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Question: Jan. 17 Closing Price:
$0 - 3 (2.7%)
<$6500 - 5 (4.5%)
$6,500-$7,000 - 6 (5.4%)
$7,000-$7,500 - 8 (7.2%)
$7,500-$8,000 - 16 (14.4%)
$8,000-$8,500 - 25 (22.5%)
$8,500-$9,000 - 10 (9%)
$9,000-$9,500 - 15 (13.5%)
>$9,500 - 23 (20.7%)
Total Voters: 111

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 21496951 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (138 posts by 32 users deleted.)
Elwar
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June 19, 2017, 01:05:27 AM

I plan on opening a hotdog stand and creating a private blockchain for inventory management.

Blockchain is cool... BUt what about an ICO first? Think BIG. You could easily get a few ten millions for your little hotdog stand. No need to invest your own money on it. Heck, no need to even open the hotdog stand.



Seems legit.
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June 19, 2017, 01:46:39 AM



Ahh cool, well I'm still learning a lot about trading, but I am currently programming a dashboard to simplify some stuff ( auto limit orders, managing funds from customer etc ). Also since this is the speculation forum, what is everyone's thought about tonight, how low will we go. 2k support or back to 1900


Well, currently, we seem  to be about in the middle of a price range of $2300 to $2650.  We are nearly in the middle, and it seems to be a bit less likely that we are going to break downwards out of the range before we break upwards.

And, yeah, if we were to break downwards, then there would be pretty decent odds of going below $2k and $1800 would be fairly reasonable.. on the other hand, like I said, breaking up seems to bit more of a better bet - at least at the moment... and if we break above $2650 then likely we will be on our way to testing $3k.

I would not rule out consolidating for 1-2 weeks either, which may cause some boredom and maybe that is slightly less odds of going up would be to go sideways within the previously described price range.


The essence of your post:
"Guys, either it will go up or it will go down. If that does not happen, it will stay the same."

You are the best oracle I've ever seen, your predictions must be like 100% true.
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June 19, 2017, 02:35:56 AM

The finance industry and others are moving to a blockchain, it has not yet been adopted in full or implemented.

my personal suspicion is that the finance industry will never find a use for a public blockchain. i've heard of people who've attended some of these professional conferences coming back with the impression that very few of the attendees knew anything about it and were there to look cool.

but that's ok because real people will force them to deal with it whether they like it or not.  

I work on finance industry, with IT at a Multinational Bank, directly with CEOs. I can confirm most people working on research and attending weekly conferences within banking corporation CEOs know NOTHING - I repat: NOTHING about crypto and some top analysts don't even have had contact with Bitcoin or any other coin whatsoever. Such a shame.

As nearly a perfect implementation of a trustless blockchain as Bitcoin is, the Financial/banking industry has absolutely zero interest in using it, for ONE reason only:

Because they can't corner the Bitcoin market at this point. And a market that they can't corner and/or rig (in favor of the wealthy elite) is a market that they can't control.

That should be telling us all something. That we should be using Bitcoin only, and use absolutely nothing that the Finance world would eventually promote.
Ken1022
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June 19, 2017, 03:14:23 AM

The finance industry and others are moving to a blockchain, it has not yet been adopted in full or implemented.

my personal suspicion is that the finance industry will never find a use for a public blockchain. i've heard of people who've attended some of these professional conferences coming back with the impression that very few of the attendees knew anything about it and were there to look cool.

but that's ok because real people will force them to deal with it whether they like it or not.  

I work on finance industry, with IT at a Multinational Bank, directly with CEOs. I can confirm most people working on research and attending weekly conferences within banking corporation CEOs know NOTHING - I repat: NOTHING about crypto and some top analysts don't even have had contact with Bitcoin or any other coin whatsoever. Such a shame.

As nearly a perfect implementation of a trustless blockchain as Bitcoin is, the Financial/banking industry has absolutely zero interest in using it, for ONE reason only:

Because they can't corner the Bitcoin market at this point. And a market that they can't corner and/or rig (in favor of the wealthy elite) is a market that they can't control.

That should be telling us all something. That we should be using Bitcoin only, and use absolutely nothing that the Finance world would eventually promote.

I've got something that can relate to this

For anonymity, I'd like to mention a certain popular bank in my country that had once provided BTC cash-out services, but following the recent month's crazy spikes, the service was indefinitely suspended.

A surprising number of low-middle class IT students in my area have been benefiting allot prior to this. It really isn't fair for their options to become limited, but at least there are still 2 other slightly lesser known banks open to this service. But on a side note: One had a serious hack/glitch issue so trust problems had arisen. The other is extremely secured and trusted, but have limited branches compared to the other two.

