Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[jbreher]

Though if you really want to take the security and usability hit of using Layer 2, there is always the option of using an exchange.

Not your keys, not your coins. Keeping coins on exchanges is not an argument.

Except, of course, that exchange trades are an example of Layer 2 trades. I'm not making an argument, I'm answering your question. You asked what Layer 2 solutions existed for the other forks of Bitcoin, so for the sake of answering your explicit question...

What security hit ?

Lightning is replete with security tradeoffs. Worth it for some, intolerable for others.

How does SV base layer handle instant payment verification with double spend protection -

Near-instant? Statistically. Amazing the things that work with five-nine's determinism when blocks are big enough to swallow all transactions generated.

1 block per 10 minutes ?

For an absolute, yes.

Even Bitcoin does not do this, without Lightning.

BTC doesn't do this, with Lightning.

[1713998197]

1713998197

[1713998197]

1713998197

[1713998197]

1713998197

[1713998197]

1713998197

[1713998197]

1713998197

[jbreher]

When page parity?

Dunno.

I'm shooting for post count parity some time in 2024.

Whoaza, jbreher... that is a pretty damned conservative timeline, but hey I don't have any problem(s) with either conservative thinking or preparing for conservative outcomes.

Post count.

We get page count next year.

[JSRAW]

Functions of Money: MoE, UoA, SoV

Bitcoin
✔medium of exchange
✔unit of account
✔store of value

Fiat
✔medium of exchange
✔unit of account
❌store of value

Gold
❌medium of exchange
✔unit of account
✔store of value

Tell your friends about Bitcoin

(Edit: And preach like a Gospel, Bhagwad Geeta, Kuran or God is not great. Be a Bitcoin missionary, Bitcoin Yogi, Bitcoin Mullah, Bitcoin Christopher Hitchens)

PS : Sorry if it already been shared.

https://twitter.com/Josh_Rager/status/1113095229102407680

[jbreher]

I'm calling Bitcoin post count parity some time in 2024. Whether that Bitcoin be BTC, BCH, or SV is an open question.

I think the next FOMO pile-in is going to make evident to the world the weaknesses of the Core-ian approach to scaling. The other forks (hewing more closely to Satoshi's inspired design) will be there to pick up the slack.

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Yes, SV is lagging at 11+%. ::sigh::

Oh my fucking god.  You are either sick or delusional to still be having those kinds of illusions of grandeur in respect to those two shitty-ass bcash projects.

Still unanswered: How LN is going to help when Layer 1 is already clogged to the point of uselessness.

[jbreher]

pit pat piffy wing wong wang

Sometimes, it takes me time to feel that I am starting to "get it."

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=pit+pat+piffy+wing+wong+wang+site%3Abitcointalk.org

[jbreher]

Jbreher doesn't care about decentralisation, security and Nakamoto consensus it's just tunnel vision terrabyte blocks without understanding the consequences.

Well, you're wrong on all counts. Let's discuss this a while, Paashaas. Let's start with: What is your definition of decentralization?

[ThrobbingSausage]

Except, of course, that exchange trades are an example of Layer 2 trades. I'm not making an argument, I'm answering your question. You asked what Layer 2 solutions existed for the other forks of Bitcoin, so for the sake of answering your explicit question...

Chicken Egg problem. What came first. The money or the bank. I do not respect your answer. Do you like XRP too ?

Lightning is replete with security tradeoffs. Worth it for some, intolerable for others.

Name one tradeoff worse than Layer 1.

Near-instant? Statistically. Amazing the things that work with five-nine's determinism when blocks are big enough to swallow all transactions generated.

Gobbledygook. Senseless.

BTC doesn't do this, with Lightning.

You are wrong. You try to be evil on Lightning, and counter party is fully rewarded and you lose everything. Incentive to play nice.

Still unanswered: How LN is going to help when Layer 1 is already clogged to the point of uselessness.

Hyperbole.

[JayJuanGee]

Is one last retarded alt pump too much to ask?

I swear to trod the narrow path from here on.

 

There are NOT too many of us, even here, who believe that the altcoins (shitcoins) are dead.  I, personally, have spouted out several times that I expect many of the altcoins to come along for at least on more pump, and I have NOT been dissuaded of that opinion. 

