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Author Topic: [ANN] Zcoin (XZC) - Implementing Zerocoin technology for financial privacy  (Read 523199 times)
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zcoinofficial
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December 30, 2016, 09:41:54 AM
 #2321

It's 2.1 million coins spread over 4 years. 10% of total eventual supply of 21 million coins. This goes to initial private investors and to dev which are currently funding development.

As for the fork, we are working on a fix. We think we found the problem but are testing it right now. Stay tuned. Github has a push already but we're making sure it works.

Fork rule is not sane.
4 values missing after 14k.
Blocks will be rejected because of: if (!(found_1 && found_2 && found_3 && found_4 && found_5))
Basic stuff..


More attempt at FUD. Those are in relation to the founder's wallet addresses which have been changed due to the new investor and removing Gary.

You already totally miscalculated the founder's reward before to say 2 million coins in 1 year which is actually 2.1 million coins in 4 years. Basic stuff.

Zcoin: Implementing Zerocoin technology for financial privacy
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December 30, 2016, 09:59:25 AM
 #2322

It's 2.1 million coins spread over 4 years. 10% of total eventual supply of 21 million coins. This goes to initial private investors and to dev which are currently funding development.

As for the fork, we are working on a fix. We think we found the problem but are testing it right now. Stay tuned. Github has a push already but we're making sure it works.

Fork rule is not sane.
4 values missing after 14k.
Blocks will be rejected because of: if (!(found_1 && found_2 && found_3 && found_4 && found_5))
Basic stuff..


More attempt at FUD. Those are in relation to the founder's wallet addresses which have been changed due to the new investor and removing Gary.

You already totally miscalculated the founder's reward before to say 2 million coins in 1 year which is actually 2.1 million coins in 4 years. Basic stuff.

@zcoinofficial, who are you? it seems you are not the dev,only someone's from internet having access to this thread. Am i wrong? Why dev leave also this thread to a third community parties?

Yesterday 1 block before fork either poramin or gary were missing in slack. Is this a "serious" way to act and atract investors?

And why everytime someone's ask something you always answers "it's fud". shame.

When devs funds started to drain with dump from gary, you were posted "it's alla okay, it's only anon bounties, noone dev is dumping, stop fud".
Then...

You have to protect investors.
zcoinofficial
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December 30, 2016, 10:12:42 AM
 #2323

@jeremy grol:

It is FUD and is evidenced by the blocks progressing to the new block past 13999 already when the fix had nothing to do with those lines.

He's not asking, he's spreading misinformation that is purely untrue. You can look at the nature of his other posts.

I am Reuben, the official community manager of Zcoin as listed in zcoin.finance (http://zcoin.finance/language/en/about/) and elaborated many times in this thread. All the technical replies I have vetted with Poramin.

As for the bounties, the only founder wallet that was significantly dumped was Gary's which was emptied. One of the big reasons that lead to the split. Remember the founder's reward does not consist of only the bounty wallet but also the initial private investors and dev's wallets.

Poramin's wallet remains almost entirely intact except for some small amounts. Roger's wallet remains untouched and the other investor's wallet liquidated only a bit during initial launch. The bounty wallet was not dumped and was indeed used to pay bounties (including my pay). This can all be seen on the block explorer.

The blog post on the bounty wallet was done by Gary and not me. I am protecting investors by preventing the spread of inaccurate information all which is publicly verifiable and in the code and Github.

As for the Slack? The old one is moderated by Gary and he's the one that is absent. We were previously removed from the old Slack by Gary.

The new one Poramin is replying in and is pretty active:
http://invite.zcoin.finance:3000 to get an invite.

Zcoin: Implementing Zerocoin technology for financial privacy
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December 30, 2016, 10:50:47 AM
 #2324


@zcoinofficial, who are you? it seems you are not the dev,only someone's from internet having access to this thread. Am i wrong? Why dev leave also this thread to a third community parties?

Yesterday 1 block before fork either poramin or gary were missing in slack. Is this a "serious" way to act and atract investors?

And why everytime someone's ask something you always answers "it's fud". shame.

