A slap to the FBI. Online drug sales triple after Silk Road closure

[Wind_FURY]

We all know that Ross Ulbricht was made an example of and was given a sentence so hard that they thought it will discourage others from following the footsteps of DPR. They were wrong.

NBC news has reported that online drug sales have tripled since the closure of the Silk Road. http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/online-drug-sales-triple-after-silk-road-closure-n627576

This is a link to the study that was made about it. https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR1600/RR1607/RAND_RR1607.pdf

This could be a silent victory for all the supporters of DPR and deep inside they are laughing at the authorities. I know I am.

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[gentlemand]

It's probably the purest definition of whack-a-mole that there'll ever be. People like drugs. People like buying things online. Once someone manages to successfully decentralise it, though I've no idea how you could do that in terms of escrow, they'll be with us until the end of time.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

It's probably the purest definition of whack-a-mole that there'll ever be. People like drugs. People like buying things online. Once someone manages to successfully decentralise it, though I've no idea how you could do that in terms of escrow, they'll be with us until the end of time.

Yep, knock one drug empire down and about 3.1415 drug empires pop up in its place.  It's a vicious circle.  People may not realize that in 1900 you could buy morphine and cocaine over the counter at pharmacies.  And the world still functioned.  Today we have drug cartels beheading people to send messages to their competitors.  The alphabet agencies ought to modify their policies, and the president and all his men ought to mandate they do so.  All of the laws to fight the war on drugs have failed, spectacularly so.  There's no need to spend more fucking money on this.  Viva la Silk Road.

[QuestionAuthority]

It's probably the purest definition of whack-a-mole that there'll ever be. People like drugs. People like buying things online. Once someone manages to successfully decentralise it, though I've no idea how you could do that in terms of escrow, they'll be with us until the end of time.

Perfect summary.

/thread

[Shiroslullaby]

You guys act like the agencies actually want to win the war.
If they eliminated all drugs  they would be out of a job. 
They aren't trying to get rid of drugs. 
They have a system set up where they get to buy cars, guns, planes, all types of high-tech equipment,
employ police on the street, secret undercover agents, prosecutors and judges, and a prison industry to lock all the offenders up.
Its a business, and they are making a ton of money off a neverending "war".

[Yakamoto]

You guys act like the agencies actually want to win the war.
If they eliminated all drugs  they would be out of a job. 
They aren't trying to get rid of drugs. 
They have a system set up where they get to buy cars, guns, planes, all types of high-tech equipment,
employ police on the street, secret undercover agents, prosecutors and judges, and a prison industry to lock all the offenders up.
Its a business, and they are making a ton of money off a neverending "war".

Of course they don't want to win the war, not very many business owners (or people with relatively safe jobs in a "war") want it to end, as long as they're getting paid. Everyone just wants to maintain a stable job and have some sort of income, and there are very few people that don't want to be doing something. And the businesses need someone to be buying guns, bullets, testing equipment, and everything else they need, so they're happy too. As long as there is some enemy to be fought, there is money to be made.

[7788bitcoin]

Silk Road is only one of the many many online channels where drugs are traded. No surprise to me that Silk Road closure has no impact on internet drug sale.

[~Bitcoin~]

There are many way people can sell drugs online and that silkroad only been a good and easier medium for that before but even it goes down there are many other which pops up and still in operation over darknet. All love online shopping these days and there is no suprise that people will not miss the chance of buying drugs easily and anonymously online.

[pooya87]

the fight between FBI (law enforcement in general) and illegal activities like buying drugs is a never-ending-battle. it doesn't matter if they close down one shop, another will pop up. and bitcoin in all this is only the icing on the cake.

[Doamader]

The funny thing is the fbi has just closed the silk road, an online way to traffic, and the real ones keeps seeling and buying all the stuffs, for several years already. Bitcoin camed and they closed it but the fiat keeps circulating for severals years, they tryed to put bitcoin as darkeness currencie for no reason, they should put the dark currencie as the fiat.

