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Author Topic: 🔶 YOLOdice.com 🔶 suspended on 16st Mar 2021  (Read 142973 times)
RHavar
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February 24, 2021, 11:56:28 PM
 #4381

I've spent a lot of time on it, and honestly bitcoin core's algorithm is actually quite good. There's little things you can do to improve it, but it's probably not worth it.


Often it looks stupidly high, but let's say you are using the default conservative estimate, (a 95% confidence?) -- it implicitly takes into consideration occurrences like "What if there's no blocks for the next 30 minutes, and everyone is out bidding each other". If that doesn't happen, your fee will indeed be stupidly high. But otherwise, it would've ended up stuck Sad


If you want to save money on fees, there's a few good things you can do (both are annoying and a bit of a PITA though):


1) Batching
2) Low-Ball the fee (target a long-range with economical) and keep bumpfee it until it ends up confirmed
3) Cap the (initial) fee rate you're paying, so you're never too early in the mempool. If you're doing 2) you can bump it later as required, but you don't want to ever really be one of the highest fee rate transactions if you can avoid it

Check out gamblingsitefinder.com for a decent list/rankings of crypto casinos. Note: I have no affiliation or interest in it, and don't even agree with all the rankings ... but it's the only uncorrupted review site I'm aware of.
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BayAreaCoins
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February 25, 2021, 12:15:54 AM
Last edit: February 25, 2021, 12:32:07 AM by BayAreaCoins
 #4382

I've spent a lot of time on it, and honestly bitcoin core's algorithm is actually quite good.

Bitcoin Core's estimator is trash.  Even "economical" is WAY overpriced from my experience "these days" (2017 and after).

They have no incentive to have their system pricing stuff fairly and all the incentive to overprice the hell out of it!  (Profit for miners + no one bitching at developers because they didn't get confirmations, lol because you're going to get confirmations using Bitcoin Cores estimator!!!!!!  I speculate that the Bitcoin Miners are purposely gaming the Bitcoin Core estimator too.)

I explain it like this... None of us know the future, but we do know the present and the past.

Think of the Bitcoin network like a 6 lane highway that does get busy.  

Friday = traffic jams and Sunday = Pretty easy driving.

Bitcoin Core tries to get you to drive on Sunday as if it's Friday's traffic!  That's fucking r-e-t-a-r-d-e-d!!!!!!!!!

Anyone who has ever driven a car knows that you drive with your eyes in real-time... sure you don't know the future, but you just do your best in the present.



I also agree with RHavar's 1, 2, & 3.   RBF is a pain in the ass too, but it's a good fucking feature!

FB's cap our Bitcoin withdraw fees both ways with a min and a max.  (10vsat min and 0.0003 BTC max)

The API I posted will reflect that 10vsat min... there won't be a max, so you may need to add some logic if you want a max.)

[We are still working on a permanent fix for that API thing, I'll post when she's complete... it shouldn't be long]


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RHavar
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February 25, 2021, 02:20:46 AM
 #4383

Bitcoin Core's estimator is trash.  Even "economical" is WAY overpriced from my experience "these days" (2017 and after).

I'm sure you already know about it, but you can use `estimaterawfee` and pick your own threshold. If you pick a low threshold (e.g. 0.5 ) you will get pretty reasonable fee rates, but you got to be prepared to feebump because they will be getting stuck

Quote
Bitcoin Core tries to get you to drive on Sunday as if it's Friday's traffic!  That's fucking r-e-t-a-r-d-e-d!!!!!!!!!

You're definitely right that that there is different transaction volume on weekends/weekdays and ideally the model would take that into account.  I however don't think there's huge gains to be had, while if rewriting bitcoin core's coinselection results in huge gains. Easily save 50% on transaction costs, if not more.

--


I think the fundamental problem is everyone wants to just "fire & forget" their bitcoin transaction. The only real way to do this, is using stupidly high fees. And if everyone is doing this, it gets a bit stupid.

I never had the chance to do it, but I always wanted to make a service where you create N transactions each with a progressively higher nlocktime and fee for a payment. And the service waits until the nlocktime and broadcasts the new transaction.