When devs funds started to drain with dump from gary, you were posted "it's alla okay, it's only anon bounties, noone dev is dumping, stop fud".
Then...

You have to protect investors.

oh Jeremy the old troll. You're still here? I saw u're trolling everywhere. Funny.
Okay in this coin there is no place for Gary anymore. I don't know where he is, if you're missing him just feel free to ping him.

I'm sure u're joining the wrong slack, get to the new slack here: http://invite.zcoin.finance:3000/
Poramin and people in the team are watching the fork and fixing it right when they saw the problem, but due to the problem of slowly initial opening of the daemon, it took longer than expected. Network is healthy now.

Btw i admit that's not a good time to hardfork since many people are in holidays.

There is no real investors.
These devs.. they manage all 6 "founder accounts"
Fork was only to clear their names after a coin dump.

Next dump and blame the other guy.
Make a new fork to change address and tell everything is fine, again.

It happened once, and it will happen again.
Nothing has changed, 5 accounts to dump from.

Call it a fud, i call it a warning.


Give me the proof for your statement. You're clearly trolling or super ignorant. (Either ways but i'm pretty sure u're trolling, even with intention, probably paid trolling)
The explorer shows clearly that only Gary' founder wallet are drained with huge amount and sent directly to Bittrex (this one https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?aLrg41sXbXZc5MyEj7dts8upZKSAtJmRDR.htm)
Another wallet is the bounty wallet which is basically the funding for community effort and was paid to people like Reuben, glitch, ... etc (and they are still very underpaid IMHO). The wallet still has a lot of  XZC, check here (https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?a1HwTdCmQV3NspP2QqCGpehoFpi8NY4Zg3.htm)

Other investors are well-known people, some of them have given publicly their support/letter. All the facts are listed in the website zcoin.finance. I will ping Reuben to update the ANN with more details.


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December 30, 2016, 11:51:05 AM
 #2325

<<The explorer shows clearly that only Gary' founder wallet are drained with huge amount and sent directly to Bittrex (this one https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?aLrg41sXbXZc5MyEj7dts8upZKSAtJmRDR.htm)
Another wallet is the bounty wallet which is basically the funding for community effort and was paid to people like Reuben, glitch, ... etc (and they are still very underpaid IMHO). The wallet still has a lot of  XZC, check here (https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?a1HwTdCmQV3NspP2QqCGpehoFpi8NY4Zg3.htm)>

@aizensou, please explain to me how you know which accounts are Gary's - or anyone else for that matter?

Is it true that each balance holders amount in sent and received transactions and current balance is publicly viewable? How is this different from Bitcoin?
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December 30, 2016, 12:55:05 PM
 #2326

<<The explorer shows clearly that only Gary' founder wallet are drained with huge amount and sent directly to Bittrex (this one https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?aLrg41sXbXZc5MyEj7dts8upZKSAtJmRDR.htm)
Another wallet is the bounty wallet which is basically the funding for community effort and was paid to people like Reuben, glitch, ... etc (and they are still very underpaid IMHO). The wallet still has a lot of  XZC, check here (https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?a1HwTdCmQV3NspP2QqCGpehoFpi8NY4Zg3.htm)>

@aizensou, please explain to me how you know which accounts are Gary's - or anyone else for that matter?



Community manager Reuben will make a public statement about the founders' wallet.

I'm doing my research so I know which wallet is from Gary. And he admits that too.


Quote
Is it true that each balance holders amount in sent and received transactions and current balance is publicly viewable? How is this different from Bitcoin?

It's a very good question indeed. Actually they could erase the trace of these wallets but if they do so, there will be a FUD fest. Anonymity is important feature of Zcoin, but not with sensitive info like founders' wallets IMHO.
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December 30, 2016, 01:11:52 PM
 #2327

After all.
Tested the client, after 12hours 30% of chain..

Any details what part of zero makes it so slow?
Does it occure with kurrent x11 fork..??

X11 fork? Do u even realize what are u talking about ?

Well I still give an answer from my understanding, not for you but for others users as well.

The slow start of the client is already a well-known problem and the team are working hard on it.

