MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[raskul]

having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

This is a very strong and totally wrong assumption.

First, there are some kinds of company (such as LLC) that eat up all debt and the owners are safe whatever happens.

Second, even if it's not the case, if the owner just doesn't have that much money, he doesn't, and you'll still get nothing.

Exactly, and that leads to the conclusion that to sue a totally blank company makes no sense, cause there isnt anything to get.

Ofcourse all under the precondition that we do KNOW what the financial condition is.

The fact is we know nothing of fact. sue.
but I have to say, you are thinking with a clear-cut ideology - and I should say that you are being slightly idiosyncratic in saying that; you can't sue anyone who has no money. A court will order future earnings seized (which would include money from the sale of the business, personal assets and anything else invested in the company.) life is not so simple to just say, nah don't bother suing someone because they have no money. I say, sue the arse off the fat f*cker.

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[V4Vendettas]

having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

This is a very strong and totally wrong assumption.

First, there are some kinds of company (such as LLC) that eat up all debt and the owners are safe whatever happens.

Second, even if it's not the case, if the owner just doesn't have that much money, he doesn't, and you'll still get nothing.

Exactly, and that leads to the conclusion that to sue a totally blank company makes no sense, cause there isnt anything to get.

Ofcourse all under the precondition that we do KNOW what the financial condition is.

The fact is we know nothing of fact. sue.

What sucks even more is we cant get any facts.

[raskul]

having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

This is a very strong and totally wrong assumption.

First, there are some kinds of company (such as LLC) that eat up all debt and the owners are safe whatever happens.

Second, even if it's not the case, if the owner just doesn't have that much money, he doesn't, and you'll still get nothing.

Exactly, and that leads to the conclusion that to sue a totally blank company makes no sense, cause there isnt anything to get.

Ofcourse all under the precondition that we do KNOW what the financial condition is.

The fact is we know nothing of fact. sue.

What sucks even more is we cant get any facts.

We won't know anything of fact until an official authority makes a statement. this will happen. there won't be a buyer for gox. law authorities/IRS or similar will give us the facts, long after the 'we still don't know' phase, and if gox are not sued, then the future earnings of those concerned, is safe as houses.

I see no reason why anyone would be of the (sane) mind that suing a company who has stolen your money, is not a good idea 
You can make assumptions until doomsday, but without a day in court, you will still be looking forward to doomsday.

[raskul]

i'll just put this here;

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=487340.0

[Squeaker]

What sucks even more is we cant get any facts.

That would probably be the best reason to file suit right now.

Even if a monetary recovery is impossible, the discovery process should at least finally bring everything out in the light so we can see just what happened to bring about the collapse.

=squeak=

[V4Vendettas]

i'll just put this here;

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=487340.0

Thank you.

[vayvanne]

Sorry for offtopic but this may help some stressed enough bitcoiners. The bitcointalk users are receiving a virus emails from info @mtgox com proposing to sign attached document to get funds back. Do not open. The relay is smtp.com.

[ardana123]

Sturle's last post was made 22 feb. What's happening Sturle?

[illdeletethis]

if the "leaked document" figures are somewhere near correct mtgox would need the bitcoinbuilder price to be at roughly 0,0025 so they could balance again
maybe they should put the site online again and make sure they get more sells on builder 

[zyk]

ok, thanks. This may sound like a stupid question, but what about the possibility of finding the theives who stole from everyone (other than gox)? That possibility has already passed right?

thats a cover-up....your coins have been sold already by Gox and laywers will explain to you that they try hard  for a fee but

unluckily there couldn´t be found any proof or traces cause  Gox is not allowed by Gag order to show where the proceeds of the selling

of 750000 BTC went ! Thats how the ruse ends and where the next exchange discovers a technical glitch

[bterproblems]

https://www.facebook.com/goxbitcoin - so based on the LTC testing comment that links http://data.mtgox.com/api/2/LTCUSD/money/ticker that FB page should be really theirs?

[BITCOIN-PIZZA-DAY]

https://www.facebook.com/goxbitcoin - so based on the LTC testing comment that links http://data.mtgox.com/api/2/LTCUSD/money/ticker that FB page should be really theirs?

no that url is known to be existing for a long time.

Also http://data.mtgox.com/api/2/NMCUSD/money/ticker

[lclc]

I received a Fiat € withdrawl I requested in early January 2 days ago. Seems like they aren't insolvent otherways they wouldn't have done that.

[jwest411]

Could you give some evidence that it is a cover up please? It seems to me that the transaction malleability problem, the hacking problem, the incompetence, the insolvency, they are all a part of the same big shitstorm. Someone was stealing from them by taking advantage of transaction malleability, they were too incompetent to realize it or wrote it off, and now they are insolvent. And yes, they are criminals as well by not doing something earlier. But there doesn't have to be just one big fat criminal in this story; there could be a few. I personally don't think they have the balls to just sell all of our btc, and that idea sounds a little farfetched.

[papamoi]

I received a Fiat € withdrawl I requested in early January 2 days ago. Seems like they aren't insolvent otherways they wouldn't have done that.

these are things wich have been initiated from longtime and would have been in their queue for excution

that doesnt mean nothing about the actual today situation

[smoothie]

Sturle's last post was made 22 feb. What's happening Sturle?

 

[iambk]

Could you give some evidence that it is a cover up please? It seems to me that the transaction malleability problem, the hacking problem, the incompetence, the insolvency, they are all a part of the same big shitstorm. Someone was stealing from them by taking advantage of transaction malleability, they were too incompetent to realize it or wrote it off, and now they are insolvent. And yes, they are criminals as well by not doing something earlier. But there doesn't have to be just one big fat criminal in this story; there could be a few. I personally don't think they have the balls to just sell all of our btc, and that idea sounds a little farfetched.

The malleability problem doesn't add up in my mind.  I mean, even if they were so incompetent as to not do a simple reconciliation of their books they would have noticed their cold storage BTC dwindling long ago.

[Amitabh S]

Can we get sturle back in here to complain about "signal to noise" in this thread?

Haha, it's all noise now.  SCREAMING.

Where you at sturle?

Simply hiding as he could not take the truth.

The "noise" he speaks of is the TRUTH. He can't handle it.

Who is this sturle ?

[ilpirata79]

Only Satoshi Nakamoto can come to the rescue!!!

Give us your bitcoinsss!!

[zyk]

I received a Fiat € withdrawl I requested in early January 2 days ago. Seems like they aren't insolvent otherways they wouldn't have done that.

these are things wich have been initiated from longtime and would have been in their queue for excution

that doesnt mean nothing about the actual today situation

yes it does! it was 2 days ago and the polish account seems to be fully operational  and that the assets of depositors to an technically

bankrupt company are squandered unevenly that way is already against the law...let alone that the thiefs can choose to run with that

money at any moment.  Why is nobody freezing those assets in the Gox accounts?...hurry up that are the only crumps the fat asshole

left to you.