be exempt from taxes, kudos to europe which apparently did understand this, and i'm lucky that i live in the euro zone and not in the usa...

[European Central Bank]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

[27QVUTZj8rgZP1]

I do not agree that it should be "free of taxes", in my opinion it should be taxed. Being taxed is just a sign government is respecting it.

And I hope you know why you are paying taxes. No one is in no way obligated to live under government's surveillance, you can go, fight for terrain, make it your country, and do not collect taxes.

If the tax is not abusive, I don't see a problem. I pay taxes if I want to exchange my local fiat to USD, EUR, GBP... Then if Bitcoin is a currency it should be treated as such.

TAX IT!

[intec]

I do not agree that it should be "free of taxes", in my opinion it should be taxed. Being taxed is just a sign government is respecting it.

So you are acknowledging who doesn't tax it doesn't respect it? Bitcoin can be seen as a threat to economy in the future, that might be the main justification to tax it, even though a hidden one.

If the tax is not abusive, I don't see a problem. I pay taxes if I want to exchange my local fiat to USD, EUR, GBP... Then if Bitcoin is a currency it should be treated as such.

TAX IT!

Doesn't make any sense, you already pay the local exchange tax to exchange it to fiat. If Bitcoin is being treated as money a value-added tax cannot apply in the same way as fiat. You could tax the purchase of goods/services, however Bitcoin has it's on network and will not happen for good.

[Bitware]

No one likes taxes, but you pay them or run the risk of getting everything legally taken from you at the point of a gun, plus you get to go to prison.

Anyone who evades taxes is a total idiot in my opinion.

Pay unto Caesar what is Caesar's.

[intec]

No one likes taxes, but you pay them or run the risk of getting everything legally taken from you at the point of a gun, plus you get to go to prison.

Anyone who evades taxes is a total idiot in my opinion.

Pay unto Caesar what is Caesar's.

What is legal or not is defined by the gov's / people.

We are talking about bitcoin scenario not fiat money. When you are working you are subject to be taxed on your salary, not the work itself. Bitcoin has miners ( work ) and you are already taxed for that in the miners you buy for mining. Taxing Bitcoin doesn't make sense to me for the previous reason, also if they state it as "virtual money" they cannot tax it as Bitcoin acts like it's own bank, connecting people all around the world, making it a humanity piece.

Bitcoin is also MIT licensed as you may know... https://opensource.org/licenses/MIT making whoever is taxing it going against "x" international laws.

Bitcoin being taxable would imply being a product of a gov, which is not. Everything Satoshi fights against.

[European Central Bank]

Are you talking about all taxes or value added tax on the coins themselves? I know that was proposed in a few places and shot down as plain stupid but I think Australia was stupid enough. Sounds like they're thinking of changing it now.

[PsursV]

we pay taxes round about every thing. i thing government run of taxes, and if some thing is legal it must pay taxes. but it is also important to explain that what kind of taxes are to be applied. value added taxes income taxes and other ones.

[Hazir]

Are you talking about all taxes or value added tax on the coins themselves? I know that was proposed in a few places and shot down as plain stupid but I think Australia was stupid enough. Sounds like they're thinking of changing it now.

It is so easy to introduce new kind of Tax, the temptation of more money in government's pocket is overwhelming. That is why those bastards are constantly trying to invent new Taxes.
In my country there is even Rain Tax where you pay money if there is raining. So I am not surprised that BTC will be either declared illegal or heavily taxed in the future.

[intec]

...
In my country there is even Rain Tax where you pay money if there is raining. So I am not surprised that BTC will be either declared illegal or heavily taxed in the future.

This is a joke right? If not, where do you live?

[killerjoegreece]

...
In my country there is even Rain Tax where you pay money if there is raining. So I am not surprised that BTC will be either declared illegal or heavily taxed in the future.

This is a joke right? If not, where do you live?

lol that rain thing made me laugh so hard

[RodeoX]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

Totally agree. At least here in the US, there is no such thing as free money. If you trade your coins at a profit then you owe capitol gains tax. Good luck arguing in court that bitcoin is magical money that is somehow the only exception in the tax code.

[iv4n]

...
In my country there is even Rain Tax where you pay money if there is raining. So I am not surprised that BTC will be either declared illegal or heavily taxed in the future.

This is a joke right? If not, where do you live?

lol that rain thing made me laugh so hard

This rain thing first surprised me, then confused me. I would like to know in which country is this happening.
Well i hope this is just a joke. For me its unbelievable, where this world going?

