Viability of a (Long Term) Mining Career?

[Psipherious]

While I'm not entirely new to the world of Cryptocurrency, I am fairly new to mining.

I only started a little over a couple of months ago with a single card, but really enjoyed it and quickly expanded to 5 cards running in a couple of hacked together configurations and just recently have built a dedicated rig to house the 5 cards and looking to add 1 additional (all 280X) for a total of 6.

I am very aware that right now we're in a phase/period of time where mining certain crypto (Ethereum) is quite a bit more profitable than usual.

I see people constantly warning, “don't buy more equipment” or build more rigs now, etc, etc because so and so and this and that got burned during Litecoin days or early BitCoin mining which turned to ASIC, etc.

But as I keep reading deeper and deeper into this world of cryptomining and it seems that there may have almost always been at least something profitable to mine if one were to monitor the market and hand pick their coins.

I also understand that "profitable" can most certainly depend on how much you pay for electricity as well as your equipment.

I'm in Canada and currently paying approx 0.14 USD per kwh and am more than doubling what I pay for in electricity each month (on Ethereum) so far.

I purchased all of my 280X's used off Kijiji and other buy/sell forums. I've earned back more than 1/3rd of what I've put in so far and before the end of June I’ll be well over 50% ROI.

I would like to hear from others that may have been doing this since the beginning or as early as possible (i.e. the last few years), whether it be mining BitCoin, LiteCoin, FeatherCoin, VertCoin, etc, etc. whatever it may be…

I am very much enjoying this business and even if I am unable to double my electricity costs, as long as I can make some kind of profit (like 50% over elec costs) I would like to continue to expand and perhaps build this into a career/long term income.

I am by no means looking to get rich/make millions, etc. But rather make something in the range of an average American income around 35 - 65k range (yes a large range but I’d be fairly content anywhere in there).

So my real question is, are there regular people that have been doing this for a few years, generally GPU mining (but I’m open to other forms/ASIC mining) and have turned it into a full time income for themselves?

Is it a viable long term business that can actually work if built from a business perspective (like not mining from our basement on residential power)?

I have already found a few ways to get some cheaper electricity, the lowest I’ve found that is accessible to me is around 0.8 usd/kwh and I am aware of even lower options but they would require either a significantly large investment or me moving to another province.

I’m considering both options such as taking out a small business loan to build some rigs, or working a side job to raise some income and build 1 rig at a time + convert all existing rig profits into further expanding the business/building more rigs.

Aside from shopping for used video cards (which as mentioned is how I got all my current ones) I’m not too sure of any way to get good deals on cards. If I was to buy 10 or 20 cards at once even, I know of now ways to get any significant bulk discounts as bulk discounts seems to only happen for hundreds or thousands of cards.

So in terms of sourcing cards/parts at good deals outside of retail and used channels, that’s probably my biggest hinderance right now in terms of expanding more quickly.

But again, I’m looking to hear from people who have been doing this for a while. I am trying to do historical research on difficulty and profitability but it’s a bit challenging. However it does *seem* like there has almost always been a profitable coin.

As said, this is something I’m really starting to enjoy and it’s almost becoming a passion for me. I regret not getting involved many years ago.

Any advice, tips, encouragement, etc or major negatives I might not be considering to people who are already doing this (living off crypto incomes) ??

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[adaseb]

What province are you located in? Because 0.14USD kwh is way too much, its almost 0.18kwh CAD.

If you really pay that much for electricity then mining in the long term will be very difficult. You can only make some decent money right now since ETH is very profitable but pretty soon half your profits will be going to pay for power alone, then you will start breaking even, and then you will be mining at a loss.

Usually these types of profits that we are getting these days are short lived. Reason being is that everybody wants "free money".

Miners don't make this much daily everyday for the last 3-4 years. There are ups and downs. Mostly its downs, where the only miners mining are the ones with free electricity.

[fanatic26]

Here are some reasons that might make you want to reconsider trying to make it your main source of income.

1. Your power cost is way too high to make it a viable in the long term as a business where you currently live. You have to buy large amounts of power in most cases to get it cheap enough to make sense for what you are doing.

2. ETH is much more profitable than any other GPU mined coin at present. This presents a problem in that the difficulty is skyrocketing because everyone is flocking to the coin. This means every difficulty change will   reduce your profits.

3. ETH is not a coin to invest in mining long term, the devs have already announced it will go Proof of Stake which basically takes gpu mining out of the equation. There are other profitable GPU coins but none that can rival ETH so you will have to balance on a razor thin profit margin.

4. If you did want to turn it into a business there are a ton of other costs to factor in. When you buy power in bulk it comes in on these high power lines and have you have to buy big expensive transformers to step
    it down to a usable range.  You will need a large warehouse sized location. You will need massive amounts of cooling. You will have to pay for an expensive reliable internet service. GPU mining rigs tend to be very picky and you cant have any internet hiccups or you will have way too much downtime.

5. With profit margins being so thin you will need a very large farm to cover bills and pay yourself a decent wage.

6. Since you did not already have the equipment when ETH went to the moon you have already missed out on the most profitable stage of its life cycle.

7. Since you are only interested in a small salary to live on I am going to guess you do not have a lot of money to start this venture. Id say you would want at least $1 million to start a company that mines full time.

[xingqiaoyin]

Mining farms in chinese locations are running at 0.6 or less electricity and they're HUGEEEEE....

If you cant find lower or equal utility price,you simply can't compete with these guys period

[QuintLeo]

Major farms in the US are mostly in Washington, paying ballpark 3c/KWH at most.
I suspect most of the major Chinese farms (all of the ones that have talked publically so far at least) if not all are also in major hydropower areas with VERY VERY cheap electric.

[Liquid71]

Not viable at all, hobby part time but as a sole source of income forget about it

[Amph]

only one thing matter: electricity cost

if you have 0.05 cent or lower, in kuwait they have 0.01, then every altcoin is profitable

you can even point at monero right now and have your $1k a month with 100gpu, yes it looks underwhelming, but it's profitable

and monero is one of the worst for gpu mining

[Psipherious]

What province are you located in? Because 0.14USD kwh is way too much, its almost 0.18kwh CAD.

If you really pay that much for electricity then mining in the long term will be very difficult. You can only make some decent money right now since ETH is very profitable but pretty soon half your profits will be going to pay for power alone, then you will start breaking even, and then you will be mining at a loss.

Usually these types of profits that we are getting these days are short lived. Reason being is that everybody wants "free money".

Miners don't make this much daily everyday for the last 3-4 years. There are ups and downs. Mostly its downs, where the only miners mining are the ones with free electricity.

Ontario. It's in the range of 13 - 14 cents usd kwh. This is the standard residential power, and also for small businesses, not sure if big commercial outfits get some of discounts.

I know it's stupidly high and mining would not likely be viable long term on that. I'm on that right now because I'm in very early stages building up hardware. Once/if profits of mining drop too low to make that worthwhile to continue using I will of course need to move my equipment.

Anyway, as mentioned, I have access to a place I can get it around 0.8 usd. The only way I know of to get it for less (in Canada) would be to either move (myself with equipment) or setup my own "facility" in another province where I could get it around 0.4 usd.

Low power costs are certainly "do-able". There does seem to be a number of options available in North America for fairly low power costs.

That 0.3 that was mentioned in Washington, I guess that's for "Industrial" power? I presume that would be subject to some type of zoning requirements?

[Psipherious]

Here are some reasons that might make you want to reconsider trying to make it your main source of income.

1. Your power cost is way too high to make it a viable in the long term as a business where you currently live. You have to buy large amounts of power in most cases to get it cheap enough to make sense for what you are doing.

2. ETH is much more profitable than any other GPU mined coin at present. This presents a problem in that the difficulty is skyrocketing because everyone is flocking to the coin. This means every difficulty change will   reduce your profits.

3. ETH is not a coin to invest in mining long term, the devs have already announced it will go Proof of Stake which basically takes gpu mining out of the equation. There are other profitable GPU coins but none that can rival ETH so you will have to balance on a razor thin profit margin.

4. If you did want to turn it into a business there are a ton of other costs to factor in. When you buy power in bulk it comes in on these high power lines and have you have to buy big expensive transformers to step
    it down to a usable range.  You will need a large warehouse sized location. You will need massive amounts of cooling. You will have to pay for an expensive reliable internet service. GPU mining rigs tend to be very picky and you cant have any internet hiccups or you will have way too much downtime.

5. With profit margins being so thin you will need a very large farm to cover bills and pay yourself a decent wage.

6. Since you did not already have the equipment when ETH went to the moon you have already missed out on the most profitable stage of its life cycle.

7. Since you are only interested in a small salary to live on I am going to guess you do not have a lot of money to start this venture. Id say you would want at least $1 million to start a company that mines full time.

1. Yes I do realize it's far too high to base any long term expectations off this. I can get it for 0.8usd with a bit of work. Or 0.4 with a *lot* of work, like moving out of province or setting up a remote facility out of province. The cost involved in setting up my own facility though, it would almost make more sense to just move to get those rates.

2 & 3. I'm fine that ETH is not for mining long term. I already know full well that it's mining phase is going to end. But that is the entire point of my post, to see if it's possible to truly make a living by hand picking the most profitable coins of the time. If that means changing to a different coin each month or even each week, so be it. If this is something I'm going to work on full time that's easily manageable.

4. These are certainly some additional things to consider. While being aware of all of these issues, power limitations, cooling and redundant internet access, the power limitations would be my biggest concern. I've got some workable ideas for the cooling and redundant net but have not much "electrical" experience other than installing some new lights and ceiling fans & light electrics soldering (fixing some TV's, etc), I have zero experience when it comes to industrial power.

5. Yes, I did pretty much figure this. EVEN if I was doubling my cost of electricity per month on say a 6 card rig AND paying only 0.5 cents, lets say I was making $75-100 per month per rig. I know I would require 25 - 50 such rigs to make a living.

6. Again, ETH itself is not a huge factor in this to me. Sure, having gear when ETH started would have been absolutely wonderful. People making tens of thousands of dollars just based on the shoot up in price. This would certain help a lot with purchasing more equipment.

This is why I'm curious of people who have may already have been doing this for years, i.e. well before ETH was even on the scenes. Say in the days between "end of BitCoin GPU mining" up til start of ETH mining. Aside from LiteCoin, were miners making anything in that phase? I mean, serious miners, not hobbyist miners.