On the other hand, even if many of us here are inclined to believe that at least one more altcoin (shitcoin) pump is going to happen, there is no real reason to discuss it here, nor to even imply that they are being monitored, unless there is some kind fo connection made to what is going on in bitcoin's price performance dynamics.

[JayJuanGee]

When page parity?

Dunno.

I'm shooting for post count parity some time in 2024.

Whoaza, jbreher... that is a pretty damned conservative timeline, but hey I don't have any problem(s) with either conservative thinking or preparing for conservative outcomes.

Post count.

We get page count next year.

ok ok ok... I hate when I have to admit that you were right... especially, in recent times, you jbreher.



But, yeah, you were right and I misread your earlier post (the page/post mix-up).

[JayJuanGee]

I'm calling Bitcoin post count parity some time in 2024. Whether that Bitcoin be BTC, BCH, or SV is an open question.

I think the next FOMO pile-in is going to make evident to the world the weaknesses of the Core-ian approach to scaling. The other forks (hewing more closely to Satoshi's inspired design) will be there to pick up the slack.

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Yes, SV is lagging at 11+%. ::sigh::

Oh my fucking god.  You are either sick or delusional to still be having those kinds of illusions of grandeur in respect to those two shitty-ass bcash projects.

Still unanswered: How LN is going to help when Layer 1 is already clogged to the point of uselessness.

We will cross that bridge when we get there.  

I have decent confidence regarding whatever developments are taking place on bitcoin and its various layer 2 solutions.

For example, it seems to me that there is no need to build a 200 lane road for 2 lanes of usage, and therefore bitcoin is likely to continue to adequately grow as its usage grows.

In other words, Bitcoin is doing fine in terms of various preparations that combine layer 1 and layer 2 and of course, continued ongoing development that is beyond the ability of many laypersons to understand their significances, but both layer 1 and layer 2 developments continue in bitcoin, so I am not sure why you want to keep pumping your bcash crap as if it provided some kind of meaningful/technical advancement over bitcoin when bcash variants are mere ongoing sham-scam attack vector projects... that are largely smoke and mirrors imitations rather than innovative developments.

[nutildah]

I'm calling Bitcoin post count parity some time in 2024. Whether that Bitcoin be BTC, BCH, or SV is an open question.

I think the next FOMO pile-in is going to make evident to the world the weaknesses of the Core-ian approach to scaling. The other forks (hewing more closely to Satoshi's inspired design) will be there to pick up the slack.

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Yes, SV is lagging at 11+%. ::sigh::

Oh my fucking god.  You are either sick or delusional to still be having those kinds of illusions of grandeur in respect to those two shitty-ass bcash projects.

Still unanswered: How LN is going to help when Layer 1 is already clogged to the point of uselessness.

That's simple. First of all, your scenario has never happened. The blockchain has never been "clogged to the point of uselessness." That doesn't make any more sense than nobody going to a restaurant anymore because its too crowded.

But let's say BTC again skyrockets and the median transaction fee goes up to $10. This means people will be incentivized to use Lightning and do as much LN transacting as possible before a channel must be closed.

During the entirety of the bear market Lightning has been preparing itself for exactly such an occurrence, all the while its critics were talking about how it will harm miners and is unsafe to use. Meanwhile its grown in leaps and bounds, and will continue to grow the higher BTC goes.

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Bitcoin's rising tide lifts all altcoins, which tend to go up higher because they are considered to be more risky investments. This has always been the case. BCH and SV aren't rising on their own merits. I suspect they will continue to lose positions in the CMC ranking because their primary marketing tactic continues to be confusing newcomers into thinking they are "the real bitcoin." Its been a failure for them so far and there's no reason to believe that will change in the future.

Put yourself in the shoes of the average business owner who is still skeptical of cryptocurrency and is only beginning to consider adopting BTC for their business... Then along comes this chatter about how BCH and SV are better, and they look into it, only to discover that now they have to learn how to use and install 2 more wallets that aren't compatible with BTC, in the hopes that they will have customers who want to pay in BCH and SV. Largely, nobody still wants to pay in BTC, so there's little chance they're going through the hassle of bothering with coins that are not _actually_ bitcoin.

[Toxic2040]

I'm calling Bitcoin post count parity some time in 2024. Whether that Bitcoin be BTC, BCH, or SV is an open question.

