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Author Topic: Avalon vs Bitmain  (Read 10965 times)
ssnova
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February 24, 2017, 10:53:08 PM
 #81

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I'm now considering putting 3-4 Avalon 721's on a single 240 volt PSU(that'll put me at like 3000-4000 watts right?)... what's the best solution for that?  I only have one 240 volt plug for the dryer.
That is a very good solution with one caveat:
Folks must keep in mind that a 3-4kw PSU also makes a very fine 250-333A DC arc welder. If there is a short on a hash board, that PSU is more than happy to feed all of its energy into that short. Considering that PCIe connectors/cables are at best only good for 27A across the 3 circuits that will result in some impressive fireworks...

Check the s7 threads for pics of what can happen. It should scare the bejeezes out of ya.

As a Engineer with over 50 years designing power electronics it would be negligent for me to not say: FUSE THE PCIe CABLE FEEDS!!! Using 30-35A automotive blade-style fuse for each cable would be perfect.

I believe ya.  However, what I need help understanding is: "fuse the pcie cable feeds".   So you're saying I should splice in fuses for each pcie cable going out to the board? Got any examples or pics?


Also, would you recommend the 240volt route that I'm thinking of?  ... In addition to say... splicing fuses in the pci-e cables?  Or would you recommend me just buying 3-4 separate PSU's? 
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NotFuzzyWarm
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February 24, 2017, 11:38:27 PM
 #82

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I'm now considering putting 3-4 Avalon 721's on a single 240 volt PSU(that'll put me at like 3000-4000 watts right?)... what's the best solution for that?  I only have one 240 volt plug for the dryer.
That is a very good solution with one caveat:
Folks must keep in mind that a 3-4kw PSU also makes a very fine 250-333A DC arc welder. If there is a short on a hash board, that PSU is more than happy to feed all of its energy into that short. Considering that PCIe connectors/cables are at best only good for 27A across the 3 circuits that will result in some impressive fireworks...

Check the s7 threads for pics of what can happen. It should scare the bejeezes out of ya.

edit added pic of a crispy fried s7. Believe it belonged to Tupso?


As an Engineer with over 50 years designing power electronics it would be negligent for me to not say: FUSE THE PCIe CABLE FEEDS!!! Using 30-35A automotive blade-style fuse for each cable would be perfect.

I believe ya.  However, what I need help understanding is: "fuse the pcie cable feeds".   So you're saying I should splice in fuses for each pcie cable going out to the board? Got any examples or pics?


Also, would you recommend the 240volt route that I'm thinking of?  ... In addition to say... splicing fuses in the pci-e cables?  Or would you recommend me just buying 3-4 separate PSU's?  
Basically just cut the 3 yellow wires of each cable a few inches from the PSU end then attach the 3 from each 'end' to a single automotive fuse holder, the 3 from psu side tie together to feed the fuse holder, the 3 headed to the miner come out of it. Just search Amazon for 'Auto fuse holder' or just 'fuse block'. Individual spliced-in ones keep it simple for use with breakout boards. A Fuse block with a single high-current feed to 4 or more fuses is more for if you know how to directly wire to the monster IBM psu's.

If you get a small 4-circuit PDU again check amazon, ebay, whoever that can be easily wired to the single 220v outlet and allow 4 smaller psu's.

-Joshua Zipkin aka Joshua Alexander leaked AMT A1 miner skype chats http://bit.ly/1Qjt6lj
-For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself.
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
ssnova
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February 26, 2017, 03:41:02 AM
 #83

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I'm now considering putting 3-4 Avalon 721's on a single 240 volt PSU(that'll put me at like 3000-4000 watts right?)... what's the best solution for that?  I only have one 240 volt plug for the dryer.
That is a very good solution with one caveat:
Folks must keep in mind that a 3-4kw PSU also makes a very fine 250-333A DC arc welder. If there is a short on a hash board, that PSU is more than happy to feed all of its energy into that short. Considering that PCIe connectors/cables are at best only good for 27A across the 3 circuits that will result in some impressive fireworks...