This is also why I'm curious if it's possible/where to get cheaper than retail bulk equipment because it will lower the ROI time allowing one to expand and build faster.

And, if I can slowly build up my equipment, even if profit margins are very thin for now, it will allow me to have the equipment in place if/when another new/big altcoin comes onto the scene.

Obviously I don't want to count on something like that and just want to plan to make money if ETH wasn't even part of the picture right now.

Anyway, you've giving me a couple extra points to think on for sure, I appreciate this input and exactly why I started this post.

[Darwin84]

Mining is a hobby. Calling it a career is a stretch of the imagination. There is no way you can compete with anything in a small town or a place where power isn't cheap and hardware isn't easy to come by. Only a small percentage of miners that I know are making money and they are usually the people making money in everything else. You have to stay on top and have good finances, constantly keep up with tech otherwise difficulty will swallow you up before you mine your first coin.

[adaseb]

Moving provinces just for mining is crazy. Like others said before me. This should only be considered a hobby.

Mining is basically "free money" and everybody wants it so with time the difficulty will keep increasing and increasing and it will get harder and harder to make anything.

Just enjoy the current profits while they last.

[bitcoin730]

I don't think so but if you search in google you will find I guess

[Mugtaiya]

If you have 12 rigs of AMD GPU, they will hash about 1.8GH/s, and consumes 14kW, you make about  $153 profit, the electricity cost is $47, revenue is $200. When the difficulty doubles, you will make $53, not enough to support you.

[Amph]

If you have 12 rigs of AMD GPU, they will hash about 1.8GH/s, and consumes 14kW, you make about  $153 profit, the electricity cost is $47, revenue is $200. When the difficulty doubles, you will make $53, not enough to support you.

$53 a day is still pretty good

and anyway you assumed a high electricty for considering $47 a day with 14kw

with 0.05 cent it is much lower, like 1/3

[Darwin84]

Do you trust your calculations to be from a 15 post miner.  What is he talking about 12 GPU without even mentioning what GPU and where and at 1.8gh.  1.8gh in ethereum is closer to 100 GPU so he probably means 12 x 6 GPU rigs, which is something I would not invest in if money was free. At 10 GPU be prepared to move out of your room or basement. At 100 GPU you can't even enter the house.

[Psipherious]

Moving provinces just for mining is crazy. Like others said before me. This should only be considered a hobby.

Mining is basically "free money" and everybody wants it so with time the difficulty will keep increasing and increasing and it will get harder and harder to make anything.

Just enjoy the current profits while they last.

Moving provinces to start a business is not as crazy as one might think and hopefully indicates some level of my seriousness in wanting to turn this stuff into a viable business.

Of course if all one thinks is that some projects can only be a hobby, that is all it will ever be for them. Many people turn passionate hobbies into full time businesses.

If that's the easiest way for me to get power at less than a quarter of what I'm paying now, then so be it. With a move I can cut my power costs in about half by renting some hosting space in a lower electricity cost area. I just don't know if that will be enough of a cut for long term though.

I'm just looking for ways to do that. Kind of brainstorming here, coming up with a plan and hoping for some input from people who might already be doing it as a profession/business.

[Darwin84]

Moving provinces is for doctors or oil workers. Moving provinces for mining is about as smart as buying a cottage in nunavut.  Do you plant to relocate to a new town and sit an house with no friends or family so you can make $10 a day for a few months.

Please try to grasp what mining is and understand difficulty. It increases daily and even you think the numbers look good on paper they are not realistic results. The calculators online are broken on purpose to attract people into mining. They are run by the big players in the game who have in interest in propping up the crypto currency. Even if the calculator show you today you can make $500/month then its more like $400 in reality but that is only for this week. Those same numbers by next week will say $375 and keep on going down daily until you hit the point where power costs more than return.

[fanatic26]

Despite all the negative nancy home miners that are bitter they cant mine on their expensive power at home saying no, you can make it a viable business. You really need a strong amount of capital to start because in order to make a living wage you must run a large number of machines.

E.G.:

Current estimated monthly profit on antminer S7 @ $0.05 power:   (using coinwarz calc)

Total Earned: $170.07
Less power: $46.80
Gross monthly profit per S7: $123.27


You run 500 S7s at the current difficulty and you are making $60k a month....of course when you look at the halving that changes things quite a bit:


Total Earned: $85.04
Less power: $46.80
Gross monthly profit per S7: $38.24


Post Halving (at current difficulty) those 500 machines are still making $19k a month.

Getting power down to $0.03/KwH the same calculations predict a return of $28,400 per month gross post halving. It really depends on your cost to build the facility, your power cost, and how fast you can scale up the number of miners you are running if you want to make this a viable business.


Disclaimer: Do not calculate profit more than 30 days out as difficulty adjusts often and projections tend to be worthless in the long run. These are very rough estimates just to be used as an example.

[Satlite]

Do you trust your calculations to be from a 15 post miner.  What is he talking about 12 GPU without even mentioning what GPU and where and at 1.8gh.  1.8gh in ethereum is closer to 100 GPU so he probably means 12 x 6 GPU rigs, which is something I would not invest in if money was free. At 10 GPU be prepared to move out of your room or basement. At 100 GPU you can't even enter the house.

That is just a simulation. With the 1.8GH, 14kW, it is achievable by 6x12 x390 undervolt and underclock. But the capital cost is high.

[Amph]

Despite all the negative nancy home miners that are bitter they cant mine on their expensive power at home saying no, you can make it a viable business. You really need a strong amount of capital to start because in order to make a living wage you must run a large number of machines.

E.G.:

Current estimated monthly profit on antminer S7 @ $0.05 power:   (using coinwarz calc)

Total Earned: $170.07
Less power: $46.80
Gross monthly profit per S7: $123.27


You run 500 S7s at the current difficulty and you are making $60k a month....of course when you look at the halving that changes things quite a bit:


Total Earned: $85.04
Less power: $46.80
Gross monthly profit per S7: $38.24


Post Halving (at current difficulty) those 500 machines are still making $19k a month.

Getting power down to $0.03/KwH the same calculations predict a return of $28,400 per month gross post halving. It really depends on your cost to build the facility, your power cost, and how fast you can scale up the number of miners you are running if you want to make this a viable business.


Disclaimer: Do not calculate profit more than 30 days out as difficulty adjusts often and projections tend to be worthless in the long run. These are very rough estimates just to be used as an example.

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

[Darwin84]

Do you trust your calculations to be from a 15 post miner.  What is he talking about 12 GPU without even mentioning what GPU and where and at 1.8gh.  1.8gh in ethereum is closer to 100 GPU so he probably means 12 x 6 GPU rigs, which is something I would not invest in if money was free. At 10 GPU be prepared to move out of your room or basement. At 100 GPU you can't even enter the house.

That is just a simulation. With the 1.8GH, 14kW, it is achievable by 6x12 x390 undervolt and underclock. But the capital cost is high.

You need a commercial unit for that. The poster would have to rent a place because its pretty tough living in a house with 72gpu. I guess he could spend another few thousand on AC and fanning and noise suppression.  So far the OP would be tens of thousands in the hole along with a move and a couple of new leases, services, etc.. I think he's better off with a truck and a lawnmower.

[fanatic26]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

1. You have to pay back your loans for everything you built.

2. As network difficulty changes your profits will drop.

3. You have to constantly upgrade/repair/replace equipment in this industry. You will need a store of cash to do this.

4. Who the hell can live on $1k a month? Thats under minimum wage. Remember not everyone lives at mommys and has no bills. I live in a smaller cheap house and my monthly bills not counting food/gas/car maintenance/etc are over $1000 a month.

You sound like someone who has no clue what its like owning a business or even living on your own for that matter if you think $1k is enough to live on. OP said $35k-65k per year. $35k is about $2900 a month before taxes. $65k is about $5400 a month before taxes. Calculate loan repayment rates, commercial rental fees, taxes on your profits......now tell me again how far off I am?

[Darwin84]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

[Darwin84]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

1. You have to pay back your loans for everything you built.

2. As network difficulty changes your profits will drop.

3. You have to constantly upgrade/repair/replace equipment in this industry. You will need a store of cash to do this.

4. Who the hell can live on $1k a month? Thats under minimum wage. Remember not everyone lives at mommys and has no bills. I live in a smaller cheap house and my monthly bills not counting food/gas/car maintenance/etc are over $1000 a month.

You sound like someone who has no clue what its like owning a business or even living on your own for that matter if you think $1k is enough to live on. OP said $35k-65k per year. $35k is about $2900 a month before taxes. $65k is about $5400 a month before taxes. Calculate loan repayment rates, commercial rental fees, taxes on your profits......now tell me again how far off I am?

lol you beat me to this response. we practically wrote the same thing

[GMPoison]

Everyone likes to talk about difficulty rising so profits will decline, when in reality the price will rise with it. Look at Bitcoin. It's always been profitable to mine. The difficulty rose, but so did the price. It was profitable to mine three years ago, it's profitable to mine now. Crazy how that works.

[limbaugh]

Everyone likes to talk about difficulty rising so profits will decline, when in reality the price will rise with it. Look at Bitcoin. It's always been profitable to mine. The difficulty rose, but so did the price. It was profitable to mine three years ago, it's profitable to mine now. Crazy how that works.

What are you are a sadist? Want to see other lose money? It's funny how the ignorant are so willing to share their opinion.

Unless you live next to a dam or have access to some other form of cheap power, you will never truly be competitive.

You would make more as a clerk in a 7-11.

Hobby mining is fun - going pro is insane.

[GMPoison]

Everyone likes to talk about difficulty rising so profits will decline, when in reality the price will rise with it. Look at Bitcoin. It's always been profitable to mine. The difficulty rose, but so did the price. It was profitable to mine three years ago, it's profitable to mine now. Crazy how that works.

What are you are a sadist? Want to see other lose money? It's funny how the ignorant are so willing to share their opinion.

Unless you live next to a dam or have access to some other form of cheap power, you will never truly be competitive.

You would make more as a clerk in a 7-11.

Hobby mining is fun - going pro is insane.

I'm not suggesting him to mine at all. Nowhere did I say that. What I implied is if it's profitable, mine. If it's not, don't. Mining is scalable. If you can mine at a profit, the more you spend on gear the more profit you will earn.

