Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[infofront]

so jbreher is censored but ruphej is allowed to post less than zero value annoyances every other post...makes total sense  

If the small block argument is so weak that it can't withstand some erudite scrutiny perhaps I need to look elsewhere for the truth.

jbreher is actively trying to destroy bitcoin.

ruphej is annoying, but mostly harmless so far. I've already deleted more of his posts than jbreher's though.

There are plenty of resources out there to educate yourself about the big block vs. small block debate.

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[gembitz]

I've only deleted a handful of his posts.

This has taken a lot of self control over the months. I always cringe when he posts because virtually every post is a direct or indirect attack on bitcoin, or a promotion of BCH.
He does sometimes have legitimate points, but they don't need to be repeated ad nauseam. Also, the thread was never about altcoins. As I mentioned in an earlier post, he has a somewhat privileged position in this thread due to his length of time participating in it, and his relatively thoughtful posts.

During busy times, I often have a few messages asking me to review certain posts, so I take those suggestions into consideration as well.

I'll also be the first to admit that I may be a less than stellar moderator.   

i'd help you mod however i'm already too busy with other forums :-D >.> thanks for your commitment!

[Torque]

There are many Bitcoin people here (because hey, this IS a Bitcoin WO thread) that have disagreements and legitimate concerns about the future of Bitcoin: Joe public adoption worries, merchant adoption worries, SegWit adoption worries, scaling worries, worries about how LN will work, worries about the power/centralization of the miners, etc. I think on some level that all of us share these concerns to some degree. And there is nothing wrong about revisiting these debates from time to time as long as it is honest and agnostic discussion.

But the thing that separates these people from the true Bitcoin trolls and alt shills is the fact that they are still pro-Bitcoin. They WANT Bitcoin to succeed and thrive long term. They have no hidden anti-Bitcoin agenda, or trying to covertly shill for an altcoin (BCH). They don't spend every moment with every post spewing anti-Bitcoin propaganda, or slyly trying to strike up a supposedly "agnostic" debate or concern, only to have their real hidden agenda slowly revealed through the way that they are debating (i.e. breadcrumbing, straw-manning, playing dumb, rebuttal of every single point, ignoring valid counter-points, supposedly have the 'real inside knowledge', leading with the sympathy/empathy card, etc.).

No common ground is ever found with a troll/shill, because they're not looking to find common ground. They are not looking to have some honest debate. They are trying to disrupt and create an emotional reaction, that is all. And in this forum's case, they are looking to disrupt and dissuade belief in Bitcoin's long term dominance and viability. In fact, they are part of a large scale campaign to do so, and it is reasonable to assume that some of them are getting paid for their effort.

The thing that the trolls apparently don't get is we are all too familiar with all of their stupid tactics. The art of internet trolling is well documented and has been around for some time. So they are pretty easy to spot.
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/5wslia/internet_troll_tactics/

Some of you guys can engage with the trolls all you want, the rest of us will just put them on /ignore. But please stop trying to 'defend' them and their actions. And if you are so blind that you can't see that they only show up when Bitcoin is falling and BCash is getting pumped, then you need to seek help.

[JimboToronto]

A late good morning Bitcoinland.

No new ATH but an OK consolidation and resistance to another weekend assault by the big-block altcoiners... currently $7740USD/$9885CAD (Bitcoinaverage).

Total (incl. forkcoins) is $9168USD/$11709CAD (Coinmarketcap).

Could be worse. One good push and we're on to a new ATH. Go Bitcoin go.

[ragnar0k]

so jbreher is censored but ruphej is allowed to post less than zero value annoyances every other post...makes total sense  

If the small block argument is so weak that it can't withstand some erudite scrutiny perhaps I need to look elsewhere for the truth.

jbreher is actively trying to destroy bitcoin.

ruphej is annoying, but mostly harmless so far. I've already deleted more of his posts than jbreher's though.

There are plenty of resources out there to educate yourself about the big block vs. small block debate.

Although I agree that jbreher was responding how and when he liked if put on a corner, I would have expected a warning shot before the kill!

[Ibian]

so jbreher is censored but ruphej is allowed to post less than zero value annoyances every other post...makes total sense  

If the small block argument is so weak that it can't withstand some erudite scrutiny perhaps I need to look elsewhere for the truth.

jbreher is actively trying to destroy bitcoin.

ruphej is annoying, but mostly harmless so far. I've already deleted more of his posts than jbreher's though.