Check the s7 threads for pics of what can happen. It should scare the bejeezes out of ya.

edit added pic of a crispy fried s7. Believe it belonged to Tupso?


As an Engineer with over 50 years designing power electronics it would be negligent for me to not say: FUSE THE PCIe CABLE FEEDS!!! Using 30-35A automotive blade-style fuse for each cable would be perfect.

I believe ya.  However, what I need help understanding is: "fuse the pcie cable feeds".   So you're saying I should splice in fuses for each pcie cable going out to the board? Got any examples or pics?


Also, would you recommend the 240volt route that I'm thinking of?  ... In addition to say... splicing fuses in the pci-e cables?  Or would you recommend me just buying 3-4 separate PSU's?  
Basically just cut the 3 yellow wires of each cable a few inches from the PSU end then attach the 3 from each 'end' to a single automotive fuse holder, the 3 from psu side tie together to feed the fuse holder, the 3 headed to the miner come out of it. Just search Amazon for 'Auto fuse holder' or just 'fuse block'. Individual spliced-in ones keep it simple for use with breakout boards. A Fuse block with a single high-current feed to 4 or more fuses is more for if you know how to directly wire to the monster IBM psu's.

If you get a small 4-circuit PDU again check amazon, ebay, whoever that can be easily wired to the single 220v outlet and allow 4 smaller psu's.

I think I got'cha on the set up, thanks for explaining that out.

By the way... out of curiosity... would the EVGA G2 PC PSU need fuse protection too, if I went that route? I was under the impression that it should've had abunch of protection mechanisms built in(the EVGA G2 series).  I'll also be making sure to get a decent surge protector too...I've got a tripp lite. I admit I'm going back and forth on the power supply option now..
NotFuzzyWarm
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February 28, 2017, 12:00:27 AM
 #84

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By the way... out of curiosity... would the EVGA G2 PC PSU need fuse protection too, if I went that route? I was under the impression that it should've had a bunch of protection mechanisms built in(the EVGA G2 series).  I'll also be making sure to get a decent surge protector too...I've got a tripp lite. I admit I'm going back and forth on the power supply option now..

Well IF a PSU can/does monitor each PCIe power output jack/cable it has all would be nice and safe.
Problem is: I have never came across a PSU that does that. From a power source stand point  - especially with miners - it is crucial that all the outputs are fed from a single point or rail. That rather precludes automatic sensing of individual cable overloads at a reasonable cost.

With multi-kw server supplies, the backplane they normally would plug into and/or the cards fed from the backplane are fused just so a short does not take out everything...

At least with each cable fused, if there is a short, yes for a hopefully brief pulse of only a few seconds the card will be cooked but as the currents rise one fuse after another feeding the hash board should blow pretty quick before things get too out of hand. Personally with even the hungriest Ant s9 I'd fuse each cable for just 20-25A. A 1,400w s9 @ 12v pulls a total of 38.89A per-card and when divided by 3 connectors/card is only 12.96A per cable. I *do* have give Bitmain credit for being very conservative on that point.

A rule of thumb on fusing: A slow-blow blade style will carry 100% of rating indefinitely. It takes at least a sustained 135-150% to blow within 30-sec and >200% to blow in several hundred ms.

Ahem, Sidehack - ever think of supplying fused PCIe cables?

edit: ref https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1493601.msg18004167#msg18004167 for a very nice pictorial translation done by another member of the cable fusing

-Joshua Zipkin aka Joshua Alexander leaked AMT A1 miner skype chats http://bit.ly/1Qjt6lj
-For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself.
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
pluMmet
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May 01, 2017, 01:20:31 PM
 #85

NP.
Along those lines... I have 2x of the Avalon 721's that finally shipped last Friday, 2 days after the BTC exchange had over 100 confirmations. Anywho, FedEx says it arrived at their processing center on LANTAU ISLAND, HK Sat morning and just checked - is still there. FedEx says will arrive this Wed. so fingers crossed...

You purchased the A721's with BTC?

I'd like to purchase some 741's but can't seem to find the way?

