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Author Topic: Will segwit be activated?  (Read 4365 times)
RealBitcoin (OP)
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January 20, 2017, 12:28:12 AM
Last edit: January 20, 2017, 12:41:29 AM by RealBitcoin
 #1

Out of the 26 periods 4 have already expired and it doesn't look like it will go through the 5th either. The support for it stagnates at 24.4%, and it doesnt look like it will grow any time soon.

Looks like nodes either dont care, or outright reject segwit, which means that the devs should already look into alternatives if the network rejects segwit.

They should not scramble at the last minute, but instead be prepared with alternative solutions instead of segwit.


What now? Maybe block size increase? I used to be against it, but looking at it now, there is really no other option. Besides the TX fee costs are already outrageous, and it's only going to get worse:

https://bitcoinfees.21.co


Fees used to be 80% cheaper just 6 months ago, and if this goes on like this then we might end up with 1-10$ size fees just like banks. What will be the point then of BTC when the fees will be just as high as of banks? Or higher?

Even if you use Bitcoin through Tor, the way transactions are handled by the network makes anonymity difficult to achieve. Do not expect your transactions to be anonymous unless you really know what you're doing.
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January 20, 2017, 12:47:59 AM
 #2

It is far more likely that Segwit is going to fail and very little will come of it, beyond the now believed and measured 25% support for changing the system to allow for more transactions and better times.

Right now people probably don't care because it doesn't immediately affect them, but once we do get large fees like you're saying, I would expect for a lot of people to want to change.
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January 20, 2017, 12:51:00 AM
 #3

Of coarse it will  Smiley. There's no other sensible solution.
Let me remind you, that the other option HARDFORK Unlimited promoted by three rascals Mile Hearn, Gavin Andressen, And Roger Ver, intend to harm and ruin Bitcoin forever. They've already made 2 attemps - XT and Classic and failed. Now their final overture we must be vigilant.
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January 20, 2017, 12:52:15 AM
 #4

It is far more likely that Segwit is going to fail and very little will come of it, beyond the now believed and measured 25% support for changing the system to allow for more transactions and better times.

Right now people probably don't care because it doesn't immediately affect them, but once we do get large fees like you're saying, I would expect for a lot of people to want to change.

Probably, but what is Plan B?

Will the devs just sit by, or they are already planning plan B in case segwit fails?

I hope they won't just wake up with their pants down after the activation period fails. I hope they are already considering alternatives, even the block increase, as last resort.

We need to be very flexible when it comes to this. After all it's the bitcoin community that has the ultimate authority, and everyone else must conform to the will of the community.

Of coarse it will  Smiley. There's no other sensible solution.
Let me remind you, that the other option HARDFORK Unlimited promoted by three rascals Mile Hearn, Gavin Andreseen, And Roger Ver, intend to harm and ruin Bitcoin forever. They've already made 2 attemps - XT and Classic and failed. Now their final overture we must be vigilant.

They won't look like rascals, when the BTC TX fee will be 5$.


We need a sensible solution, right NOW. We cannot wait 1 more year.

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January 20, 2017, 12:59:06 AM
 #5


They won't look like rascals, when the BTC TX fee will be 5$.

We need a sensible solution, right NOW. We cannot wait 1 more year.

Do you remember Andressen assertion that Craig is Satoshi Nakamoto. And you want to believe this man?
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January 20, 2017, 01:03:31 AM
 #6


They won't look like rascals, when the BTC TX fee will be 5$.

We need a sensible solution, right NOW. We cannot wait 1 more year.

Do you remember Andressen assertion that Craig is Satoshi Nakamoto. And you want to believe this man?

What the hell does that have to do with technical discussions?

We are not talking about celebrities here, and who does what like teenage girls, we are trying to solve bitcoin's scaling problem.

I have no opinion on Gavin, I dont really even care about people in bitcoin.

What I care about is a safe and prosperous future for bitcoin.


If a bad guy is supporting a good solution, that doesnt make the solution bad, get it? Look at the facts objectively, and stop the gossip about who did what.


If the hardfork is the best for bitcoin, then I dont care if the devil is advocating it, as long as it is a safe and good solution for bitcoin.

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January 20, 2017, 01:08:06 AM
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They won't look like rascals, when the BTC TX fee will be 5$.

We need a sensible solution, right NOW. We cannot wait 1 more year.

Do you remember Andressen assertion that Craig is Satoshi Nakamoto. And you want to believe this man?

What the hell does that have to do with technical discussions?


I have no opinion on Gavin, I dont really even care about people in bitcoin.

What I care about is a safe and prosperous future for bitcoin.


If a bad guy is supporting a good solution, that doesnt make the solution bad, get it? Look at the facts objectively, and stop the gossip about who did what.