So effectively, say I wanted to pay you -- I'd could create 3 transaction:
* Pay BayAreaCoins with 10 sat/vbyte now
* Pay  BayAreaCoins with 20 sat/vbyte with a nlocktime of in 3 hours
* Pay  BayAreaCoins with 50 sat/vbyte with a nlocktime of in 5 hours
* Pay  BayAreaCoins with 70 sat/vbyte with a nlocktime of in 10 hours
...


And then I could go offline, and know that eventually you'll get paid


Check out gamblingsitefinder.com for a decent list/rankings of crypto casinos. Note: I have no affiliation or interest in it, and don't even agree with all the rankings ... but it's the only uncorrupted review site I'm aware of.
BayAreaCoins
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February 25, 2021, 02:59:53 AM
 #4384

I'm sure you already know about it, but you can use `estimaterawfee` and pick your own threshold. If you pick a low threshold (e.g. 0.5 ) you will get pretty reasonable fee rates, but you got to be prepared to feebump because they will be getting stuck

I've never heard of estimaterawfee... it's not in the "help" text when I type it on the Console!  lol *sigh* (or maybe I'm blind?)

We messed around with estimatesmartfee for a while.


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BayAreaCoins
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February 25, 2021, 05:36:28 AM
Last edit: February 25, 2021, 06:11:17 AM by BayAreaCoins
 #4385

Basically,  This estimates the cost to go .75 MB deep in the chain at the time of the request.  Each block usually takes 1mb off the chain, so it's isn't very aggressive and transactions can take some time to confirm.  Being not aggressive kind of helps not contribute to unnecessary blockchain bloat.

I think you'll be shocked at the price difference and the speed these estimates confirm!

https://freebitcoins.com/xchange/api/v1/btcfee ({"satsPerVbyte":"102"} at the time of this post)

I really like the idea behind it; it's pretty much what I've been doing manually looking at Johoe's mempool stats. However, for some reason, it seems to be returning 10 satsPerVByte right now, despite there being 45+ MB of transactions greater than paying greater than 10 sat/byte.

That's exactly what I did as well.  The same website too! Tongue

Good eye, something broke, Xploited is fixing the API call right now... because your right, 10 looks hella low atm.

I forgot to mention, we have it set to a minimum of 10, even if the network is lower.  I've just seen the network blowup in the low numbers too fast... 10 seems to be a decent number.

I'll post when she's fixed... it should just be a minute.


Fixed.   Our mempool is still growing... the larger it is, the more accurate it will be.

We had to move some stuff around and change a little logic & a new server, but she's looking better.  It's aiming for around 0.5MB to 0.75MB deep & she updates every minute.

This website is really decent too:  https://fee.cryp.ee/#/btc

Thanks for pointing that out Darkstar.

Good luck Ethan.


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rdbase
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February 25, 2021, 09:43:58 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4386

I have to admin that what you are saying is highly inspiring to me. The decision about suspending is final, so that did not change my mind, but damn, [/b]YOU GUYS ARE GREAT[/b].

I am getting tons of emails from "potential buyers" about YOLOdice, and let's make it clear: our intention is NOT to sell it. Especially not for 1 BTC, as offered by one of such "buyers".

As you noted earlier, there is a matter of reputation - the new owner would basically have to start building his reputation from ground, and there is a pretty long way from that to accepting investments.

On the other hand I strongly believe that what makes YOLOdice reputable is 1. people that run it, 2. people that support it, 3. people that use it. There is a huge value in the package (1+2+3), not necessarily in the separate pieces.

Suspending YOLOdice is not THE end. It's the end of something, but come on - there are less and less people who want to deposit coins if transaction fees are over $10, and coins themselves are increasing in value even if you don't gamble them.

I respect Dooglus for closing JD and switching from BTC to CLAM - it was a sort of solution to keep the game rolling, but detach the value of the tokens from BTC.

YOLOdice might actually come back in the future (that's why I am reluctant to sell it), but in a different form.

Cheers,
Ethan

PS. If you really want to buy YOLOdice, please spare me some nerves and don't offer 1 BTC for it :-)
Just received this news via the update a couple of days ago.
And it is a tragic turn of events to decide to suspend play on your site as it had been around for a long time.
One of the first dice sites from what I remember as I was never a primedice fan to begin with and your site was lightning fast at everything including the bets which was the important part of any gambling site. Wink

But as others have mentioned already, it was a decision you had to make and as with everything else in life:
Nothing truly last forever.
And it is probably the best for you and the site that you take a break for now.
Hope you do recover and come back one day, so really knows.
But all the best to you and your loyal players from Yolodice. Smiley

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February 25, 2021, 11:19:17 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4387

It is sad to say good bye to Yolodice. Although I'm not really active playing here since few years back but at least I have a great experience at Yolodice especially when it comes to contest as I won good amount from the past contest. I hope ethan will come back with new bigger project in the future.

