Help... Mt Gox has lost my money?

[massivebitman]

I should've been paid 1.14719885BTC from satoshi dice. Except I ticked send from a green address..

The funds must've come back to gox. I sent more funds using that option, and it came from the same address.

Am I wrong? Am I missing something?

It's possible, but seems to me the help desk staff might be new, and are the ones who don't understand the system

What can I do now? should I pursue this further?

## Please do not write below this line ##
Ticket #****: Re: [Mt.Gox] Withdraw from your account **** 
 
Your request (#****) has been marked as solved, pending closure. Should you believe that your request has not been adequately addressed and wish to postpone closure, or should you wish to review or comment upon your request, please follow the link below:
http://support.mtgox.com/tickets/****

Mt.Gox Support appreciates any feedback that you may wish to provide.



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Mt.Gox Support, Apr 17 22:25 (JST):
Hello,

As stated, we have checked that address and it is no longer an Mt.Gox receiving address. It may belong to someone else now which we cannot trace who the address belongs to. This is why we have a warning beside the bitcoin address in the withdrawal page that our system does not work with SathoshiDice.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team



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Me, Apr 17 18:23 (JST):
Hi

I understand that the green address may now be used by someone else.

But where did the 1.14719885 BTC go that was sent back to it?

That money was received by Mt. Gox at that address and must have gone somewhere



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Mt.Gox Support, Apr 17 13:12 (JST):
Hello,

Please understand how our system works. The sending address is used only once and then can become someone else`s address that is not linked to your account at all. Therefore, we cannot link it to your account because now it belongs to someone else.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team



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Me, Apr 17 13:08 (JST):
Hi,

I clicked the use green address option, which as I understand is not a one-time use generated address.

From my understanding this means Mt Gox uses a special address for that payment, that it maintains so that receivers can verify the identity of the sender.

This address is still making and receiving payments.

It can be seen on the blockchain that this belongs to Mt. Gox
https://blockchain.info/address/1LNWw6yCxkUmkhArb2Nf2MPw6vG7u5WG7q

I’m sure this issue would’ve come up before. Can you please escalate it.



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Mt.Gox Support, Apr 17 12:35 (JST):
Hello,

As mentioned earlier, the sending address is a one-time use generated address. 1LNWw6yCxkUmkhArb2Nf2MPw6vG7u5WG7q is no longer an Mt.Gox address and therefore, we are unable to retrieve any funds.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team



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Me, Apr 17 12:28 (JST):
Hi,

Yes. I understand that the outgoing transaction cannot be reversed from your end.

However, I have found out that satoshi dice has sent my mone back to Mt. Gox.

Unfortunately, since I sent it from a green address, this was paid back to the Mt Gox green address and this has not made it back to my account..

I have been looking at the blockchain and I can see this is the transaction id
16ef3025a6a9bdd92dcc97ea316a0d769e8150a55532ae451c2184c9a210cef5

Looking up this transaction on the satoshi dice website,
http://www.satoshidice.com/lookup.php?tx=16ef3025a6a9bdd92dcc97ea316a0d769e8150a55532ae451c2184c9a210cef5

Shows that 1.14719885 BTC was returned to me, but paid to the Mt Gox green address(1LNWw6yCxkUmkhArb2Nf2MPw6vG7u5WG7q).
Under this transaction
c687129238e0a01b0c3e3ff3d0ca3fd565b9f2480fb9c8dd863a45924c30369c

Mt Gox, now has been credited with 1.14719885 BTC, and I am requesting it be returned to my account.



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Mt.Gox Support, Apr 17 01:22 (JST):
Hello,

Thank you for contacting us. Unfortunately, bitcoin withdrawals are irreversible. We would advise you to contact the bitcoin address service provider to retrieve your funds and ask them to send it to the address you see at Funding Options>Add Funds>Bitcoins and not the sending address as that address is a one-time use address. Our apologies for the inconvenience caused and please let us know how we can be of further assistance to you.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team



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Me, Apr 16 21:14 (JST):
Hi,

I sent this as a support request also. (#*****)
Just saw this email now

I did something silly. I sent 1BTC across to satoshi dice, and accidentally
ticked the "from green address" option.

