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Author Topic: Is taxation theft?  (Read 57899 times)
BADecker
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August 19, 2018, 08:57:52 PM
 #1201

tax is a civic responsibility a gainfully employed citizen owe to his/her country, its an obligation you owe to your country, so as a responsibly employed citizen, it is imperative one pays his or her income tax to the government of ones country, but what i am against and will never support is multiple taxation, that is theft.

If they can force taxation once, they can do it twice, and can go all the way if they want, and make you their slave. If you enjoy slavery, and you voluntarily pay, then it is not taxation for you. Rather, it is organized donation (contribution).

Actually, they have gone all the way. You are their slave. And I am receiving the bounty from your taxation slavery. Please keep on volunteering. I am enjoying being paid by you.

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August 22, 2018, 12:14:32 AM
Last edit: August 22, 2018, 11:30:50 AM by yogg
 #1202



"Heard from a French entrepreneur, a demonstration with figures that enlightens the reasons for our high unemployment rate.
When I give 100€ "gross" to one of my employees, in fact, it costs me 150€ because of all charges I have to pay for that.
From these 100 gross euros, my employee will get around 70€ after salary taxes deduction.
Then, he'll have to pay revenue taxes on this salary, around 30%, which will be 21€. So he has 49€ left.
However, on top of that, everything he buys has a 20% VAT tax on it, so, really, his purchasing power is only 39€.
End of the story, on 150€ spent on an employee, he'll get 39€ and the state gets 110€.
That's the cost of labour in France. This is how we have killed our industry and jobs. And if there is nothing done, this will only get worse..."
SimonOdell
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August 22, 2018, 02:11:04 AM
 #1203

No it's not theft it's a payment you make for the  privilege of living in a civilized society.

If you don't want to be taxed at all, then your free to move to the jungle where there are no taxmen, but also no roads, schools, firemen, police, hospitals, etc etc.

I'm not a communist, but I tell you what, if my house was on fire I would not want to have to check if I had paid my
subscription to the fire-brigade service before ringing them up and asking for their help to save my property from my
bad luck.

People who want to live in a society and contribute nothing towards it but still want to be helped by that society in all
the myriad ways that society helps its members out, are some sort of selfish scumbags IMHO.

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BADecker
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August 22, 2018, 02:21:54 PM
 #1204

No it's not theft it's a payment you make for the  privilege of living in a civilized society.

If you don't want to be taxed at all, then your free to move to the jungle where there are no taxmen, but also no roads, schools, firemen, police, hospitals, etc etc.

I'm not a communist, but I tell you what, if my house was on fire I would not want to have to check if I had paid my
subscription to the fire-brigade service before ringing them up and asking for their help to save my property from my
bad luck.

People who want to live in a society and contribute nothing towards it but still want to be helped by that society in all
the myriad ways that society helps its members out, are some sort of selfish scumbags IMHO.

If I don't want it, but am forced to pay it, it is a tax. That's robbery.

Look at Brazil and many African governments to see that there is taxation in the jungle.

If I and a bunch of other people don't want government services, why should we be forced to pay for them. For example, those stupid roads are in the way of the rights-of-way so that I can't use the rights-of-way without having to travel on the stupid roads. And the dumb cops are worse than the crooks at times, but seem to be almost immune to prosecution. Stop taxing me so that I have enough funds to buy decent services, and the services I want... not the services you and a bunch of government jerks want me to have. What you and government are promoting is robbery.

Build a concrete house, and you won't need a fire brigade. What need do I have of a fire brigade when my house is concrete and I have my personal fire prevention installed? Why are you charging me through taxation to pay for your lack of wisdom in building your house?

I want to live in a society that buys what they want, or donates to help others... not a society that steals my money property from me.