[intec]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

Totally agree. At least here in the US, there is no such thing as free money. If you trade your coins at a profit then you owe capitol gains tax. Good luck arguing in court that bitcoin is magical money that is somehow the only exception in the tax code.

Well let's tax everything...rain with the excuse of being for natural disasters expenses, and water for drinking it. Bitcoin for being open source , a threat to fiat money and being unique.

Now seriously, are you implying you are a product of your government? Cause if Bitcoin won't be any different, I'm done with this closed minded people who can't accept Bitcoin will/might/already is the future of money. Taking only in consideration the same BULLSHIT behavior seeing profit everywhere.






Do you think aliens accept FIAT money (1)? CMON!!

BITCOIN UNITING THE UNIVERSE.


(1) Fiat money is a currency established as money by government regulation or law.

[RodeoX]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

Totally agree. At least here in the US, there is no such thing as free money. If you trade your coins at a profit then you owe capitol gains tax. Good luck arguing in court that bitcoin is magical money that is somehow the only exception in the tax code.

Well let's tax everything...rain with the excuse of being for natural disasters expenses, and water for drinking it. Bitcoin for being open source , a threat to fiat money and being unique.

Now seriously, are you implying you are a product of your government? Cause if Bitcoin won't be any different, I'm done with this closed minded people who can't accept Bitcoin will/might/already is the future of money. Taking only in consideration the same BULLSHIT behavior seeing profit everywhere.


https://i.imgur.com/jsOdRSc.jpg



Do you think aliens accept FIAT money? CMON!!

BITCOIN UNITING THE UNIVERSE.

I don't think anyone is saying we like it, just that it is the law. I'm appalled at how much of my tax money goes to nonsense or is wasted. That is a different subject. However the concept of taxation is that the money you made was possible by the conditions and infrastructure of society; and that taxation is societies way of getting paid for facilitating these economic conditions.

[intec]

You cannot tax the intellectual property of someone.

http://www.un.org/en/universal-declaration-human-rights/


"Article 17
1. Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with
others."

If so you are being a product of your gov and still going against UN.


"Article 17
2. No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property. "

[RodeoX]

You cannot tax the intellectual property of someone.

http://www.un.org/en/universal-declaration-human-rights/


"Article 17
1. Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with
others."

If so you are being a product of your gov and still going against UN.


"Article 17
2. No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property. "

I'm not a tax attorney or anything. But I think your right that intellect property is not taxable. However the money you make from it (or anything) is. You are being taxed on the gain in capitol value. So if I made a $1 profit because my bitcoins went up in value when I traded them, I owe about $0.10. That is 10% of the profit I made.
The good news is that I don't pay until I sell/buy with my coins because until then I have not profited. And capitol gains are a relatively low tax. Compare it to income tax which I pay 30+%. Even better I can claim a loss on my taxes if the price is lower than I paid.

[intec]

You cannot tax the intellectual property of someone.

http://www.un.org/en/universal-declaration-human-rights/


"Article 17
1. Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with
others."

If so you are being a product of your gov and still going against UN.


"Article 17
2. No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property. "

I'm not a tax attorney or anything. But I think your right that intellect property is not taxable. However the money you make from it (or anything) is. You are being taxed on the gain in capitol value. So if I made a $1 profit because my bitcoins went up in value when I traded them, I owe about $0.10. That is 10% of the profit I made.
The good news is that I don't pay until I sell/buy with my coins because until then I have not profited. And capitol gains are a relatively low tax. Compare it to income tax which I pay 30+%. Even better I can claim a loss on my taxes if the price is lower than I paid.

Let the gov's decide the wrong way, Bitcoin will win this war for the good of humanity. Is fiat money considered a gov product?

Can anyone clarify the situation of customs duties of products/services purchased with Bitcoin?

[RodeoX]

Let the gov's decide the wrong way, Bitcoin will win this war for the good of humanity. Is fiat money considered a gov product?

Can anyone clarify the situation of customs duties of products/services purchased with Bitcoin?

I think in most countries fiat is produced by the government. In the U.S. it is produced by the Federal Reserve, which is not officially part of the government. It is considered an independent central bank. At least on paper it looks like more of a banking cabal. 

As far as customs and duties... That could get complicated as it involves so many laws and governments. I think the main triggering event would be moving $10K or more across a border. When entering the U.S. you must declare anything valued at $10k or greater.

[intec]

Let the gov's decide the wrong way, Bitcoin will win this war for the good of humanity. Is fiat money considered a gov product?

Can anyone clarify the situation of customs duties of products/services purchased with Bitcoin?

I think in most countries fiat is produced by the government. In the U.S. it is produced by the Federal Reserve, which is not officially part of the government. It is considered an independent central bank. At least on paper it looks like more of a banking cabal. 