[pinkflower]

You guys act like the agencies actually want to win the war.
If they eliminated all drugs  they would be out of a job.  
They aren't trying to get rid of drugs.  
They have a system set up where they get to buy cars, guns, planes, all types of high-tech equipment,
employ police on the street, secret undercover agents, prosecutors and judges, and a prison industry to lock all the offenders up.
Its a business, and they are making a ton of money off a neverending "war".

This is a good point. The men at the top of the order must think all of us are really stupid. We fight and bicker against each other and they are laughing all the way to the bank.

I saw the documentary about Ross Ulbricht and he is far from what the media portrayed him to be as this evil criminal mastermind. I find him to be a smart, loving and gentle person. His sentence was indeed too harsh.

[Kakmakr]

Silkroad only opened the door and lead the way to show criminals how to trade drugs online. The customers prefer not to deal on shady street corners where they get mugged and robbed and even killed. They want to sit in the safety of their homes high on coke, press a button and then the drugs gets delivered to them.

We life in a world of convenience, where people become more lazy every day. ^hmmmmm^

[JeffBrad12]

NBC news has reported that online drug sales have tripled since the closure of the Silk Road. http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/online-drug-sales-triple-after-silk-road-closure-n627576

The closure of silk road is not giving meaningful impact, and this fact is unexpected. The way is always there for them to selling a drugs. and until when this is will end?

[NorrisK]

I don't think it is the FBIs fault by closing down Silk Road. If they had left it open, Silk Road would be three times bigger (or more) by now and drug sales would still have trippled.

The only thing now is that there are numerous places where people go to buy rather than one, which makes it more difficult to keep an eye on.

All business is shifting online. You order your electronics and even groceries online now. Those numbers probably also trippled in the same time. Would anyone really expect the drug trade not to follow a similar trend? In a few years every post office might have drug dogs to pick the packets out..

[Mzie]

Triple , and which website are they buying from?

[yayayo]

It's probably the purest definition of whack-a-mole that there'll ever be. People like drugs. People like buying things online. Once someone manages to successfully decentralise it, though I've no idea how you could do that in terms of escrow, they'll be with us until the end of time.

Exactly. Even draconic sentences won't help to stop people from buying and using drugs. There are a lot of (Asian) countries that have extremely strict drug laws, yet drug use is far from extinct in these countries. If governments had a real interest in reducing drug abuse, it would be much better to focus on education on the user's side rather than illusory trying to drain supply (which will only drive up prices and make drug use more dangerous).

Ironically, the Silk Road closure and sentencing of Ulbricht led to a decentralization of the marketplaces, which will make it much harder to control. The media exposure of the case may have even encouraged users to search for drug offerings in the so-called "dark web".

ya.ya.yo!

[QuestionAuthority]

It's probably the purest definition of whack-a-mole that there'll ever be. People like drugs. People like buying things online. Once someone manages to successfully decentralise it, though I've no idea how you could do that in terms of escrow, they'll be with us until the end of time.

Exactly. Even draconic sentences won't help to stop people from buying and using drugs. There are a lot of (Asian) countries that have extremely strict drug laws, yet drug use is far from extinct in these countries. If governments had a real interest in reducing drug abuse, it would be much better to focus on education on the user's side rather than illusory trying to drain supply (which will only drive up prices and make drug use more dangerous).

Ironically, the Silk Road closure and sentencing of Ulbricht led to a decentralization of the marketplaces, which will make it much harder to control. The media exposure of the case may have even encouraged users to search for drug offerings in the so-called "dark web".

ya.ya.yo!

That's right and here's your proof:

Portugal in 2001 became the first European country to officially abolish all criminal penalties for personal possession of drugs, including marijuana, cocaine, heroin and methamphetamine.

"Judging by every metric, decriminalization in Portugal has been a resounding success," says Glenn Greenwald, an attorney, author and fluent Portuguese speaker, who conducted the research. "It has enabled the Portuguese government to manage and control the drug problem far better than virtually every other Western country does."

Compared to the European Union and the U.S., Portugal's drug use numbers are impressive. Following decriminalization, Portugal had the lowest rate of lifetime marijuana use in people over 15 in the E.U.: 10%. The most comparable figure in America is in people over 12: 39.8%. Proportionally, more Americans have used cocaine than Portuguese have used marijuana.