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Regdain
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August 23, 2018, 10:58:20 PM
 #1205

Paying tax is a government rule that every citizens on the country must follow. Whether simple person, poor, medium, and rich all are required to pay tax without any explanation to what is this, why we need this. Tax come from government that everybody now before born tax is smiling already. Even in the time of birth tax is there already. Tax in milk, wipes, pampers, and baby clothes and baby needs that can buy in the store. Tax is always working daily that the government catch it. It wasn't theft but the person whom have bad interest make tax distributable that the citizens become aggressive not to pay tax anymore but it cannot be.
tsinelas
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August 24, 2018, 04:12:59 AM
 #1206

When you study the word "tax" in the legal dictionaries, if you study it deeply enough, you will find that it equates to "fraud."

Cool

So, we should descend into anarchy?

And live like apes with sticks,stones, stealing from each-other, not building anything, not having any regulations, any funds to build something useful?

Tax have a good purpose if we will consider it as a theft there will no public service. And as you said steal with each other (theft).  We must see tax as a contribution for the good , I just see the tax as a good thing but excessive tax must be controlled.

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valisa
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August 24, 2018, 02:20:09 PM
 #1207

tax is a lot of problems in a country, so many people are in arrears of taxes, I myself agree with the tax but if the management is good and can be accounted for, because most of the mismanagement is in the hands of the government, many officials are corrupt from tax money, maybe therefore many people do not trust their government and refuse to pay taxes
BADecker
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August 25, 2018, 03:09:37 AM
 #1208

When you study the word "tax" in the legal dictionaries, if you study it deeply enough, you will find that it equates to "fraud."

Cool

So, we should descend into anarchy?

And live like apes with sticks,stones, stealing from each-other, not building anything, not having any regulations, any funds to build something useful?

Tax have a good purpose if we will consider it as a theft there will no public service. And as you said steal with each other (theft).  We must see tax as a contribution for the good , I just see the tax as a good thing but excessive tax must be controlled.

Some people don't want public service. I never use the public bus which is subsidized by city government, which subsidies come from taxes. Why should I pay for something I don't want?

If you go to Walmart and buy some groceries, is such a public service? Rather, isn't it buying and selling what you want? You never have to give part of your Walmart groceries to some other guy in a different check-out lane, and he doesn't have to give any of his to you. So, why should we have to give some of our money to government to pay for things we don't want?

It would be a lot better to buy the services you want from government, and never be taxed for anything. If you didn't buy a share of the road, you can't use it until you buy your share.

Cool
Kekenapep
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August 25, 2018, 09:12:39 PM
 #1209

Not at all... Tax money is used for the development of the society
BADecker
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August 25, 2018, 09:24:00 PM
 #1210

Not at all... Tax money is used for the development of the society

I don't want to be developed, society-wise. Who has the right to take my money to develop me society-wise if I don't give them permission? And if they develop other members of society with my money, that is double robbery.

Get rid of taxation and let members of society buy society improvements according to their own judgment and desires. Why let others judge me when my ideas are best for me?

Cool
yogg
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August 26, 2018, 11:07:55 AM
 #1211

Not at all... Tax money is used for the development of the society

I don't want to be developed, society-wise. Who has the right to take my money to develop me society-wise if I don't give them permission? And if they develop other members of society with my money, that is double robbery.

Get rid of taxation and let members of society buy society improvements according to their own judgment and desires. Why let others judge me when my ideas are best for me?

Cool

I couldn't agree more. We could be great friends BADecker.  Grin

Why taxation is theft, explained in a couple of minuts : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0-cgs51zEA

The fact that the state gives us "gifts" that what didn't ask for, as a return for paying taxes, doesn't legitimize the theft.
jaydenbox
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August 26, 2018, 11:37:35 AM
 #1212

Now I see the video is making a point but without TAX it is hard for the country, tax money is usually used to improve the country, like schools, hospitals and all the other important stuff we need on a daily basis, like infrastructure.
yogg
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August 26, 2018, 12:00:03 PM
 #1213

Now I see the video is making a point but without TAX it is hard for the country, tax money is usually used to improve the country, like schools, hospitals and all the other important stuff we need on a daily basis, like infrastructure.