There are plenty of resources out there to educate yourself about the big block vs. small block debate.

Although I agree that jbreher was responding how and when he liked if put on a corner, I would have expected a warning shot before the kill!

Perhaps before the split. Shots have been fired and the time for peaceful attempts is over.

[flynn]

That BCH pump is rather a flabby one

I still have a few to get rid of, I'm sort of disapointed.

[AlcoHoDL]

There are many Bitcoin people here (because hey, this IS a Bitcoin WO thread) that have disagreements and legitimate concerns about the future of Bitcoin: Joe public adoption worries, SegWit adoption worries, scaling worries, worries about how LN will work, worries about the power/centralization of the miners, etc. I would think on some level that all of us share these concerns to some degree.

But the thing that separates these people from the true Bitcoin trolls and alt shills is the fact that they are still pro-Bitcoin. They WANT Bitcoin to succeed and thrive long term. They have no hidden anti-Bitcoin agenda, or trying to covertly shill for an altcoin (BCH). They don't spend every moment with every post spewing anti-Bitcoin propaganda, or slyly trying to strike up a supposedly "agnostic" debate or concern, only to have their real hidden agenda slowly revealed through the way that they are debating (i.e. breadcrumbing, straw-manning, playing dumb, rebuttal of every single point, supposedly have the 'real inside knowledge', leading with the empathy card, etc.).

No common ground is ever found with a troll/shill, because they're not looking to find common ground. They are not looking to have some honest debate. They are trying to disrupt and create an emotional reaction, that is all. And in this forum's case, they are looking to disrupt and dissuade belief in Bitcoin's long term dominance and viability. In fact, they are part of a campaign to do so, and it is reasonable to assume that some of them are getting paid for their effort.

The thing that the trolls apparently don't get is we are all too familiar with all their stupid tactics. The art of internet trolling is well documented and has been around for some time. So they are pretty easy to spot.
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/5wslia/internet_troll_tactics/

Some of you guys can engage with the trolls all you want, the rest of us will just put them on /ignore. But please stop trying to 'defend' them and their actions. And if you are so blind that you can't see that they only show up when Bitcoin is falling and BCash is getting pumped, then you need to seek help.

Well said.

Personally I don't mind jbreher's posts because they are easily refuted using facts. So I don't think he is to be feared. But I understand your points, after all it's a Bitcoin thread (arguably the best there is), and it should stay a Bitcoin thread. Altcoin supporters and Bitcoin haters can go post in the appropriate sections or start their own threads.

[Peter R]

It is not useful to allow dishonest people to operate in a rules based environment where the ultimate foundation of the entire project is honesty.

Bitcoin is whatever the consensus mechanism decides it is. That was the original idea and one of the foundational pillars of what makes bitcoin as an idea able to function at all, and the result is in. Continuing to complain about it, and even going to far as to split the blockchain in two, is nothing short of an attempt to undermine bitcoin as a whole. They are enemies, not only of the personal wealth of many of us here, but far more importantly they are enemies of a lifeboat for countless millions of people when the economy collapses. They are, in a word, evil, right down to their core.

Bitcoin is broken due to high fees and unreliable confirmation times.  


- I want to help bank the billions of unbanked across the world.

- I want a low-friction form of money that people in Venezuela or the next Zimbabwe can use to escape hyperinflation.

- I want a border-less form of money that the people or Argentina can use to bypass capital controls.

- I want a transportable form of money that I can pay to a programmer in India for work on the Bitcoin Unlimited website, thereby helping bring disenfranchised groups across the world out of poverty.  

- I want bitcoin to be so massively adopted that it becomes politically impossible to shut down, ending governments ability to raise money for war and other atrocities with the stealth-tax of inflation.


You cannot achieve those goals with a crippled bitcoin limited to 3 transactions per second (and no, LN is no panacea either, but that's another discussion).  

And then you call me evil for working to bring bitcoin back to its original vision as better money that would improve the lives of people all across the world.

Give you head a shake, Ibian.

[vroom]

these guys will never understand that the core devs are willing to increase the blocksize when the time is right and it's tested properly

[gentlemand]

I want to...