But there is a movement afoot in the U.S., in the legislatures of New York State, California and Massachusetts, to reconsider our overly punitive drug laws. Recently, Senators Jim Webb and Arlen Specter proposed that Congress create a national commission, not unlike Portugal's, to deal with prison reform and overhaul drug-sentencing policy. As Webb noted, the U.S. is home to 5% of the global population but 25% of its prisoners.

Source: http://content.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

[155UE]

Instead of deterring the sales of drug trafficing they inadvertently encouraged it's success 

[BitHodler]

I think the increased popularity will only grow in the coming years as it has never been this easy to buy drugs just from behind your computer.

Even certain Youtubers are showing how easy it is to buy a few gram of cocaine or weed and receive it via mail...

[Doamader]

I think the increased popularity will only grow in the coming years as it has never been this easy to buy drugs just from behind your computer.

Even certain Youtubers are showing how easy it is to buy a few gram of cocaine or weed and receive it via mail...

Well the big problem around online sells and buys that must be trust, something silk road were giving to the costumers, i dont know how it worked, but it were working. Fbi has major issues to handle, the fiat criminal problems but they tryed to stop bitcoin to become one more problem.

[Mikestang]

Making something illegal has never once stopped people from producing or acquiring it, never ever never.  Prohibition is a failed methodology.

[Hueylewis]

free Ross Ulbricht !!

[designerusa]

We all know that Ross Ulbricht was made an example of and was given a sentence so hard that they thought it will discourage others from following the footsteps of DPR. They were wrong.

NBC news has reported that online drug sales have tripled since the closure of the Silk Road. http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/online-drug-sales-triple-after-silk-road-closure-n627576

This is a link to the study that was made about it. https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR1600/RR1607/RAND_RR1607.pdf

This could be a silent victory for all the supporters of DPR and deep inside they are laughing at the authorities. I know I am.

as everyone see, drug trade cant be easy with silk road or bitcoin . if somebody needs to buy some drugs , he or she can reach them with another resources. no matter what condition they are in, they can buy drugs if they want to make it happen.

[TippingPoint]

It might possibly be better for people to buy drugs from home, over the internet, than having people go to street corners, in bad neighborhoods, after dark, to buy drugs.

[Kprawn]

Silkroad and all the publicity it received only increased the awareness of the existence of these sites. Previously people would not even have considered buying drugs online, because these sites were

targeted and most of them were honey traps. Now with the decentralization of these markets, the sites stays online much longer and they flourish in these circumstances. The take down of Silkroad was

just a Band-Aid on a open wound. 

[Cryptonitex]

So, if they shut down silk road, and sales rose up 3x
what are people buying these drugs from now? Is there something more popular than silk road now?

[TippingPoint]

According to the 200-page RAND report in the first post, the process involves using TOR, and finding the deepnet address of a site like AlphaBay (they list several in the report).  You cannot get to the sites from the open net.

I don't take any drugs.

[QuestionAuthority]

Here's the sad truth for Ulbrich and all people convicted of nonviolent drug crimes. The US has no retroactive clemency, amnesty laws automatically releasing prisoners when the law changes. Presidential or gubernatorial commutations are a PR no-no and almost never done. Even if all drugs af any kind were instantly made legal the previously convicted would remain in the custody of the profit monger the Corrections Corporation of America.

[richardsNY]

Making something illegal has never once stopped people from producing or acquiring it, never ever never.  Prohibition is a failed methodology.

Prohibition of something doesn't work, that's right. Especially when it comes to a product (drugs) that sees it demand increasing and increasing. Beside that, it's normal that the sales in this part of the market is going through the roof. Dealers from the streets more and more start to shift their business to these so called black markets. Where they normally only sell their stuff in their local area, they can now target a world wide audience.

[Wind_FURY]

I don't think it is the FBIs fault by closing down Silk Road. If they had left it open, Silk Road would be three times bigger (or more) by now and drug sales would still have trippled.

The only thing now is that there are numerous places where people go to buy rather than one, which makes it more difficult to keep an eye on.

All business is shifting online. You order your electronics and even groceries online now. Those numbers probably also trippled in the same time. Would anyone really expect the drug trade not to follow a similar trend? In a few years every post office might have drug dogs to pick the packets out..