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February 25, 2021, 12:30:07 PM
 #4388

IMO, if you said reluctant to sell Yolodice to other people, it would be great if you never give a little hope for them to tell them pm/email you their offer since you will decline it.
Or atleast tell them how much mininum amount you want to accept so they won't spam your email with their offers (if you changed your mind and would sell Yolodice)

Here's my thinking: YOLOdice is not for sale. Definitely not to a random unknown buyer. I can image a few scenarios in which I would consider selling YOLOdice, but I don't think it would be an easy process. As you can imagine, it's not just about the money.


Glad to hear you won't sell Yolodice to stranger or random user. Yolodice has gain their reputation from scratch, you shouldn't sell for any price IMO. Hopefully you and yolodice will comeback on gambling industry later, ethan.

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February 25, 2021, 12:45:42 PM
 #4389

IMO, if you said reluctant to sell Yolodice to other people, it would be great if you never give a little hope for them to tell them pm/email you their offer since you will decline it.
Or atleast tell them how much mininum amount you want to accept so they won't spam your email with their offers (if you changed your mind and would sell Yolodice)

Here's my thinking: YOLOdice is not for sale. Definitely not to a random unknown buyer. I can image a few scenarios in which I would consider selling YOLOdice, but I don't think it would be an easy process. As you can imagine, it's not just about the money.


Glad to hear you won't sell Yolodice to stranger or random user. Yolodice has gain their reputation from scratch, you shouldn't sell for any price IMO. Hopefully you and yolodice will comeback on gambling industry later, ethan.

He post this word below so I believe YOLO dice will be back but in other form nor maybe they will add something beneficial to them together with their players as well maybe with their investors.


YOLOdice might actually come back in the future (that's why I am reluctant to sell it), but in a different form.

Cheers,
Ethan


Also I'm truly impressed about how the owner do their exit since they really keep their reputation in good condition maybe in future when they came back their old users will play again to them.

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February 26, 2021, 04:13:17 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4390



I'm guessing the biggest reason is that Ethan wants to shut down is that he doesn't want to deal with the stress of making sure the balances of all investors (BTC bankroll alone was > 100 BTC, or roughly 5 million USD at current rates) are safe. Continuing with altcoins likely wouldn't solve that issue, especially since ETH & LTC are fairly major coins too.


I agree with you on that, as i said, or tried to, the same reason just-dice switched from btc to clam, as i was told dooglus didnt wanted to take the responsiblity anymore so he switched to a coin with "much" less value, cause people did not want to see the site dying.

If not with ltc or eth, i think there are still altcoins (doge, polkadot, etc) which could be used instead, from what i understood most people love the community of the site and the gui and all other things around that, to abandon it completely would be disappointing, even it is all ethans decision.
Back in those days just-dice changed because Canadian rules changed, doog and his wife was managing basically a small time place, it was so small that I remember clearly that we were chatting with doog and his wife in the chat, there were few more people as well, bayareacoin was there too if I am not wrong, so basically like a 10 people situation where we were always there and some people came in and go out but that 10 or so people were always the same.

So, when the change happened we talked about it and he specifically said it was legal reasons, because it was "bitcoin" that had a new rule but crypto didn't, so he had to pick another coin and clam was nowhere in any law so he switched to clam knowing that casino wouldn't be as big as it could be with bitcoin, but at least he would not have any legal problems thanks to the switch, which is why I think his was a bit different than just stress.


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February 26, 2021, 05:46:53 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4391

It is sad to say good bye to Yolodice. Although I'm not really active playing here since few years back but at least I have a great experience at Yolodice especially when it comes to contest as I won good amount from the past contest. I hope ethan will come back with new bigger project in the future.
Same here , i am not an active Player of YoloDice but i am proud to say that this is the first Dice game/Site that i Played when i learned Crypto gambling
, I registered my account back when they are just newly promoted here . because i am not a dice player those time and i only Plays Poker and Blackjack back in the time.
Now that Yolo is coming to end , I think the legacy will remain to all of us who once played in their legit and trust worthy site.

