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Author Topic: Coinbase banned Germany & Luxembourg  (Read 6469 times)
Bitcotalk
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July 08, 2016, 07:31:01 PM
 #61

It seems that they banned the members of Germany because of the government of Germany, You government have banned that currency so for not involving you in any problem they have banned you people from there and informed you about that.
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onleines (OP)
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July 09, 2016, 10:40:18 AM
 #62


Coinbase was not banned. The issue is that ALL the exchangers including Coinbase MUST have a financial license in EU. Coinbase has licenses only in USA. Germany is not joking when it's about finances and that's why Coinbase removed this country from their list. Smiley


There is actually not an European Rule that you must have an license.

The European Commission plans this rules which must be setup in national laws till 2017

Tackling terrorist financing risks linked to virtual currencies: to prevent misuse of virtual currencies for money laundering and terrorist financing purposes, the Commission proposes to bring virtual currency exchange platforms and custodian wallet providers under the scope of the Anti-Money Laundering Directive. These entities will have to apply customer due diligence controls when exchanging virtual for real currencies, ending the anonymity associated with such exchanges;


The question is "Why does only Germany banns Coinbase and localbitcoins?"
What is with the other european countries?

The second question what will happened with the other bitcoin exchanges like Kraken, Circle and so on? Will they banned also in the next days?

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July 09, 2016, 10:50:45 AM
 #63

I think the German government doesn't want to allow Coinbase to operate without a license in the country because they most probably would like to collect tax on the profits of the exchange. Germans in general are pretty strict when it comes to taxes and rules compared to other countries where the governments are more lenient towards taxing foreign businesses. However I do think that US companies will need to obtain licenses in order to operate in the European Union.
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July 09, 2016, 11:11:37 AM
 #64


Coinbase was not banned. The issue is that ALL the exchangers including Coinbase MUST have a financial license in EU. Coinbase has licenses only in USA. Germany is not joking when it's about finances and that's why Coinbase removed this country from their list. Smiley


There is actually not an European Rule that you must have an license.

The European Commission plans this rules which must be setup in national laws till 2017

Tackling terrorist financing risks linked to virtual currencies: to prevent misuse of virtual currencies for money laundering and terrorist financing purposes, the Commission proposes to bring virtual currency exchange platforms and custodian wallet providers under the scope of the Anti-Money Laundering Directive. These entities will have to apply customer due diligence controls when exchanging virtual for real currencies, ending the anonymity associated with such exchanges;


The question is "Why does only Germany banns Coinbase and localbitcoins?"
What is with the other european countries?

The second question what will happened with the other bitcoin exchanges like Kraken, Circle and so on? Will they banned also in the next days?


This is a completion for an existing law.Even now, you must have a financial license if you operate as e-currency exchanger. You are transmitting money(you work with fiat; receive and send money) and this thing  follows under an existing EU law. You need to be PI(payment institution) or E-money institution(EMI).

Coinbase does not have a such license in EU( indeed they are licensed in almost all the USA but these licenses are not passporting to EU) and that's why they preferred to remove Germany from their list. Why Germany? Because this country specified that all the BTC trades require a license.

According to BaFin ( German Federal Financial Supervisory Authority), as a rule, commercial trading of Bitcoins is regulated and more than that, anyone who purchases and sells Bitcoins commercially in his own name for the account of others conducts principal broking services and has to obtain a licence by BaFin

So, the EU financial law regarding to the companies who run an exchanger already exists. They must be licensed now too. That's why Bitstamp and Circle already took these licenses. Do you think that they wanted to spare a lot of money for an useless thing? Smiley No! It is mandatory if you want to operate legally and with the peace of the mind in EU.

So, Circle has a financial license in EU and Kraken is illegal(both in USA and EU).

Kraken is operating without being MSB in any state from US and they have no license in EU too...What does mean? It's an illegal company. Smiley Yes, they are very vocal in media but they are...out of law.

The new article that you quote will make the existing law more clearly AND more, all the "wallets" will have to get a such license if they want to have clients from EU.

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July 09, 2016, 12:31:46 PM
 #65


So, Circle has a financial license in EU and Kraken is illegal(both in USA and EU).

Kraken is operating without being MSB in any state from US and they have no license in EU too...What does mean? It's an illegal company. Smiley Yes, they are very vocal in media but they are...out of law.


Maybe Kraken is under the Umbrella of Fidor. They use this bank, also bitcoin.de, for german customer and Kraken did have a very strong KYC check for Germans.
Make sense. 

Very good explanation. Many likes from my side.

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July 09, 2016, 12:48:47 PM
 #66

Hey,

I am logged into my account Coinbase to buy Bitcoins.

I get the following message:

Sorry! Buy & Sell not available in Germany

We are not able to Provide exchanging bitcoin in your region yet. Consider Contacting your local government. Learn More>


It seems to be also affected Luxembourg alongside Germany.
The rest of Europe (32) are not affected.

Since Localbitcoin is banned in Germany, seems probably because the German "local government" there which prohibit.

Does anyone have any info, is on what legal basis prohibited here?

Well since there are regulations banning bitcoins in your area the best way to have bitcoins is not to buy them but produce them through online jobs that pays bitcoin. In our country there is no declaration banning ownership or use of bitcoins but given the area that I am living in there are no place where you can purchase bitcoin, if I wanted to but I will need to travel 43 kilometers but there's no guarantee that I can buy one. The best alternative is to register on online jobs or get a signature campaign so you can own bitcoins. Hope this helps.
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July 09, 2016, 01:41:27 PM
Last edit: July 09, 2016, 01:53:32 PM by mayax
 #67


So, Circle has a financial license in EU and Kraken is illegal(both in USA and EU).

Kraken is operating without being MSB in any state from US and they have no license in EU too...What does mean? It's an illegal company. Smiley Yes, they are very vocal in media but they are...out of law.


Maybe Kraken is under the Umbrella of Fidor. They use this bank, also bitcoin.de, for german customer and Kraken did have a very strong KYC check for Germans.
Make sense.  

Very good explanation. Many likes from my side.

"very strong KYC" does not mean a financial license. also, they request documents without having authority to do that. only a licensed company can request documents to its clients. those document must be stored and reviewed by certain persons from company and according with strict rules (defined in license).

"very strong KYC" cannot be an excuse when the Feds will shut down Kraken. It will happen sooner or later.  Many exchangers were closed(and put them in jail) due to the same reason, unlicensed money transmitter.

Kraken is not under "the Umbrella of Fidor" because the bank license cannot be passported to other company. Smiley  Kraken is partially using Fidor for its EURO payments.  The rest of them are processed by Paycash Smiley

so, all the people who are sending documents(IDs, bills, bank statements) to these illegal companies are doing it on their own risk.
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July 11, 2016, 12:30:51 PM
 #68

That's fantastic. As a German I have the choice between Bitcoin.de and Bitstamp. Otherwise no other alternatives?

I would not discuss the advantages and disadvantages of these two suppliers. But I would like to choose where I buy my Bitcoins and not let me dictate this from my government.

What's next?

Can I as a merchant accepting bitcoin? or the user must then identify?
Did my order and my bitcoin address in combination with my identity reported to the government, NSA, FBI, KGB and so on?

You can use Kraken,

I wouldn't https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4s7biu/kraken_has_not_released_23000_of_my_funds_and/
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