I think the next FOMO pile-in is going to make evident to the world the weaknesses of the Core-ian approach to scaling. The other forks (hewing more closely to Satoshi's inspired design) will be there to pick up the slack.

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Yes, SV is lagging at 11+%. ::sigh::

Oh my fucking god.  You are either sick or delusional to still be having those kinds of illusions of grandeur in respect to those two shitty-ass bcash projects.

Still unanswered: How LN is going to help when Layer 1 is already clogged to the point of uselessness.

1st bit..lol..literally. Middle part just opinion. This last bit is out right lies.

I will just follow with this.

"You are a sad, strange little man and you have my pity."

"Farewell."

[kenzawak]

[goldkingcoiner]

Takeoff!!! Hang on to your coins, we are about to break through the stratosphere!!!

"We" gonna 80x this one?  go bitcoin go

The gods of luck say no.

[JayJuanGee]

Takeoff!!! Hang on to your coins, we are about to break through the stratosphere!!!

"We" gonna 80x this one?  go bitcoin go

The gods of luck say no.

Hahahahahaha...   I say GREAT!!! 

Maintain your reason and don't get too greedy.  We can get rich in bitcoin without any stinky 80x...

go bitcoin go.!!!

[JSRAW]

raised

~Edited Out~

Tell your friends about Bitcoin

(Edit: And preach like a Gospel, Bhagwad Geeta, Kuran or God is not great. Be a Bitcoin missionary, Bitcoin Yogi, Bitcoin Mullah, Bitcoin Christopher Hitchens)

PS : Sorry if it already been shared.

https://twitter.com/Josh_Rager/status/1113095229102407680

The thing is, governments don't want fiat to be a store of value, they want debt, loans and fees everywhere. That way they get taxes on it all too.

True, but in the longer run, Fiat storage doesn't make sense and not a benefiting move IMHO. any economist guy can explain more clearly and in details here.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Takeoff!!! Hang on to your coins, we are about to break through the stratosphere!!!

"We" gonna 80x this one?  go bitcoin go

The gods of luck say no.

Hahahahahaha...   I say GREAT!!! 

Maintain your reason and don't get too greedy.  We can get rich in bitcoin without any stinky 80x...

go bitcoin go.!!!

I’ll settle for a modest 10 - 20 x increase JJG

[starmman]

About time - that bear had us on the ropes for way too long LOL

[DaRude]

...

Incidentally, while BTC is up 14+% in the last 24 hours, BCH is up over 27% in the same time frame.

Bitcoin's rising tide lifts all altcoins, which tend to go up higher because they are considered to be more risky investments. This has always been the case. BCH and SV aren't rising on their own merits. I suspect they will continue to lose positions in the CMC ranking because their primary marketing tactic continues to be confusing newcomers into thinking they are "the real bitcoin." Its been a failure for them so far and there's no reason to believe that will change in the future.

Put yourself in the shoes of the average business owner who is still skeptical of cryptocurrency and is only beginning to consider adopting BTC for their business... Then along comes this chatter about how BCH and SV are better, and they look into it, only to discover that now they have to learn how to use and install 2 more wallets that aren't compatible with BTC, in the hopes that they will have customers who want to pay in BCH and SV. Largely, nobody still wants to pay in BTC, so there's little chance they're going through the hassle of bothering with coins that are not _actually_ bitcoin.

With "low" stagnant BTC prices bitmain doesn't have the profits to prop up bcash, so bcash was being priced to go bye bye into the night. Unfortunately BTC going up gives bitmain fatter margins to continue keeping its pet project afloat, so bcash shorts got burned this time around. Gambling on shitcoins being leveraged BTC will burn a lot of "traders".

[JayJuanGee]

Takeoff!!! Hang on to your coins, we are about to break through the stratosphere!!!

"We" gonna 80x this one?  go bitcoin go

The gods of luck say no.

Hahahahahaha...   I say GREAT!!! 

Maintain your reason and don't get too greedy.  We can get rich in bitcoin without any stinky 80x...

go bitcoin go.!!!

I’ll settle for a modest 10 - 20 x increase JJG

Exactamente!!!!!

Who needs 80x when 10-20x will make an already decent amount of Richie?

On the other hand, NOT going to complain if 80x comes.