I sent it to this address
1dicegEArYHgbwQZhvr5G9Ah2s7SFuW1y

It hasn't shown up on the block chain yet... If it hasn't been sent, could
it please be cancelled.

Otherwise if it has, and I've won with the money has being returned to gox,
could you please credit the money back into my account.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mt.Gox
Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2013 9:12 PM
To: ****
Subject: [Mt.Gox] Withdraw from your account ****

Dear ****,

There has been a withdrawal from your Mt.Gox account:

Transaction reference: eff7b70b-8734-4c03-8ac2-654aead87a97
Date: 2013-04-16 11:42:50 GMT
IP: 121.45.4.113

You can access your account history for more details.

Please contact us as soon as possible by replying to this email if you did
not request this withdrawal.

Thanks,
The Mt.Gox Team
 
 
This email is a service from Support Desk 
 
Message-Id:PV65F9CG_516ea2e83de77_1acc12f707829117e3_sprut

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[Stephen Gornick]

The funds must've come back to gox. I sent more funds using that option, and it came from the same address.

Am I wrong? Am I missing something?

It's possible, but seems to me the help desk staff might be new, and are the ones who don't understand the system

They went back to an address that Mt. Gox controls.  A normal withdrawal from an E-Wallet account is different from a withdrawal that comes from a local wallet.  So normally a person withdrawing from Mt. Gox to SatoshiDICE will lose any payout because that payout goes to some other Mt. Gox customer's account.  In this case, the address 1LNWw6yCxkUmkhArb2Nf2MPw6vG7u5WG7q is for Mt. Gox's own account and not that of one of its customers.  Therefore, you are correct -- Mt. Gox has full control of that money.

But whose money is it?

Well, this is a recurring topic.  There has been before a scammer tag given to when funds were sent to the wrong person (verifiable externally) and then that person that received the funds wouldn't send them back.      I don't see how an exchange refusing to return funds it received by accident is any different.

Another exchange, Bitcoin-Central, has a simple check for withdrawals and will not allow withdrawals from their E-Wallet to any SatoshiDICE address.  

Mt. Gox has been asked to implement a similar filter but it appears there is still no restriction on withdrawing to SatoshiDICE addresses nor any other consumer protection.

Now had you not clicked Green Address, then you would have been stuck because there's no way for you to know who received the funds, and Mt. Gox is not responsible if the person who did receive the funds then withdrew them.  But a Green Address is a different animal.  You have a valid claim, in my opinion.

[MegaBrutal]

Their sending addresses are not receiving addresses for the specified account. An Mt.Gox account doesn't work like a standard wallet. They even have a warning on the withdrawal page that their system doesn't work with SatoshiDICE.

Regardless, they could return your funds, just out of courtesy. It can be proved that you paid SatoshiDICE from your account and that payment came back to the sending address just like after your withdrawal, and the amount is equal to the amount you should have received from that SatoshiDICE address......

It reminds me to the case when I accidentally clicked BUY instead of SELL. I opened a ticket, but they refused to reverse the order. But then, if they see it might cause a problem, they could implement a mechanism to double-verify orders - like Vircurex does that you need to "release" your order before it actually gets traded, thus you get another chance to verify it.

[massivebitman]

Their sending addresses are not receiving addresses for the specified account. An Mt.Gox account doesn't work like a standard wallet. They even have a warning on the withdrawal page that their system doesn't work with SatoshiDICE.

Regardless, they could return your funds, just out of courtesy. It can be proved that you paid SatoshiDICE from your account and that payment came back to the sending address just like after your withdrawal, and the amount is equal to the amount you should have received from that SatoshiDICE address......

It reminds me to the case when I accidentally clicked BUY instead of SELL. I opened a ticket, but they refused to reverse the order. But then, if they see it might cause a problem, they could implement a mechanism to double-verify orders - like Vircurex does that you need to "release" your order before it actually gets traded, thus you get another chance to verify it.

I've done that as well... My time I accidentally clicked sell, and sold my entire holdings. I was up at that point, and decided not to buy back in. A big mistake.

They need a confirmation screen.

[MaGNeT]

Bitcoin is supposed to be a decentralized coin.
Never leave your BTC on an exchange.

I don't blame MtGox for this, use MtGox, VirCurEx, BTC-E, etc for trades only, not as a "Bitcoin bank-account".