Based on my KW/h I can make $50 a month off a 20 mh/s gpu. I don't have cheap electricity, I have average electricity in the USA. $50 a month on a single gpu. Scale it up and you're looking at $50 x how ever many gpu's you have. Simple as that. If you want to take the calculated risk of going pro and spending a lot of money, go for it.

[GMPoison]

It's funny what the mining community calls "profit". In the world of investing, hitting ROI in three months is UNHEARD OF. Making all of your money back in as little as three months, then make nothing but pure profits? You'd be labeled insane.

[adaseb]

Basically there are only 2 ways of actually earning a living with Bitcoins


1) Trading. You can trade on margin coins like BTC, LTC, ETH. You can make alot of money with this but its very difficult to do consistently because its like being a stock market day trader.

2) Bitcoin Business. Most popular is like a Gambling site. Or if you are creative you can create some websites such as Bitcoin Magazine, CrpytoCoinNews, etc.


Earning a living consistently with mining is almost impossible. I would move provinces also if I was guaranteed todays earnings with my GPU rigs for the next 5 years. However that's not possible.

The profits for mining ETH have almost dropped 40% in only 48 hours. And yet the difficulty keeps increasing.

[GMPoison]

Basically there are only 2 ways of actually earning a living with Bitcoins


1) Trading. You can trade on margin coins like BTC, LTC, ETH. You can make alot of money with this but its very difficult to do consistently because its like being a stock market day trader.

2) Bitcoin Business. Most popular is like a Gambling site. Or if you are creative you can create some websites such as Bitcoin Magazine, CrpytoCoinNews, etc.


Earning a living consistently with mining is almost impossible. I would move provinces also if I was guaranteed todays earnings with my GPU rigs for the next 5 years. However that's not possible.

The profits for mining ETH have almost dropped 40% in only 48 hours. And yet the difficulty keeps increasing.

True. If electricity is too high, you would need to move. I don't think you should decide whether or not to start mining based off profits 5 years from now though, in my own opinion of course.

Sure the price is down 11.79% at this very moment, but it's up far more than 11.79% since inception. Based off of that alone (though there are more points that could be made for it rising), I'd say if it's profitable now it will remain profitable in the near future. Long enough for you to make a profit at least, which is all that matters.

[limbaugh]

It's funny what the mining community calls "profit". In the world of investing, hitting ROI in three months is UNHEARD OF. Making all of your money back in as little as three months, then make nothing but pure profits? You'd be labeled insane.

You assume this is a common occurrence. We will most likely experience years of unprofitable mining after this uncommon run peters out.

Coins are moving away from PoW anyway. There will be no "move to the next profitable coin" option.

[fanatic26]

Earning a living consistently with mining is almost impossible.

As with almost everyone on this forum you refuse to look at mining from a business perspective. I just laid out in very simple terms the basics of what you need to make it profitable. The OP was asking about making a career out of it, he wasnt asking people that are butthurt that they cant make their fortune running half a dozen miners in their garage to tell him how he cant.



P.S. Bitcoin is the only coin that matters in the long run....when is it moving away from PoW exactly?

[limbaugh]

P.S. Bitcoin is the only coin that matters in the long run....when is it moving away from PoW exactly?

The Bitcoin dev team is bought and paid for by corporations and ASIC fabs. Of course it will never go PoS.

Get a clue Sherlock before posting nonsense.

[fanatic26]

The Bitcoin dev team is bought and paid for by corporations and ASIC fabs. Of course it will never go PoS.

Get a clue Sherlock before posting nonsense.

Well my dear Watson, considering my response was to the previous post stating coins are moving away from PoW and me not actually asking when it would happen, I think you should feel a bit silly about your comment.

Thanks for playing!

[limbaugh]

The Bitcoin dev team is bought and paid for by corporations and ASIC fabs. Of course it will never go PoS.

Get a clue Sherlock before posting nonsense.

Well my dear Watson, considering my response was to the previous post stating coins are moving away from PoW and me not actually asking when it would happen, I think you should feel a bit silly about your comment.

Thanks for playing!

So clever! When was the last time you mined some Bitcoin with a rack of GPUs?

Since you laid out your genius plan, how profitable would your GPU farm be mining Bitcoin? Since it is PoW and the only coin that matters.

Now who feels silly?

[GMPoison]

The Bitcoin dev team is bought and paid for by corporations and ASIC fabs. Of course it will never go PoS.

Get a clue Sherlock before posting nonsense.

Well my dear Watson, considering my response was to the previous post stating coins are moving away from PoW and me not actually asking when it would happen, I think you should feel a bit silly about your comment.

Thanks for playing!

So clever! When was the last time you mined some Bitcoin with a rack of GPUs?

Since you laid out your genius plan, how profitable would your GPU farm be mining Bitcoin? Since it is PoW and the only coin that matters.

Now who feels silly?

I'm fairly sure there's always been a profitable coin to mine that hasn't been Bitcoin. Besides that point though, you are right when you say Bitcoin is really the only coin that matters. If you've got a good chunk of money you want to play with, I'd much rather set up a larger Bitcoin mining operation than an altcoin operation.

It's something I actually plan on doing depending on what Bitcoin looks like after the halving in a couple of months and the dust has settled, whereas alt coin mining has always just been a thought for me.

[fanatic26]

So clever! When was the last time you mined some Bitcoin with a rack of GPUs?

Since you laid out your genius plan, how profitable would your GPU farm be mining Bitcoin? Since it is PoW and the only coin that matters.

Now who feels silly?

Its almost like you are reading another topic because you keep coming back with these nonsensical responses. Where did I say a damn thing about GPU mining...especially GPU mining bitcoin?

Kindly pull your head out of your ass and read the whole thread before you just throw shit at the wall that makes no sense. I mean seriously read my fucking posts.

[arielbit]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

cut $1k in two.

500$.. i can live with that a month 

[Darwin84]

Everyone likes to talk about difficulty rising so profits will decline, when in reality the price will rise with it. Look at Bitcoin. It's always been profitable to mine. The difficulty rose, but so did the price. It was profitable to mine three years ago, it's profitable to mine now. Crazy how that works.

What are you are a sadist? Want to see other lose money? It's funny how the ignorant are so willing to share their opinion.

Unless you live next to a dam or have access to some other form of cheap power, you will never truly be competitive.

You would make more as a clerk in a 7-11.

Hobby mining is fun - going pro is insane.

I'm not suggesting him to mine at all. Nowhere did I say that. What I implied is if it's profitable, mine. If it's not, don't. Mining is scalable. If you can mine at a profit, the more you spend on gear the more profit you will earn.

Based on my KW/h I can make $50 a month off a 20 mh/s gpu. I don't have cheap electricity, I have average electricity in the USA. $50 a month on a single gpu. Scale it up and you're looking at $50 x how ever many gpu's you have. Simple as that. If you want to take the calculated risk of going pro and spending a lot of money, go for it.

You are scaling up but only the GPU count. If you got that from a calculator you will never even reach that because in 30 days the difficulty will increase quite a bit and that $50 is actually $45. Next month $37 and so on.

[Amph]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

1. You have to pay back your loans for everything you built.

2. As network difficulty changes your profits will drop.

3. You have to constantly upgrade/repair/replace equipment in this industry. You will need a store of cash to do this.

4. Who the hell can live on $1k a month? Thats under minimum wage. Remember not everyone lives at mommys and has no bills. I live in a smaller cheap house and my monthly bills not counting food/gas/car maintenance/etc are over $1000 a month.

You sound like someone who has no clue what its like owning a business or even living on your own for that matter if you think $1k is enough to live on. OP said $35k-65k per year. $35k is about $2900 a month before taxes. $65k is about $5400 a month before taxes. Calculate loan repayment rates, commercial rental fees, taxes on your profits......now tell me again how far off I am?

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like "you have no clue", when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

are you serious man, it's not like there is only america out there, in kuwait or egypt(just an example) the cost is not that high as you think and electricity is at 1 cent

even in iceland where electricity is 5 cent and the cost is 40% higher than europe, you can still live easily with 1k, 1k is overkill actually

it's not about how much you earn it's about how much you spend also, if you fuck your money in useless stuff, it's not my fault

i think you guys know nothing on how much you need to spend each month to survive

[arielbit]

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

1. You have to pay back your loans for everything you built.

2. As network difficulty changes your profits will drop.

3. You have to constantly upgrade/repair/replace equipment in this industry. You will need a store of cash to do this.

4. Who the hell can live on $1k a month? Thats under minimum wage. Remember not everyone lives at mommys and has no bills. I live in a smaller cheap house and my monthly bills not counting food/gas/car maintenance/etc are over $1000 a month.

You sound like someone who has no clue what its like owning a business or even living on your own for that matter if you think $1k is enough to live on. OP said $35k-65k per year. $35k is about $2900 a month before taxes. $65k is about $5400 a month before taxes. Calculate loan repayment rates, commercial rental fees, taxes on your profits......now tell me again how far off I am?

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like you have no clue, when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

that makes us two here at 500$.. i can still live at 300-350$ "happily" but i don't want to scare some people here LOL..

[adaseb]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

[Amph]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

you are right about the bike, but not about food, well i did travel a lot when i was really young due to my father job, so i don't care anymore about travelling

you can have a decent life at 500 let alone at 1k, but only if you are alone yes

[adaseb]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

you are right about the bike, but not about food, well i did travel a lot when i was really young due to my father job, so i don't care anymore about travelling

you can have a decent life at 500 let alone at 1k, but only if you are alone yes

Are you living in North America?

[QuintLeo]

Moving provinces is for doctors or oil workers. Moving provinces for mining is about as smart as buying a cottage in nunavut.  Do you plant to relocate to a new town and sit an house with no friends or family so you can make $10 a day for a few months.

 Actually, I do - I have no family where I'm at NOW, and very few friends.
 Won't be "for a few months" either - I'm NOT limiting my plans to Ethereum - in fact I'm still earning more from LiteCoin right now than Ethereum (already have the hardware, no point in shutting it down since it's profitable even though I can't switch it).

 It's not practical to live on less than $500/month ALL UP in most of the US for most folks, but $1000 is easy - I've not made $12000 in a year in over a decade, but I've been pretty comfortable that whole time. Being single, no dependents, etc helps noticeably.