That is not the point. The point is in over 50 years of their "war on drugs" the illegal drugs industry keeps getting bigger and bigger. The cartels are getting richer and are increasing in political influence. What they are doing is not effective and they are only wasting tax payer's money. What good did getting Ulbricht in prison bring? Nothing.

[MyBTT]

You cut off the head, two more grow back. When the big dog goes down, all the small ones try to get the alpha spot. We see that happening right now.

[Yakamoto]

Making something illegal has never once stopped people from producing or acquiring it, never ever never.  Prohibition is a failed methodology.

Prohibition of something doesn't work, that's right. Especially when it comes to a product (drugs) that sees it demand increasing and increasing. Beside that, it's normal that the sales in this part of the market is going through the roof. Dealers from the streets more and more start to shift their business to these so called black markets. Where they normally only sell their stuff in their local area, they can now target a world wide audience.

It's true, it does end up moving dealers from small "home-grown businesses" into an international market where they grow rapidly. Stopping the war on drugs on the streets can go and move it in a direction towards more digitized and clandestine markets, which allows for it to grow rapidly and grow far bigger than it would in an average system. It's something working directly against those who want to mitigate the amount of drugs available.

[Kakmakr]

Here's the sad truth for Ulbrich and all people convicted of nonviolent drug crimes. The US has no retroactive clemency, amnesty laws automatically releasing prisoners when the law changes. Presidential or gubernatorial commutations are a PR no-no and almost never done. Even if all drugs af any kind were instantly made legal the previously convicted would remain in the custody of the profit monger the Corrections Corporation of America.

If you break the law that was implemented at the time, you should pay the price. The drug trade has more far reaching consequences than simply being illegal products. There are associated crimes directly attributed to these products that needs to be controlled to protect the community.

People steal to buy drugs, people drive under the influence of drugs and kill other people in the process. Drugs should never be legalized. Alcohol is legal, and look at all the problems we are being faced because of that. Just last week one of my friends died because of alcohol related problems. ^hmmmm^

[QuestionAuthority]

Here's the sad truth for Ulbrich and all people convicted of nonviolent drug crimes. The US has no retroactive clemency, amnesty laws automatically releasing prisoners when the law changes. Presidential or gubernatorial commutations are a PR no-no and almost never done. Even if all drugs af any kind were instantly made legal the previously convicted would remain in the custody of the profit monger the Corrections Corporation of America.

If you break the law that was implemented at the time, you should pay the price. The drug trade has more far reaching consequences than simply being illegal products. There are associated crimes directly attributed to these products that needs to be controlled to protect the community.

People steal to buy drugs, people drive under the influence of drugs and kill other people in the process. Drugs should never be legalized. Alcohol is legal, and look at all the problems we are being faced because of that. Just last week one of my friends died because of alcohol related problems. ^hmmmm^

Yeah, that's one argument I suppose. That same argument can be said about prescription drugs too. Prescription drugs kill around 100,000 people per year in the US. Illegal drug overdoses kill about 17,000. Which one is worse? You could argue that prescription drugs help people but are abused. You could argue that illegal drugs are a personal choice and not pushed on people like prescriptions are. The debate is endless.

The only reality that's indisputable is that governments and government contractors make a ton of money from pandering to pharmaceutical companies and from the "war" on drugs. Remove the criminal nature of drugs and put treatment programs in place instead and you will have a better outcome for everyone. Portugal did it with unbelievable success. Unfortunately, that will never happen because of the amount of money supporting the status quo.

[manselr]

It's an never ending battle. I don't understand why they even bother, no matter how many times you close Silk Road, by the time you catch the guy there are 10 news Silk Roads. Why can't adults take drugs freely? And I don't even drink beer.

[Red-Apple]

It's an never ending battle. I don't understand why they even bother, no matter how many times you close Silk Road, by the time you catch the guy there are 10 news Silk Roads. Why can't adults take drugs freely? And I don't even drink beer.

what are you suggesting? they give up fighting against drugs and the cartel
that never works, it is not just about adults using drugs freely it is mostly about all the crime and other harms that it inflicts on the society.

