Post your SegWit questions here - open discussion - big week for Bitcoin!

[classicsucks]

There were 2 hard forks, one unintentional fork due to a database locking bug, and a second intentional hard fork to fix the bug. Everyone worked together, and the drama was over in 48 hours. A few old servers continued running the broken release, but they were ignored and caused no problems on the network. Don't believe me, read the official Core account of what happened: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0050.mediawiki

The drama most certainly was not over in 48 hours. The intentional hard fork to fix the problem took until August 2013 while the unintentional one occurred several months before that in March 2013. Up until Autust, everyone was still using the consensus rules forced by the database locks. Even in the emergency situation, a hard fork still took several months to actually deploy. We aren't in such a situation now; a hard fork will need to take longer to deploy so that all of its consequences can be considered and tested.

In 48 hours the the newer chain dominated the network and the chain split was resolved. There was a single double spend, but the person who did it returned the funds and stated that he was just a researcher.  

There are still upwards of 20,000 lines of code in support software that still haven't been written. Another reason Segwit is simply dead in the water.

Just because what seems like a large number of lines of code have yet to be written does not mean that it is "dead in the water". More than half of the companies, services, and wallets listed on the segwit adoption page have already completed their implementations.

In any case, Segwit software support is not ready at all. In fact, the coders are waiting on Segwit activation that likely will never happen... why waste time if the code won't be used?  I also feel sorry that C0re wasted so much time developing code that won't run. An old wooden "Spruce Goose" that will not fly.

[1715356793]

1715356793

[1715356793]

1715356793

[hv_]

According to Peter Rizun@ conf The Fututre of Bitcoin / Arnhem 1th July 2017


due to the SW - SF and potential fractional network there is an attack vector for selfish miners to hold back the initial small SW - witness data relatively easy and get into a potential success on a late but fast release  to the network once they expect a next block coming up.

Could you pls comment on that or point me to some place where this was discussed or solved? How do you weight this impact?

[HostFat]

@hv_
https://bitcrust.org/blog-incentive-shift-segwit.html

[hv_]

@hv_
https://bitcrust.org/blog-incentive-shift-segwit.html

Thx - guess these guys have shown their Rust power the day before Peter...

why is this not taken up here?

[d5000]

@hv_
https://bitcrust.org/blog-incentive-shift-segwit.html

Thx - guess these guys have shown their Rust power the day before Peter...

why is this not taken up here?

Because it's FUD. In the German Forum a technically much more advanced user than me has explained it in a convincing way. The miners that would participate in such an attack would simply fork away because exchanges and other economic actors would never accept their blocks.

[ninza]

I tweeted to Charlie today about what the best thing an individual can do to support Segwit was and he replied with convincing exchanges to run UASF code. That seems valid but are there other things that people can do? Asking for myself and anyone who is new to bitcoin.

 BTC

[noobinscrypt]

is there an official link to the BIP 91 and BIP148 UASF on here? Im curious if its really going to get locked in this week and we can finally moon....

[JayJuanGee]

is there an official link to the BIP 91 and BIP148 UASF on here? Im curious if its really going to get locked in this week and we can finally moon....

I'm not sure what you mean, exactly; however, some folks are watching the closeness of the BIP91 locking in on these two websites.

https://coin.dance/blocks


https://www.xbt.eu/

[achow101]

is there an official link to the BIP 91 and BIP148 UASF on here? Im curious if its really going to get locked in this week and we can finally moon....

I'm not sure what you mean, exactly; however, some folks are watching the closeness of the BIP91 locking in on these two websites.

https://coin.dance/blocks


https://www.xbt.eu/

Also my website is tracking BIP 91 signaling: https://www.btcforkmonitor.info/ as well as monitoring for any chain splits.

[leirou]

If BTC split wont happen what will the new update(BIP 91) be good for?

[hv_]

is there an official link to the BIP 91 and BIP148 UASF on here? Im curious if its really going to get locked in this week and we can finally moon....

I'm not sure what you mean, exactly; however, some folks are watching the closeness of the BIP91 locking in on these two websites.

https://coin.dance/blocks


https://www.xbt.eu/

Also my website is tracking BIP 91 signaling: https://www.btcforkmonitor.info/ as well as monitoring for any chain splits.

Really cool - Thx a lot!

 I'll try to distribute this a bit,  ok?

[JayJuanGee]

If BTC split wont happen what will the new update(BIP 91) be good for?

Are you serious?

Activating and locking in segwit.

BIP91 seems to provide a path in which segwit is activated fairly promptly and the USAF BIP148 is avoided.

Miners seem to prefer segwit to be activated through BIP91 rather than through BIP148

[Darooghe]

I'm using alternative client ELECTRUM. if ELECTRUM choose another chain after hard forking that has lower value market then i want to know what will happen for my coins? Can i use them at higher value market?

[achow101]

I'm using alternative client ELECTRUM. if ELECTRUM choose another chain after hard forking that has lower value market then i want to know what will happen for my coins? Can i use them at higher value market?

Electrum allows you to connect to an electrum server that you want to use so you can choose the chain you want to use. If you end up on a chain that you don't want to use, you can switch to using a different server and use the chain that you do want to use.