I don't believe anyone would object to that if code was offered up that was demonstrably superior in every way and addressed every technical doubt about that approach. If it was then enough people would agree, migrate and that would become Bitcoin.

Most people are not married to the Core path. What Core has that can't be touched at present is straightforward competence and that's what keeps their grip on Bitcoin's development.

That is, er, not quite the case with the present campaign.

[bones261]

That BCH pump is rather a flabby one

I still have a few to get rid of, I'm sort of disapointed.

Too many people got burned when Bithumb went down at an inopportune time, last weekend. Even though wash trades can help with volume, you need to attract actual suckers to buy it up.

[Torque]

these guys will never understand that the core devs are willing to increase the blocksize when the time is right and it's tested properly

And even when the Bitcoin block size limit does get raised when the time is right, they'll just say it's not enough and BCash has it where it needs to be. Or come up with other arguments and excuses why Bitcoin still sucks.  

[AlcoHoDL]

Guys, we have a green vertical!

CAROLINA?

Edit: I really expected blood this weekend. I'm not complaining. I hope the BCH cancer is cleared away soon, and for good.

[Torque]

I want to...

I don't believe anyone would object to that if code was offered up that was demonstrably superior in every way and addressed every technical doubt about that approach. If it was then enough people would agree, migrate and that would become Bitcoin.

Most people are not married to the Core path. What Core has that can't be touched at present is straightforward competence and that's what keeps their grip on Bitcoin's development.

That is, er, not quite the case with the present campaign.

Troll tactic #47 - Leading with the sympathy/empathy card

[ragnar0k]

Perhaps before the split. Shots have been fired and the time for peaceful attempts is over.

Yeh, but they will say bitcoiners are nazis and blah blah. Just saying, I am a newcomer after all

[JimboToronto]

I don't mind jbreher's posts because they are easily refuted using facts. So I don't think he is to be feared. But I understand your points, after all it's a Bitcoin thread (arguably the best there is), and it should stay a Bitcoin thread. Altcoin supporters and Bitcoin haters can go post in the appropriate sections or start their own threads.

There will always be anti-Bitcoin FUD and pro-altcoin shilling here in the Wall Observer. The issue is the frequency and intensity.

Kwukduck generally only comes out during dips and generally doesn't post walls of text the way Jbreher does.

Most of us have come to look upon Kwuk as a comic-relief buffoon and are entertained by his drivel, but because Jbreher dresses his BS up with a pseudo-intellectual snottiness, it rubs people the wrong way.

Perhaps we should just stop feeding the troll by taking him so seriously.
_____

Thanks to Infofront for doing such a good job at a thankless task. Cheers bro.

[Logic-Elliven]

A good read:

Bitcoin’s future – Money changes everything
https://bravenewcoin.com/news/bitcoins-future-money-changes-everything/

"Where the risks do lie, however, is in the debilitating effects on bitcoin specifically, caused by the now par-for-the-course social vitriol targeted at anybody who puts their hand up with a proposal on how bitcoin might be improved. After all, there are plenty of other currencies and crypto assets they could be dedicating their brainpower to, and it would be unfortunate for bitcoin if the public trolling saw the best and brightest assigning bitcoin to the too-hard basket in favour of more welcoming crypto communities"

[drbrockcoin]

Wel well, as the weekend is coming, the noob trolls are back to this thread, just like if this was their vacancy residence or something. Monday they all will be back at home.  

Offtopic: after i dumped my remaining shitcoin at 0.4, my mind blown off and suddenly i remembered my 2013 username account!!! I just tried to login and surprise... That account was banned and my main account too, and i can not access this forum from my laptop because it is ip banned, wtf... This is the message i received:

"Sorry Guest, you are banned from using this forum!
Your account is locked because it sat inactive for years after the password hashes were leaked in 2015, and was therefore at high risk of being hacked. Email react-vdnp8@theymos.e4ward.com to get it unlocked."

I sent a mail to Theymos a week ago but still not any response.. If anybody knows what else can i do will be really appreciated  

+1

I had the exact same experience a few weeks ago... also no reply yet

[Lopumbo]

chill out, 10k$ is just a matter of days

with the upcoming forks of Bitcoin Silver, Bitcoin Diamond and Super Bitcoin the FOMO will be inevitable
and if that will not help, print more Tether!!!