Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[jbreher]

https://youtu.be/Csj1l2ymPjw

What a sh*tshow ....... poor people that lives there, good they have BTC to work with!

First time I have heard from Ben Swann in several years. I had forgotten about him.

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[infofront]

Bitcoin is a store of value.

Wrong for the 4000th time.  Nothing is a store of value unless it's a non-perishable commodity.  Bitcoin is neither non-perishable or a commodity.  Claiming Bitcoin is a store of value is no different than claiming Dogecoin, Factcom, or NXT is a store of value.  Everyone knows that statement is completely false, you just pretend you can pass off your lie for bitcoin in an attempt at personal gain.  

In case whoever is reading this is stupid and can't figure it out, things like Bitcoin require external inputs to exist at all.  It's extremely perishable and can disappear at any second.  A real non-perishable commodity like silver or gold simply sits there rejecting any advance of entropy (as far as any human civilization time span is concerned) and doesn't simply vanish without a black hole hitting the planet.

Total nonsense.   A store of value can be anything that a society chooses.   Many non-metal things have been used in the past, such as salt and even stones carved into wheels.   Today, art, coins, stamps, baseball cards and even dolls are often used as stores of values.   As far a commodities go, they are mostly traded in forms of derivatives and actually probably less real than crypto-currency.    Most stores of value in this age are nothing more than numbers in accounts.   We are so far from using gold or silver as a currency that hording them provides no security.   Gold does have a long history of being a useful store of value, but we are at the end of that period.   Maybe you can be buried in a gold coffin, you won't be any better off than someone buried at sea.  In the future maybe your coffin will be found and people will wonder how profoundly stupid it was to horde so much almost as such a common resource as gold.  

The purpose of money is to transfer value from the present to the future.  Time span is 'relative' to the 3rd party observers in this equation, but yes, table salt is an actual commodity that can reliably be used as a store of value for....five years.  If another commodity - let's say gold or silver - can reliably be used as a store of value for a consecutive millions or even billions of years, is it not a much superior store of value?  Of course it is.  

What is the reliable time span bitcoin can be used as a store of value?  The answer is ZERO, because it is not non-perishable, has no time span at all of reliable usage such as five years for salt, and can disappear at any second because it requires external inputs to exist at all.  Bitcoin is not money.  It is not a commodity.  It is not a store of value.  The only thing it can be classified as is a currency.  It even has currency in the name "cryptocurrency" just in case you're too stupid to figure it out.  Currencies are never stores of value and virtually any currency that's ever existed is generally a scam that always starts at a value of zero and returns there on a long enough timeline.

Gold requires an ongoing input of energy so as to maintain the informational state (and public CONFIDENCE) of its value and the willingness of others to accept it:

    I explained to you (https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/ps6tdj) that the valuation of all above ground stocks, is set by the opportunity cost of the marginal miner, because one has a choice whether to mine it or buy it.
    Without ongoing transactions in gold, there’s no evidence that it’s still widely accepted. With gold these transaction fees (sometimes hidden in the spread) are paid to the moneychangers (who btw Jesus threw out of the temple). Wit Bitcoin these transaction fees are paid directly to the miners as a combination of protocol-dictated debasement and free market fees.


Gold and Bitcoin are analogous, with the major distinction being that the heavy mass of Bitcoin does not need to move physical locations when BTC is transferred. Read my blog Secrets of Bitcoin’s Dystopian Valuation Model (https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/secrets-of-bitcoin-s-dystopian-valuation-model) and all comments below it (including my reactions to Roy Sebag’s recent ZH article), for more details.

Btw, linked below is an elaboration on why I am so confident the SegWit donations will be taken by the miners when the altcoin Bitcoin Core is forced to fork-off (actually fuck off):

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/ps965c

That above linked post (and the entire blog) should also explain why I am nearly certain Bitcoin was created by a think tank of the global elite banksters and their plan for bringing about a world government. See also the following Medium post:

https://medium.com/@hamoun.gh/i-finally-had-a-chance-to-carefully-read-your-article-f0b3dfc38060

[Last of the V8s]

Guys any NEO/BTC market observer?

I thought to buy (experimental) some NEO so that I can accumulate my BTC. Seems like NEO price is really low against BTC.

I don't care about NEO/USD

These coins are going to pump and dump now seemingly at random.
You could easily get very burned in the short term on any of them.
You seem right about the market structure of NEO/BTC compared to the others, but no one really knows.
The fundamentals of it are dreadful, with many other coins competing, but it does have some hefty backing from CZ's rich buddies.
Obviously see how far it pulls back now, and watch the volume.

[JayJuanGee]

What should I change the poll to?

What percent invested (in crypto) are you of your total savings?

100%
75-99%
50-74%
25-49%
0-25%


EDIT
* Excluding stable coins

Yeah that’s a really good one to be fair.

+ 1 Merit

Edit - Just worked it out. I’m over 80% crypto to 20% fiat savings.

Shit!