If the hardfork is the best for bitcoin, then I dont care if the devil is advocating it, as long as it is a safe and good solution for bitcoin.
He is not supporting the solution he is MAIN CREATOR AND PROMOTER of this solution. And he is completely MAD or CORRUPT...
How are we to trust this lunatic???
RealBitcoin (OP)
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January 20, 2017, 01:16:40 AM
 #8


He is not supporting the solution he is MAIN CREATOR AND PROMOTER of this solution. And he is completely MAD or CORRUPT...
How are we to trust this lunatic???

But who really cares about Gavin? To my knowledge he is not even involved in BTC now.

What is your problem? Haven't you read what I was saying above?


Don't look at the person, look at the plan, it's only weak minds that are discussing people, inteligent people are discussing code and possible solutions.

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January 20, 2017, 01:23:49 AM
Last edit: January 20, 2017, 01:56:29 AM by HostFat
 #9

On the Bitcoin Unlimited forum and Slack chat, it's hardly to see both Gavin Andressen or Roger Ver.
Again, you can't find them anywhere by nearly a year.

All the devs of Bitcoin Unlimited (or Bitcoin Classic) are working on their own, Gavin Andresen and Roger Ver could even disappear from the earth tomorrow and nothing will change on the Bitcoin Unlimited developing cicle.

This, just to help you to be in better contact with the reality Wink

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January 20, 2017, 01:25:22 AM
 #10


He is not supporting the solution he is MAIN CREATOR AND PROMOTER of this solution. And he is completely MAD or CORRUPT...
How are we to trust this lunatic???

But who really cares about Gavin? To my knowledge he is not even involved in BTC now.

What is your problem? Haven't you read what I was saying above?


Don't look at the person, look at the plan, it's only weak minds that are discussing people, inteligent people are discussing code and possible solutions.
I look at the whole picture and don't let rascals shit my brain as should you do.
Segwit is far more progressive and technological solution than dumb increesing block size by HARDFORK... If you want to hear technical details  Cheesy
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January 20, 2017, 01:30:35 AM
 #11

On the Bitcoin Unlimited forum and Slack chat, it's hardly to see both Gavin Andressen or Roger Ver.
Again, you can't find them anywhere by nearly a year.

All the devs of Bitcoin Unlimited are working on their own, Gavin Andresen and Roger Ver could even disappear from the earth tomorrow and nothing will change on the Bitcoin Unlimited developing cicle.

This, just to help you to be in better contact with the reality Wink
But still they're enemies of BITCOIN and decentralization and they promote this solution. I don't want bitcoin to die, so fuck Roger Ver and his HARDFORK
RealBitcoin (OP)
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January 20, 2017, 01:35:00 AM
 #12

On the Bitcoin Unlimited forum and Slack chat, it's hardly to see both Gavin Andressen or Roger Ver.
Again, you can't find them anywhere by nearly a year.

All the devs of Bitcoin Unlimited (or Bitcoin Classic) are working on their own, Gavin Andresen and Roger Ver could even disappear from the earth tomorrow and nothing will change on the Bitcoin Unlimited developing cicle.

This, just to help you to be in better contact with the reality Wink

Well yeah, Ver is an entrepreneur not a programmer, why would he be into technical stuff?

But say this to Viscount not to me, he is obsessed with Gavin and Roger.


I look at the whole picture and don't let rascals shit my brain as should you do.
Segwit is far more progressive and technological solution than dumb increesing block size by HARDFORK... If you want to hear technical details  Cheesy

But still they're enemies of BITCOIN and decentralization and they promote this solution. I don't want bitcoin to die, so fuck Roger Ver and his HARDFORK

I think that is a very closed minded statement.

Ver is a huge investor in Bitcoin. Bitcoin failing is probably the last thing he wants to see.

He just wants a quick solution (as most of us to) to this god awful problem of scaling.

I dont see any problem with decentralization being affected by hardfork.

In fact the clock is ticking either way, and if we dont resolve the fee problem, then the demand will probably go away.

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January 20, 2017, 01:43:33 AM
 #13

Current data: Mining Pool Support by Proposal - Bitcoin Unlimited is supported by 17.30% of miners, SegWit by 16.67 and 8 MB Blocks Increase by 9.30%
As we can see Bitcoin Unlimited is winning with SegWit, we can forget about 95% consensus. Roger Ver was very happy when he tweeted that:

"Bitcoin Unlimited now has more support from bitcoin miners (and likely users for a while now) than SegWit in the last 24 hours."

https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/821802321860444160
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January 20, 2017, 01:45:06 AM
 #14




Ver is a huge investor in Bitcoin. Bitcoin failing is probably the last thing he wants to see.