So inside my little town, I do also believe... and experience at first hand.... that the banking/financial industry at a majority not dependable with bitcoin in the near future.
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June 19, 2017, 04:11:40 AM

I plan on opening a hotdog stand and creating a private blockchain for inventory management.

Blockchain is cool... BUt what about an ICO first? Think BIG. You could easily get a few ten millions for your little hotdog stand. No need to invest your own money on it. Heck, no need to even open the hotdog stand.



Seems legit.

HotDogStand ICO.
Ticker symbol HDS.
Long name: HotDogs.
Algo: Proof of Steak. or Proof of Meat. or Proof of Hotdogs.
Coin Supply: 1000
To be sold in ICO: 800, 200 will be kept by Elwar and Devs, locked in escrow for a period of 6 months
Angel Day Bonus: 20%
1 week Bonus: 15%
2 week Bonus: 10%
3 week Bonus: 5%
Last week: 0%
Minimum Target: 100 BTC
Maximum Target: 10000 BTC, if reached, will have 24 hours and then ICO will end.
Coin Price: Price Discovery
Escrow: Individual Addresses per Participant, Multi-signature consolidated public address forwarded daily.

Roadmap: You get hotdogs. Each coin is backed by hotdogs. Normal hotdogs go stale in 24 hours. We will use a preservative that will keep it good for 3 years.

Pre-Ann to be announced soon, and Pre-sale and Pre-ICO before the real one 2 months later.

*edit* If I post an address, someone is going to send something to it. Crazy.
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June 19, 2017, 04:13:49 AM

The Risks of Segregated Witness: Opening the Door to Mining Cartels Which Could Undermine the Bitcoin Network

https://coingeek.com/risks-segregated-witness-opening-door-mining-cartels-undermine-bitcoin-network/

 Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh

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June 19, 2017, 04:17:27 AM

The Risks of Segregated Witness: Opening the Door to Mining Cartels Which Could Undermine the Bitcoin Network

https://coingeek.com/risks-segregated-witness-opening-door-mining-cartels-undermine-bitcoin-network/

 Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh



Quote
By Dr. Craig Wright

I read enough at that point.
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June 19, 2017, 04:26:59 AM

The Risks of Segregated Witness: Opening the Door to Mining Cartels Which Could Undermine the Bitcoin Network

https://coingeek.com/risks-segregated-witness-opening-door-mining-cartels-undermine-bitcoin-network/

 Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh



Quote
By Dr. Craig Wright

I read enough at that point.


Do you have a consistent argument to discuss your point? If it's not that way, thank you.
arklan
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June 19, 2017, 04:35:56 AM

The Risks of Segregated Witness: Opening the Door to Mining Cartels Which Could Undermine the Bitcoin Network

https://coingeek.com/risks-segregated-witness-opening-door-mining-cartels-undermine-bitcoin-network/

 Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh



Quote
By Dr. Craig Wright

I read enough at that point.


Do you have a consistent argument to discuss your point? If it's not that way, thank you.

isn't that the guy that claimed to be satoshi but then backed down when pressed to prove it?
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June 19, 2017, 04:45:59 AM

Quote
By Dr. Craig Wright
Do you have a consistent argument to discuss your point? If it's not that way, thank you.
isn't that the guy that claimed to be satoshi but then backed down when pressed to prove it?

Do I need an argument? The guy has no credibility.

Yes, that's the guy who can't prove anything, or was too afraid to try to prove something. Can't even do a simple sign this bitcoin message, or sign this PGP message. So simple, yet can't do it.
bitserve
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June 19, 2017, 04:49:22 AM

I plan on opening a hotdog stand and creating a private blockchain for inventory management.

Blockchain is cool... BUt what about an ICO first? Think BIG. You could easily get a few ten millions for your little hotdog stand. No need to invest your own money on it. Heck, no need to even open the hotdog stand.



Seems legit.

HotDogStand ICO.
Ticker symbol HDS.
Long name: HotDogs.
Algo: Proof of Steak. or Proof of Meat. or Proof of Hotdogs.
Coin Supply: 1000
To be sold in ICO: 800, 200 will be kept by Elwar and Devs, locked in escrow for a period of 6 months
Angel Day Bonus: 20%
1 week Bonus: 15%
2 week Bonus: 10%
3 week Bonus: 5%
Last week: 0%
Minimum Target: 100 BTC
Maximum Target: 10000 BTC, if reached, will have 24 hours and then ICO will end.
Coin Price: Price Discovery
Escrow: Individual Addresses per Participant, Multi-signature consolidated public address forwarded daily.

Roadmap: You get hotdogs. Each coin is backed by hotdogs. Normal hotdogs go stale in 24 hours. We will use a preservative that will keep it good for 3 years.