 DO keep in mind that SOME parts of the US have low rental costs, it's not ALL about insane pricing in places like Manhattan (NY) or Orange County (CA) and such.


 P.S. - I've not "lived with mommie" in 37 years and change.

[arielbit]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

well i got a bike  

i hate ramen noodles ( the instant ones), i'm eating beef, seafoods, veggies, and fruits, and i have some spices on stock ready to be used when needed. buying clothes for me is not a monthly routine so it is not expensive, haircut here is 1$. there are cheap insurance plans that is enough, i bought GPU's instead of travelling..I'll travel, just waiting for the mood... having family in time..

[Sanguintan]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

you are right about the bike, but not about food, well i did travel a lot when i was really young due to my father job, so i don't care anymore about travelling

you can have a decent life at 500 let alone at 1k, but only if you are alone yes

Are you living in North America?

From the post post times, I can see Amph lives in Central Europe or maybe in the East Europe.

[Amph]

Yeah I am sure most of us can live under $500 a month.

However that would mean moving back in with your parents, riding a bike instead of driving, eating Ramen noodles, wearing used clothes from Goodwill, cutting your own hair, having no insurance, never travelling, not having your own family, etc.

What kind of life is that.

you are right about the bike, but not about food, well i did travel a lot when i was really young due to my father job, so i don't care anymore about travelling

you can have a decent life at 500 let alone at 1k, but only if you are alone yes

Are you living in North America?

From the post post times, I can see Amph lives in Central Europe or maybe in the East Europe.

in italy, and it's already expensive to live here. but you can do it with 500 euro a month

[Darwin84]

Sorry but but that's just fools luck. You got lucky that's all. There is no life @ $500 /m unless you are lucky. What if someone dies tomorrow are you going to bury them in your backyard ?  What if you get sick tomorrow and need $20k for a simple surgery, you will die.. What if you injure someone tomorrow just by doing something simple as riding your bike, you will be sued. How about actually living and not just surviving. What kind of life do you have with no toys or gadgets or cars and insurance. How about a boat ? How about parking. Your monthly survival rate is what people pay for parking for 1 month in my city.

@$500 month you can't even afford a new motherboard if something goes down. Its a failed business plan and I hope nobody takes your advice.

Moving provinces is for doctors or oil workers. Moving provinces for mining is about as smart as buying a cottage in nunavut.  Do you plant to relocate to a new town and sit an house with no friends or family so you can make $10 a day for a few months.

 Actually, I do - I have no family where I'm at NOW, and very few friends.
 Won't be "for a few months" either - I'm NOT limiting my plans to Ethereum - in fact I'm still earning more from LiteCoin right now than Ethereum (already have the hardware, no point in shutting it down since it's profitable even though I can't switch it).

 It's not practical to live on less than $500/month ALL UP in most of the US for most folks, but $1000 is easy - I've not made $12000 in a year in over a decade, but I've been pretty comfortable that whole time. Being single, no dependents, etc helps noticeably.


 DO keep in mind that SOME parts of the US have low rental costs, it's not ALL about insane pricing in places like Manhattan (NY) or Orange County (CA) and such.


 P.S. - I've not "lived with mommie" in 37 years and change.

[arielbit]

@Darwin84

500$ a month for parking? from where i live there is no parking fee around here, there is insurance that cost 6 to 11 $ a month, a computer is already a toy, i don't get why people want to play with gadgets, i have a 24 inch monitor and a lot of GPUs to use for gaming. a used motherboard for my mining rigs costs 28$ max, for bike injury you just need an alcohol and terramycin.

[adaseb]

He's probably living in Toronto or Vancouver where downtown parking could cost $500/month.

[Amph]

Sorry but but that's just fools luck. You got lucky that's all. There is no life @ $500 /m unless you are lucky. What if someone dies tomorrow are you going to bury them in your backyard ?  What if you get sick tomorrow and need $20k for a simple surgery, you will die.. What if you injure someone tomorrow just by doing something simple as riding your bike, you will be sued. How about actually living and not just surviving. What kind of life do you have with no toys or gadgets or cars and insurance. How about a boat ? How about parking. Your monthly survival rate is what people pay for parking for 1 month in my city.

@$500 month you can't even afford a new motherboard if something goes down. Its a failed business plan and I hope nobody takes your advice.

Moving provinces is for doctors or oil workers. Moving provinces for mining is about as smart as buying a cottage in nunavut.  Do you plant to relocate to a new town and sit an house with no friends or family so you can make $10 a day for a few months.

 Actually, I do - I have no family where I'm at NOW, and very few friends.
 Won't be "for a few months" either - I'm NOT limiting my plans to Ethereum - in fact I'm still earning more from LiteCoin right now than Ethereum (already have the hardware, no point in shutting it down since it's profitable even though I can't switch it).

 It's not practical to live on less than $500/month ALL UP in most of the US for most folks, but $1000 is easy - I've not made $12000 in a year in over a decade, but I've been pretty comfortable that whole time. Being single, no dependents, etc helps noticeably.


 DO keep in mind that SOME parts of the US have low rental costs, it's not ALL about insane pricing in places like Manhattan (NY) or Orange County (CA) and such.


 P.S. - I've not "lived with mommie" in 37 years and change.

no-sense with all this "what if"

i can argue the same, what if you just die tomorrow, with your millions in pocket? you think your money will resurrect you from the tomb?

[Psipherious]

I do appreciate the sensible replies with math and data regarding how to make 35k+ per month from mining.

They've given me some good things to think on, problems to solve. I truly enjoy this whole Cryptocurrency industry, the alternative finance part of it, the mining is enjoyable. I like maintaining the systems and have no problems trying to solve the issues of how to get cheaper power, where to get good deals on hardware, etc, etc.

But as to the battle that this has turned into as to whether or not someone can live on $500 a month or not is just stupidity.

Go start your own thread titled "how much is enough to live off of per month" or something because it's highly unrelated to whether or not AltCoin mining can be profitable long term. Profit is profit, whether it's $50 a month or $50,000 a month.

People can live off NOTHING per month. People do. Their life sucks. But that is also based on perspectives.

*I* could live off of 20k, or even less per year if I really wanted to or needed to. I don't want to. 35k is my minimum goal. That goal is also mostly irrelevant to whether or not mining can be profitable for you.

Mining is scale-able, so if you can consistently make 500 a month off it, then you can simply spend some more monies on hardware and scale it up.

My main question and entire point of this thread is how sustainable can that be?

If I can make $1 per day off of each GPU card (profit after electricity and other expenses), then 90 cards make me 90 a day which is 2700 a month which is pretty close to my goal. 90 cards = 15, 6 card rigs probably running in the range of 1200 - 1400W per mo each.

But how long is this sustainable. 280X cards which came out nearly 3 years ago are still making great money on a number of coins (including some that are not Ethash based). 7970's which are essentially nearly identical to 280X's are even older. So that's 4+ year old cards that are STILL able to make $1 per month PROFIT over the past year at the very least.

At one point long ago they were profitable on LiteCoin too, I'm sure they're not now but this is my whole point, can you keep selecting the next top coin and continuously make $1 per month profit off a card that's 4 years old?

Again, I appreciate the sensible replies, so ty to those who have posted some.

[Amph]

my advice is, don't buy anything old, at this point

new monster gpu are coming, like the 480, which will kill any other amd instantly, at 150w(the real consumption will be much less, by tweaking the power limit) and doing 25MH on etheruem

you would save really big on consumption, not to mention that they willl cost only 200, with a much greater resell value than 280 or 290

[adaseb]

I do appreciate the sensible replies with math and data regarding how to make 35k+ per month from mining.

They've given me some good things to think on, problems to solve. I truly enjoy this whole Cryptocurrency industry, the alternative finance part of it, the mining is enjoyable. I like maintaining the systems and have no problems trying to solve the issues of how to get cheaper power, where to get good deals on hardware, etc, etc.

But as to the battle that this has turned into as to whether or not someone can live on $500 a month or not is just stupidity.

Go start your own thread titled "how much is enough to live off of per month" or something because it's highly unrelated to whether or not AltCoin mining can be profitable long term. Profit is profit, whether it's $50 a month or $50,000 a month.

People can live off NOTHING per month. People do. Their life sucks. But that is also based on perspectives.

*I* could live off of 20k, or even less per year if I really wanted to or needed to. I don't want to. 35k is my minimum goal. That goal is also mostly irrelevant to whether or not mining can be profitable for you.

Mining is scale-able, so if you can consistently make 500 a month off it, then you can simply spend some more monies on hardware and scale it up.

My main question and entire point of this thread is how sustainable can that be?

If I can make $1 per day off of each GPU card (profit after electricity and other expenses), then 90 cards make me 90 a day which is 2700 a month which is pretty close to my goal. 90 cards = 15, 6 card rigs probably running in the range of 1200 - 1400W per mo each.

But how long is this sustainable. 280X cards which came out nearly 3 years ago are still making great money on a number of coins (including some that are not Ethash based). 7970's which are essentially nearly identical to 280X's are even older. So that's 4+ year old cards that are STILL able to make $1 per month PROFIT over the past year at the very least.

At one point long ago they were profitable on LiteCoin too, I'm sure they're not now but this is my whole point, can you keep selecting the next top coin and continuously make $1 per month profit off a card that's 4 years old?

Again, I appreciate the sensible replies, so ty to those who have posted some.

It won't be sustainable for years. Maybe a few more months.

Litecoin mining was only profitable for maybe 6 months or so.

The rest of the time those 280x were making $0.30/day for people with free electricity.

[Darwin84]

@Darwin84

500$ a month for parking? from where i live there is no parking fee around here, there is insurance that cost 6 to 11 $ a month, a computer is already a toy, i don't get why people want to play with gadgets, i have a 24 inch monitor and a lot of GPUs to use for gaming. a used motherboard for my mining rigs costs 28$ max, for bike injury you just need an alcohol and terramycin.

That's downtown Toronto. $300-$600 a month, depends on security and covered or not and that's just work, you need another $100 or so to park at home.


Great so you have a life of GPUs and gaming in a deadbeat farming town and you fix yourself with alcohol.  

That's a waste of life to most people.

I'm not judging but don't pass this off as advice. You'll be on the streets of a big city soon enough when you're first major life upset happens that you can't fix with $500.

