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Author Topic: Ideas / Possible SOLUTION to NEVER-ENDING BLOCKCHAIN..  (Read 5897 times)
Killdozer
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March 14, 2013, 10:34:37 PM
 #21

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Another Idea could be to limit spend TX's to maybe 4 decimal places?
Whatever solution will be found, messing with decimal places is a bad idea.
No one knows how valueable bitcoins are going to be in the future.
If any change should be done, it should be increasing the possible decimal places, not decreasing them.
SD sending out transactions of less value than transaction fee should be dealt with in some other way.

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Sukrim
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March 14, 2013, 11:20:49 PM
 #22

EDIT: Well actually the fee does present a legitimate problem, and it would be hard to make this system work without any incentive like that. Hmm...
The incentive would be that even though it does not bring income, it reduces cost (in the sense of making the unspent outputs smaller).

A stronger counter argument could be that colored coins might get harder to track, on the other hand this stuff would work probably better on a merge-mined chain anyways...

One of the other questions (which is still under debate) is, if block space should be limited - if it is limited, "defragging" the unspent transactions is going to be costly and either has to be enforced by rules (e.g. "after latest 1 year with no transaction there HAS to be a refresh, to allow for a sliding blochchain") or it will happen out of necessity (having more unspent TX is more expensive than accepting regular transactions) of miners. If block size is unlimited (or practically unlimited), something like a shorter sliding block chain is easier to implement, as the next limiting factor then is probably rather the bandwidth (and refresh-transactions can be precalculated, so other nodes only need the TX-hash) between miners and network than block space.

The edge case would be to have these transaction in every block, meaning every block would contain a full set of all addresses with a balance - downloading all headers since genesis and 1 block is enough. However, one either needs then to precalculate a lot of refreshes (as a big part of blocks will be refreshes) and just receive the tiny delta of actual transactions each new block or a really fast internet connection.

The longer the chain becomes, the more additional "junk" is stored (transactions that could be pruned) but the smaller blocks can get due to fewer refreshes. The current chain is the other edge case - all blocks are needed to get the current set of unspent outputs and 0 refreshes are in the chain.

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March 15, 2013, 04:34:01 AM
Last edit: March 15, 2013, 04:46:55 AM by bitfreak!
 #23

The incentive would be that even though it does not bring income, it reduces cost (in the sense of making the unspent outputs smaller).
Yeah I've been thinking about it some more and it may work even without the fees. There is still benefits to doing it, and I'm sure that if this was implemented there would be people who work on building these refresh transactions. When they broadcast these refresh transactions, miners will have an incentive to include them in their blocks even without the fee because they would understand the benefit of it. Of course not all miners would accept these transactions, but I believe enough would to make it work. Still it would probably be much faster and much more efficient if they had a monetary incentive to include the refresh transactions in their blocks.

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March 15, 2013, 05:27:39 AM
 #24

This is exactly the 'rolling block chain' approach (option 3) I favored. These transactions do not need to be broadcasted, they can be made by miners themselves. Also you can add a rule that the inputs must be from blocks of say one year ago at least, then any miner can assemble the transaction and charge a fixed transaction fee. The downside is there is a slight chance that user transactions can conflict with it, but I think anyways there needs to be a way to cancel an unconfirmable transaction, so probably not a big issue.


Regarding block chain size, I observe there are a couple lines of possible development in this front:

1) Ultraprune in bitcoin (large downloadable checkpoint of unspent outputs)
2) Balance based ledger block (this approach seems to have been taken by ripple)
3) Relocating unspent outputs forward in block chain

I am favoring 3) because of ease of implementation. Overall I think the most efficient is probably 2) but it's a costly redesign for bitcoin.

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