Due to its zerocoin implementation, upfront starting loading the blocks, the client needs to re-verify the existing blocks (important feature of Zerocoin to ensure no double spending or error in zerominting). Because of the current algo (Lyra2 with quite high matrix dimension), it makes the verification even slower.

Things will get much better with further improvements and MTP release.

The seed nodes are quite slow too, I will ask Poramin about improvements on that part as well.
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December 30, 2016, 01:16:26 PM
 #2328

<<The explorer shows clearly that only Gary' founder wallet are drained with huge amount and sent directly to Bittrex (this one https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?aLrg41sXbXZc5MyEj7dts8upZKSAtJmRDR.htm)
Another wallet is the bounty wallet which is basically the funding for community effort and was paid to people like Reuben, glitch, ... etc (and they are still very underpaid IMHO). The wallet still has a lot of  XZC, check here (https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xzc/address.dws?a1HwTdCmQV3NspP2QqCGpehoFpi8NY4Zg3.htm)>

@aizensou, please explain to me how you know which accounts are Gary's - or anyone else for that matter?



Community manager Reuben will make a public statement about the founders' wallet.

I'm doing my research so I know which wallet is from Gary. And he admits that too.


Quote
Is it true that each balance holders amount in sent and received transactions and current balance is publicly viewable? How is this different from Bitcoin?

It's a very good question indeed. Actually they could erase the trace of these wallets but if they do so, there will be a FUD fest. Anonymity is important feature of Zcoin, but not with sensitive info like founders' wallets IMHO.


Nothing here sounds anonymous at all. I can't understand why it is so important to know the devs wallet balances - sounds like a twist on an MLM scheme.

I find it very hard to believe that Roger Ver or any other investor wants his account balance known, or that it means a damn thing anyway - since any one of the devs could open up any number of anonymous accounts.

It is sounding more and more like a complete scam
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December 30, 2016, 01:58:20 PM
 #2329

Nothing here sounds anonymous at all. I can't understand why it is so important to know the devs wallet balances - sounds like a twist on an MLM scheme.

I find it very hard to believe that Roger Ver or any other investor wants his account balance known, or that it means a damn thing anyway - since any one of the devs could open up any number of anonymous accounts.

It is sounding more and more like a complete scam

Anonymity is not mandatory, but an option at Zcoin.
If you want to make your XZC anonymous, you send them to the accumulator and receive XZC with no transaction history back.
You can't hide balances at Zcoin. That's what helps you ensure that no flaw was found and abused to create tons of XZC in secret.
It's not bad to see that the devs and investors are holding (at least most of them).

Despite all the trouble, the design and implementation of Zcoin are great and there's some real development going on: implementing MTP right after having implemented the Zercoin protocol.
Zcoin doesn't tingle my scam sensors.
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December 30, 2016, 03:28:56 PM
 #2330

After all.
Tested the client, after 12hours 30% of chain..

Any details what part of zero makes it so slow?
Does it occure with kurrent x11 fork..??

X11 fork? Do u even realize what are u talking about ?

Well I still give an answer from my understanding, not for you but for others users as well.

The slow start of the client is already a well-known problem and the team are working hard on it.

Due to its zerocoin implementation, upfront starting loading the blocks, the client needs to re-verify the existing blocks (important feature of Zerocoin to ensure no double spending or error in zerominting). Because of the current algo (Lyra2 with quite high matrix dimension), it makes the verification even slower.

Things will get much better with further improvements and MTP release.

The seed nodes are quite slow too, I will ask Poramin about improvements on that part as well.


x11 fork:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1691086.0

If it is related to lyra.. mtp wont fix past blocks..
Chain restart needed.

I am sure it is possible somehow to hash the previous blocks and validate all Lyra blocks at once, then only do real validating starting from MTP blocks... Not now but later after switching to MTP such code could be hardcoded into the new wallet. This is just one idea, I am sure other ways are possible too.
Don't be so grumpy Smiley. Think about something good Smiley

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December 30, 2016, 03:33:28 PM
 #2331

I would like to say thanks to AizenSou for his helpful comments here at these hard times, and also express my full respect to Reuben, who provides a great communication here.
Frankly speaking, Reuben's excellent work was the actual reason I personally supported Poramin's fork, not Gary's one Smiley. In fact, I supported "Reuben's fork"  Grin
Keep it up! Smiley

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December 30, 2016, 04:37:22 PM
 #2332

Nothing here sounds anonymous at all. I can't understand why it is so important to know the devs wallet balances - sounds like a twist on an MLM scheme.