Good luck

[Darwin84]

If I can make $1 per day off of each GPU card (profit after electricity and other expenses), then 90 cards make me 90 a day which is 2700 a month which is pretty close to my goal. 90 cards = 15, 6 card rigs probably running in the range of 1200 - 1400W per mo each.

Not really because there are extra costs as you increase. Cooling, space, internet requirements and I'm not even talking about the legal stuff like licensing,taxes, insurance. The cheap mining model works at home on free internet and up to a few GPU's. You've obviously never mined if you don't know this. After one rig you have to start cooling. After two rigs you have to move out of the room. At 90 GPU you have to move out of the house. AC, noise suppression, fanning, racking, power upgrades to draw that kind of power. Ever think about a fire ?

You also missed the whole chapter on difficulty. If you can't grasp the aboveyou will never understand that.

If you project 2700 a month at today's difficulty expect to be paid on $2400 tops because difficulty isn't going to stop when you come online with 90gpu. Next month $1700-$2000. Next month $1500. But your bills stay the same, in 3 months you can't make rent.  To keep up with 2700 you have to add another 10-15 GPU each month. 

[arielbit]

@Darwin84

500$ a month for parking? from where i live there is no parking fee around here, there is insurance that cost 6 to 11 $ a month, a computer is already a toy, i don't get why people want to play with gadgets, i have a 24 inch monitor and a lot of GPUs to use for gaming. a used motherboard for my mining rigs costs 28$ max, for bike injury you just need an alcohol and terramycin.

That's downtown Toronto. $300-$600 a month, depends on security and covered or not and that's just work, you need another $100 or so to park at home.


Great so you have a life of GPUs and gaming in a deadbeat farming town and you fix yourself with alcohol.  

That's a waste of life to most people.

I'm not judging but don't pass this off as advice. You'll be on the streets of a big city soon enough when you're first major life upset happens that you can't fix with $500.

Good luck

i'm in a city, in a province..if you read up thread i said i can do 300-350$ "happily" ... the minimum wage here is ~175$ LOL ..i'm fine with 500$ 

my location is a comfortable one, i'm even planning to buy a piece of property around here with my savings, 3 malls are in a biking/walking distance, a 4th one is being made, two hospitals are walking distance and a 5 minute commute to the city square.

a metropolis provides higher wages because of higher standard of living..here is a sweet blend of provincial and city living

[Amph]

If I can make $1 per day off of each GPU card (profit after electricity and other expenses), then 90 cards make me 90 a day which is 2700 a month which is pretty close to my goal. 90 cards = 15, 6 card rigs probably running in the range of 1200 - 1400W per mo each.

Not really because there are extra costs as you increase. Cooling, space, internet requirements and I'm not even talking about the legal stuff like licensing,taxes, insurance. The cheap mining model works at home on free internet and up to a few GPU's. You've obviously never mined if you don't know this. After one rig you have to start cooling. After two rigs you have to move out of the room. At 90 GPU you have to move out of the house. AC, noise suppression, fanning, racking, power upgrades to draw that kind of power. Ever think about a fire ?

You also missed the whole chapter on difficulty. If you can't grasp the aboveyou will never understand that.

If you project 2700 a month at today's difficulty expect to be paid on $2400 tops because difficulty isn't going to stop when you come online with 90gpu. Next month $1700-$2000. Next month $1500. But your bills stay the same, in 3 months you can't make rent.  To keep up with 2700 you have to add another 10-15 GPU each month. 

this assuming that no other profitable coin come out, and he can not make the big profit with it like it happened with etehruem

which is a bit stupid to assume, telling the past here, also it is known that when bitcoin will skyrocket you will automatically have 2x profit or 3x profit or more

not to mention that when bitcoin skyrocket the new influx of fresh money will be huge, this will also reflect to many other big alt

[QuintLeo]

Litecoin was profitable on GPUs for more like a year at least, unless your electric rate was VERY high.

 Ethereum looks like it might last that long - depends mostly on how many folks jump into it and how much they bring with them vs. price rise.


 On the other hand, counting on Ethereum mining to make a living for more than a few months, perhaps a year at most, is a fools choice.
 Get the short-term profits, certainly - but long-term is ZERO probability.

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

[Amph]

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

funny because before ethereum was pumped they were saying the same thing i suppose, that there was no future for mining in alt anymore and nothing was profitable

then boom ethereum pumped and everything changed again

the true is that one never know what will happen, my rig will always be ready for the next big thing no matter what

[sanas]

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

funny because before ethereum was pumped they were saying the same thing i suppose, that there was no future for mining in alt anymore and nothing was profitable

then boom ethereum pumped and everything changed again

the true is that one never know what will happen, my rig will always be ready for the next big thing no matter what

Before the Etheruem pump, there is very little profit to be made with the GPU mining for about 2 years.

[adaseb]

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

funny because before ethereum was pumped they were saying the same thing i suppose, that there was no future for mining in alt anymore and nothing was profitable

then boom ethereum pumped and everything changed again

the true is that one never know what will happen, my rig will always be ready for the next big thing no matter what

Before the Etheruem pump, there is very little profit to be made with the GPU mining for about 2 years.

Yeah I keep saying this to everybody but for some reason nobody believes me and thinks for their benefit there will always be a profitable coin out.

[Amph]

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

funny because before ethereum was pumped they were saying the same thing i suppose, that there was no future for mining in alt anymore and nothing was profitable

then boom ethereum pumped and everything changed again

the true is that one never know what will happen, my rig will always be ready for the next big thing no matter what

Before the Etheruem pump, there is very little profit to be made with the GPU mining for about 2 years.

you didn't understand what i said in that post, i know that there was no profit(after the end of summer 2014 until early 2016 or so) but then boom, the pump happened and everything turned profitable

how you can be so sure that this will not happen again with a new coin in 1-2 years? you can not

p.s. there was no profit in that long time frame, only because bitcoin was dumped hard and because of that the sentiment was very bad in the crypto world, now we are in a different time frame, completely different, bitcoin is increasing strongly

this will bring new fresh money in the crypto scene

[Namsbreh]

 Can't count on new profitable coins either - there MIGHT be some such, but the openings for viable altcoins are growing fewer and fewer as more and more altcoins have swamped the coinspace.

funny because before ethereum was pumped they were saying the same thing i suppose, that there was no future for mining in alt anymore and nothing was profitable

then boom ethereum pumped and everything changed again

the true is that one never know what will happen, my rig will always be ready for the next big thing no matter what

Before the Etheruem pump, there is very little profit to be made with the GPU mining for about 2 years.

What a load of rubbish!  I started mining in 2014 and have always found something worth mining.  ETH is just a nice bonus!!!

[sp_]

2014 was the end of the litecoin Klondike.

[QuintLeo]

Litecoin has been profitable with some ASIC if you bought them at the right time - the early Gridseed stuff was so overpriced it may have never made ROI, but once the blades got down to $800 they were able to achieve ROI if you had fairly low cost electric. A2/Titan/Alcheminers were profitable if you got them early enough but late enough you didn't pay $8000+ for them.

 For GPU mining, X11 was profitable 'till fairly shortly after that first ASIC for it showed up, if youre electric wasn't high and you had an efficient mining setup - that covers well into the timeframe when Ethereum BECAME significantly profitable.

 I'm sure there were other options I'm not aware of.

[adaseb]

Litecoin has been profitable with some ASIC if you bought them at the right time - the early Gridseed stuff was so overpriced it may have never made ROI, but once the blades got down to $800 they were able to achieve ROI if you had fairly low cost electric. A2/Titan/Alcheminers were profitable if you got them early enough but late enough you didn't pay $8000+ for them.

 For GPU mining, X11 was profitable 'till fairly shortly after that first ASIC for it showed up, if youre electric wasn't high and you had an efficient mining setup - that covers well into the timeframe when Ethereum BECAME significantly profitable.

 I'm sure there were other options I'm not aware of.

From what I remember. I don't think X11 was ever that profitable. I remember having like a  R9 280X GPUs back then and I think I made like $1 per day.

And then I think in August 2014 It was down to $0.50/per day/ per 280x. I don't think it was ever profitable if you had to pay for electricity.

Back then an Antminer S1 made good money and was fairly affordable.

[Charloz24]

I discovered crypto and mining in dec 2013. That was good time, a 280x gained 10$ /day, but that did not last very long. At that time I purchased 3x 280x and one 290.  I turned off the mining rig in summer 2014 becauseit was not profitable anymore and sold  one 280x andthe 290 (doh!).  I restarted in march (eth of course) and I was out of crypto world in 2015 but I think that was talk about jackpotcoin that was profitable last year?

[adaseb]

I discovered crypto and mining in dec 2013. That was good time, a 280x gained 10$ /day, but that did not last very long. At that time I purchased 3x 280x and one 290.  I turned off the mining rig in summer 2014 becauseit was not profitable anymore and sold  one 280x andthe 290 (doh!).  I restarted in march (eth of course) and I was out of crypto world in 2015 but I think that was talk about jackpotcoin that was profitable last year?

I did Jackpot coin mining also but that was in summer 2014. But I am pretty sure it wasn't making much more than $0.50-$0.75/day.

[Charloz24]

I discovered crypto and mining in dec 2013. That was good time, a 280x gained 10$ /day, but that did not last very long. At that time I purchased 3x 280x and one 290.  I turned off the mining rig in summer 2014 becauseit was not profitable anymore and sold  one 280x andthe 290 (doh!).  I restarted in march (eth of course) and I was out of crypto world in 2015 but I think that was talk about jackpotcoin that was profitable last year?

I did Jackpot coin mining also but that was in summer 2014. But I am pretty sure it wasn't making much more than $0.50-$0.75/day.

Ok so it look like I didn't miss the jackpot... lol 

[adaseb]

I discovered crypto and mining in dec 2013. That was good time, a 280x gained 10$ /day, but that did not last very long. At that time I purchased 3x 280x and one 290.  I turned off the mining rig in summer 2014 becauseit was not profitable anymore and sold  one 280x andthe 290 (doh!).  I restarted in march (eth of course) and I was out of crypto world in 2015 but I think that was talk about jackpotcoin that was profitable last year?

I did Jackpot coin mining also but that was in summer 2014. But I am pretty sure it wasn't making much more than $0.50-$0.75/day.