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May 01, 2017, 01:34:11 PM
 #86

NP.
Along those lines... I have 2x of the Avalon 721's that finally shipped last Friday, 2 days after the BTC exchange had over 100 confirmations. Anywho, FedEx says it arrived at their processing center on LANTAU ISLAND, HK Sat morning and just checked - is still there. FedEx says will arrive this Wed. so fingers crossed...
You purchased the A721's with BTC?
I'd like to purchase some 741's but can't seem to find the way?
Unless Canaan has changed their process, put in a note about using BTC when you place your order. No matter what it is a 3-step process when ordering:
1) is placing the order
2) is Canaan contacting you to give wirexfr info or BTC amount and address - sometime they don't catch the note from step-1 so remind them you want to use BTC, then they will tell you BTC amount and address.
3 or 4) is you sending the funds and replying

Tip: When possible, stick with using Canaan's support ticket system for replies. Sometimes the Ticket system and email replies do not sync in a timely manner (and that is being nice...)

-Joshua Zipkin aka Joshua Alexander leaked AMT A1 miner skype chats http://bit.ly/1Qjt6lj
-For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself.
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
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May 01, 2017, 01:55:27 PM
 #87

I have a ticket in now.. I'm glad for your advice as I had not seen the BTC option just people complaining that they could not use BTC Wink

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May 29, 2017, 01:29:39 PM
 #88

I am new to the bitcoin mining i want to buy S9 for bitcoin mining but does segwit affect the mining of bitcoin
Is there some thing like this that S9 will not be more profitable or not compatible to the bitcoin mining because software update will not be compatible with the S9 hardware miner.Because i read some where that  Wu Jihan the founder of bitmain is against the segwit
Avalon is a good option if i not continue with the bitmain?
need your help.This will help me lot.
philipma1957
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May 29, 2017, 06:54:32 PM
 #89

I am new to the bitcoin mining i want to buy S9 for bitcoin mining but does segwit affect the mining of bitcoin
Is there some thing like this that S9 will not be more profitable or not compatible to the bitcoin mining because software update will not be compatible with the S9 hardware miner.Because i read some where that  Wu Jihan the founder of bitmain is against the segwit
Avalon is a good option if i not continue with the bitmain?
need your help.This will help me lot.


this is a nonsense question.

it is senseless.

so you are fully ignorant  and new

or you are a troll.



if segwit  becomes true  every btc mining device will be subject to it.

So having all bitfury, all bitmain, all avalon  will not shield you from the affect of segwit.

As to what segwit will do no one is sure if it will hurt or help BTC.

So  either don't get any btc miner at all

or get anyone you want

or do what I do mine btc with  btc miner
and mine some alternative coins with gpus.

So if segwit is bad for btc  you still have alternative coin mining.

and if segwit is good for btc  you still have btc miners.

Please support sidehack with his new miner project Send to : 1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
I mine alt coins with https://simplemining.net I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
NotFuzzyWarm
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May 29, 2017, 06:57:50 PM
 #90

BTC miners do not care about segwit or BU or whatever as they do not affect what the miners do or how they work. Both the s9 and Avalons are a good choice.

-Joshua Zipkin aka Joshua Alexander leaked AMT A1 miner skype chats http://bit.ly/1Qjt6lj
-For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself.
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
Heike Reagan
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May 30, 2017, 09:24:17 AM
 #91

I am new to the bitcoin mining i want to buy S9 for bitcoin mining but does segwit affect the mining of bitcoin
Is there some thing like this that S9 will not be more profitable or not compatible to the bitcoin mining because software update will not be compatible with the S9 hardware miner.Because i read some where that  Wu Jihan the founder of bitmain is against the segwit
Avalon is a good option if i not continue with the bitmain?
need your help.This will help me lot.


this is a nonsense question.

it is senseless.

so you are fully ignorant  and new

or you are a troll.



if segwit  becomes true  every btc mining device will be subject to it.

So having all bitfury, all bitmain, all avalon  will not shield you from the affect of segwit.