I find it very hard to believe that Roger Ver or any other investor wants his account balance known, or that it means a damn thing anyway - since any one of the devs could open up any number of anonymous accounts.

It is sounding more and more like a complete scam

Anonymity is not mandatory, but an option at Zcoin.
If you want to make your XZC anonymous, you send them to the accumulator and receive XZC with no transaction history back.
You can't hide balances at Zcoin. That's what helps you ensure that no flaw was found and abused to create tons of XZC in secret.
It's not bad to see that the devs and investors are holding (at least most of them).

Despite all the trouble, the design and implementation of Zcoin are great and there's some real development going on: implementing MTP right after having implemented the Zercoin protocol.
Zcoin doesn't tingle my scam sensors.


Obviously having account balances publicly viewable is not full privacy, and could be traced simply by amounts alone in many instances, revealing someone's identity, especially during low volume times.

I still don't see why the devs couldn't make plenty of coins here in secret? According to zcoin logic, you shouldn't be able to see what coins came from or went to who. So how would you verify or how can you tell? Please explain
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December 30, 2016, 06:07:43 PM
 #2333


Anonymity is not mandatory, but an option at Zcoin.
If you want to make your XZC anonymous, you send them to the accumulator and receive XZC with no transaction history back.
You can't hide balances at Zcoin. That's what helps you ensure that no flaw was found and abused to create tons of XZC in secret.
It's not bad to see that the devs and investors are holding (at least most of them).

Despite all the trouble, the design and implementation of Zcoin are great and there's some real development going on: implementing MTP right after having implemented the Zercoin protocol.
Zcoin doesn't tingle my scam sensors.


Obviously having account balances publicly viewable is not full privacy, and could be traced simply by amounts alone in many instances, revealing someone's identity, especially during low volume times.

I still don't see why the devs couldn't make plenty of coins here in secret? According to zcoin logic, you shouldn't be able to see what coins came from or went to who. So how would you verify or how can you tell? Please explain

Because if you create coins out of thin air, the supply will go up, it's very easy to check. Why are you attacking that fact without any understanding of the underlying mechanism ?

Nothing here sounds anonymous at all. I can't understand why it is so important to know the devs wallet balances - sounds like a twist on an MLM scheme.

I find it very hard to believe that Roger Ver or any other investor wants his account balance known, or that it means a damn thing anyway - since any one of the devs could open up any number of anonymous accounts.

It is sounding more and more like a complete scam

Complete scam because investors forgo their privacy to make funding more transparency ? LOL

I don't understand your logic at all, could you elaborate more?

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December 30, 2016, 06:08:13 PM
 #2334

I would like to say thanks to AizenSou for his helpful comments here at these hard times, and also express my full respect to Reuben, who provides a great communication here.
Frankly speaking, Reuben's excellent work was the actual reason I personally supported Poramin's fork, not Gary's one Smiley. In fact, I supported "Reuben's fork"  Grin
Keep it up! Smiley

Both are very talented people Smiley I will try to contribute more soon too, especially with news from China.
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December 30, 2016, 06:45:50 PM
 #2335

<<Complete scam because investors forgo their privacy to make funding more transparency ? LOL>>

It is simple: no one wants the amount in their bank account linked with their name. They immediately become a target for people to hurt them and take their money. Make sense?

Also, if they can have their accounts de- anonymized, then that tool most likely exists to do that to others. Not convinced that this coin has any financial privacy whatsoever, which may make it worthless because the concept is flawed
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December 30, 2016, 07:05:15 PM
 #2336

<<
Because if you create coins out of thin air, the supply will go up, it's very easy to check. Why are you attacking that fact without any understanding of the underlying mechanism ?<>

Again my friend, if Roger Ver creates coins and does so in different anonymous accounts with a key that allows unlimited number of uses to create coins. That key is not guaranteed to have been destroyed by any auditable means.