Ok so it look like I didn't miss the jackpot... lol 

From what I can remember the only profitable coin between Litecoin and Ethereum was Quark. I think with some Russian kernels you could of made like $5/day with a 280X but that was only for like 2-3 months back in May 2015 or so...

[Crypto Nut]

What about the new S9 14 T/h miner and the new A4 600 M/h scrypt miners coming out very soon. Will they not make bitcoin and scrypt coin mining profitable again. The 600 M/h A4 will earn around $40 a day mining LTC you would only need 3 or 4 of them to earn a good living.

A4 Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W.

That's prob $60 a day at 850 Mhs ?

[Charloz24]

What about the new S9 14 T/h miner and the new A4 600 M/h scrypt miners coming out very soon. Will they not make bitcoin and scrypt coin mining profitable again. The 600 M/h A4 will earn around $40 a day mining LTC you would only need 3 or 4 of them to earn a good living.

A4 Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W.

That's prob $60 a day at 850 Mhs ?

You forgot the fact that diffculty will rise with those new miner, so profitability will be much lower.

[cjmining]

What about the new S9 14 T/h miner and the new A4 600 M/h scrypt miners coming out very soon. Will they not make bitcoin and scrypt coin mining profitable again. The 600 M/h A4 will earn around $40 a day mining LTC you would only need 3 or 4 of them to earn a good living.

A4 Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W.

That's prob $60 a day at 850 Mhs ?

You forgot the fact that diffculty will rise with those new miner, so profitability will be much lower.

Difficulty on LTC and BTC is so high that these new miners probably won't make too much of a difference to the difficulty. Yes it will go up but don't think it will go up too much to effect the profit by any large amount. BTC halving in rewards will have more of an effect on the profitability of the S9 than the difficulty.

[Amph]

What about the new S9 14 T/h miner and the new A4 600 M/h scrypt miners coming out very soon. Will they not make bitcoin and scrypt coin mining profitable again. The 600 M/h A4 will earn around $40 a day mining LTC you would only need 3 or 4 of them to earn a good living.

A4 Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W.

That's prob $60 a day at 850 Mhs ?

you need to factor roi time, those beast usually require a 3-6 months roi time when bought at the beginning, unless you are planning to sell them fast

i can not see how they are profitable

[adaseb]

Yeah they would of been VERY profitable only if they were FREE. However most Scrypt equipment is like 1 year ROI. And the S9 is like 7-8 months ROI.

[QuintLeo]

Litecoin is profitable NOW with the older A2 units.

 The A4 will be profitable immediately, but will take some time to achieve ROI - and if enough of them are sold they will eventually make the older A2/Alcheminer and eventually the Titan miners unprofitable at anything less then VERY VERY cheap or free electric.

 It will NOT be a $60/day machine - I've got a bit over 450MH mining Litecoin right now, and I pull in more like $20/day (bit higher this past week with the out-of-nowhere BIG diff drop coupled with the Litecoin price surge of the last month and some). That's GROSS income, not net after electric use - the NET on an A4 will be higher than on my existing A2 farm due to the much lower power use.


 Get used to machines needing a YEAR to ROI - the days of 3 month ROI on new gear is LONG GONE for the most part, and even managing 3 month ROI on USED gear isn't real likely.


 Based on what I'm estimating the cost of a single A4 to be to the "partners", I'm figuring on Litecoin diff doubling over the course of the rest of this year - NOT factoring the "where the heck did it come from" massive DROP of the last week. The main kicker in that estimate is "how many chips will they get out of the foundry how fast" coupled with "how much money are non-founders willing to invest into Scrypt gear".

 S9 at current pricing I'm not sure WILL ROI - many variables involved, and the current price is high even for an "early adopter" premium price.

[greaterninja]

One would need to take advantage of renewable energy (Solar, Wind, Water) and renewable energy rebates for city, business, state, federal (in USA).

I can only see this being a  viable career if you get your power costs down to zero or it in fact returns money by selling power back to the company.




BTW, if anyone is interested in doing this with me...LMK.  I'm thinking of buying land in Arizona or Colorado.


Oh and mining and being successful is about doing the numbers and having a strategy and maintaining that strategy or change gears if you have absolutely have to.

[sanas]

One would need to take advantage of renewable energy (Solar, Wind, Water) and renewable energy rebates for city, business, state, federal (in USA).

I can only see this being a  viable career if you get your power costs down to zero or it in fact returns money by selling power back to the company.




BTW, if anyone is interested in doing this with me...LMK.  I'm thinking of buying land in Arizona or Colorado.


Oh and mining and being successful is about doing the numbers and having a strategy and maintaining that strategy or change gears if you have absolutely have to.

Do you buy the land to set up the renewable energy generation plant? That would cost a lot of money.

[QuintLeo]

Are there viable wind power sites in those states?

 The good wind power areas I know about are the "corner" of NW Iowa/MN/NE area, parts of Texas, and parts of California.
 I could see some of the mountain passes in AZ and CO being viable, like the Cajon/Tehachapi passes in California.

 AZ for solar is pretty obvious, given how many large commercial sites and experimental plants have been set up there.

[minerman121]

Everyone likes to talk about difficulty rising so profits will decline, when in reality the price will rise with it. Look at Bitcoin. It's always been profitable to mine. The difficulty rose, but so did the price. It was profitable to mine three years ago, it's profitable to mine now. Crazy how that works.

OMG - this ^^^

What you people are all missing the point of is that difficulty acts as a mediator between inflation and deflation. A coin with too many miners generates too many coins, which will be dumped on the market, dropping the price. It will get to the point where there is no point in mining it. Don't be fooled; a majority of miners out there are NOT mining it based on ideology. They are chasing ROI.

Let me give you an example; with Monero. The same power mining a half year ago and the same power mining today on the different difficulties yielded relatively the same profits +/-. But no one talks about that. Why? Because too many idiots are still comparing ASIC resistant Altcoins to Bitcoin mining.

Bitcoin mining took a spike in difficulty because of the release of NEW TECHNOLOGY that hashes faster. It killed the GPU miners. Monero, ETH, ETC and ZEC do not have ASICs. This mysterious spike in difficulty that so many neigh-sayers are boasting; where will it come from?

Yes you can make Mining a career but you are taking a heavy risk. You have to consider many several things.

1. The cost of the rigs and their efficiency.

2. The placement of said rigs. Once you hit a certain amount of rigs your breakers won't be able to cope. They will also generate a crapload of heat. I got 4 rigs in my bedroom and during summer its bad. My breakers can cope though.

3. Cutting costs; locating sources of cheaper equipment and looking for cheaper electricity sources, ie. Solar. Solar took my costs from 0.187AUd to 0.09AUD per kWh. Min you, I am in a pretty decent profit even at 0.187kWh. I also have the luxury of converting the coin from USD to AUD which is at a rate of about 0.76c as of today.

4. Market stability, coin utility; ie. Fundamental Analysis and due diligence.

If you read most of the misguided posts in this thread you will find that the qualms are mainly with difficulty. But no one has taken into account the price rises that accompany difficulty. No one takes into account the fact that Divergence of Dif/Price are short lived. And most of all no one takes into account the REASON BTC dif skyrocketed and why Altcoin Algo's are mitigating this with the resistance of ASIC.

You might not make a full CAREER out of mining. But you will supplement your income with a hefty (tax free in some cases) residual boost, that you can not only CLAIM tax credits on, but claim tax credits on your electricity there-by lowering your overall costs!

[RentGPU]

Thats a very interesting thread here,and the most interesting part that $1k/month ....guys i realized that most ppl here dont know anything about prices worldwide,you are living in realy expensive countries if $1k is not enough , do you know that $1k=20,000 egyptian pound per month and thats a f**kin rich man here, lol, i will give you an example here to clear that situation : uber here in cairo charges 1.5egp/km and thats is $0.075/km ......do your calculations , here i am paying a fixed charge for electricity $20/month no maximum amps just draw as much as your wire can carry .....my question why are you mining if $1k isn't enough ....thats nonsense

[Amph]

Thats a very interesting thread here,and the most interesting part that $1k/month ....guys i realized that most ppl here dont know anything about prices worldwide,you are living in realy expensive countries if $1k is not enough , do you know that $1k=20,000 egyptian pound per month and thats a f**kin rich man here, lol, i will give you an example here to clear that situation : uber here in cairo charges 1.5egp/km and thats is $0.075/km ......do your calculations , here i am paying a fixed charge for electricity $20/month no maximum amps just draw as much as your wire can carry .....my question why are you mining if $1k isn't enough ....thats nonsense

like i said in this thread, regular job give them 1-2k per month, but they want to make 60k with mining...this is nosense to me

mining is becoming as a stable as any other job out there

[RentGPU]

Thats a very interesting thread here,and the most interesting part that $1k/month ....guys i realized that most ppl here dont know anything about prices worldwide,you are living in realy expensive countries if $1k is not enough , do you know that $1k=20,000 egyptian pound per month and thats a f**kin rich man here, lol, i will give you an example here to clear that situation : uber here in cairo charges 1.5egp/km and thats is $0.075/km ......do your calculations , here i am paying a fixed charge for electricity $20/month no maximum amps just draw as much as your wire can carry .....my question why are you mining if $1k isn't enough ....thats nonsense

like i said in this thread, regular job give them 1-2k per month, but they want to make 60k with mining...this is nosense to me

mining is becoming as a stable as any other job out there

Mining became my primary job now and takes all my time ,and by the way if i continued in my previous job as electrical engineer i won't make even half what i am making now from mining and i don't have that insane hardware.....i think they are trying to let newbies out of buisness

[Ambros]

Thats a very interesting thread here,and the most interesting part that $1k/month ....guys i realized that most ppl here dont know anything about prices worldwide,you are living in realy expensive countries if $1k is not enough , do you know that $1k=20,000 egyptian pound per month and thats a f**kin rich man here, lol, i will give you an example here to clear that situation : uber here in cairo charges 1.5egp/km and thats is $0.075/km ......do your calculations , here i am paying a fixed charge for electricity $20/month no maximum amps just draw as much as your wire can carry .....my question why are you mining if $1k isn't enough ....thats nonsense

like i said in this thread, regular job give them 1-2k per month, but they want to make 60k with mining...this is nosense to me

mining is becoming as a stable as any other job out there

Mining became my primary job now and takes all my time ,and by the way if i continued in my previous job as electrical engineer i won't make even half what i am making now from mining and i don't have that insane hardware.....i think they are trying to let newbies out of buisness

As you said you pay 20$/month for electricity, that's pretty unique.
We are thousands of people on this forum and i've never read about anything similar, that's the main reason you are making good money.
We are not trying to scare people, but just make them to think about costs, that are usually as high as mined alt coins

[_javi_]

Living in Cairo is cheap. You cant compare to the rest of the world

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings.jsp

[kadza]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

[Ambros]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

You can start with a couple of 6 GPU rigs made with classic equipment:
- g1840
- h81 pro btc
- rx 470/480 or gtx 1070

If those assumptions are real you can make good money with mining

[Pennywis3]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

With those conditions and 3k$ usd u can make 2x 6GPU rigs with rx 470 8 GB cards.
If a card is hashing at 29Mh/s ETH, thats 12x1,23$ which comes to about 440$/monthly
And thats just mining ETH, if u dual mine with decred of pascal u are looking at close to 500$ monthly ( BTW, even with 10c/Kwh you'd still be making about 400$ ).