Thanks!

I was about 90% until we hit 6000.  then I was'nt sure about this rally at all so sold for now.  

Now keep up the meditate t’ill end 2019 and buy back add 25000  

Talking of stash increasing

Didn't you hodl all the way from 19.5k to 3.2k? 

Yes....

HODL and bought.  NOT  a bad idea.

You can make a trajectory, yourself.  If you started dollar cost average buying in bitcoin on a weekly basis, starting at $19,666 in mid December 2017, you would be quite well in profits today, and you would have accumulated a decent amount of BTC depending on the amount of your weekly purchases...  Of course, those able to do $1k per week would be in a much better absolute position than those buying $5 per week, yet the percentage of profitability would be the same so long as the weekly BTC buy amounts were kept consistent through that time and relative to the different budgets. 

Of course, in the real world, the weekly financial abilities of many people would likely fluctuate over more than a year and a half (cash flow, expenses, etc), so there could be some weeks in the real application, in which personal circumstances caused more or less financial abilities to change the weekly BTC buying amounts.

[jbreher]

Yet -- if it is CSW's utterances to which you refer -- he advocates a return to the protocol enshrined upon release of 0.1 in perpetuity.

0.1?
that had bugs, needed feedback
satoshi hung around here a long time ironing it out
he left us with 0.3.19 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2228.msg29479#msg29479

The software implementation had bugs. Perhaps you are confusing software implementation with protocol?

[jbreher]

Yet -- if it is CSW's utterances to which you refer -- he advocates a return to the protocol enshrined upon release of 0.1 in perpetuity.

0.1?
that had bugs, needed feedback
satoshi hung around here a long time ironing it out
he left us with 0.3.19 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2228.msg29479#msg29479

Never mind the bollocks, V8. Jbreher can be a reasonable guy, but as soon as we touch one of his personal icons - be it Jihan, Ver or lately CSW - he becomes a smarmy religious zealot.

You keep conflating my reasoned analysis of protocols with a support of personalities associated with those protocols. Please learn to discern the difference.

[jbreher]

Watchtowers will be released in next LN update.

https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/3133

Great! Coming soon to a Lightning Network near you! The Trusted Third Parties required if you don't want to have your funds stolen while your node isn't online!

Of course, they can't economically be of value in any case where the tx fee for inclusion within the repudiation interval is higher than the funds at risk. But it makes good advertising copy.

Watchtowers are a Good Thing.

Well, they're a Necessary Thing. For LN, anyhoo. For everything else, there's Bitcoin.

[AB de Royse777]

Can I order a hat from xhomerx :-)



Thank you.

I guess you can, but i’m not the HATmaster

I know the master and I am in a quest for him. I am hesitating to PM him. May be I will angry him and he will say F off :-P
#xhomerx10 :-D

[jonoiv]

What should I change the poll to?

What percent invested (in crypto) are you of your total savings?

100%
75-99%
50-74%
25-49%
0-25%


EDIT
* Excluding stable coins

Yeah that’s a really good one to be fair.

+ 1 Merit

Edit - Just worked it out. I’m over 80% crypto to 20% fiat savings.

Shit!

Thanks!

I was about 90% until we hit 6000.  then I was'nt sure about this rally at all so sold for now.  

Now keep up the meditate t’ill end 2019 and buy back add 25000  

Talking of stash increasing

Didn't you hodl all the way from 19.5k to 3.2k?  

Yes....

HODL and bought.  NOT  a bad idea.

You can make a trajectory, yourself.  If you started dollar cost average buying in bitcoin on a weekly basis, starting at $19,666 in mid December 2017, you would be quite well in profits today, and you would have accumulated a decent amount of BTC depending on the amount of your weekly purchases...  Of course, those able to do $1k per week would be in a much better absolute position than those buying $5 per week, yet the percentage of profitability would be the same so long as the weekly BTC buy amounts were kept consistent through that time and relative to the different budgets.  

Of course, in the real world, the weekly financial abilities of many people would likely fluctuate over more than a year and a half (cash flow, expenses, etc), so there could be some weeks in the real application, in which personal circumstances caused more or less financial abilities to change the weekly BTC buying amounts.

i couldn't give 2 shits about your holding from 19.5k,  your choice but not for me.

JJG greed tinged with anger = short. JJG fear tinged with doubt = Long.  
It's pretty easy to get a good and effective trading stategy from your menstrual cycle.  

[Last of the V8s]

Yet -- if it is CSW's utterances to which you refer -- he advocates a return to the protocol enshrined upon release of 0.1 in perpetuity.

0.1?
that had bugs, needed feedback
satoshi hung around here a long time ironing it out
he left us with 0.3.19 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2228.msg29479#msg29479

The software implementation had bugs. Perhaps you are confusing software implementation with protocol?

I may well be confused. Did satoshi change the blocksize limit and nix some of the opcodes and were these protocol changes?