As far as customs and duties... That could get complicated as it involves so many laws and governments. I think the main triggering event would be moving $10K or more across a border. When entering the U.S. you must declare anything valued at $10k or greater.

I meant if you are purchasing something with Bitcoin over the internet, but helpful info anyways.

[RodeoX]

Let the gov's decide the wrong way, Bitcoin will win this war for the good of humanity. Is fiat money considered a gov product?

Can anyone clarify the situation of customs duties of products/services purchased with Bitcoin?

I think in most countries fiat is produced by the government. In the U.S. it is produced by the Federal Reserve, which is not officially part of the government. It is considered an independent central bank. At least on paper it looks like more of a banking cabal. 

As far as customs and duties... That could get complicated as it involves so many laws and governments. I think the main triggering event would be moving $10K or more across a border. When entering the U.S. you must declare anything valued at $10k or greater.

I meant if you are purchasing something with Bitcoin over the internet, but helpful info anyways.

Ah, I misunderstood. I think most people just don't pay the taxes they are "supposed to pay" on the internet. It has been a long standing thing and there is little any government can do to enforce it. I mean technically if you find a gold ring on the sidewalk you are required to pay tax on it. But who does that? Like garage sales and other examples it would cost more to enforce than it brings in.

[the_new_emperor]

Like garage sales and other examples it would cost more to enforce than it brings in.

 

This never stopped tax authorities to try and collect what they think is due  However I think that if tax authorities are not entitled to follow every single internet transaction they won't have any effective tool to introduce and collect fees on internet transactions in general. But this is highly unlikely.

I think that BTCs themselves should not be taxed - they are only a tool. But if you make a profit of them, may be a small tax on the profit is not that bad. In my some countries this would be a flat 10% tax - not that bad. 

[intec]

Like garage sales and other examples it would cost more to enforce than it brings in.

 

This never stopped tax authorities to try and collect what they think is due  However I think that if tax authorities are not entitled to follow every single internet transaction they won't have any effective tool to introduce and collect fees on internet transactions in general. But this is highly unlikely.

I think that BTCs themselves should not be taxed - they are only a tool. But if you make a profit of them, may be a small tax on the profit is not that bad. In my some countries this would be a flat 10% tax - not that bad. 

I hope we all are born on earth, facts = there are law's ( what happened before laws? - conquering. )
Bitcoin early adopters know it's not about the price nor either the quantity rather conquering the economical world.

How can this be achieved? Not funding gov's. We indeed need to help people and go even further then moon, the world needs us all however central authorities even if by democracy have proven to be what they are - central authorities. The vote you cast every 4 years or so is kind of useless when it comes to this no matter decisions taken.

[darkangel11]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

I find VAT to be much more just and much less ridiculous than income tax. The best type of tax is always head tax because it's the most just. Everyone is treated equally and has to pay a certain amount of money towards services. It stopped being applied in most countries because of difficulties in execution, but it can always be introduced in the form of property tax. Vat is fine because you're paying it while buying goods and services. It can't be too high because otherwise the prices of goods would skyrocket and nobody would buy them. As a result nobody would make money. Income tax is the most unjust as it punishes hard work and promotes laziness.

[intec]

Depends on what type of tax you're talking about. Stuff like value added tax is ridiculous and shouldn't apply. If you make a massive capital gain on them and sell then I don't see why it should be exempt.

I find VAT to be much more just and much less ridiculous than income tax. The best type of tax is always head tax because it's the most just. Everyone is treated equally and has to pay a certain amount of money towards services. It stopped being applied in most countries because of difficulties in execution, but it can always be introduced in the form of property tax. Vat is fine because you're paying it while buying goods and services. It can't be too high because otherwise the prices of goods would skyrocket and nobody would buy them. As a result nobody would make money. Income tax is the most unjust as it punishes hard work and promotes laziness.

Indeed, VAT is much more acceptable than tax income which can go up to 35 % on some countries, pretty much ridiculous... isn't that slavery?

[RodeoX]

If it were tax free in the U.S. it would be unique. Most Americans don't do it, but technically even the proceeds from your garage sale require paying tax. Or even finding a gold ring on the ground.

[Mhd-Bobbi]

but i do agree that bitcoin should be exempt from taxes, kudos to europe which apparently did understand this, and i'm lucky that i live in the euro zone and not in the usa...

I think if bitcoin runs online, or on the internet, it might not be taxed, because bitcoin is everywhere, how they get taxes, while they don't know who the owner is, what they know is the wallet address, I think it's right to be free tax.