Just go for it  

At the moment, mining is in a realy good place and you can make serious profits from it, don't listen much to other people and make your own calculations...

[botmanside]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

buy BTC till its cheap you shall get quicke roi

[Mugtaiya]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

buy BTC till its cheap you shall get quicke roi

For most people, it is better to buy the bitcoin directly.

[RentGPU]

Hi,

After my miss back in the 2011 when i didnt trust Digital currencies i'm willing to start small just for fun and if it gets good i will expand.

I have few questions assuming that i have:

1) No electricity cost
2) No rental
3) No utilities fees
4) Really great server rooms with a lot of cooling

And i am willing to spend $2000-3000 what am i to build GPU rigs to mine altcoins invest into dedicated equipment for mining ? I'm fairly familiar on the topic of crypto currencies  after my miss with BTC back in the day ( sold them way to cheep).

Edit: I chose to ask question here because i saw that some people have free or low cost electricity here.

buy BTC till its cheap you shall get quicke roi

For most people, it is better to buy the bitcoin directly.

I don't agree with you, mining is more fast,fun,safe and profit than buying and holding some coins , you just need to make your calculations and have access to cheap electricity and then give it some time and patience.

[Nikolaj]

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like "you have no clue", when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

are you serious man, it's not like there is only america out there, in kuwait or egypt(just an example) the cost is not that high as you think and electricity is at 1 cent

even in iceland where electricity is 5 cent and the cost is 40% higher than europe, you can still live easily with 1k, 1k is overkill actually

it's not about how much you earn it's about how much you spend also, if you fuck your money in useless stuff, it's not my fault

i think you guys know nothing on how much you need to spend each month to survive

Iceland 1k/month living easily? You're alone and you live with 500 bucks/month?

Pretty hilarious statements (to not mentioning mining in kuwait, sorry but you've got literally no clue about what you're talking) 

500 usd/month probably in a communist block, eating each others

[Kompik]

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like "you have no clue", when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

are you serious man, it's not like there is only america out there, in kuwait or egypt(just an example) the cost is not that high as you think and electricity is at 1 cent

even in iceland where electricity is 5 cent and the cost is 40% higher than europe, you can still live easily with 1k, 1k is overkill actually

it's not about how much you earn it's about how much you spend also, if you fuck your money in useless stuff, it's not my fault

i think you guys know nothing on how much you need to spend each month to survive

Iceland 1k/month living easily? You're alone and you live with 500 bucks/month?

Pretty hilarious statements (to not mentioning mining in kuwait, sorry but you've got literally no clue about what you're talking)

500 usd/month probably in a communist block, eating each others

Haha this is a funny discussion. In Czech Republic 1k USD is about the average GROSS wage ( median is about 900 USD). Actually 60-70% people dont make that amount of money here and they can even have a car and a family! Dont know about Iceland though, that place seems kind of expensive

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Iceland&city1=Reykjavik&country2=Czech+Republic&city2=Brno&displayCurrency=USD

[Nikolaj]

He lives in Italy, where life costs 35/40% more than czech republic.

If living with 500$ it's incompatible with a decent life, how could it be compatible with mining ? (one of the most expensive activities as an "hobbyist")

If someone argues that it's possible in a western europe country, this means the following:

- he never had a  girl, never dated anyone or built a solid relationship
- he never made vacations
- he've never been in museums, cinemas, opera, events, concerts, nothing " expensive" at all
- never had a car, never practiced sports, never had the oportunity to buy complex instruments, never practiced music, never had courses, never.. Etc.
- he won't have ANY oportunity to raise a child, a relationship and a family, or to support himself when in need
- he hadn't any of the things mentioned above, while living with his parents (a rent in italy, for a single room in a decent city, it's almost what he stated) and while abusing of their income (especially if with an age bigger than 30)

The fundamental question, as greatly stated in the book "to be or to possess" (E. Fromm), it's if we need to be, or to possess things in life, but let"s be honest: this is a very costly hobby, and given the amount of time and income that one could expect (low, on average, with a 50k USD budget, high if you invest 500k) it"s pretty clear tha having a backbone of 500$ to support your life and your activity it"s foolish, to say the least.

In iceland:

A coffe 4.5 eur
A rent 2000 eur/month
A beer 13 eur
A car rent: no way...
Food: prepare yourself to starve (restaurant average/ person 40/50 eur if not more)
Clothes: .. .. It's very cold, and all terribly expensive

Yeah, 1k gross in iceland it's fine. Go on, try it and report. Just to get there and return you need to spend from 430 to 700 eur by plane, from europe.

[dagarair]

i have 60 miners and work full time.  I have time to jump in and out of the house though for special launches and stuff.

Basically I don't trust quitting and doing this fulltime with 100+ miners because when I do it, everything will crash =(  FOOKIN BLACK CLOUD!

[sp_]

In iceland:

A coffe 4.5 eur
A rent 2000 eur/month
A beer 13 eur
A car rent: no way...
Food: prepare yourself to starve (restaurant average/ person 40/50 eur if not more)
Clothes: .. .. It's very cold, and all terribly expensive

Yeah, 1k gross in iceland it's fine. Go on, try it and report. Just to get there and return you need to spend from 430 to 700 eur by plane, from europe.

Norway is more expensive than Iceland. Cost of living/labour/taxes.

But you earn around 17EUR an hour flipping burgers at Mcdonalds with no education. (around €2600 a month) Students normally share apartments. You can rent a 3 room apartment for around $2000.
if you share you spend around €700 for the room and you have €1900 for food and other expenses..

[Amph]

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like "you have no clue", when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

are you serious man, it's not like there is only america out there, in kuwait or egypt(just an example) the cost is not that high as you think and electricity is at 1 cent

even in iceland where electricity is 5 cent and the cost is 40% higher than europe, you can still live easily with 1k, 1k is overkill actually

it's not about how much you earn it's about how much you spend also, if you fuck your money in useless stuff, it's not my fault

i think you guys know nothing on how much you need to spend each month to survive

Iceland 1k/month living easily? You're alone and you live with 500 bucks/month?

Pretty hilarious statements (to not mentioning mining in kuwait, sorry but you've got literally no clue about what you're talking) 

500 usd/month probably in a communist block, eating each others

if you think you need more than 500 per month to live alone, you are seriously wasting your money, i don't need any fancy thing like buying coffe at the morning and vacations to be happy

if you want to go to the restaurant every night that's your problem, i can live without any problems alone and 500 a month yes, i already mentioned that this is done without a family, i don't need a family or anything like that

[sp_]

if you think you need more than 500 per month to live alone, you are seriously wasting your money, i don't need any fancy thing like buying coffe at the morning and vacations to be happy

if you want to go to the restaurant every night that's your problem, i can live without any problems alone and 500 a month yes, i already mentioned that this is done without a family, i don't need a family or anything like that

Where are you from?

[Amph]

if you think you need more than 500 per month to live alone, you are seriously wasting your money, i don't need any fancy thing like buying coffe at the morning and vacations to be happy

if you want to go to the restaurant every night that's your problem, i can live without any problems alone and 500 a month yes, i already mentioned that this is done without a family, i don't need a family or anything like that

Where are you from?

as i said italy but that's not the real point, the real point is how many money you take out for your expenditures

if you earn 3k but you spend 4k, even 3k won't be enough and so on...i just live with the most simple needs

[sp_]

as i said italy but that's not the real point, the real point is how many money you take out for your expenditures
if you earn 3k but you spend 4k, even 3k won't be enough and so on...i just live with the most simple needs

True. It's possible to live really cheap in any country.

In Norway there is almost 80% tax on liquor(40%.)

A bottle in the store cost €39



But a chicken cost less than €4.

So you can buy 10 chickens for the price of one bottle of vodka.

[Nikolaj]

you don't need to live under your parent to live with 1k, i can live with 500 and i'm alone, just don't be stupid and build a family with 500 or 1k

again don't say shit like "you have no clue", when you know nothing about the cost of living around the world

if you think that you need 3k a month in every place of earth just to have a normal life, you are the one which is clueless

another thing to add

why in the hell you need to aim at making 60k or 19k a month, when with a regular job you would only make 1k?

let's be equal here, if you want to get rid of your steady job, you need just an income of 1k per month, it can be reached easily by mining any shitcoin if you have proper electricity

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ? That is $12,000 a year and even the poverty rate in Ont is about $18,000 .. You are suggesting surviving in Ontario at 1/3 below the poverty rate. Even people who are old and home bound or disabled would living substantially better than you.

$1k is more like slovakia.


Please share your model for mining $1k on a shit coin .. I'm must be the dumbest miner on the block because I can't find one.

are you serious man, it's not like there is only america out there, in kuwait or egypt(just an example) the cost is not that high as you think and electricity is at 1 cent

even in iceland where electricity is 5 cent and the cost is 40% higher than europe, you can still live easily with 1k, 1k is overkill actually

it's not about how much you earn it's about how much you spend also, if you fuck your money in useless stuff, it's not my fault

i think you guys know nothing on how much you need to spend each month to survive

Iceland 1k/month living easily? You're alone and you live with 500 bucks/month?