Pre-Ann to be announced soon, and Pre-sale and Pre-ICO before the real one 2 months later.

*edit* If I post an address, someone is going to send something to it. Crazy.

The funny thing is that Elwar does in fact have a real project that would be a perfect candidate for an ICO. That seasteading thing.
JayJuanGee
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June 19, 2017, 05:25:08 AM



Ahh cool, well I'm still learning a lot about trading, but I am currently programming a dashboard to simplify some stuff ( auto limit orders, managing funds from customer etc ). Also since this is the speculation forum, what is everyone's thought about tonight, how low will we go. 2k support or back to 1900


Well, currently, we seem  to be about in the middle of a price range of $2300 to $2650.  We are nearly in the middle, and it seems to be a bit less likely that we are going to break downwards out of the range before we break upwards.

And, yeah, if we were to break downwards, then there would be pretty decent odds of going below $2k and $1800 would be fairly reasonable.. on the other hand, like I said, breaking up seems to bit more of a better bet - at least at the moment... and if we break above $2650 then likely we will be on our way to testing $3k.

I would not rule out consolidating for 1-2 weeks either, which may cause some boredom and maybe that is slightly less odds of going up would be to go sideways within the previously described price range.


The essence of your post:
"Guys, either it will go up or it will go down. If that does not happen, it will stay the same."

You are the best oracle I've ever seen, your predictions must be like 100% true.

Generally, I don't predict or attempt to predict short term BTC price directions.

Of course, my style has evolved a bit over the years, but frequently what I do is discuss price directions, dynamics and momentum and attempt to give probabilities to directions.  You as a reader are free to reach whatever conclusion that you believe is appropriate and to weigh your own probabilities  - whether you personally find my discussion to be helpful or not...

For example a few days ago, I was more inclined towards down; however, when the price recovered fairly quickly above $2500 and pretty much well above $2500, I began to conclude that the odds of up are becoming more likely. 

In both cases, I have been disinclined to give very high odds to sideways because we seem to be getting too much volume and too much disagreement about price.

Sure, in the end, any of the three can happen - but on a day to day basis the odds can change and one direction can become more probable than another based on passage of events - on the other hand, there can be a kind of ongoing existing buying pressure that allows HODLRs to feel somewhat comfortable about the odds against the price going down very much and even a very decent longer term likelihood that we are continuing up - even though in the shorter term we might not go directly up.
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June 19, 2017, 05:54:18 AM

Do I need an argument? The guy has no credibility.

Yes, you need an argument. Regardless of your opinion on CSW, his points stand on their own.

And it's not like this is some new oddball claim he is discussing. It is an aspect of SegWit that we have known since inception, bot for some reason never gets discussed.

Without SegWit, the most devastating thing a miner 51% attack could accomplish is to roll back some transactions. In all their expenditure, they are unable to claim others' coins for themselves.

However, once SegWit activates, the attack surface of a 51% attack takes on a new aspect. If a miner (or a cartel thereof) accumulates 51% of the hashrate, they are able to steal the funds of others. All it requires is mining new non-Segwit blocks that contain transactions which spend the 'anyone can spend' transactions in previous SegWit blocks.

Further, every additional block for all eternity contains additional incentive for the chain to be so attacked, as it will contain monotonically-increasing value locked in transactions that are SegWit under the new rules, but subject to theft via anyone-can-spend chain rollbacks.

So CSW aside, how come nobody wants to talk about this aspect of SegWit?
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June 19, 2017, 06:03:48 AM


I work on finance industry, with IT at a Multinational Bank, directly with CEOs. I can confirm most people working on research and attending weekly conferences within banking corporation CEOs know NOTHING - I repat: NOTHING about crypto and some top analysts don't even have had contact with Bitcoin or any other coin whatsoever. Such a shame.

Beautiful.  Keep it that way.
Elwar
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June 19, 2017, 06:04:50 AM

I plan on opening a hotdog stand and creating a private blockchain for inventory management.

Blockchain is cool... BUt what about an ICO first? Think BIG. You could easily get a few ten millions for your little hotdog stand. No need to invest your own money on it. Heck, no need to even open the hotdog stand.



Seems legit.

HotDogStand ICO.
Ticker symbol HDS.
Long name: HotDogs.
Algo: Proof of Steak. or Proof of Meat. or Proof of Hotdogs.
Coin Supply: 1000
To be sold in ICO: 800, 200 will be kept by Elwar and Devs, locked in escrow for a period of 6 months
Angel Day Bonus: 20%
1 week Bonus: 15%
2 week Bonus: 10%
3 week Bonus: 5%
Last week: 0%
Minimum Target: 100 BTC
Maximum Target: 10000 BTC, if reached, will have 24 hours and then ICO will end.
Coin Price: Price Discovery
Escrow: Individual Addresses per Participant, Multi-signature consolidated public address forwarded daily.