[eternalgloom]

It might possibly be better for people to buy drugs from home, over the internet, than having people go to street corners, in bad neighborhoods, after dark, to buy drugs.

Yeah I'd say it's a lot safer to buy your drugs online, certainly if you live in the US, where drugs are being sold by people (gangs) who carry guns.
Even in Europe, where drug dealers are less likely to carry guns, you'd probably be safer buying online, since the chances of getting busted are lower by buying online.

I'm saying this based on anecdotal evidence, so it might not be the case that all drug dealers in the US are part of a gang or carry guns, but it just appears to me that buying drugs in Europe is generally safer than buying it in the US.

[Patatas]

We all know that Ross Ulbricht was made an example of and was given a sentence so hard that they thought it will discourage others from following the footsteps of DPR. They were wrong.

NBC news has reported that online drug sales have tripled since the closure of the Silk Road. http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/online-drug-sales-triple-after-silk-road-closure-n627576

This is a link to the study that was made about it. https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR1600/RR1607/RAND_RR1607.pdf

This could be a silent victory for all the supporters of DPR and deep inside they are laughing at the authorities. I know I am.

The irony is,they're using the same place for all the trades IE tor which is developed by the NSA.You think they're not aware of all the illegal trades that is silk road clones still exists there ? You're wrong!If they want to,they can always bring down the sites but they won't!Its just like Pablo's case US government was well aware of his illegal routes to America,since everyone was getting their cuts,everything was fair!

[bitdumper]

that right insted of being afraid of this incident everyone just looked on the brightside and only see how much profit they got and they are also finding opportinuties and when silkroad got down they take their chances

[LFC_Bitcoin]

We all know that Ross Ulbricht was made an example of and was given a sentence so hard that they thought it will discourage others from following the footsteps of DPR. They were wrong.

NBC news has reported that online drug sales have tripled since the closure of the Silk Road. http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/online-drug-sales-triple-after-silk-road-closure-n627576

This is a link to the study that was made about it. https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR1600/RR1607/RAND_RR1607.pdf

This could be a silent victory for all the supporters of DPR and deep inside they are laughing at the authorities. I know I am.

Tripled? Jeez, I didn't think stats like that would be possible, might have a little read up on the links you left here

[xdrpx]

Thing is everytime another Silkroad gets raided, an equally large amount of Bitcoins are confiscated by the Federal Bureau, and when that happens the Bitcoin's price falls a bit. It again falls a bit more when they put it on an auction. So afterall are they aiding the Government to have more control on the price of Bitcoin by not keeping their funds and identity safe?

[countryfree]

This is a link to the study that was made about it. https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR1600/RR1607/RAND_RR1607.pdf

I would not give much importance to that study. Sure I've been reading it quickly, but from what I understood their estimate of a sales triple comes from the size of drug listings and the number of feedbacks each vendor had received. Those can be fake. We've seen that with restaurants and hotels in tourist guides.

[clickerz]

I would not give much importance to that study. Sure I've been reading it quickly, but from what I understood their estimate of a sales triple comes from the size of drug listings and the number of feedbacks each vendor had received. Those can be fake. We've seen that with restaurants and hotels in tourist guides.

Maybe you are correct here. Is there any way to to validate the listings? Of course we know it is illegal trade and difficult to countercheck this. Meaning the volume of drugs triple on market?

[Doamader]

Thing is everytime another Silkroad gets raided, an equally large amount of Bitcoins are confiscated by the Federal Bureau, and when that happens the Bitcoin's price falls a bit. It again falls a bit more when they put it on an auction. So afterall are they aiding the Government to have more control on the price of Bitcoin by not keeping their funds and identity safe?

Well the country can easy rebuy those, and try to control bitcoin, step by step buying and confiscating over the years, but in the end i dont believe they have interest at it, but bitcoin will be the next gold currencie over the next years, soo countries should invest at bitcoin.

I dont know if those reports are the reality or just an updated from the total of drugs being sold, usually the media changes the numbers to make people believe, who knows if bitcoin hasnt a press being paid to clean the image.

[adamstgBit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Di5NSU5yuKE