Pretty hilarious statements (to not mentioning mining in kuwait, sorry but you've got literally no clue about what you're talking) 

500 usd/month probably in a communist block, eating each others

if you think you need more than 500 per month to live alone, you are seriously wasting your money, i don't need any fancy thing like buying coffe at the morning and vacations to be happy

if you want to go to the restaurant every night that's your problem, i can live without any problems alone and 500 a month yes, i already mentioned that this is done without a family, i don't need a family or anything like that

If you live under a bridge surely 

Nevermind 

[Iranus]

If you want to make a proper profit from mining altcoins, you need to be prepared to convert your coins into the more stable Bitcoin regularly and switch between lots of different altcoins depending on what the profit is at the time.

It's viable, but don't put in all of your money because any investments into altcoins are inherently risky and you should have a backup source of income, preferably as a job in real life as a means of stability.

[Opquar]

If you want to make a proper profit from mining altcoins, you need to be prepared to convert your coins into the more stable Bitcoin regularly and switch between lots of different altcoins depending on what the profit is at the time.

It's viable, but don't put in all of your money because any investments into altcoins are inherently risky and you should have a backup source of income, preferably as a job in real life as a means of stability.

That is what I am doing. I convert most of the mined altcoin into bitcoin and hold some good altcoin.

[BTCBusinessConsult]

My family consists of the wife and I. We live in a very modest 2 bed 2 bath apt, have 0 debt and make over 100k a year.

We spend 1k USD a MONTH ( 250 a week) on groceries at walmart.

People who say you can live in the US just fine on 500 a month are:

Farmers or completely self reliant
Living with Mom and Dad
Free loaders getting full benefits from the government ( and they dont count that as income)
Lying internet trolls

[RentGPU]

If you want to make a proper profit from mining altcoins, you need to be prepared to convert your coins into the more stable Bitcoin regularly and switch between lots of different altcoins depending on what the profit is at the time.

It's viable, but don't put in all of your money because any investments into altcoins are inherently risky and you should have a backup source of income, preferably as a job in real life as a means of stability.

Real life!!, sorry but mining is in real life you are converting this coins to cash to buy something in real life so this coins are real and the machines creating this coins are real also, so the buisness is real and i am making a profit from mining better than any job.

[GMPoison]

My family consists of the wife and I. We live in a very modest 2 bed 2 bath apt, have 0 debt and make over 100k a year.

We spend 1k USD a MONTH ( 250 a week) on groceries at walmart.

People who say you can live in the US just fine on 500 a month are:

Farmers or completely self reliant
Living with Mom and Dad
Free loaders getting full benefits from the government ( and they dont count that as income)
Lying internet trolls

I guess that depends on your definition of "just fine".

I don't doubt that you could live on $500 a month if you live out of your car. Does that count as "just fine"? Probably not, but it is still "living".

[arielbit]

i think i just need to reiterate this...the earth is big my friends..

@Darwin84

500$ a month for parking? from where i live there is no parking fee around here, there is insurance that cost 6 to 11 $ a month, a computer is already a toy, i don't get why people want to play with gadgets, i have a 24 inch monitor and a lot of GPUs to use for gaming. a used motherboard for my mining rigs costs 28$ max, for bike injury you just need an alcohol and terramycin.

That's downtown Toronto. $300-$600 a month, depends on security and covered or not and that's just work, you need another $100 or so to park at home.


Great so you have a life of GPUs and gaming in a deadbeat farming town and you fix yourself with alcohol.  

That's a waste of life to most people.

I'm not judging but don't pass this off as advice. You'll be on the streets of a big city soon enough when you're first major life upset happens that you can't fix with $500.

Good luck

i'm in a city, in a province..if you read up thread i said i can do 300-350$ "happily" ... the minimum wage here is ~175$ LOL ..i'm fine with 500$  

my location is a comfortable one, i'm even planning to buy a piece of property around here with my savings, 3 malls are in a biking/walking distance, a 4th one is being made, two hospitals are walking distance and a 5 minute commute to the city square.

a metropolis provides higher wages because of higher standard of living..here is a sweet blend of provincial and city living

$200 - $300 i can spend (vacation) ~4 days in this paradise and eat a lot of delicious seafoods



EDIT: in a nearby island they filmed Survivor series...damn those people prevented me from going to an island nearby (there is a mandate not to go there due to filming at that time) bummer!

[fathur.aza]

hobbies also can produce something more than a career

[Tmdz]

My family consists of the wife and I. We live in a very modest 2 bed 2 bath apt, have 0 debt and make over 100k a year.

We spend 1k USD a MONTH ( 250 a week) on groceries at walmart.

People who say you can live in the US just fine on 500 a month are:

Farmers or completely self reliant
Living with Mom and Dad
Free loaders getting full benefits from the government ( and they dont count that as income)
Lying internet trolls

I guess that depends on your definition of "just fine".

I don't doubt that you could live on $500 a month if you live out of your car. Does that count as "just fine"? Probably not, but it is still "living".

There's nothing wrong with living out of your car.  No rent, you can cook, shower, grow dope and do whatever the fuck you want like a normal person.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGDJ2tGA4F8

[dagarair]

pretty sure you won't have sufficient power to run miners out of a car..... 

[QuintLeo]

My family consists of the wife and I. We live in a very modest 2 bed 2 bath apt, have 0 debt and make over 100k a year.

We spend 1k USD a MONTH ( 250 a week) on groceries at walmart.

People who say you can live in the US just fine on 500 a month are:

Farmers or completely self reliant
Living with Mom and Dad
Free loaders getting full benefits from the government ( and they dont count that as income)
Lying internet trolls

 What the HECK are you buying to manage to go through $500/month on food per person?
 Steak or seafood every night?
 Talk about living high on the hog - no wonder you don't believe folks can live on less when you waste so much on fancy food alone!

 I do pretty much all of my grocery shopping at Walmart now (they're by far the low cost leader here) and I'm perhaps going through $250/month and probably half of that is for my excessive soda consumption.
 Used to go through less then $200/month in Iowa but we had low-cost grocery stores in Cedar Rapids (Save-A-Lot and Fareway BOTH consistantly beat Walmart pricing on almost anything I bought regularly - Save-A-Lot REGULAR pricing on Pepsi products in particular was often beating SALE pricing out of any other store in the area).

 I doubt I could live on $500 a month - but $700 *NOT* counting electric to feed my miners is more than my budget has been most of the last decade, living BY MYSELF in my own home (or currently my side of a rental duplex) with ZERO income from any government program (unless you count using my VA medical benefits instead of having to pay crazy rates for ObamaCare).

 No, I do not farm - I don't even garden.

 I just don't waste a lot on excessive fancy and call it "very modest".


 Oh wait.
 Make over 100k a year.
 No wonder you can't believe folks can live comfortably on a lot less, you're probably in a VERY HIGH COST OF LIVING area like NYC or most of Southern California where 50k/year is bloody near poverty wages.

 I do have to wonder what you consider a "very modest 2 bed 2 bath apt" - I've never SEEN a 2 bedroom apartment that sported 2 bathrooms unless it was double or MORE the cost of a low-end 2 bedroom apartment for the area, AKA not even close to being "modest".
 Over or under 800 square feet?

[QuintLeo]

A couple of gross details to point out.  Hopefully you can correct me or correct yourself.

$1k / month  ??  

Who can or will live on a $1k a month ?

 I spent almost a decade living on less than $9000/year.

 To be fair, I owned my mobile home - but I got it for $2500 early on in "The Great Recession" and turned around and sold it for $8000 about 8 years later with no more than a "fix what went wrong with it while I was in it" into it.
 Even had I had to invest the $8000 into it instead of the $2500 I got it for, it still would have cost me less than $100/month had I gotten NOTHING out of it in the end - instead I made a PROFIT on it (and that profit is a large part of what financed my move to Washington State and the expansion of my cryptomining farm last summer).

 I didn't pay income taxes - both Iowa and the Feds did not require income taxes to even be FILED if you made $9000 or less a year all of those years - and since I never owed income taxes, I could claim "exempt" and not have taxes taken out in the first place.

 I rode the bus most of that time. I did get benefit from a "low income" program from the bus system, but that only saved me $15-$20 a month in the months I was working so it wouldn't have been a major issue had the program not existed and all of those years I'd STILL have been under $9000 a year even if I counted the savings from the "low income" program as income (the last year it *might* have tipped me to just over $9000 - but I'd have STILL been under the Federal "no tax" threshold due to inflation adjustments - since the savings didn't count as income, it was a non-factor).

 Some of my income was unemployment - I was typically working a total of 5-6 months out of a year, on an intermittant work basis every year in that timeframe due to the nature of the work I did. The months I did not work I just paid for a $3 day-pass fare (STANDARD for that bus system, not discounted at all) for a once-a-week run errands and grocery shop run, and skipped the monthly pass.

 My food budget was around $200/month the last year, less before that as prices did increase occasionally.

 My lot rent was between $200 and $260 that entire time (mobile home living is CHEAP, an apartment of similar size would have cost me $400-$600 per month instead depending on the year).


 I could have gotten by on LESS than $500/month most of that time, had I been willing to go through the hoops and hassle to apply for food stamps.
 The last couple years would have needed more, between my expanding cryptocoin efforts (which I DO count in my income) and cost increases on the rent and electric rate increases.
 I did look into Section 8 at one point (does NOT cover mobile homes it turns out) but I quickly figured out t would have cost me more to live in a Section 8 apartment than to stay where I was at, I'd have been stuck in an apartment that was a LOT smaller, and they would not have covered the cost for me to move OR the cost of the storage place I would have needed for my book collection.



  Just because YOU are used to living very high on the hog on a 6-figure income and don't know how to economise doesn't mean NOBODY can manage it, and still live comfortably.

[wartimekillers]

my monthly wage are less than $500 and I'm an sales analyst, create complex sales reporting everyday working full time in a Bank, i have a wife and two kids, living regular life, Mining give me more than my monthly salary, so i can eat at restaurant, buy vehicles, and travelling.
Really hope i live in scandinavia, the salary and the black metal is good

[Sanguintan]

my monthly wage are less than $500 and I'm an sales analyst, create complex sales reporting everyday working full time in a Bank, i have a wife and two kids, living regular life, Mining give me more than my monthly salary, so i can eat at restaurant, buy vehicles, and travelling.
Really hope i live in scandinavia, the salary and the black metal is good

As long as your salary can support your life style, it is a good life.