Roadmap: You get hotdogs. Each coin is backed by hotdogs. Normal hotdogs go stale in 24 hours. We will use a preservative that will keep it good for 3 years.

Pre-Ann to be announced soon, and Pre-sale and Pre-ICO before the real one 2 months later.

*edit* If I post an address, someone is going to send something to it. Crazy.

The funny thing is that Elwar does in fact have a real project that would be a perfect candidate for an ICO. That seasteading thing.

I just signed on as a volunteer for a new seasteading company, Blue Frontiers, as part of the Blockchain group. We had discussed an ICO at the conference but their legal folks are pretty sure that stuff will be stamped out by the SEC at some point. I believe we might go the route of allowing for purchase of equity with bitcoins. My input to the group will definitely push the concept of being able to invest bitcoins to get invested.
I believe the main push will be toward recording property rights on the blockchain. Can't really record a seastead deed in some government office.
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June 19, 2017, 06:09:43 AM

Quote
By Dr. Craig Wright
Do you have a consistent argument to discuss your point? If it's not that way, thank you.
isn't that the guy that claimed to be satoshi but then backed down when pressed to prove it?

Do I need an argument? The guy has no credibility.

Yes, that's the guy who can't prove anything, or was too afraid to try to prove something. Can't even do a simple sign this bitcoin message, or sign this PGP message. So simple, yet can't do it.



You missed the point

Why do you think satoshi is anonymous? Because it dosen't matter the person, who he is or what he does. But it matters the idea behind him.

Now, the idea is that:


Quote
The introduction of SegWit would alter the maximum known risk associated with bitcoin from a 51% attack with the ability to censor transactions or to engage in elaborate double-spending attacks, to a catastrophic risk that could possibly and completely destroy the whole ledger and all contained value. The premise that miners will not steal funds at the genesis of SegWit does not address the introduction of new players who are now incentivised more and more each and every day to steal the funds that are locked into the ledger and which are growing daily. These new players and the increasing level of funds place all open areas of the ledger at risk to attack at a later date.

sorry for my bad english



bitserve
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June 19, 2017, 06:16:35 AM

Do I need an argument? The guy has no credibility.

Yes, you need an argument. Regardless of your opinion on CSW, his points stand on their own.

And it's not like this is some new oddball claim he is discussing. It is an aspect of SegWit that we have known since inception, bot for some reason never gets discussed.

Without SegWit, the most devastating thing a miner 51% attack could accomplish is to roll back some transactions. In all their expenditure, they are unable to claim others' coins for themselves.

However, once SegWit activates, the attack surface of a 51% attack takes on a new aspect. If a miner (or a cartel thereof) accumulates 51% of the hashrate, they are able to steal the funds of others. All it requires is mining new non-Segwit blocks that contain transactions which spend the 'anyone can spend' transactions in previous SegWit blocks.

Further, every additional block for all eternity contains additional incentive for the chain to be so attacked, as it will contain monotonically-increasing value locked in transactions that are SegWit under the new rules, but subject to theft via anyone-can-spend chain rollbacks.

So CSW aside, how come nobody wants to talk about this aspect of SegWit?

There have been plenty of arguments around that issue already so maybe thats why there's no need to talk anymore about it.

Yes, a 51% attack could spend segwit transactions but:

a) If they do that, Bitcoin (at least THAT majority chain) will be worthless anyways.
b) They could just change the rules and increase the block size reward to whatever arbitrary value they would like instead. They could do that with or without Segwit in place.

I would consider it a non-issue or at least not more critical than the risk that a 51% of miners could totally ruin Bitcoin value. That's why I would prefer miner control would be somewhat more limited and distributed than what it is at this time.

There is a 1million prize in Litecoin for any miner that want to do it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/litecoin/comments/6azeu1/1mm_segwit_bounty/

I fact it may be 2 mill at current price. Noone has claimed it (F2POOL would be in a position to do it).
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June 19, 2017, 06:36:30 AM

Litecoin breakout in 3, 2, 1....

Bitcoin to follow.
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June 19, 2017, 06:55:26 AM

Litecoin breakout in 3, 2, 1....

Bitcoin to follow.

Dat walls though....

I am not sure LTC price has a significant influence in Bitcoin Price... besides as a reference of what will happen when BTC approves SW.
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June 19, 2017, 07:09:20 AM

Litecoin breakout in 3, 2, 1....

Bitcoin to follow.

Dat walls though....

I am not sure LTC price has a significant influence in Bitcoin Price... besides as a reference of what will happen when BTC approves SW.

Gonna get Pink Floyd chomped.
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