That is true either, but that's easy to fix. Easy, if the aim of taxation wasn't a mass wealth transfer from the millions to a few.
In some countries, the amount paid by the government only to serve the public debt interests overcomes the total income tax revenue the government has.

Let the governments bring us accounting, transparency and choice, as opposed to the obscure "tax package" that we have nowadays and I'll be more than happy to participate for what I really use/owe, unlike now where it just feels like robbery. In it's current form, taxation is theft.
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August 26, 2018, 01:27:12 PM
 #1214

No it's not theft it's a payment you make for the  privilege of living in a civilized society.

If you don't want to be taxed at all, then your free to move to the jungle where there are no taxmen, but also no roads, schools, firemen, police, hospitals, etc etc.

I'm not a communist, but I tell you what, if my house was on fire I would not want to have to check if I had paid my
subscription to the fire-brigade service before ringing them up and asking for their help to save my property from my
bad luck.

People who want to live in a society and contribute nothing towards it but still want to be helped by that society in all
the myriad ways that society helps its members out, are some sort of selfish scumbags IMHO.

I would be fine doing that, but every piece of land on this earth is "owned" by someone.  We are forced to live in modern society.  There is really no where else we can go.  Most have of us have zero say in the laws and policies, we just have to follow their orders or we get punished.  Beautiful system, isn't it....
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September 26, 2018, 09:56:30 AM
 #1215

No, taxation is not theft. Taxation may seem like it but we need to know that the tax money is eventually spend on us. No governments can run on their own. You can look at the third world countries and see that there is chaos because of tax cheats. Please, don't become one of them and pay your taxes.
BADecker
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September 26, 2018, 11:20:46 AM
 #1216

No, taxation is not theft. Taxation may seem like it but we need to know that the tax money is eventually spend on us. No governments can run on their own. You can look at the third world countries and see that there is chaos because of tax cheats. Please, don't become one of them and pay your taxes.

Sounds like you are asking people to pay taxes.

If people volunteer to pay, the payments are not taxes. They are donations or contributions.

If people are forced to pay, the payments are taxes, and you don't have to say "please."

Why don't you donate a little more, so government has the strength to regulate the comb in your pocket? Or you could move to one of the strict socialist communist countries.

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September 26, 2018, 07:17:52 PM
 #1217




Source: Existential Comics

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September 26, 2018, 09:57:06 PM
 #1218

Look at the 2016 me!
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1732082.msg17331855#msg17331855
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1732082.msg17331667#msg17331667
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1732082.msg17331705#msg17331705

Interesting to see my opinion just 2 years ago, something I laugh at right now  Cheesy
I'm a devoted libertarian now Smiley

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September 26, 2018, 11:18:51 PM
 #1219

Not at all... Tax money is used for the development of the society

No, not development. Control of society. Management of society. If you like to be controlled, if you like to walk on a path which has been traced by someone else, you may like tax, but if you believe in freedom, if you believe it is your right to decide alone everything about your life, you don't like tax, nor do you like the idea of government.

X
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September 26, 2018, 11:24:28 PM
 #1220

No. Not in America at least.

Let's examine why it's not theft:

You're born. Where are you born? If it's in a hospital, guess who paid for that building? The roads, the infrastructure, the schooling for the doctors and nursing, the schools that gave the doctors a baseline intelligence? Well, society.

You live your life from the ages of 0-16 without paying a single penny into the system. At the same time, the system puts thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of dollars into you; school, healthcare, etc.

You go off to university; government (and by extension society) has funded these institutions through grants.

The land you walk on, American soldiers pushed back Native Americans, and defended the ground from them. America blood was paid to take the land which you think is yours.

In reality, the only way it'd be considered theft is if you've never utilized, or worked with any service provided by society.


Also, if you don't like paying your taxes, fucking leave. It's a small administrative fee to no longer pay taxes.

There's several countries in the world which have an effective tax rate of 0%:

United Arab Emirates, Saudi Arabia, and Oman to list a few. Enjoy the life of a slave there, without any rights, benefits, or freedoms.
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