How does anyone know which accounts are Roger Vers, and how to prove this is correct? Especially if coins are made out of thin air - prove it.

If there is no metadata or IP data to audit, how do you know in fact that any specific account belongs to any one specific person?
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December 30, 2016, 09:26:06 PM
 #2337

I would like to say thanks to AizenSou for his helpful comments here at these hard times, and also express my full respect to Reuben, who provides a great communication here.
Frankly speaking, Reuben's excellent work was the actual reason I personally supported Poramin's fork, not Gary's one Smiley. In fact, I supported "Reuben's fork"  Grin
Keep it up! Smiley

Both are very talented people Smiley I will try to contribute more soon too, especially with news from China.

Gary left because this is a complete scam, he is a nice guy, and he did not want to say it in public because it not politically correct to do so.

Gary learned of it, sold his lot, kept his mouth shut, and is looking again to team with Poramin, who can remain in the shadows on a beach in Thailand.

Is it not possible?
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December 30, 2016, 10:28:30 PM
 #2338

<<
Because if you create coins out of thin air, the supply will go up, it's very easy to check. Why are you attacking that fact without any understanding of the underlying mechanism ?<>

Again my friend, if Roger Ver creates coins and does so in different anonymous accounts with a key that allows unlimited number of uses to create coins. That key is not guaranteed to have been destroyed by any auditable means.

How does anyone know which accounts are Roger Vers, and how to prove this is correct? Especially if coins are made out of thin air - prove it.

If there is no metadata or IP data to audit, how do you know in fact that any specific account belongs to any one specific person?

The answer is the simple cold hard facts here with ZCoin. Because the private unlimited key was allegedly destroyed without an audit trail, the people that believe in this coin are indeed believing in something called blind faith.

The blind faith is that Roger Ver, or any other "investor", is being honest:

1. In acknowledging that they purposefully selected a way of disposing of the private shared unlimited coin minting key that left no audit trail. This is simply dishonest and not good business practice
2. There is no way of knowing if the growth of ZCoin is from mining or from use of this private shared unlimited coin minting key
3. The idea that knowing the balances of some accounts that cannot be proven to belong to anyone is a hole in the whole zero coin scam bubble.

If we cannot prove that the so called founders actually own and have possession of the accounts they claim to control, then the whole heartedly false blind faith belief that this is proof that the project is legit is a scam

FAIL
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December 30, 2016, 10:50:33 PM
 #2339

Member when I accused the founders of dumping their coins and you ass holes yelled at me in slack?

Who's holding my bag I dumped at more than 10x the current price?

Gary and Poramin are both sketchy fucks and this code is open source.  Why the hell would you continue to listen to either of these guys bullshit?  Find another project, this is total shit.  Sorry for your losses, but you were warned.
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December 30, 2016, 11:02:32 PM
 #2340

<<
Because if you create coins out of thin air, the supply will go up, it's very easy to check. Why are you attacking that fact without any understanding of the underlying mechanism ?<>

Again my friend, if Roger Ver creates coins and does so in different anonymous accounts with a key that allows unlimited number of uses to create coins. That key is not guaranteed to have been destroyed by any auditable means.

How does anyone know which accounts are Roger Vers, and how to prove this is correct? Especially if coins are made out of thin air - prove it.

If there is no metadata or IP data to audit, how do you know in fact that any specific account belongs to any one specific person?


This is like a multi level marketing scam where the initial founders make all the money from the ponzi scheme. They tell everyone they recruit this, that Jim and Maggie sold 1 million of toiletries this year netting them 500k, and it attracts many to work hard doing the same, bringing in others, for materialistic reasons. Only new recruits pay up the lines or channels though. There is never enough.

Here the lure is in the "trusted" setup, but no proof can be given that it should be trusted and isn't simply defrauding anyone dumb enough to get involved. If ZCoin is anonymous at all, it is impossible to know if their trusted info can be trusted
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