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February 26, 2021, 06:21:52 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4392

It is sad to say good bye to Yolodice. Although I'm not really active playing here since few years back but at least I have a great experience at Yolodice especially when it comes to contest as I won good amount from the past contest. I hope ethan will come back with new bigger project in the future.
Same here , i am not an active Player of YoloDice but i am proud to say that this is the first Dice game/Site that i Played when i learned Crypto gambling
, I registered my account back when they are just newly promoted here . because i am not a dice player those time and i only Plays Poker and Blackjack back in the time.
Now that Yolo is coming to end , I think the legacy will remain to all of us who once played in their legit and trust worthy site.
Very few crypto gambling sites were popular for Dice. Yolodice is good and the increased price of bitcoin had made the team take a decision to shut the website. As of now, more other cryptocurrencies were available with reduced transaction fee. Maybe they might've experienced some pressure from the government. Anyhow it is the teams decision, and let them flourish in the upcoming projects.


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February 26, 2021, 07:18:37 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4393

Maybe this is the third time I feel that I have lost a crypto gambling site in this community that I like, like before about Directbet, Rollin, and now I will really lose Yolodice and maybe there are others but I don't really pay attention to it. These sites are closed at least the same year that Bitcoin will or has gone up to the moon, and that is likely to be something I fear for the future (Bitcoin to the moon scared me to lose more crypto gambling sites Cry).

Anyway, I hope Ethan and Scott, and the team involved can come back with other great ideas in the future, I realize decisions like that are tough ones but I'm sure it's all for the good of all.
I wish all the best for all, Thank you for being in this community for a long time and it is wonderful.


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February 26, 2021, 07:42:45 AM
Merited by kodtycoon (1)
 #4394

Maybe this is the third time I feel that I have lost a crypto gambling site in this community that I like, like before about Directbet, Rollin, and now I will really lose Yolodice and maybe there are others but I don't really pay attention to it. These sites are closed at least the same year that Bitcoin will or has gone up to the moon, and that is likely to be something I fear for the future (Bitcoin to the moon scared me to lose more crypto gambling sites Cry).

Anyway, I hope Ethan and Scott, and the team involved can come back with other great ideas in the future, I realize decisions like that are tough ones but I'm sure it's all for the good of all.
I wish all the best for all, Thank you for being in this community for a long time and it is wonderful.

Yep you would say that with those bitcoin prizes they wouldn't stop. Last month Lcukybit also stopped. Let's hope there aren't anymore sites stopping in the next monhts.

YOLOdice was for as far I know the first site where you could bet even smaller than 0.01% which most sites had.



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February 26, 2021, 10:17:08 AM
 #4395

Maybe this is the third time I feel that I have lost a crypto gambling site in this community that I like, like before about Directbet, Rollin, and now I will really lose Yolodice and maybe there are others but I don't really pay attention to it. These sites are closed at least the same year that Bitcoin will or has gone up to the moon, and that is likely to be something I fear for the future (Bitcoin to the moon scared me to lose more crypto gambling sites Cry).

Anyway, I hope Ethan and Scott, and the team involved can come back with other great ideas in the future, I realize decisions like that are tough ones but I'm sure it's all for the good of all.
I wish all the best for all, Thank you for being in this community for a long time and it is wonderful.

Yep you would say that with those bitcoin prizes they wouldn't stop. Last month Lcukybit also stopped. Let's hope there aren't anymore sites stopping in the next monhts.

YOLOdice was for as far I know the first site where you could bet even smaller than 0.01% which most sites had.

It's sad to see them closing down since they are the casino/dice we can rely on interns of honest betting but some business come unto this phase and provably they think about it deeply if it's really worth to stop this or not, but anyways since all things are set to end with Yolodice maybe let's hope they will be back when bitcoin price lower down or they find a good solution in terms of currency options to their site since I'm sure many gamblers still want to play at them.