[Globb0]

Yet -- if it is CSW's utterances to which you refer -- he advocates a return to the protocol enshrined upon release of 0.1 in perpetuity.

0.1?
that had bugs, needed feedback
satoshi hung around here a long time ironing it out
he left us with 0.3.19 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2228.msg29479#msg29479

Above all this is a great point.

How can his vision be rewound version, it was his actuals.

[JayJuanGee]

bitcoin to 50k in 2019
anyone against that?

Screw it, I'll open myself up to some haters: I just offloaded 50% of my portfolio. Can't shake what r0ach has been saying recently, he makes a lot of sense when it comes to manipulation. The rapid increase over the last few weeks just doesn't feel right. It's too fast and money (whatever you feel that may be) just isn't supposed to be this easy.

I think just below $2500 will be the bottom personally.  and it will happen arround oct / nov 2019

This looks like an elliotwave phase B bear rally, I fully expect people to call me out as usual.  But I will, and have put my money where my mouth is

I really don't care what JJG has to say on the matter or any other person.  im happy to be quoted in November.  

I seem to recall you betting down, previously, while bitcoin prices were going up.  

Difficult to lose money in a bull market, but some peeps manage to achieve such... including jonoiv.  This time is different?  hahahahahaaha

Good luck.....  

NOT.      

OMG... JayJuanGee, are you OK?  I only see like 4 lines in your post above...

Umm.. in all seriousness, "elliotwave phase B bear rally" .. for those of us who aren't in the know.. is that good or bad long term? Sounds a lot like mystical mumbo-jumbo to me....

JJG knows full well I got a margin call going long during the FBI/silk road coin sale anouncement, and the subseqent events..  He's talking shit as usuall.

How am I supposed to remember all your details, except just having a general idea that you tend to be bearish, and continuously talking bearish phoney baloney... and perhaps your silk-road margin call caused you to become butthurt rather than learning lessons about either not betting margin and/or taking a more reasonable incrementalist approach.. that clearly would have been profitable in the past and is likely to be profitable in the future, without having to engage in too risky of gambling behaviors.

And the bellend gave me shit for saying the price will hit 3-4k,  in March 2018 when the price was 10-11k.... lo and behold $3122.    But yet the abuse continues time after time.  

Yeah.. right.. selective memory.. if you want to say that you were calling a price crash that ended up coming true.

Lot's of deluded and insecure gamblers would like to be considered as a sorcerer, but it should not be necessary for folks who attempt to be more realistic about the near impossibilities to predict BTC direction with any kind of ongoing correctness.

The giuy is a deluded c-nut.

You mean "nutcase"?   Nutcase would be "nut-c" not "c-nut."

Or are you attempting to say something else?

[El duderino_]

Can I order a hat from xhomerx :-)



Thank you.

I guess you can, but i’m not the HATmaster

I know the master and I am in a quest for him. I am hesitating to PM him. May be I will angry him and he will say F off :-P
#xhomerx10 :-D

I can ensure you, he's the very best and most kind when you PM him..... better do so, never no he overlooks your HAT request....

[Globb0]

if i were satoshi (ALL BOW BEFORE THE MIGHTY VAPOURMINER... err i mean SATOSHI) i would dump the alts and donate them to charities/research/foundations. many of the real bitcoin stash too. i mean satoshi really needs more than a million coins to be happy? jeez and i thought I was being greedy with my pitiful aspirations..

Alternate possible scenario: Satoshi foresaw the possibility of idiots perverting his system, and maintained a large reserve of coin capable of righting the wrong.

#justsayin

But Satoshi said bitcoin was the one true needed coin. Wont he fix this one then?

Cant see him joining team B



Unless you are adamant he is Satoshi?

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

HODL until the final whistle. 🤪

Observing @ $8,700

Arsenal can score in any moment!

[HairyMaclairy]

Today I looked up the price of a BCH. I feel dirty.

Wanna get downright filthy? Look up SV.

Yes, there was the copyright bump that will be temporary, but that is likely done and dusted. There is likely some element of bump due to the imminent CoinGeek Toronto conference too.

But what remains after discounting those is fundamental.

Fundamentally zero. Give it a few years before something brighter and shinier comes along.  

SV will be just another Feathercoin

[Biodom]

The recent out-performance of various altcoins is what bothers me about the overall crypto market advance.
Typically, in a stock market, when 'pennies' (or highly speculative stocks) start shooting up 20% a day it means that the advance is close/closer to the end.
We shall see.

[El duderino_]

*yeah I know I don't have all HATs, but its the WO approval *

^
Let it come only 300 bucks away!!!

[El duderino_]

HODL until the final whistle.

Observing @ $8,700

Arsenal can score in any moment!

Pffffffff lol, HAZARD can score any moment, if the boys deliver him a ball.

edit: or Giroud

[Toxic2040]

What should I change the poll to?

a few a/b polls off the top of me head..


do you prefer shaved or unshaved?

do you like your bacon crispy or soft

anyway..you get the idea...im sure you will do fine as usual