[Darooghe]

I'm using alternative client ELECTRUM. if ELECTRUM choose another chain after hard forking that has lower value market then i want to know what will happen for my coins? Can i use them at higher value market?

Electrum allows you to connect to an electrum server that you want to use so you can choose the chain you want to use. If you end up on a chain that you don't want to use, you can switch to using a different server and use the chain that you do want to use.

Which one is better and safer for 1st august.

Option 1: Downloading bitcoin core from bitcoin.org and then made a address and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and export privkey and keep it.
Option 2: Using electrum and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and keep secret phrase.

Any different between them only for 1st august.

I am not so technical and sorry for my newbie questions.

[Quickseller]

I'm using alternative client ELECTRUM. if ELECTRUM choose another chain after hard forking that has lower value market then i want to know what will happen for my coins? Can i use them at higher value market?

Electrum allows you to connect to an electrum server that you want to use so you can choose the chain you want to use. If you end up on a chain that you don't want to use, you can switch to using a different server and use the chain that you do want to use.

Which one is better and safer for 1st august.

Option 1: Downloading bitcoin core from bitcoin.org and then made a address and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and export privkey and keep it.
Option 2: Using electrum and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and keep secret phrase.

Any different between them only for 1st august.

I am not so technical and sorry for my newbie questions.

Electrum would probably be incrementally safer because it would allow you to easily change the blockchain that you are working with for in the event that you need to verify that a transaction exists on a specific branch of a split (you likely will not know which branch you will care about prior to aug 1).

[achow101]

Which one is better and safer for 1st august.

Right now the problem is not August 1st. In fact, forks can and are likely to happen before august 1st because of BIP 91.

Option 1: Downloading bitcoin core from bitcoin.org and then made a address and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and export privkey and keep it.
Option 2: Using electrum and Transfer all of my coins from exchanges into it and keep secret phrase.

Any different between them only for 1st august.

Downloading Bitcoin Core will require you to sync the entire blockchain. This may take a long time. However Bitcoin Core gives you much finer and more granular control over which blockchain you want to use (you can mark blocks as invalid). For a newbie, I recommend that you use Electrum as you can still switch to use the chains that you want to by switching to a different electrum server.

[Qoheleth]

I'm trying to get a handle on the current state of various SegWit activation mechanisms. Please forgive me if these are stupid questions; I've been tuned out for a while and it's hard to sift through all the partisan jargon to find out what's going on.

• At this point, due to BIP141 activation windows, SegWit can't become active until about August 8th, right?
• At this point, assuming BIP91 miners don't change their minds and they continue to ignore non-BIP141 blocks, BIP148 is a no-op, right?

[Quickseller]

I'm trying to get a handle on the current state of various SegWit activation mechanisms. Please forgive me if these are stupid questions; I've been tuned out for a while and it's hard to sift through all the partisan jargon to find out what's going on.

• At this point, due to BIP141 activation windows, SegWit can't become active until about August 8th, right?
• At this point, assuming BIP91 miners don't change their minds and they continue to ignore non-BIP141 blocks, BIP148 is a no-op, right?

The next activation period for SegWit starts in about 2.1 days from this post (based on the number of blocks left in the current activation period and the estimated network hashrate). We can call the start of the new activation period July 27. Each activation period lasts 2016 blocks, and one might estimate it will take 13 days for the miners to mine 2016 blocks (this assumes an increase in difficulty of about 7%). This would put the end of the activation period at around August 6, 2017. Once SegWit 'locks in' there will be a 2016 block delay before SegWit (BIP 141) activates, and going off of a 13 day 2016 block schedule, it would put SegWit activating around August 19, 2017.

Both BIP 91 and BIP 148 use the same rules to validate blocks once activated, so as long as BIP 91 is followed (it would not be economical for the miners to not follow BIP 91 because they would be risking their block rewards), UASF (BIP 148) will be a non-event.

[B1tUnl0ck3r]

I'm not entirely sure why, perhaps this makes me a dick for saying this, but I hope Bitcoin Cash fails horribly. Wasn't Satoshi's original vision for bitcoin to have only 1MB for the block size? I'm not saying that he is correct with this stance, but I don't think it is cool that they use Satoshi's name like that to market themselves when it isn't his "original vision" like they say it is.

"We the people will breath new life into bitcoin"?? What is this? Most of us people don't want a fork, right?

Like so many you have been misinformed by those who wish to see bitcoin fail. The reality is the opposite of what you have been told, beware of the intense level of propaganda that prevails.

Satoshi's original design called for blocks to grow. The 1Mb limitation is currently imposed by a small and voiceful faction of the community who call themselves 'Core Developers' who don't want bitcoin to scale so they can implement an additional layer with their own technology on top of bitcoin.

So for all intents and purposes Bitcoin Cash is closest to Satoshi's vision.

Having said that, it doesn't mean the fork is a good idea. There is a community consensus to implement segwit on Aug 1st and then increase block sizes in November and this is what should be followed.

I agree with this post.

with segwit you add another layer of potential problems. when a simple modification to a 10mb block would have solved the issue temporary before raising to 100mb.

So why shall I have confidence in adding another layer to bitcoin? I am better using pivx for example where there will no problem or question about scaling the block size once the transaction capacity is reached (actually 70tps)...

it's pathetic. How do you plan to make money with segwit? Is there a way to host a second layer node and make some sats?