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February 26, 2021, 10:24:16 AM
Last edit: February 27, 2021, 06:32:11 PM by Karartma1
 #4396

Maybe this is the third time I feel that I have lost a crypto gambling site in this community that I like, like before about Directbet, Rollin, and now I will really lose Yolodice and maybe there are others but I don't really pay attention to it. These sites are closed at least the same year that Bitcoin will or has gone up to the moon, and that is likely to be something I fear for the future (Bitcoin to the moon scared me to lose more crypto gambling sites Cry).

Anyway, I hope Ethan and Scott, and the team involved can come back with other great ideas in the future, I realize decisions like that are tough ones but I'm sure it's all for the good of all.
I wish all the best for all, Thank you for being in this community for a long time and it is wonderful.
I felt actually the same but the reality which most users don't see is that these platforms require a hell of work under the hood. It's not easy to guarantee 24/7 service, safety of users' funds, etc. I believe they did an amazing job and leaving the floor like this is sad but it gives everyone time to leave YD gracefully.
Truly hope they'll eventually find a way to come back.

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February 26, 2021, 10:40:54 AM
 #4397

Listen, I'll just have to tell you what I have in mind: I like what JD did - shut down BTC and started their own coin. But I don't think this solved the main problem IMO - whoever admins the site still is responsible for the coins, for the server security, for software etc. If you want to do it right, it's a 24/7 job with alerts waking you up in the middle of night. That's how it is if you want to run a reliable site. It gets better over time as you code matures, you solve most of daily maintenance issues etc.

I am thinking about starting a new blockchain with stakeable coins, but at the same time offering investor and player roles similar to dice sites. In addition to staking you could put your coins in the "bankroll". Players on the other hand could issue transactions similar to "bets" that would win or lose, based on verifiable distributed random number generation.

- The game itself would be a part of the blockchain protocol, so there would be no need to keep data centralized.
- The investors would always have control over their coins (no need to deposit them to any site).
- Investors would gain from both staking and providing coins for the bankroll (with game volatility involved).
- The game would be provably fair for both players AND investors (!!!).
- The blockchain would be fully distributed, no central storage or site. Ideally it would not be "owned" by anyone either.
- For the chain to be attractive I believe some social aspects should be implemented too - user accounts, chat, avatars etc.

It's still an early idea. If we decide to follow it, there will be numerous challenges, but hey, it could be really fun!

It's still to early to talk about ICO, but the idea keeps evolving in my mind and I have started exploring some technical aspects already.

What do you think?

Cheers,
Ethan

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February 26, 2021, 12:30:27 PM
 #4398


It's still to early to talk about ICO, but the idea keeps evolving in my mind and I have started exploring some technical aspects already.

What do you think?

Cheers,
Ethan

Just hoping once you and your team running your own ICO, it will be worthy on the future. 2 gambling popular gambling site ever had running their ICO (Betking and Bitdice) but unfortunately their investors suffered huge loss after bought/invested on their ICO (no offense) until now, more worse is betking.

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February 26, 2021, 12:53:20 PM
 #4399

Interesting to see that the discussion about how yolodice is closing (and ethan probably taking a break before he comes back with something else) turned into how bitcoin core could be good or bad, I mean it is obviously bad which is why we are looking for other improvements, but I am trying to figure out how that topic turned into this topic lol.

All jokes aside it is sad to see yolodice go, but I know that ethan would be coming back soon, he can probably deal with himself until summer or maybe just whole year this year but at the very latest by 2022 we are going to see him working to get back in lol, crypto is not something that leaves your mind alone, I remember for months I tried to think other stuff and not make crypto my main life, and eventually that failed so miserably that now I am full time crypto person that works and earns and lives all thanks to crypto lol.

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February 26, 2021, 01:51:19 PM
 #4400

Interesting to see that the discussion about how yolodice is closing (and ethan probably taking a break before he comes back with something else) turned into how bitcoin core could be good or bad, I mean it is obviously bad which is why we are looking for other improvements, but I am trying to figure out how that topic turned into this topic lol.

All jokes aside it is sad to see yolodice go, but I know that ethan would be coming back soon, he can probably deal with himself until summer or maybe just whole year this year but at the very latest by 2022 we are going to see him working to get back in lol, crypto is not something that leaves your mind alone, I remember for months I tried to think other stuff and not make crypto my main life, and eventually that failed so miserably that now I am full time crypto person that works and earns and lives all thanks to crypto lol.

Indeed, I definitely need a fresh perspective and a "clean slate" to start working on something new... :-)

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