As to what segwit will do no one is sure if it will hurt or help BTC.

So  either don't get any btc miner at all

or get anyone you want

or do what I do mine btc with  btc miner
and mine some alternative coins with gpus.

So if segwit is bad for btc  you still have alternative coin mining.

and if segwit is good for btc  you still have btc miners.

Thanks for your reply 
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May 30, 2017, 12:37:44 PM
 #92

BTC miners do not care about segwit or BU or whatever as they do not affect what the miners do or how they work. Both the s9 and Avalons are a good choice.

 In the long term, BTC miners DO care about Segwit and 2MB block adoption - because without those measured to fix the Bitcoin "scaling" issue Bitcoin was going to start losing demand and dropping in price.

 In the short term, they don't care because it should not affect the actual mining as long as
 1) If you are solo mining, you keep your wallet updated
 2) If you are pool mining, the pool you are mining through keeps THEIR wallet(s) updated.



 BU however had the potential under certain circumstances to allow an entire chain - and ALL OF THE TRANSACTIONS ON IT - to just "poof", which would have been very bad news for an miner that found a block on that chain only to have their block reward poof with the chain, or had payouts from finding shares on that chain poof with the chain.

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May 30, 2017, 12:43:17 PM
 #93

BTC miners do not care about segwit or BU or whatever as they do not affect what the miners do or how they work. Both the s9 and Avalons are a good choice.

 In the long term, BTC miners DO care about Segwit and 2MB block adoption - because without those measured to fix the Bitcoin "scaling" issue Bitcoin was going to start losing demand and dropping in price.

 In the short term, they don't care because it should not affect the actual mining as long as
 1) If you are solo mining, you keep your wallet updated
 2) If you are pool mining, the pool you are mining through keeps THEIR wallet(s) updated.



 BU however had the potential under certain circumstances to allow an entire chain - and ALL OF THE TRANSACTIONS ON IT - to just "poof", which would have been very bad news for an miner that found a block on that chain only to have their block reward poof with the chain, or had payouts from finding shares on that chain poof with the chain.



I think he was talking about the machines not the people. Smiley

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May 30, 2017, 12:54:16 PM
 #94

<snip>
I think he was talking about the machines not the people. Smiley
Yes, I was referring to the hardware not caring about BU, segwit, et al.

-Joshua Zipkin aka Joshua Alexander leaked AMT A1 miner skype chats http://bit.ly/1Qjt6lj
-For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself.
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
philipma1957
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May 31, 2017, 05:00:41 PM
 #95

BTC miners do not care about segwit or BU or whatever as they do not affect what the miners do or how they work. Both the s9 and Avalons are a good choice.

 In the long term, BTC miners DO care about Segwit and 2MB block adoption - because without those measured to fix the Bitcoin "scaling" issue Bitcoin was going to start losing demand and dropping in price.

 In the short term, they don't care because it should not affect the actual mining as long as
 1) If you are solo mining, you keep your wallet updated
 2) If you are pool mining, the pool you are mining through keeps THEIR wallet(s) updated.



 BU however had the potential under certain circumstances to allow an entire chain - and ALL OF THE TRANSACTIONS ON IT - to just "poof", which would have been very bad news for an miner that found a block on that chain only to have their block reward poof with the chain, or had payouts from finding shares on that chain poof with the chain.



I think he was talking about the machines not the people. Smiley

Internet is a bitch  when it comes to understanding each other.

I have said nice things  and got into wars  online as the other guy thought I was sarcastic.

As far as I know the gear will mine.

And  the segwit-bu-  make up your mind already !!  Has done so much damage to btc or  growth to alt coins .(Eye of the beholder ) 

 At this point in time  I no longer care what gets done as long as it takes a long time to do it.  As the indecision seems to be working for my mining choices.

Please support sidehack with his new miner project Send to : 1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
I mine alt coins with https://simplemining.net I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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June 05, 2017, 08:55:31 AM
 #96

Avalon has never ever given me a problem, not even a hiccup...can't say the same for Bitmain.

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