He WAS an investor in Bitcoin. He made his fortune on it, that's true.
But now he's fond of alts he says bitcoin is dead pushes some alts e.g. monero. That's why he wants bitcoin to die so his forks prevail... which never happens.
So If you fond of monero too not bitcoin I understand why you take hardfork side  Sad
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January 20, 2017, 01:48:32 AM
 #15

Current data: Mining Pool Support by Proposal - Bitcoin Unlimited is supported by 17.30% of miners, SegWit by 16.67 and 8 MB Blocks Increase by 9.30%
As we can see Bitcoin Unlimited is winning with SegWit, we can forget about 95% consensus. Roger Ver was very happy when he tweeted that.

segwit nodes 1601 (28.64%)
unlimited 398 (7.12%)
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January 20, 2017, 01:51:20 AM
 #16

before segwit activation, wallets need to leave the WIP/PLANNED marker ... so, they MUST test products in TESTNET that it is SEGWIT activate.

https://bitcoincore.org/en/segwit_adoption/
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January 20, 2017, 01:59:20 AM
 #17

as best as unbiased as i can be..
here are some options.

1. if segwit truly was 'backward compatible'. core could make some segwit transactions now and relay them directly to BTCC or Slush..(the two pools in support) get the Tx's added to the block and see if any orphans occur when that block is relayed to the network.
if no orphan occurs, then its backward compatible and that raises the confidence level.

core cough blockstream cough have $90m so they can happily pay BTCC $15k (price exceeding more than a blockreward) as a safeguard to btcc if the block orphans.
cheap 'test' in reality.

however it does not solve the second bit of confidence/risk that the majority of pools are not happy jumping forward at.. (lack of node full validation count)

2. doing it as a full community consensus. getting the community to have a consensus, rather than just the pools.
this is a consensus (hard)fork.. not an intentional split. .. consensus. there is a difference.

and if pools see a high majority of nodes able to fully validate these new blocks, then pools will gain confidence to vote for it and make them.

however it then means the community gain power to veto aswell as show devotion for (yep core dont want decentralised free choice).

3. so knowing they would need 95% community acceptance they would need to give the community something the community really want.
real true onchain transaction scaling thats not just a one time boost and also not having to let the devs decide what nodes should or shouldnt do.

so by also including dynamic blocks as a core release. nodes regain the independant diverse decentralised power. and it grows only when nodes show they can cope with.

then its just a 2 birds 1 stone election event where everyone gets what they want. and all different (10 different implementations) can be diversely accepting and consenting to the same things on an even playing field, rather than a one brand dominance/control event

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January 20, 2017, 02:05:39 AM
 #18

Ver is a huge investor in Bitcoin. Bitcoin failing is probably the last thing he wants to see.
He WAS an investor in Bitcoin. He made his fortune on it, that's true.
But now he's fond of alts he says bitcoin is dead pushes some alts e.g. monero. That's why he wants bitcoin to die so his forks prevail... which never happens.
So If you fond of monero too not bitcoin I understand why you take hardfork side  Sad


why is it that blockstream sheep use all of blockstream failures to sound like someone else is doing it.

Gmaxwell loves monero.. he is the lead dev.. he even has a monero address in his profile!! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=11425
gmaxwell actually wanted the other implementations to fork off, the other implementations laughed and aggressively said no
gmaxwell has helped add tx maturity(CLTV: bank 3-7day funds not available)
gmaxwell has helped add tx revocation(CSV: bank paypal chargebacks)
gmaxwell has pushed the fee war (advocated not to increase blocksize.. added 'average' fee estimator that actually increases fee even with no demand)
gmaxwell /rusty russell wants commercial permissioned services (LN Hubs)
gmaxwell/adamback organised many all expense weekends for miners to bribe miners
gmaxwell/adamback are members of the bankers hyper ledger (bankers blockchain)
gmaxwell/adamback are paid by bankers

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Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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January 20, 2017, 02:29:41 AM
 #19




Ver is a huge investor in Bitcoin. Bitcoin failing is probably the last thing he wants to see.


He WAS an investor in Bitcoin. He made his fortune on it, that's true.
But now he's fond of alts he says bitcoin is dead pushes some alts e.g. monero. That's why he wants bitcoin to die so his forks prevail... which never happens.
So If you fond of monero too not bitcoin I understand why you take hardfork side  Sad


Actually I find Monero pretty crappy, because after years of being online ,they cant even put out a GUI lightweight wallet.

And besides that the blockchain is pretty bloated and has a big size. Some people say that the cryptonote technology is not good and not safe.

Perhaps DASH is better, because at least it's price is going up now.



But on the bitcoin side. I would support a hardfork now.

And a BTC hardfork would not split the network in 2 because BTC has a 2 week retarget, and no miner would mine on the minority chain for 2 weeks.

So the majority always wins. It could technically happen with 51%, but just for safety and less drama, let's say 70%.

So if 70% agrees to hardfork now, of a 2mb, then the other 30% will be outnumbered, and then they will later see that it was not a big deal.


It' will not split in 2 like Ethereum vs Eth classic.

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January 20, 2017, 02:46:38 AM
 #20

Well it is hard to be answered, segwit is solution for bitcoin's problem but right now it becomes problem for bitcoins
because of many people are dissagree with segwit especially the miners from China although the segwit will be activated
it needs much time and hard discussion for activation of it.
But if still there are no solution for activation the segwit must there are other ways fixing bitcoin's problem except segwit.
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